Help settle a "debate"

[EMHDad]

Thanks for the comments. I do think it is a little foolish to try and run a marathon with little or no training, I do know that some people can do it (if they are mentally prepared), but I am sure it will cost them.

My thoughts were more surprise that people would attempt it who were not mentally ready to do so (as I believe most are). For example, I know that if I tried to run a marathon tomorrow I couldn't. I have never run more than 11 miles (Ever) and that was 2 years ago. I just would not make it. I need the training to develop my endurance, but also my confidence. I read the blog of the woman who didn't even make it 2 miles in the Disney marathon. While I appreciate people's well wishes for her, I am dumbfounded. This was not a solid try that just fell short. This was just a little over half a 5k. To use an analogy, it is one thing to try and take the SATs (or ACTs) without a lot or any studying. What this woman did was try and take the SATs without even having the basic classes of math/science/english taken.

I would be willing to guess what happens is that a lot of people follow the advice of signing up for a big race before the training begins. SOme require like a 6-9 month advance registration. They say to do this (make a commitment) to motivate you. However, then the person still does not train and yet races anyway, because well, they signed up. Recipe for disaster. To each their own I guess.

 

[sunshine269]

Just caught up on this thread. It's making me more nervous for Goofy. I've been following the training and will continue, but I am on the slower end.

Jennifer

 

[Ariel484]

Just caught up on this thread. It's making me more nervous for Goofy. I've been following the training and will continue, but I am on the slower end.

Jennifer

Don't worry! This is mostly talking about people who AREN'T training and are signing up for these races anyway. If you stick to your training I am sure you will be fine. :

 

[DisneyRunnerGirl]

Just caught up on this thread. It's making me more nervous for Goofy. I've been following the training and will continue, but I am on the slower end.

Jennifer

Don't be nervous. You already said the most important thing in your post....you are following the training and will continue.

 

[disnutt]

I just found this thread and read through it all rather quickly so I may have missed someone commenting on this. Folks that say they could have finished if they had been given a 'good' corral placement are incorrect.

People are placed into their corral based on estimated finish time. The individual runner/walker time doesn't start until their assigned corral goes over the mat. If you've trained to/race to the maximum pace allowed you will have enough time to finish the race without being swept.

People who move up in the corrals to get a 'good' placement end up causing more congestion and making the event more difficult for everyone.

I have one sweeping experience under my belt at Disney. A friend who hadn't run and was sort of Pooh sized was impressed with my running at Disney. She asked if we could plan on doing a Donald together. I said, "Sure, that would be great!"

We lived in different states at the time and kept in touch casually by email. She was supposed to be following a Galloway training program but was always rather vague about the status of her training when we talked. I figured she was a grown up and would stick to her commitments. I thought that until I met her at the airport.

I arrived first and got to her gate to meet her (we both flew SWA just different planes). My first impression was, 'There is NO way she has been getting any exercise." She seemed upbeat and I didn't want to hurt her feelings so I didn't say anything.

Morning of the race she's optimistic and happy so I figure we'll finish and she'll be proud to do her first half marathon and it will start a lifetime of Disney running like it did for me. We start the race with a nice slow 2 min run/1 min walk like her Galloway plan so I'm feeling happy.

We made it one mile before she said she had to slow down. Our first mile took 14 min. We started to slow down from there.

I had never seen the sweeper guys on bikes before. They were circling like vultures by mile 5. They started threatening us by mile 8. I was trying to be supportive but I was getting a little angry at her because I no longer just suspected that she hadn't been training but now I KNEW. It ticked me off because my finishing record was being jeopardized and the only reason was that I had promised to finish with her.

Somewhere between mile 9-10 I realized that I would have been back at the room, showered and out to the parks if I had gone alone. I had been on the road for a longer time than any of my training runs and I REALLY had to use a port-a-pot. I made a fatal error and said I would run over and use one. SHE decided she should do the same thing. I told her to keep walking and I would catch up.

The only thing she did slower than walk was use a port-a-pot. I was done and standing outside the john waiting for her. What was she doing in there???

She comes out all smiles and starts walking. By this time we are passing the Contemporary and the guys on the bikes are literally screaming at us to pick up the pace. She doesn't seem to take them seriously or maybe she really couldn't walk any faster because she didn't.

We're with a clump of about 20 people. We're about to make the left onto the service road that heads towards MK. There's a little security shack there. I've run past it a million times. I had never noticed the big steel plates in the road before.

As we're making the turn a horde of race/security staff starts raising their hands in the air. waving them back and forth and yelling something. We're too far out to hear but apparently someone behind us understood because she took off running very fast straight toward the shack. There was a sudden metallic 'CLUNK' and two large steel plates spring up out of the ground blocking the road. Huh!

From our angle it looked like the force helped spring the runner up and over the plates allowing her to continue past the barrier and continue the race. The rest of us were stuck on the wrong side of the plates. Our little clump of 20 people grew in the hot sun with no shade or water to around 100 people.

My friend was chit-chatting with everyone and taking pictures. I was stewing knowing we had been swept. We stood/sat/slumped there for about 30 min before they admitted they couldn't get a bus to us and we were going to have to do the walk of shame over to the MK to catch the monorail over to the finish line at Epcot. We ended up walking almost the whole distance of the half. They escorted us to a special tent and started handing out medals. My co-racer (by this time I was sure she wasn't a friend) took the medal. I refused but they literally shoved one into my hand. I ended up throwing it away.

That's my story. My friend ended up doing a Wine and Dine relay with her husband some years later. We don't have any contact now and I suspect some of it is based on this race. It felt like she had lied to me about something very important and I didn't really respect her for accepting that medal.

I think they should have an "I got swept" keychain and use the brooms from Fantasia.

 

[erinna]

I wouldn't want a medal if I didn't finish the race because for me, my medals symbolize my ability to surprise myself by succeeding in an area I would not have expected success. But if someone else wants a medal because, for them it symbolizes their hard work trying to complete the race (or they think they worked hard)? Meh -- it's their symbol, not mine. Whatever floats their friendship boat, I guess.

To my husband, after all, I'm pretty sure my medals stand for my ability to find something else Disney to spend money on.

 

[Rupert B Puppenstein]

That really sucks, Disnutt. It is one thing to be swept if you are accountable for not being trained, but for someone else, that is horrible. I think you were well within your rights to have left her behind when you started to see the sweepers. But, I commend you for being a good friend and sticking with her. I am sure that you believed that she could have finally found the motivation to kick her butt in gear and it is not fair that she pulled you down with her. I don't blame you for not being friends now. Any good friend would have told you to go ahead.

Like others have said, I find these races to be a huge accomplishment. Not just another shiny medal to add to my ever expanding collection. Don't get me wrong, the reason I did the Disneyland 1/2 after the Princess being my bucket list race was for that Coast to Coast. I pushed through the WDW Marathon because of that medal too. But, now, it isn't about any of that. I look at those medals and realize that I accomplished so much more than I ever thought I would have. That each of those stands for a day of 13.1 or 26.2 miles. I start out every race the same way, "Why the heck am I here?" and somehow find that voice that pushes me through to the end.

It does disappoint me that some feel the need to post the stories about people that practically roll out of bed and run a race and don't face the sweepers. To me, that may be a reality for some, but it doesn't give the underlying experience that those people had. Maybe they ran in school, maybe they run on the treadmill, etc. It isn't usually going to be that person who spends each night on the couch watching TV, and all of a sudden goes and runs 13.1 miles without a huge problem. To me, that gives those who are ill prepared hope that they shouldn't have. Races aren't for everyone, and should be an incredible feat to accomplish. They shouldn't be "I paid the entry fee so give me a medal!"

A learning experience is different than not being trained. There should be a minimum expectation of what you should accomplish before you arrive to any race shouldn't there?

 

[disnutt]

That really sucks, Disnutt. It is one thing to be swept if you are accountable for not being trained, but for someone else, that is horrible. I think you were well within your rights to have left her behind when you started to see the sweepers. But, I commend you for being a good friend and sticking with her. I am sure that you believed that she could have finally found the motivation to kick her butt in gear and it is not fair that she pulled you down with her. I don't blame you for not being friends now. Any good friend would have told you to go ahead.

Thanks-I've learned to make sure that anyone I run with knows that we're both free to go at our own pace. Also, I'm far less likely to do anything more than a 5K with a new runner if they really want me to stick with them.

 

[Goofierunner]

Ok, the "Pooh sized" description of your *ahem* friend made us lol. We got the picture.

I would absolutely not take a medal if I didn't finish a race. If the volunteer forced it upon me, it would be left at the next water table. I'm an adult. I don't need a "well at least you tried so here's a medal" and a hug. Come on now.

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

To be clear,you cannot tell someone's training or speed by their size.

 

[erinna]

Ok, the "Pooh sized" description of your *ahem* friend made us lol. We got the picture.

I would absolutely not take a medal if I didn't finish a race. If the volunteer forced it upon me, it would be left at the next water table. I'm an adult. I don't need a "well at least you tried so here's a medal" and a hug. Come on now.

I think that's a fair and credible point of view. But I also know some of my friends in more directly competitive sports thinks it's silly to give people a medal just for finishing a 5K. Different strokes for different folks.

 

[helloirishkitty]

To be clear,you cannot tell someone's training or speed by their size.

Agreed. I'm 5'11", 250ish and will be crossing the finish line for the ToT at the end of this month and the half in January. The PPs "you could tell she hadn't gotten any exercise" is infuriating.

 

[AnotherPrincess]

I agree to not judge a book by its cover. A year ago I made a commitment to myself to "runDisney". I'm short and overweight, not gonna admit by how much. I've never continued with any exercise program for longer than 3 months until I started running last year. I have faithfully completed all my short and long runs only taking 3 weeks off last December for bronchitis, tonsillitis and a double ear infection. I have almost 350 training miles behind me since October 31 of last year. There will be those at TOT later this month who will look at me and think I shouldn't be there. Those people won't know what I looked like before I started. They won't know that my legs are more toned than they've ever been in my life. They won't know that I haven't had this much stamina since high school. They won't know that my resting heart rate is healthy. They won't know that I've trained in the snow, heat, rain and wind just like they did. None of that matters though because I know I'll finish. I'll finish near the end but I will finish. And I'll do it under the required pace because that's what I've trained for.

 

[disnutt]

Agreed. I'm 5'11", 250ish and will be crossing the finish line for the ToT at the end of this month and the half in January. The PPs "you could tell she hadn't gotten any exercise" is infuriating.

I could tell because I knew HER.

I've been lapped in every race I've run by Clydesdales and Athena racers. I've even come in 3rd in my age group in a local Athena category so I'm not speaking as a skinny mini runner. We larger runners may be larger but there is a look of fitness about us that was not evident in my 'running' partner.

 

[disnutt]

To be clear,you cannot tell someone's training or speed by their size.

You can if you know the person and can tell that they look unhealthier/less fit than the last time you saw them. My judgement was based on past knowledge.

I'm one of those runners that doesn't look like a runner but I fancy that there is a glow to my skin and a firmness to my extra padding that even skinny non-runners don't have.

 

[mking624]

To be clear,you cannot tell someone's training or speed by their size.

I agree and disagree with this...

I agree from personal experience. I am on the low end of my ideal weight range. My friends and family know I run, and they see what I look like and comment on how fast/great I must be. I run 14-15mpm and no matter how much I train, I can't seem to get any faster than that. I do fine increasing my distance, just not my pace. So when I get comments about my speed and how great it must be, I feel like a failure...especially when they find out my pace and the face expression changes from awe to disappointment. So I would not only say don't judge based on appearance alone...but also don't make someone feel bad because they aren't at some pace you expect them to be. A runner is a runner regardless of how fast or slow they go.

On the other hand, I get what disnutt is saying. If you KNOW someone well enough, you can generally tell how they've been doing with training. My BIL comes to mind. He isn't training for anything, but I see him about once a year and can tell just upon seeing him that he is not taking care of himself. And without me or my DH even saying anything, my MIL expressed concern to us about this during our most recent visit...confirming what I see (she was asking me for tips since he lives with my inlaws).

 

[disnutt]

A runner is a runner regardless of how fast or slow they go.

On the other hand, I get what disnutt is saying. If you KNOW someone well enough, you can generally tell how they've been doing with training. My BIL comes to mind. He isn't training for anything, but I see him about once a year and can tell just upon seeing him that he is not taking care of himself. And without me or my DH even saying anything, my MIL expressed concern to us about this during our most recent visit...confirming what I see (she was asking me for tips since he lives with my inlaws).

Love the statement about a runner is a runner!

I'm glad you understood what I was trying to say. My friend simply did not look healthy.

 

[stargazertechie]

To be clear,you cannot tell someone's training or speed by their size.

No, but if you have a friend who weighs X pounds or wears size X clothing, and you train for a half marathon, and upon seeing said friend you realize that they have not lost weight/become leaner it's fairly safe to assume that they didn't put much effort into training.

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

No, but if you have a friend who weighs X pounds or wears size X clothing, and you train for a half marathon, and upon seeing said friend you realize that they have not lost weight/become leaner it's fairly safe to assume that they didn't put much effort into training.

That’s completely untrue. Many, many runners do not notice any weight change while training for a half, and most people gain training for a full.

 

[dburg30]

That’s completely untrue. Many, many runners do not notice any weight change while training for a half, and most people gain training for a full.

ok.. i think everyone gets the point about not judging a book by it's cover, but in this case, sounds like the person was pretty safe in doing it. First clue would have been 'we have to walk that far just to the starting line?'

edit: and while I guess they could gain while training, seems like normally would be muscle and from this conversation, dont this this was muscle lol