Having trouble pulling the trigger!

[Caskbill]

I didn't read all the answers above completely, so if this has been mentioned already that's great, but a couple of thoughts.

For your $200/night remember that's with no taxes. That's equivalent to paying about $180/night plus tax. So you'd have to find a cash rate of arount $180 to be equivalent.

Also, you won't need the 2-B/R villa forever. I think you did your analysis of a 2-B/R for the full contract duration. Have you done any calculations what it might be if you only need a 1-B/R later on in life, or maybe would even be happy with a Studio from time to time. Those same points, depending on how they're used, could get you a lot more time, (thus the average cost per night goes down). Just a thought.

 

[Snow Shoe]

My wife and I looked at buying into DVC in a different way. Here's our thoughts.

It's not a "finanical investment/decision" your making here, it's a decision on spending time with your family, building memories with your children, and a place where you can go, have a "real vacation", relax and not worry about whats going on in the outside world for a few days. It took me a long time to figure this out myself, but once I did, buying at first Vero and then Boardwalk has been a wonderful experience!!!

In 2001 we used points and went to DLP and stayed at the Disneyland Hotel there. It was really nice. The Paris Metro stopped literally next door, and so we made many day trips into Paris site seeing on our own. The Buffalo Bill Wild West Show at the Disney Village was unbelievable!

We have one child left at home, 16yo DD, and she has been going all her life. Her older brothers, both honeymoonded at Disney using our points. Buying DVC was for us a " no brainer decision" for us, Disney fit our vacationing plans. Last year, we took our only grandson so far, on his very first Disney trip to MNSSHP. Getting to see Disney through his eyes for the first time and watching his dad, was something I'll never forget. This coming July, we're heading back for his second trip, we'll be at BWV's with a 2 bdrm villa. We're planning next year, a Christmas trip for everybody in the family, and without DVC it wouldn't be finanicaly possible. Like I first stated, it's not a "finanical investment/decision" your making here, it's a decision on spending time with your family, and having a memoriable time doing it.

As you can see, we purchased VB, and BWV's because Disney is where we enjoyed vacationing. If you'll vacation at Disney at least every other year, then I would recommend DVC for you, and rent your points out when you don't go.

 

[Plutofan]

Dont forget that Disney also has two resorts that are not at WDW. One is a Hilton Head and the other is at Vero Beach. The Vero beach resort was rated as one of the top ten familly vacation places to go in the US by Forbes. It is also a three diamond resort by AAA. We plan on taking a break from WDW and doing Vero and the Disney cruise in 2007.

 

[TomD]

We recently joined and I looked at it from a totally different point of view. My family has been going to Disney since it opened in 1971.

Cost to stay at the Polynesian then was $29-44 a night. There was no such thing as a discount code then(yes people actually paid rack rate...gasp) and who knows if there will be in the future.

To stay there now is $300-$600 maybe more.

Prepaying for a vacation made sense to me. Took me 3 trips and many long talks to convince the wife to buy and when we did it was her idea

We too would like to trade out and try something different once in a while. We might not get our #1 choice but we will get to go somewhere we haven't been to in great accomedations.

 

[eliza61]

Hi CHIdad,
I'm your gal for using your points at other places. My Husband (he who must be happy) and I have used our points in the concierge collection and the World passport collection. Let see, specifics
Memorial day 05 we went to Washington DC. Stayed at the Mandarian Oriental, a 4 star joint (at $400 bucks a day, we never would have booked here paying cash) had a great suite that easily fit us and our 2 teenage sons.
October 04 "He who must be kept happy" & I went to NYC for our anniversary. Once again the location was fabulous. The Plaza hotel
April 2000 We took the family to London and stayed at the Dorchester.
All in all its very easy to book other places (you get charged a $85.00 fee up front, but I think it's gone up to ~$90.00)and no out of pocket expenses on lodging. We are going back to Disney this August but next year we are planning on celebrating "he who must be kept happy's 45th birthday in Australia. We will be using our points.
feel free to email me if you have any specific question.

Eliza

 

[PinkTink63]

All great advice from the above posters!
We bought because we love Disney and it's accommodations! We don't really plan on using it for the other places. We feel it is a good deal for us, because we get to stay at really nice places for a great price. Being the bargain shopper that I am, I would rent out my points and apply that money to a vacation somewhere else.
We just bought at the end of last year and our vacation plans were already made. We are going to DL not WDW. Yes, you can use your points there, but I do not feel they are a good value. I read many posts that people use them there, but I can get a better deal with an AP discount over using points. So, I just rented out my 2005 pts and will be applying that money to our vacation.
The general opinion on these boards is that if you are buying primarily to use at Disney, then it is worth it. If you are wanting to buy mostly for the other places, then it probably isn't worth it!
Good Luck with your decision!
Stephanie

 

[zillow]

Have you considered buying a smaller DVC contract and going every other year? With banking and borrowing, it can be done quite easily, then both the initial cash outlay and the points are less. We find that we have been averaging every other year and have too many points (200) for that purpose. Our extended family have been enjoying lots of free Disney trips since we have so many points, we always invite people to join us. Last trip we had 2 2 bedrooms at VWL.

 

[Dale-n-Chip]

The way I arrived at my figures was $83.30 x 210pts = $17493. If you divide this by 48 years, that comes to ~ $364/yr. Annual dues were figured at $3.96/pt (all in today's dollars and not taking into account increases) which adds another $831 annualy bringing your total to $1195. If we were to stay at VWL for 6 nights in a 2-brm, that would take 210 (so no banking) bringing cost per night to $199.

The one thing I don't see in earlier posts on this thread is the discrepancy between the VWL used in your calculations and the fact that SSR is the only resort up for the $83.30 deal. Maybe you were just using the VWL as a comparison, but we'd be remiss if we didn't remind you not to count on buying one place but staying at another!

Do not even consider SSR if you don't think you could be happy there on your WDW vacations. If you simply must have another resort, rework your calculations to buy that one resale instead.

We're happy new owners at SSR and know we can be happy there if we never get stay at another resort. But that's us.

Good luck deciding!

 

[crisi]

Have you considered buying a smaller DVC contract and going every other year? With banking and borrowing, it can be done quite easily, then both the initial cash outlay and the points are less. We find that we have been averaging every other year and have too many points (200) for that purpose. Our extended family have been enjoying lots of free Disney trips since we have so many points, we always invite people to join us. Last trip we had 2 2 bedrooms at VWL.

That is what we do. We enjoy traveling other places (or will now that our kids have gotten to the age at which they can travel without an amusement park at the end). We discovered cash for our cruise was cheaper than using points (I value mine at more like $6 per point - and we booked our cruise early, got the early booking discount, stateroom credit and a rebate, so our seven night is $3500 for four people in a cat 6 - as opposed to 788 points - $4700.

I don't like being limited in vacations to what is offered through DVC. For instance, we want to go to the Far East (Korea) in a year or two - no current places to use points there. I'd rather be able to book what appeals to us, and be able to take advantage of unusual deals with our vacation time and dollars.

 

[dianeschlicht]

Everyone has given you great reasons that I can't really add a lot of different information too, but I wanted to add that there is one thing MOST of us will tell you..... We wish we would have done it sooner! The longer you delay, the more time and money you waste when you could be saving and staying in great accommodations. You say the luxury isn't necessarily that important, but your family will continue to grow in stature, and the extra space is really nice to have, and the extra bathroom almost essential as they become teens.

As for trading out to the other sites...We have done it only once, and had a very positive experience. We were able to trade out to Hawaii and got our dates just 5 days after starting the search.

 

[eliza61]

Everyone has given you great reasons that I can't really add a lot of different information too, but I wanted to add that there is one thing MOST of us will tell you..... We wish we would have done it sooner! The longer you delay, the more time and money you waste when you could be saving and staying in great accommodations. You say the luxury isn't necessarily that important, but your family will continue to grow in stature, and the extra space is really nice to have, and the extra bathroom almost essential as they become teens.

Definitely 2nd the sentiment on your post Diane. I can honestly say it has been one of the best ways we have spent our money. My children are turning into teenagers
so I look forward to our vacations more than ever since every one is running around like chickens the rest of the year.

 

[Mike]

Her argument is that the ammenities of the villas are worth something as well (doing laundry in your room and not having to bring the piggy bank!). I don't disagree with her since it seems like I'm the one who always does the laundry on these trips...

LOL ... this was THE biggest selling point for me. I always do the laundry for my wife when we are on vacation and I am sooo glad that the days of trudging around a resort in search of a free machine with roll of quarters in hand and then heading back constantly to check and switch the loads are FINALLY over. We typically stay for 2 weeks so I was doing this 3 times per trip.

When people ask me about DVC, my response usually goes something like this ..... it is great .. there is a laundry room right in your villa!!! oh and .......

 

[mikesmom]

Just an addendum..
as a parent of 3 , you will not believe how much you will save on food when you have a full kitchen at your disposal. As your crew gets older, they will eat everything in sight (if they haven't already!). I only travel with 2 teenagers, but the difference was amazing. We don't cook all our meals, as it is vacation, but putting together a hearty breakfast puts off hunger until late in the day, plus having your own stash of chips, fruit, drinks, ice cream, etc makes a huge difference in your vacation bill.

 

[PinkTink63]

Everyone has given you great reasons that I can't really add a lot of different information too, but I wanted to add that there is one thing MOST of us will tell you..... We wish we would have done it sooner! The longer you delay, the more time and money you waste when you could be saving and staying in great accommodations. You say the luxury isn't necessarily that important, but your family will continue to grow in stature, and the extra space is really nice to have, and the extra bathroom almost essential as they become teens.

As for trading out to the other sites...We have done it only once, and had a very positive experience. We were able to trade out to Hawaii and got our dates just 5 days after starting the search.

I agree with you whole heartedly! One more thing I can add.... We just went to DL over the holidays and had to stay off site, because I didn't book in time. It was a last minute trip and I was trying to be a little more thrifty than usual. There also was a lack of places to stay at that late date. Well, to make a long story short, it does matter where you stay when you get stuck in your room for long periods of time! Our son got sick, so my husband and I traded off staying with him in the hotel. It wouldn't have been so bad had we been in our nice DVC room! Never again! One thing, my husband and I do agree on!
Something to think about.
Stephanie

 

[Daitcher]

For starters how does a family of 5 stay in a hotel room? A suite would even be cramped. We do a 2 bedroom for a family of 3, sometimes to stretch points we might book a 1 bedroom. With your family 2 bedroom will be a must. One bedroom units only sleep 5 if one child is in a pack and play. DVC does offer roll aways. The points you mention won't go far with a 2 bedroom. Once you stay in a unit with bedrooms for the kids, hotel stays will be a thing of the past. Don't mom and dad need a little down time? I also don't understand your math. Where are you coming up with $200 a night? The break even point for Dvc is about the 8 year mark based on rack rates. Many find the break even point much sooner. After that your annual dues are the only cash outlay. For the points you mentioned dues would be around $850 a year. That will increase over time but not enough to make it $200 a night.

DAVE

 

[CHIdadOF3]

Thanks to everyone that has responded! Tons of great info here.

Seems like several people out here have mentioned that they wish they had purchased more point at first or wish they had purchased a smaller contract at one resort and added a second contract at another resort. This opens up a whole other conversation.

DW and I were discussing the benefits of doing this - we are now thinking about buying 150 pts at SSR and buying a resale at Vero Beach. Overall cost of ownership would go down since VB pts are cheaper. But how does this work if you want to use all your points at 1 resort or the other? Technically it's 2 different contracts but are they 2 different accounts? Can you easily transfer pts from one account to the other? Let's say we bought 150 pts at SSR and 100 pts at VB. Can we transfer our VB points to our SSR account and then have 250 pts to use at our "home" resort (i.e. 11 month window)? What about banking and borrowing? You bank pts and then transfer them the next UY to your other account or borrow from one account and transfer all of them to the other? This is starting to get very complicated...

 

[Daitcher]

We're pretty new, so I haven't done much outside of the DVC resorts.....but we are about to....we leave for the Disney Eastern Caribbean 7 night cruise in 1 week.

St. Martaan, St Thomas/St. John, Castaway Cay are the stops.

This trip total points: 388. We have 320 points,so it is a little over a year allotment for us...the free 100 single use points for adding on in the summer is what helped us with this one, otherwise, we would have to borrow or bank to go on this trip.

If we assume $5 per point is my end cost with maintenance, than this trip cost me $1940 (which, incidently, is what the insurance I bought would reimburse me should we need to cancel)

I had priced this trip out through Disney and through other travel companies, and it was approx $4000 for the trip.

Basically, I am getting this cruise for 1/2 price. Still a great value.

My understanding is that some of the trades are about 170 points for 1 week depending on the time of year (including Hawaii). We haven't done this, so I can't tell you the value.

I am really confused with your post. Advice on these boards and others has always been to rent points and pay cash for a cruise. How is the cruise only 388 points and the cash price is $4,000? Assuming $10/pp renting your 388 still only equals $3,880. It appears you made out unless I'm missing something. Why all the advice to never cruise on points? Thanks for any clarifications on this. My son just turned 4 so we are thinking maybe a cruise next year with him. We were going to pay cash but now I'm not so sure.

DAVE

 

[Daitcher]

Wow! Lots of great advice - thanks to all who have responded. It seems as though most of the responses indicate that the DVC is actually not suitable for our purposes. While I would be happy returning to WDW every year (as would the kids) my DW doesn't want to be locked into the same vacation every year. Don't get me wrong, she loves WDW but we thought this would give us a great opportunity and flexibility to visit other locations outside of DIS and do it cost effectively. However, that doesn't appear to be the case - at least not on the surface.

I'm down but not out... Marketing material should be arriving any day now so I'll take a look at the numbers for the non-DIS properties and go from there.

Again, greatly appreciate the wealth of information everyone has provided.

You might want to look into Marriott for your needs. A good trader like Hawaii or Aruba would be the best bet. You would certainly be able to trade anywhere you wanted. I feel MVC is the second best option out there behind DVC. Marriott is a better program only for trading. No where near as good for flexibility. I also find the DVC Resorts superior. We just returned from Marriott Aruba Surf Club by the way on cash. We paid $845 cash a night for a 2 bedroom oceanfront there. At these rates it wouldn't take long to cover the buy in. Good luck with whatever you decide. DVC purchase with the idea of trading is not something I'd recommend.


DAVE

 

[CHIdadOF3]

Dave,

I showed my math in an earlier post. Here's the breakdown:

210 pts x $83.30 = $17,493
$17,493 / 48 yrs = $364.44 yr
210 pts x $3.826 (annual fees) = $803.46

$803.46 + $364.44 = $1,167.90

If we were to use our pts to stay at VWL for 6 nights during Adventure season this breaks down to $194.65 per night. My earlier calc was a few dollars higher because I wasn't sure of the annual fees but I just received the marketing material and $3.826 was the number they showed.

Now, I realize hotel costs are going to increase as will the annual dues. This also doesn't take into account all the econimic factors like inflation, lost opty costs, yada yada yada. This is just a straight forward calc based on what it would cost me to do this right now at today's costs. I also realize that I could stay at other properties which would take less pts and therefore the cost per night goes down. I have done all my homework and understand what I am looking at. I used VWL as a baseline because the 210 pts seemed like a good average for 6 nights during that time of year.

In terms of 5 to a room, we have done it several times and, while not the most comfortable situation, it has worked out fine. Since we spend very little time in the room anyway, not sure why I would pay $$$ for space we don't use. However, that's today. My kids are still small and we can do it this way. Five years from now, that'll all change. At that point the kids will need more space as will we and that's why we are looking at this as an option.

 

[LisaS]

we are now thinking about buying 150 pts at SSR and buying a resale at Vero Beach. Overall cost of ownership would go down since VB pts are cheaper. But how does this work if you want to use all your points at 1 resort or the other? Technically it's 2 different contracts but are they 2 different accounts? Can you easily transfer pts from one account to the other? Let's say we bought 150 pts at SSR and 100 pts at VB. Can we transfer our VB points to our SSR account and then have 250 pts to use at our "home" resort (i.e. 11 month window)? What about banking and borrowing? You bank pts and then transfer them the next UY to your other account or borrow from one account and transfer all of them to the other? This is starting to get very complicated...

Vero Beach resale contracts cost less per point but the dues at VB are the highest of all of the DVC resorts. So your initial purchase price would be lower but your cost of ownership would be higher if you do this, and your dues will cost you far more in the long run than your initial purchase. OKW would probably be a better choice as your second resort if you are looking only at cost of ownership.

To book a resort 11 months out you can only use points from that resort. You cannot combine points from two different resorts and use them at the 11-month window at one of those resorts. You can use home resort points to book part of your stay at 11 months and then add additional days (if available) at 7 months using your non-home resort points.

Some people buy a small add-on at another resort if they want/need an 11-month booking window somewhere else. Say you bought 150 SSR points but you really want to be able to stay at VWL in early December every few years. You could buy enough VWL points to cover 1/3 of the cost of your reservation. By banking all of your Year N points into Year N+1, and borrowing all Year N+2 points into Year N+1, you would have enough VWL points to use at 11 months to book a reservation there every three years.

As far as the details of managing multiple contracts and transferring points between contracts, I have no idea how that works but there are others on the boards who do. You could also do a search because I know this has been discussed in the recent past.