GRAND OPENING - GRAND CLOSING (Florida)

[godisney14]

Hawaii is in the middle of the ocean. You cannot compare them to states here that share borders with the exception of Alaska and that required most often going through Canada or flying.

How would you actually quarantine people who live in one state and work in another? Or people who live right on the border and they go from this place to that place just to go to the store.

The quarantines right now do the best they can with common sense being utilized; reduce the desirability of leisure travel because the rest is normally a matter of necessity.

Have you been following the news??

We’re talking quarantining leisure and unnecessary travel across state borders. People who need cross borders for work purposes are still allowed.

NY is forcing a 2-week quarantine on everyone traveling from 14 different states. It has definitely helped their situation as that mandate is preventing people visiting NY from states with higher incidence.

I’m not talking Australia and New Zealand style closing of borders (although, that did help their situation at one point go all the way down to 0 confirmed cases).

 

[dvcgirl67]

Have you been following the news??

We’re talking quarantining leisure and unnecessary travel across state borders. People who need cross borders for work purposes are still allowed.

NY is forcing a 2-week quarantine on everyone traveling from 14 different states. It has definitely helped their situation as that mandate is preventing people visiting NY from states with higher incidence.

I’m not talking Australia and New Zealand style closing of borders (although, that did help their situation at one point go all the way down to 0 confirmed cases).

I know that the "14 day quarantine" is in place for NJ, or at least it's suggested. I know my sister has in-laws who arrived on Saturday from Nevada. They're not quarantining for 14 days....they rented a big beach house for a week and are going out to outdoor restaurants, taking little ones up to the boardwalk....etc. It's tough to enforce, and many people simply aren't following the rules. For the record, my brother-in-law did go over to see his family outside, but didn't go in. But other members of the family, including his 80 year old mother, were all in the house, no masks, cooking, eating, laughing and talking. Photos all over Facebook. I think it's incredibly selfish and stupid for his family to have traveled here without folioing the rules.

 

[Heigh-Ho]

It's not ridiculous or impossible to regulate. We did it for quite some time between our Canadian Provinces - which share massive land borders. In fact, our Atlantic Provinces are still not allowing anyone in from other provinces and have not since the spring. It's not hard to regulate at all - any vehicle that does not have that Province's plates is pulled over and sent packing - as well as given a hefty fine in some cases. No buses or transit are allowed to cross those borders, either.

Ditto for the longest land border between 2 countries - which we have maintained as closed to the U.S. for 4 months now despite many U.S. members of congress appealing to our Federal Gov't to open it. It's starting to get quite humorous to us Canadians, actually, how many U.S. citizens are still showing up at the border every day trying to cross in order to take a vacation. They seemingly don't know about the closed border?

For those who live in one Province, work in another - most were laid off or forced to work from home. The only vehicles allowed across the border to both the U.S. and between restricted provinces are those truckers carrying essential goods.

It's obviously not ideal and takes an incredible amount of sacrifice, but it's certainly not impossible.

With all due respect have you looked at the map of the U.S. to see just how many borders there are between states? It's not the size of your province that is important. You frame a portion comments discussing the U.S. and Canada border but what people are talking about are between each state. There are 50 states and 48 that share a borders with multiple states with I believe maybe Maine being the only 1 that shares with just 1 state (don't quote me on that could be wrong about just Maine). The sheer amount of people that cross state lines every day as a matter of necessity probably would shock you but it's a lot.

 

[sam_gordon]

It's not ridiculous or impossible to regulate. We did it for quite some time between our Canadian Provinces - which share massive land borders. In fact, our Atlantic Provinces are still not allowing anyone in from other provinces and have not since the spring. It's not hard to regulate at all - any vehicle that does not have that Province's plates is pulled over and sent packing - as well as given a hefty fine in some cases. No buses or transit are allowed to cross those borders, either.

I'm picturing all of the little state & county roads that go between two states. Here's a 7 mile stretch of the TN/MS border...


They're not going to be able to roadblock all off the roads between states. I feel pretty confident in border areas it's not unusual to see the opposite states plates.

For those who live in one Province, work in another - most were laid off or forced to work from home. The only vehicles allowed across the border to both the U.S. and between restricted provinces are those truckers carrying essential goods.

And if they haven't been laid off or work from home? Too bad, so sad, can't cross the border?

It's obviously not ideal and takes an incredible amount of sacrifice, but it's certainly not impossible.

I didn't say it was "impossible".

 

[godisney14]

I know that the "14 day quarantine" is in place for NJ, or at least it's suggested. I know my sister has in-laws who arrived on Saturday from Nevada. They're not quarantining for 14 days....they rented a big beach house for a week and are going out to outdoor restaurants, taking little ones up to the boardwalk....etc. It's tough to enforce, and many people simply aren't following the rules. For the record, my brother-in-law did go over to see his family outside, but didn't go in. But other members of the family, including his 80 year old mother, were all in the house, no masks, cooking, eating, laughing and talking. Photos all over Facebook. I think it's incredibly selfish and stupid for his family to have traveled here without folioing the rules.

Oh, I’m sure there are many, many people not following the quarantine rules. Just like any other law in life (ie. there’s an almost $400 fine for driving in the HOV lane in CA, but about 1/3 of all cars are still solo drivers in that lane). But, with a penalty or punishment in place, it will at least reduce the amount of undesired behavior.
That doesn’t mean the mandate/law doesn’t need to be in place because some people don’t take it seriously. Just like having a mask mandate is still better than not having one.

ETA: Looks like I just triggered another controversial freedom reaction with this idea of restricting leisure travel across state borders. It’s being done in the NE. Even a little reduction in travel helps, just like with wearing masks. It’s not difficult to enact.

 

[adkkev]

Have you been following the news??

We’re talking quarantining leisure and unnecessary travel across state borders. People who need cross borders for work purposes are still allowed.

NY is forcing a 2-week quarantine on everyone traveling from 14 different states. It has definitely helped their situation as that mandate is preventing people visiting NY from states with higher incidence.

I’m not talking Australia and New Zealand style closing of borders (although, that did help their situation at one point go all the way down to 0 confirmed cases).

The N.Y. mandate works for people flying into the state but that’s about it. Our next door neighbors spent a week in North Carolina, driving down and back. While the wife was forced to work from home by her employer, that didn’t stop them from going to and fro in the town, including eating out at various restaurants, posting it all on Facebook. The husband is a recently retired State Trooper and generally doesn’t feel that rules really apply to him and his family. And the local police have made it clear that they aren’t going to enforce the mandate or the mask wearing.

 

[Heigh-Ho]

Have you been following the news??

We’re talking quarantining leisure and unnecessary travel across state borders. People who need cross borders for work purposes are still allowed.

NY is forcing a 2-week quarantine on everyone traveling from 14 different states. It has definitely helped their situation as that mandate is preventing people visiting NY from states with higher incidence.

I’m not talking Australia and New Zealand style closing of borders (although, that did help their situation at one point go all the way down to 0 confirmed cases).

No need to patronize me I'm well aware of the quarantines

You used Hawaii as an example for how there should be quarantine requirements on "on all interstate travel" I'm just responding to your exact wording. Hawaii is isolated in the middle of the ocean. They technically don't even have an interstate by definition because it doesn't travel between two states but they are built using the same guidelines. There's nearly 47,000 miles (just looked that up wow that's a lot) of interstate highways in the U.S. and 50 states for people to come from (Hawaii and Alaska being geographically more difficult but you get my point).

I'm all ears (sincerely I might add) for your plan on how states or the Federal government is going to patrol that to differentiate who is driving to the store (as that should also be a valid reason to cross state lines depending on where one lives), to work or taking a jaunt or vacation away from their home residence in their state and for the millions of people in the U.S.. Like I mentioned before I think the way they are doing it now is the best given the circumstances. Never said it was perfect; there will be people will choose to break it and/or there's limitations to it, but travel restrictions such that they are act as a deterrent for at least a portion.

If you've got a better way don't see any issues with discussing that but saying "If states enact strict quarantine requirements on all interstate travel " is one of those "okay how" viewpoints at least to me. I know some states did have people during stay at home orders carry around paperwork stating they were essential or going for essential duties but that to my knowledge wasn't wide spread. I have to imagine there were legitimate reasons why some states did and some states didn't do that.

 

[KBoopaloo]

We should let Disney and the NBA run the country. They seemingly have this figured out. As I've said, people have to get there, which is the problem, because outside of the Disney bubble....it's not as great.

However, the NBA is in the Disney/NBA bubble. They have really strict rules in place for the players. They couldn't leave the bubble. No other person allowed in their rooms. Two players tested positive last Monday, and so they were quarantined. Today, all 346 players tested negative. So, they did it. If you don't give the virus a new host to jump to...the virus dies.

I believe they enter a phase down the road where some family are allowed to stay with the players, but they need to be quarantined/tested first. It'll be interesting to see how that next phase goes. But these kinds of strict controls are necessary to squash this virus.

I’ve been watching some of the player vlogs from the bubble and they are being really strict with them about the masks. I figured that once they got there and got their first batch of testing done they’d loosen up the rules but they are seemingly making them wear the masks anytime they are in the resort other than in the spot where they eat or the pool. They are wearing them on the buses to the Wide World is Sports and again inside the practice facility other than when they are actively practicing. I imagine the idea is that they should be masked any time they might be in contact with a non bubble person which would be basically all of the cast members and the Mears bus drivers.

 

[Heigh-Ho]

ETA: Looks like I just triggered another controversial freedom reaction with this idea of restricting leisure travel across state borders. It’s being done in the NE. Even a little reduction in travel helps, just like with wearing masks. It’s not difficult to enact.

I'd love a good conversation but not when it reduces down to petty shots and certainly wasn't about freedom Did a poster mention freedom to do this or that? Or were you just assuming they were of some opinion? I see the discussion around realistic aspects, I don't see anyone crying "it's my right" other than someone describing someone they know who had that viewpoint.

 

[sam_gordon]

ETA: Looks like I just triggered another controversial freedom reaction with this idea of restricting leisure travel across state borders. It’s being done in the NE. Even a little reduction in travel helps, just like with wearing masks. It’s not difficult to enact.

First, no one who questioned you said anything about "freedom". Second, since you seem to know how, please explain to us how exactly you ban interstate travel. ESPECIALLY when you would (presumably) still allow "essential workers" to live in one state and work in another.

ETA: If all you're referring to is people having to self-quarantine, I think that is reasonable. Whether people do it or not is a different story, so I'd like to know how you enforce it.

 

[godisney14]

First, no one who questioned you said anything about "freedom". Second, since you seem to know how, please explain to us how exactly you ban interstate travel. ESPECIALLY when you would (presumably) still allow "essential workers" to live in one state and work in another.

ETA: If all you're referring to is people having to self-quarantine, I think that is reasonable. Whether people do it or not is a different story, so I'd like to know how you enforce it.

Alright, I get that I should be very specific with how I word things. My fault.

Again, as was subsequently mentioned, it’s not going to be perfect. Driving solo in an HOV lane, not wearing a mask (in many states), not wearing a seat belt while driving (in many states), not lighting up fireworks in a residential or hillside area are all examples of laws that aren’t perfectly followed. Are all of these enforced to the T at every stop sign? No, but having the law at least reduces the unwanted behavior. Of course, it’s easier to check visitors traveling by plane since everyone has to go through checkpoints. But, you can still see an out-of-state plate on cars. Regardless, it won’t be easy. Doesn’t mean not to do it since not everyone will follow it. By that logic, then mandating masks is worthless.


In any case, it was one additional idea of trying to minimize spread. That’s all.

 

[tarheelmjfan]

I don't think banning people from traveling to a different state for reasons other than working or shopping in a nearby state would be that difficult. All they need to do is require an in state address verification for lodging of any kind. Any business that doesn't comply could be fined heavily. There wouldn't be many people traveling to other states, if they're going to have to sleep in their car. You'd still have people staying with family members, but it would be a small number compared to the tourism many states have.

 

[cakebaker]

On the discussion of children being less likely to spread the virus - looks like that doesn’t apply to older kids, in fact they may be more likely to spread.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/18/health/coronavirus-children-schools.html

 

[theSurlyMermaid]

Looks like Spain has completely lost patience in social distancing. After their early disaster they had a successful lockdown. But now cases are completely out of control again. Stay at home order again now for Barcelona - but everyone is ignoring it and the beaches are full apparently.

My family was supposed to go to Barcelona August 10-17. Obviously that’s not happening now but I have been SUPER frustrated with AirB&B’s ridiculous cumbersome process to get a refund. Our host in Barcelona was like “the borders are open! Should you choose not to come I can only offer you a 60 percent refund”. Yeah. Because they are just letting Americans in by the truckload. But AirB&b itself is making you provide specific documentation as to why you are canceling...as if they don’t have any idea about the news and the EU’s bans on Americans. It’s cumbersome and obnoxious and I’m disgusted with them.

 

[mmouse37]

Oh, I’m sure there are many, many people not following the quarantine rules. Just like any other law in life (ie. there’s an almost $400 fine for driving in the HOV lane in CA, but about 1/3 of all cars are still solo drivers in that lane). But, with a penalty or punishment in place, it will at least reduce the amount of undesired behavior.
That doesn’t mean the mandate/law doesn’t need to be in place because some people don’t take it seriously. Just like having a mask mandate is still better than not having one.

ETA: Looks like I just triggered another controversial freedom reaction with this idea of restricting leisure travel across state borders. It’s being done in the NE. Even a little reduction in travel helps, just like with wearing masks. It’s not difficult to enact.

We live literally a mile from the border between two states. We do most all our shopping, banking, dining, gas, etc. in the other state. I would say the vast majority of people in the towns around me also do the same. It is closer for me to drive over the state line to grocery shop, get gas, pick up take out than it is to do those things in our own state. We are in the Northeast and every place you go in either state requires a mask. It would really be a hardship if we were not allowed to drive over the state line.

MJ

 

[anthony2k7]

So, heres something no one seems to be talking about.

How long are test samples valid for? How old can they be and still give an accurate result when the lab processes them?

I read someone on twitter say its only 72 hours. She was only a regular person and not an expert so I'm not gonna quote her as fact. But, it makes sense, we know the virus only lasts a limited time on surfaces.


So if it is only 72 hours or something like that, all those tests that people say they had to wait a week or more for in FL will likely be invalid. FL positive case numbers could potentially be significantly higher in that case.

 

[tarheelmjfan]

https://www.aol.com/article/news/20...gainst-state-over-school-reopenings/24567764/

 

[HeatherC]

No argument from me. We need to be testing way, way more. And we need to be wearing masks. Just wanted to point out that testing, a short period of isolation and masks...works. Yes, more difficult to do in general society, but if we were all doing the same thing for the same length of time, it’s possible to we could flatten the curve as a nation. We won’t do that. But we could have.

The sad thing is now all the labs are totally overwhelmed and results can take up two weeks. There is also delays in even being able to get a test in many places. We have to do better. Can’t wait to see what impact the flu season will have on

 

[HeatherC]

So, heres something no one seems to be talking about.

How long are test samples valid for? How old can they be and still give an accurate result when the lab processes them?

I read someone on twitter say its only 72 hours. She was only a regular person and not an expert so I'm not gonna quote her as fact. But, it makes sense, we know the virus only lasts a limited time on surfaces.


So if it is only 72 hours or something like that, all those tests that people say they had to wait a week or more for in FL will likely be invalid. FL positive case numbers could potentially be significantly higher in that case.

Wow. Never thought of that. Good point. Quite a concern if this is true since the labs are so backed up.

 

[CarolAnn856]

So, heres something no one seems to be talking about.

How long are test samples valid for? How old can they be and still give an accurate result when the lab processes them?

I read someone on twitter say its only 72 hours. She was only a regular person and not an expert so I'm not gonna quote her as fact. But, it makes sense, we know the virus only lasts a limited time on surfaces.


So if it is only 72 hours or something like that, all those tests that people say they had to wait a week or more for in FL will likely be invalid. FL positive case numbers could potentially be significantly higher in that case.

Well, it's not like the samples are just laying around on a table somewhere waiting to be processed. The 72 hours is for a hard, unsealed, surface, not a sealed laboratory swab, which I imagine gives a significant protection to the virus, if present.