Good Camera around $500??__UPDATE! More ???s

weHEARTmickey

Dreamin' of Disney.......
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Feb 27, 2008
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Hello! I searched through 4 pages & didn't find what I was looking for. We've had a Sony Cybershot for about 3-4 years now & we are desperate to get a "real" camera. :headache:

I don't have enough money to buy extra lenses & lots of fancy equipment. I just want an all-around good camera (NOT PnS) that can take good pics in the dark, good zoomed in shots, & decent action shots. Any ideas?

My dad has the Rebel & I've always wanted that type, because I've seen the great pics taken w/ it. Is there anything out there that's any better for around $500?? (I'm not opposed to buying used.) :rolleyes1

Thanks for any advice! :hippie:
 
Check out the used stuff from KEH, Adorama, and B&H. I personally am not trusting enough to do Craig's List or Ebay, but many people have found good legit deals, just be more sceptical if something does not seem right or too good to be true. You are not likely going to find everything you are looking for in new because you are looking at at least three different lenses to do what you ask. (a basic zoom ~18-55mm, a longer zoom ~50-200mm or 300mm, and a prime for low light such as a 50mm f/1.8). All DSLRs are good cameras, so with a limited budget you need to consider all brands and models you can afford.
 
don't have enough money to buy extra lenses & lots of fancy equipment. I just want an all-around good camera (NOT PnS) that can take good pics in the dark, good zoomed in shots, & decent action shots.

I just wanted to clarify in an attempt to help you get an answer. Are you distinguishing 3 types of cameras (PnS, a bridge, and a dslr) or two types (Pns (of which bridge is a subset) and dslr)? There are many bridge cameras that have good zoom, but their low-light isn't going to compare to a dslr.

For $500, in the used dslr range, you'd still probably be looking at a camera with a lens kit, which isn't going to help you with your zoom or your dark shots you are wanting.

Something possibly worth looking at is the new Casio line of high speed cameras. They will help you possibly get better low-light pictures by the sheer number of frames they are taking and you choose the best one.

http://http://www.casio.com/products/Cameras/High_Speed_EXILIM/EX-FC100BK/

http://http://www.casio.com/products/Cameras/High_Speed_EXILIM/EX-FH20/
 
For $500, you can get an entry level DSLR with good low light capabilities or good zoom, but not both.
 

look at refurbished cameras, they usually have at least a 90 day warranty. adorama has nikon d40 and canon xs with one lens for the ballpark price you are talking about(canon xti for cheaper). you can add the 55-250 IS to the canon for another $250 or so when you can get a little more cash together and have a nice set up that would be up to similar to a 400ish (due 1.6 crop) zoom. not sure what nikon would have lens wise for that price. as far as low light you can also add a canon 50mmf1.8 for around a $100 or less. so it is a little over your budget but technically you would have everything you want.
 
WOW! Thank you all for your responses. I looked at your galleries & you all are AMAZING!!!!!!! Okay, I'm sure it's obvious, but my camera knowledge is absolutely *zilch*. :confused3 I didn't realize I was asking for 3 different lenses! So, will any of these lenses "come with" the camera? I'm most interested in the night shots. Of all our trips to Disney, we've NEVER been able to take pics at night (or of any indoor shows.) :sad2:

Our Sony is decent if the lighting is just perfect, but other than that it's useless to us! :rolleyes1 We could keep it for the basic outdoor/daytime pics. I guess I don't have to have the action shots right now.

So, is there a specific camera that pops into your head? I really have NO clue where to start. Is the Rebel not for me? I truly do appreciate any advice out there! :flower3:
 
the canon xs and xti are from the rebel line up. i think the refurbs came with the 18-55 IS lens. low light you want to look for a small number by the "f" ie f1.8, 2.8 something under f4 or so( aka a"fast lens"). with a zoom it will say f4-5.6 or something similar which means at the widest angle( say 17mm-270mm, at the 17mm) it will be f4, but at the longest/narrowest mm, the 270 in this eg, it will be f5.6 so not low light.
this is a great chart to help you see what focal distance lenses you might want. tamron has a new one that is 17mm to 270 ish but i don't know how great it is and i think is in the $400 range.
http://www.tamron.com/lenses/learning_center/tools/focal-length-comparison.php
for night shots you probably could have used a tripod and your p&s. that way you can use a higher f stop, you just need a longer shutter speed which means you can't hand hold it. ride shots you would need a low light lens since you also need a fast shutter speed to stop the action( guessing since i have never taken a ride shot, i am to busy screaming and having fun to think of taking photos:):):))
 
Okay, I'm sure it's obvious, but my camera knowledge is absolutely *zilch*. :confused3 I didn't realize I was asking for 3 different lenses! So, will any of these lenses "come with" the camera?

First pointer - no matter what camera you are using, if you really seriously want to get better photos, nothing at all can replace learning a bit about the basics of photography. That's not to say there aren't better cameras or worse cameras. But when it comes down to it, a good photographer can still take good photos even with a bad camera, and a bad photographer can still take bad photos even with a great camera! You don't need to become a great photographer - but like anything else (computers, cars, cooking, you name it), you can get better at it with practice and a little learning.

I only say this because I see a lot of people who want to upgrade cameras so they can start taking marvelous photos in all these different situations, but without realizing that the camera isn't the only reason they don't always get the results they want. Knowledge and skill will help improve your photos much much more than a new camera will. Depending on what 'Cybershot' model you have now, you may actually have a camera with much more ability than you realize (Cybershots are a brand name...there are hundreds of actual models of Cybershots, ranging from basic pocket cams to serious prosumer and ultrazooms).

I'm most interested in the night shots. Of all our trips to Disney, we've NEVER been able to take pics at night (or of any indoor shows.)

Our Sony is decent if the lighting is just perfect, but other than that it's useless to us! :rolleyes1 We could keep it for the basic outdoor/daytime pics. I guess I don't have to have the action shots right now.

Actually, ALL digital cameras, even the cheapest ones, can pull of decent night shots. Some are much better than others, but when it comes to those lovely lights and smooth waters and crisp details and colors that most people like in night photography, a mid-grade or higher P&S model will take night shots almost as well as a high-end DSLR. Beautiful night shots only require a long exposure...so your camera's longest shutter speed is the only factor. Cheap pocket P&S models are sometimes limited to only 1 second shutter speeds, so those will give you passable but not great results. Mid-line pocket P&Ss, and any high-end P&S, will usually give you up to 30 seconds...and with those, you'd be hard-pressed to tell the difference between those and a multi-thousand dollar DSLR shot. Depending on which Cybershot model you have, you may actually be capable of some pretty stunning night shots with your current camera! It all comes down to the technique.

Check out this gallery of my night shots...the first 92 photos in the gallery were all taken with 3 different Sony Cybershot models...a 2003 Sony F717, a 2005 Sony H5, and a 2007 Sony T100 ultra-compact. The rest of the photos were taken with a DSLR. Personally, I think the best from the Cybershots compare quite well with the best from the DSLRs:

http://www.pbase.com/zackiedawg/night_photography&page=all

Now, of the shots you mentioned, your current camera may be just fine for night shots (depending on the model you have). Even if it is a basic model with only 1 second shutters, you can still get much better night shots than you are currently getting just by following some basic rules, like keeping ISO to 100 or 200, slow shutter speed, open aperture, and most importantly, put the camera on a level surface and don't touch it - use the self-timer and let it take the photo with your hands off.

Where your current camera will not be able to keep up with a DSLR is with the action shots and ride shots. But remember that a DSLR won't cure your problem immediately - much of the ability of a DSLR to shoot action and indoor scenes comes from the lens you are using. Most cheap DSLRs will come with a cheap, basic lens...it will be plenty usable - and at least as good as your P&S in most situations...but it won't be as light sensitive, and therefore will force you to use very high ISO to compensate. And though a DSLR can shoot at much higher ISO than a P&S and still be good quality, you will suffer from that 'grainy' or 'noisy' look as you push higher. Most of us with DSLRs that want to shoot action or low light end up spending money on low light lenses or fast action lenses...and they cost much more money!

A DSLR is ultimately the most flexible and best type of camera to get. But like any other top of the line tool, it has its compromises that users accept to get that felxibility and quality. They're much heavier, bigger, more expensive, and generally require more maintenance. And that maximum flexibility comes at a price...namely the cost of adding the lenses you need for each scenario. I've always felt it was probably best to stick with a good P&S, or a basic DSLR and kit lens, while you learn more about photography and camera control, and only when you've really begun to grasp camera settings and understand how to set up for different kinds of shots, should you then go out and spend bigger money on the serious lenses.

Hope that helps a bit!
 
Thanks Jann1033 & zackiedawg. :thumbsup2 I have a Cyber-shot DSC-P200. After reading some reviews on it, I suppose the blurry pics are from unsteady hands. However, all of the night shots we've ever taken (even w/ tri-pod) are too dark. Even when they are not blurry, they are so dark you can barely tell what they are.

I'm not expecting to buy a camera & all of a sudden be a pro...I would just like to have some sharp, clear night pictures & also bright daytime pics. The cyber-shot is fine, like I mentioned, when the lighting is great & the subjects are pretty still.

Here are a couple of examples of the darkness I'm getting. Like you said, zackiedawg...maybe it's just my lack of knowledge/skill with the camera. I must mention that I'm completely embarrassed to post any pics of mine on this thread--especially my worst of the worst! :laughing:

Blurry, red, & dark....
DisneyPhotos-AKMK202.jpg

Too dark...
DisneyPhotos-AKMK200.jpg

My DM with my "sleepwalking" DD...all the nighttime EPCOT shots are terrible!
DSC07389.jpg
 
can you adjust the iso on your camera? i see for the first one it is 200 could you go to 400 or so? not sure how bad the noise would be although it doesn't look bad in these at 200. the first one looks kind of like motion blur . it says the speed is 1/50 and the lens mm is 1/16 so that should be ok in general but you could have just moved or they did( no doubt). if they are moving, the speed isn't high enough to stop the action so they look blurred...also it has a aperture of 4.5 so you wouldn't have a very large area of the photo in focus which would also blur out what ever you were not focusing on (or not the same distance from you) looks like the focus is on the lady at the lower left corner so the background people are out of focus.the second looks clearer in the center but again underexposed same with the last one..i'm guessing you don't have some kind of night mode or manual controls that you can adjust? it maybe just can't handle something trickier like these types of shots.
the one of your daughter is so cute though, she looks like how i feel after a full disney day:lmao:
the photos are nicely composed though so if you can upgrade, you'll have some nice shots. i like how the horned guy is blurry in 2, nice action.
 
Thanks Jann1033 & zackiedawg. :thumbsup2 I have a Cyber-shot DSC-P200. After reading some reviews on it, I suppose the blurry pics are from unsteady hands. However, all of the night shots we've ever taken (even w/ tri-pod) are too dark. Even when they are not blurry, they are so dark you can barely tell what they are.

I'm not expecting to buy a camera & all of a sudden be a pro...I would just like to have some sharp, clear night pictures & also bright daytime pics. The cyber-shot is fine, like I mentioned, when the lighting is great & the subjects are pretty still.

Here are a couple of examples of the darkness I'm getting. Like you said, zackiedawg...maybe it's just my lack of knowledge/skill with the camera. I must mention that I'm completely embarrassed to post any pics of mine on this thread--especially my worst of the worst! :laughing:

Blurry, red, & dark....
DisneyPhotos-AKMK202.jpg

Too dark...
DisneyPhotos-AKMK200.jpg

My DM with my "sleepwalking" DD...all the nighttime EPCOT shots are terrible!
DSC07389.jpg

#1 - It's focused on the brightest subject which explains the blurriness. Not much you can do there unless you camera has manual focus which is doubtful on most P&S's. It's a bit dark but not bad for a action shot under these conditions. I could be wrong but it also looks like you used your flash which probably didn't help the situation any.

#2 - Flash fired and not a long enough exposure for the ISO setting used. Likely you would have gotten a blurry shot unless you increased ISO further though. Longer exposures = more chance of blur.

#3 - Can't tell if a weak flash was fired or not but the simple fact is there wasn't enough exposure time/not a high enough ISO setting.
 
Thanks Jann1033 & zackiedawg. :thumbsup2 I have a Cyber-shot DSC-P200. After reading some reviews on it, I suppose the blurry pics are from unsteady hands. However, all of the night shots we've ever taken (even w/ tri-pod) are too dark. Even when they are not blurry, they are so dark you can barely tell what they are.

OK...that helps a lot! Your camera is actually quite a good night performer for still and landscape scenes...better actually than some current cameras in the compact range. Yours has a reasonable 7MP on a 1/1.8 sensor, which is a larger and less densely packed sensor than most compacts on the market today...a good thing. Your camera has several 'scene' modes that may help you quite a bit, and also a Manual mode which lets you set the shutter speed as long as 30 seconds. So when it comes to taking nice outdoor night shots of non-moving subjects, you should be in excellent shape. You'll still struggle a bit on the indoor scenes like the performance shots you showed - but you can go higher than the ISO200 you used in these shots - your camera can go to ISO400. Yes, you may see some more graininess, but you'll get a much brighter and better exposed shot.

Here are a couple of examples of the darkness I'm getting. Like you said, zackiedawg...maybe it's just my lack of knowledge/skill with the camera. I must mention that I'm completely embarrassed to post any pics of mine on this thread--especially my worst of the worst! :laughing:

Blurry, red, & dark....
DisneyPhotos-AKMK202.jpg

The red is the white balance which was off - you can set this in the camera menu for different scenes, whenever you notice that the auto white balance doesn't seem to be compensating enough. These shots will be challenging for a P&S camera - dark AND moving are hard even for DSLRs, without spending bigger money for low light lenses. You could definitely do better with a DSLR and basic lens...but don't expect it to be perfect - it'll still end up being a bit noisy and grainy, as with a basic F3.5 kit lens you'd have to probably shoot around ISO1600.

Too dark...
DisneyPhotos-AKMK200.jpg

This one surprisingly isn't horrible. The motion in some of the dancers is actually not bad, and kind of adds to the dynamic feeling of the performance. And the details are not bad on the lead performer. You could have gotten brighter results with ISO400, and certainly setting the white balance to compensate for all the red from the stage lighting would have helped too. If you were to edit the full size shot through a very basic noise reduction software, and adjust the colors and brightness, you could get a fairly usable shot from this. (note...on this computer I don't have access to a serious editing software...and I'm working off your small posted shot...but to give an idea I just ran this through Microsoft's basic Photo Editor software and adjusted color balance, gamma, and contrast:

original.jpg


Results could be much better with the larger file and a real photo editing software.

My DM with my "sleepwalking" DD...all the nighttime EPCOT shots are terrible!
DSC07389.jpg

One of your scene modes would have helped here - it's called "Twilight Portrait" mode. The camera should be on a tripod, and the people in the photo need to stand perfectly still for several seconds. In this mode, the camera will first fire the flash to light up the people in the shot a bit, but then it will actually keep the shutter open for several more seconds to pull in more light from the background and give you a much brighter scene. This is exactly the type of shot that this mode was designed for...but you need to remember not to let the subjects move after they see the flash, because the camera isn't done with the photo yet.

With nighttime shots without moving people - like nice scenery shots of the World Showcase or MK castle...you can use "Twilight" mode on your camera. It's just like the Twilight Portrait mode, but without the flash since noone is standing in your shot. If you put the camera on a tripod, or lay it flat on a level surface like a rail, wall, garbage can, etc...then set the self timer to take the shot...you can press the shutter then release the camera, and the timer will count down and take the photo. The shutter will remain open up to 30 seconds until the sensor has properly exposed the scene at night.

You can also use your Manual mode, and set the shutter speed to any number you desire - this will let you experiment if you want to make the photo even brighter or darker than the Twilight mode did. You can set the shutter as long as 30 seconds. But always remember not to touch the camera or let it move in any way during that entire 30 seconds while it takes the shot.
 












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