Girl Scouts - Privacy Rules

[sha_lyn]

Well some of the leaders on this very thread said that they would not accommodate the girl, that she has to take a deep breath and deal with her own issues, and that the rules are the rules.

Actually I said there was no feasible way to accommodate the request.
However when I pictured the hanging of the sheet, I only pictured dividing the tent in half. However IMHO setting aside a little corner would just invite everyone to wait for the private area.
I do not make the rules and I could get in serious trouble for breaking them.
This yr was very hectic because both of our units wet activities were in the afternoon right before carpool. I explained in my last post how inconvenient that is time wise with some many girls needing to change at once.

As for the suggestion to use the bathroom in the office, we were specifically told that the girls could only use that bathroom if seeing the nurse, or attending the one activity that was held in the building. Once again I have no control over what the rules are. In previous yrs that bathroom was 100 off limits, unless visiting the nurse because it was where the pixie unit was. However this yr the camp borrowed a portable air conditioner and placed it in a separate building for the pixie unit. The bathroom in that building was off limits to anyone except the pixies.

As for the bathroom in the lodge/office. Only one stall had a functioning toilet. A couple of non functioning toilets were missing the stall doors. The handicap toilet was also out of order. I did change sanitary napkins in that stall because there was a line to use the one functioning toilet. The is an open area with a bench where the adult could change if we had to, but we were really suppose to use the tent (without any girls present)unless really pushed for time. My co leader for the unit refused to use the portapoties or to change in the tent. It wasted a lot of the girls time to wait on her. I do plan on bring it up with the camp director in a round about, no naming names way. I'm sorry if some of my aggravation due to her (and both water activities being scheduled right before carpool)spilled over onto this thread. It wasn't even the reporting to water activities that held us up since we were right there with another adult (either the life guards or canoe instructors) but every time we walked by the building she would have to stop, and I needed to wait for her before going on to the next activity.
The one time the entire week I had to stop to get a sanitary napkin from the nurse she acted like I was greatly inconviencing her, when she was stopping at the office 2-3 times a day.

Like I said, sore subject and I am truly sorry if my anger at her came out at others in this thread.

 

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

And you decided again to send her to a camp program that was obviously not a good fit for your family?

How can you say that GS isn't a good fit for anyone's family? So again, if someone had an allergy to the food served there, you would say, "Too bad. You decided to send your child to a camp program that is obviously not a good fit for your family."? We're talking about one tiny aspect. Getting change in front of other people isn't a vital part of what scouting is all about.

 

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

Actually I said there was no feasible way to accommodate the request.
However when I pictured the hanging of the sheet, I only pictured dividing the tent in half. However IMHO setting aside a little corner would just invite everyone to wait for the private area.

I think you're missing the point here. We aren't talking about your situation; we are talking about the OPs. There are perfectly usable change rooms, shower stalls and bathroom stalls right there to be used. We are talking about what the leaders should or shouldn't do to accomodate the OP's child in this situation.

According to the poster before you, the only possible solution would be for the OP to not send her child to camp since it's "clearly not a good fit for her family."

 

[mickeyboat]

And you decided again to send her to a camp program that was obviously not a good fit for your family?

-Becca-

No. We discussed it and planned in advance to address the only issue she had with the camp. We didn't see any reason why there could not be some sort of resolution. And there has been a resolution, she has opted out of swimming. She is not being scarred for life, and she is having a great time at camp.

ETA - Becca - I know that you are young and that your children are young, so you have little experience with helping your children navigate through a world without you. I hope this thread, and others on the DIS will someday help you through some of those tough issues - not sending your child into complicated situations is not always an option.

I appreciate everyone's suggestions and the dialogue that has gone on here.

 

[dreamer17555]

How can you say that GS isn't a good fit for anyone's family? So again, if someone had an allergy to the food served there, you would say, "Too bad. You decided to send your child to a camp program that is obviously not a good fit for your family."? We're talking about one tiny aspect. Getting change in front of other people isn't a vital part of what scouting is all about.

Wait I didn't mean her skip out on being a GS I am talking about her not going to a day camp that has had her child changing in a locker. Being a GS and going to a summer day camp program are two different things.

-Becca-

 

[VirtuallyMe]

No. We discussed it and planned in advance to address the only issue she had with the camp. We didn't see any reason why there could not be some sort of resolution. And there has been a resolution, she has opted out of swimming. She is not being scarred for life, and she is having a great time at camp.

I'm glad to hear she is having fun at camp... that is the important thing. I'm still stumped as to why they couldn't change if adequate spaces in a secured area so adults can "supervise" as needed.

I also found it funny that other girls opted to change in bathroom and weren't stopped- see the old rule- that sometimes it is better to beg forgiveness then to ask permission comes through again...

anyway- glad she is having fun... my kids started school last Friday- so a long year until summer camp rolls around again for us. And I don't believe that this has ever been an issue- mainly because I can't see anyone ever restricting a girl from making some accomodation or the other. But at our last camp we had an abundance of adults- and even girl aides who could supervise a girl changing in a more private location...

 

[sha_lyn]

I think you're missing the point here. We aren't talking about your situation; we are talking about the OPs. There are perfectly usable change rooms, shower stalls and bathroom stalls right there to be used. We are talking about what the leaders should or shouldn't do to accomodate the OP's child in this situation.

According to the poster before you, the only possible solution would be for the OP to not send her child to camp since it's "clearly not a good fit for her family."

I get the point. However I believe that describing the situation at our camp illustrates that there are often underlying reasons for the rules that one might not think of.
I did think you were including me with in your comment

Well some of the leaders on this very thread said that they would not accommodate the girl, that she has to take a deep breath and deal with her own issues, and that the rules are the rules

because of your previous comment to me on this thread. Sorry I jumped to conclusions.

 

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

Wait I didn't mean her skip out on being a GS I am talking about her not going to a day camp that has had her child changing in a locker. Being a GS and going to a summer day camp program are two different things.

-Becca-

But why would you purposely exclude someone at the age of 7 from any sort of GS program, camp or otherwise, when there's only one tiny little problem? And you didn't answer my question: If someone couldn't eat the camp food or couldn't swim at all for whatever reason, would you give the same response to their parents that this camp wasn't a good fit for them? You're not actually a GS leader, are you?

 

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

I get the point. However I believe that describing the situation at our camp illustrates that there are often underlying reasons for the rules that one might not think of.
I did think you were including me with in your comment

because of your previous comment to me on this thread. Sorry I jumped to conclusions.

But in this situation, what are those underlying reasons that we aren't thinking of? According to the OP, there are several kids who are changing privately and it doesn't seem to be a problem. So, why were the leaders so unwilling to allow the OP's DD to have the same privacy?

 

[sha_lyn]

But in this situation, what are those underlying reasons that we aren't thinking of? According to the OP, there are several kids who are changing privately and it doesn't seem to be a problem. So, why were the leaders so unwilling to allow the OP's DD to have the same privacy?

I don't know their reasoning. I do think they should explain why to the OP.

Off the top of my head I wonder if it isn't part of their deal with the facility if members are there during camp. If so the agreement could be to leave the showers, private changing areas etc free for the members.
I do think the entire premise of having the camp at a fitness club is a bit strange. Then again I'm picturing our local Y or Golds gym etc. When I think of camp I think of the great outdoors, not a building and a pool surrounded by concrete.

 

[mickeyboat]

I don't know their reasoning. I do think they should explain why to the OP.

Off the top of my head I wonder if it isn't part of their deal with the facility if members are there during camp. If so the agreement could be to leave the showers, private changing areas etc free for the members.
I do think the entire premise of having the camp at a fitness club is a bit strange. Then again I'm picturing our local Y or Golds gym etc. When I think of camp I think of the great outdoors, not a building and a pool surrounded by concrete.

That is a possibile explanation, and if they had just told me that, I would be satisfied and DD would just have to deal with it. When I tried to discuss it with them, I got the "there isn't enough time" explanation, which I think is a load of crap.

The camp is held in a large field that has a huge pavillion with picnic tables. The fitness facility - which is a community center, is next door and is used for the restrooms and for the swimming pool. We do have a more "campy" camp in our area, for other day camps and overnights, but this one is great because the price is low and it is closer to town so more accessible to more girls.

 

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

I don't know their reasoning. I do think they should explain why to the OP.

Well, I'm glad we could finally agree.

 

[sha_lyn]

Well, I'm glad we could finally agree.

LOL...as long as you don't say I'm starving children in 3rd world countries because of the brand of litter we use...LOL

 

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

LOL...as long as you don't say I'm starving children in 3rd world countries because of the brand of litter we use...LOL

Well, not just 3rd world countries exclusively.

 

[Piglets Mommy]

I agree that while "Rules are rules" and rules need to be followed, it is also very important that we teach our young girls (and boys) to trust their instincts and not to put themselves in situations where they feel uncomfortable, espescially when it comes to their bodies and sexuality. We teach them not to talk to strangers, not to get in a car with someone who is intoxicated, not to touch others or allow themselves to be touched inappropriately, and most importantly that no means no. I want my kids to be able to trust their instincts, whether it be at 3,5, 15,35,53 or 103. I fell that yes, in most cases, changing in a locker room is no big deal, and there is nothing to be ashamed about. BUT if a child is really that uncomfortable with it, then I would do what I could to see that they were given some sort of privacy.

 

[sha_lyn]

Lol

 

[Lilogirl]

To the OP:

I am so glad you DD is having fun. I am glad they offered another activity for her and it is one she enjoys.

This thread has made me realize that I LOVE DD's camp. It is close, affordable and run by reasonable adults. It has been staffed with the same adults for the 2 years DD has been there. On the rare occasion there was an issue-they worked with DD to find a solution. There was a solution before I even knew there was a problem LOL.

I did use this thread to talk to my DD what she would have done in this situation and I was quite pleased with her answer.

 

[dreamer17555]

But why would you purposely exclude someone at the age of 7 from any sort of GS program, camp or otherwise, when there's only one tiny little problem? And you didn't answer my question: If someone couldn't eat the camp food or couldn't swim at all for whatever reason, would you give the same response to their parents that this camp wasn't a good fit for them? You're not actually a GS leader, are you?

First off I am a Co- Leader of our Brownie Troop. And I do not like how you asked that. I just don't believe the rules should be bent for one child if she is not in any danger.

And I would appreciate it if you would stop comparing a child not wanting to change to an allergy. My son is highly allergic to cow's milk and all soy (and soy is a filler in almost all processed foods). I myself am allegeric to peanuts. That is a life threatening dangerous situtation, this is a child being uncomfortable.

My DD on the other hand is a vegatarian. That is her choice and she feels very, very strongly about it. But she knows since it is something she has control over she cannot ask for the rules to be changed for her. If we do cook out, she can choose not to have a hot dog, and just eat the ants on a log, and watermelon but no one is going to bring something special for her. We always make sure there is enough for second helpings of everything so she will be feed just not have as many choices as the other girls

My son honestly might not be able to go to camp. Like I said soy is in everything and while its not fair it is understandable. Thats why I will have to research and make sure whatever program he is in can accomodate his condition. If not he would be in physical danger. This girl is not in any physical danger.

I think it is great that the camp is allowing her to do another activity in place of swimming, lots of camps would just make her sit out on the side. They are obviously trying to work with the child here

Honestly the post about the girls missing clothes and glasses is not okay at all. Stealing and hiding someone's property is not okay and I hope that the leaders actually displined the girls that would do that. To be honest this place sounds ill run all around and I wonder why the OP (who had sent her children the year prior) would continue with this day camp instead of finding something else where her girls might feel more comfortable.

To the OP I am really glad that the girls are enjoying the other parts of camp. And I read that your DDs know not to break rules and good for you I think I might be jaded because I come into contact with far too many children and parents that thinks rules should be bent for their child. Personally I would look into a different camp for next summer, with all the problems this one has been giving you (glasses being taken?) I would spend my money else where.

-Becca-

 

[stsomewhere]

I don't understand why the leaders can't be a bit more resourceful. Why not run a line of rope and clip some sheets to it to form a make shift changing room? It wouldn't be expensive, it would take up little room and solve the problem of girls changing in the toilet stalls.
I think if a child wants privacy to change she should get it.

I use to work at a summer camp. This is a fire hazard.

 

[krcit]

Wow, I'm so suprised at the posts here. They have made me think but I still have to say that I believe that noone should be made to undress in front of anyone else if they are uncomfortable. I have a 13 year old dd who is so modest it's ridiculous, but I respect that about her. I really don't see that it's unreasonable to expect a bit of privavcy to change into a bathing suit. She is a very responsible girl and follows the rules but I would nver want her to do something that made her so uncomfortable.I have told her all her life about her private parts and I have also given her the" we all have the same parts' speech. She still won't change in front of anyone including me. She broke her collarbone a few weeks ago and even then would not let me help her change her clothes.That's ok even though I find it a bit silly, she is modest. Now, all that being said, she would find a way to get changed in private or she would forgo the activity. I'm just suprised that so many posters think that it's no big deal and the little girl should just do it or even quit camp. I also don't think that you can compare this situation to a gym. At a gym, the women choose to be there and to change or not. They choose to be in that position.