Gearheads...help me figure out how heavy a camper I should be looking at,please!

[kc5grw]

OK, grand total of truck, loaded trailer, passengers and cargo is 11,700 lbs.

Your sticker however states that 1640 lbs passengers and cargo is the max for the truck.

Sooooo, if you max out the truck with 1640 with passengers and golf cart, so you are basically using all of your GVWR of 6700 lbs, then you subtract that from the 11,700 and you get:

5000 lbs of completely loaded camper.

So, I would be looking somewhere in the 2500 - 3500 lb empty range, but make sure the trailer Gross weighting on the camper is above 5000 (meaning how much "stuff" you can put IN the camper before the camper axle is overloaded).

Does this make sense??

The only thing Carol missed in this explanation is the 1640 lb payload must also include the tongue weight of the trailer. Figure 10% of trailer weight as tongue weight. You're going to need to have enough of the 1640 lbs left over after golf cart and peeps in order to add the tongue weight of the trailer.

You're right the the electric cart weighs around 900lbs, if you figure a 3000lb trailer the tongue weight would be 300lbs. So now you're at 1200lbs of your payload used up leaving about 440 lbs for peeps, fuel, and other stuff in the pickup itself.

One possibility you could consider is to actually remove the batteries from the cart and carry them in the trailer. This would shift weight back to the trailer, but with the ultralights out there you might not have the payload capacity in the trailer and still be able to carry all your camping gear.

One of the first things you need to do is to load up everybody in the truck, fill it up and head over to the nearest scales and see exactly what your loaded weight is without the cart. If it is easy to load and unload you could always carry the cart too. Get the weight with the cart in the truck then take it out and weigh the truck without the cart (everybody else still in the truck). This gives you a good starting point in figuring out which direction you're going to need to go as far as toy hauler pop-up or not.

Now that I've probably confused things beyond all hope I'll go crawl back into my hole.

 

[stacktester]

Rog, TiggnTazz has about what you are looking for. He has a pup, 4 kids, wife and golf cart and he pulls it with a Chevy 1/2 ton. I think it's an 00 so it may have the 350 or 305 in it. Can't remember. I know Christy had a truck close to your's that they used to pull the pup I got from her. No cart and a couple less people but I see a pup working. Personally I think a pup with the 1 place deck would be a better fit so you can have the bed free up. You're gonna have one helluva blind spot with that cart behind you.

 

[LONE-STAR]

I think I would go with a pop up toy hauler. That way you still have the bed of your truck to haul stuff. Throw a camper shell on the back and you have a rolling closet(and if you get a pop up you will need it).

 

[Gatordad]

way to be schooled by a girl Rog........

 

[Tigger1966]

Git a gas cart less weight and you don't have to charge the batteries every night.

 

[Thumper_ehhhhh]

Im on the same thought path as those who say popup toyhauler. Also get a good weight distrubution. Your tounge weight will be high and you might put to much weight on the rear axle if you don't get one. This type trailer will also help with wind drag. 4.6 are not a strong motor for towing a TT and with a 3.55 gears that makes it worse. If you go the popup toyhauler you should be fine. Get a trailer that has a max weight capacity lower than what your truck is allowed to tow. Preferbly by 15%. This should give you the extra needed for stuff in the bed of the truck. Yaknow like beer and beer. oh and ice for the beer.

 

[des1954]

You might want to subscribe to Trailer Life magazine or hook-up with someone who has a subscription. With a subscription # you can log on to their website and find the exact info you're looking for. They take all the guess work out of it.

We only had 1 TT, a 21' Coleman and our F-150 had a difficult time towing it - and the only "hills" we had to worry about were the overpasses on the interstates.

 

[ftwildernessguy]

You might want to subscribe to Trailer Life magazine or hook-up with someone who has a subscription. With a subscription # you can log on to their website and find the exact info you're looking for. They take all the guess work out of it.

We only had 1 TT, a 21' Coleman and our F-150 had a difficult time towing it - and the only "hills" we had to worry about were the overpasses on the interstates.

What the heck did you have for equipment on that truck, Deb? My F150 pulls my hybrid fully loaded like there's nothing behind me. I have the 5.4L with the tow package.

 

[Gatordad]

wynottah has what dr's. call sort of a weight problem.

 

[des1954]

What the heck did you have for equipment on that truck, Deb? My F150 pulls my hybrid fully loaded like there's nothing behind me. I have the 5.4L with the tow package.

I don't think I ever knew - as I didn't know to pay attention to those details back then. All I know is that it was a V-8. The TT was no light weight. We bought it new in 1987 along with the truck. They didn't use light-weight material back in '87 when building any kind of RV. The frame was a steel alloy & the sides were either OSB or plywood with aluminum siding - so it was a heavy TT. Now that being said... my '97 Explorer has been put to the test several times towing heavy loads & has always been faithful & trustworthy.

wynottah has what dr's. call sort of a weight problem.

I don't know about Wynottah....but her keeper certainly has what Dr's consider a weight problem.

 

[2goofycampers]

wynottah has what dr's. call sort of a weight problem.

 

[bigdisneydaddy]

Rog I cant believe I didnt see this thread, you throw one slow and down the middle for me and I am not even in the ballpark, you shoulda PM'ed me ?

I think most of its been covered but here my summary.

your cargo capacity will be close if you have the cart, people and tongue weight of a trailer, its doable though.

You will definitely need a weight distributing hitch setup to move the trailer weight forward on the truck, this will balance the weight and distribute some of it to the front wheels making braking, steering and sway much more manageable. The weight of the cart will squat the truck down a little so the WD hitch is needed to lessen that affect also.

Dont sweat the gear ratio, you wont be able to pull that load in overdrive anyways, since you will be pulling in 3rd that gear ratio will be well suited and probably get you decent economy (all things considered)
I had a 1/2 ton avalanche with 4:10 gears and a 1/2 ton suburban with 3:73 and the sub got a little better MPG and pulled well since I was in 3rd gear anyways, the 4:10 wound out about another 100 RPM which didnt net me anymore power but did hurt the MPG.

IMHO you are good up to about a 5000# trailer as long as you stay under 21 ft or so and use the WD hitch. There are some very nice Hybrids that will net you some nice space and are still easily towed with that truck.

Next question ?

 

[ftwildernessguy]

Rog I cant believe I didnt see this thread, you throw one slow and down the middle for me and I am not even in the ballpark, you shoulda PM'ed me ?

I think most of its been covered but here my summary.

your cargo capacity will be close if you have the cart, people and tongue weight of a trailer, its doable though.

You will definitely need a weight distributing hitch setup to move the trailer weight forward on the truck, this will balance the weight and distribute some of it to the front wheels making braking, steering and sway much more manageable. The weight of the cart will squat the truck down a little so the WD hitch is needed to lessen that affect also.

Dont sweat the gear ratio, you wont be able to pull that load in overdrive anyways, since you will be pulling in 3rd that gear ratio will be well suited and probably get you decent economy (all things considered)
I had a 1/2 ton avalanche with 4:10 gears and a 1/2 ton suburban with 3:73 and the sub got a little better MPG and pulled well since I was in 3rd gear anyways, the 4:10 wound out about another 100 RPM which didnt net me anymore power but did hurt the MPG.

IMHO you are good up to about a 5000# trailer as long as you stay under 21 ft or so and use the WD hitch. There are some very nice Hybrids that will net you some nice space and are still easily towed with that truck.

Next question ?

That answer is so beautiful, I think I'm gonna cry.

 

[Gatordad]

I am crying.

 

[Thumper_ehhhhh]

Whatever you end up doing im sure you will have fun.

 

[Shan-man]

That's just awe-inspiring... I have little goosepimples! Good show!

 

[BigDaddyRog]

Rog I cant believe I didnt see this thread, you throw one slow and down the middle for me and I am not even in the ballpark, you shoulda PM'ed me ?
......

You will definitely need a weight distributing hitch setup to move the trailer weight forward on the truck, this will balance the weight and distribute some of it to the front wheels making braking, steering and sway much more manageable. The weight of the cart will squat the truck down a little so the WD hitch is needed to lessen that affect also.
....

Cost to join DISboards...$0.00
Cost of WD hitch on ebay/craigslist...about $350-400
Cost to replace an overworked transmission...$1200-1500
Free advice from knowledgable FIENDS...PRICELESS

 

[LarryJ]

I won't get into the trailer towing thing since everytime I do I seem to get into trouble on this forum, but never being shy to share my knowledge or at least what I think the little of that I have left after over 60yrs on this planet ...

Your trucks GVWR is 6700 which is supposed to be the limit on the 2 axles on your truck. This limit is based mainly on what the braking system has been tested to for stopping distances, fad, etc. and that's why the door sticker has that caveat about conforms to all FMVSS on the date of manufacture.

On your truck your rear axle has a weight limit of 3800 and the front a weight limit of 3450. While these two numbers add up to 7250 or 550lbs over your GVWR this is common and just allows for more flexibility in loading. Sometimes these limits are due to tires or suspension components. To give you a real world example, my Vans GVWR is 9500lbs and all four tires have a max load of 3042 each. I'm not sure exactly what my rear axle or suspension are rated at, but my door sticker for the rear axle is 6084 (2x each load rating on the tires) so my rear is tire limited. The front axle on an E-350 is normally rated at 4400 lbs, but there was an option called a one up FAWR and thus my door sticker has a front weight limit of 4600lbs and this increase is because the one up FAWR got me different coil springs on the front. I have plenty of tire capacity in front (6084), but not enough suspension capacity. To emphasize this GVWR basded on braking, my one up FAWR did not raise my GVWR by 200lbs. This is because the FMVSS testing is very expensive. Also note that for me with a GVWR of 9500 my combined axle wts. can total either 10484lbs or 10684lbs or almost twice the slop in your GVWR to combined axle ratings.

You GCWR for everything is 11,700 and your sticker shows a combined weight of occupants and cargo should be less that 1640lbs. It's unclear how that is 1640 lbs is calculated and I would take that number as a ball park as long as you definitely stay under your individual axle weight ratings and fairly close to your GVWR. Another real world example I got my rig weighed today and my trailer has a GVWR of 7549 with twin axles rated at 3500 lbs each and tires rated at 3520 per axle. My weights were 6780 on the two trailer axles (220lbs under the axle ratings and 260lbs under each axles tire rating). The front axle on my Van came in a 3800 (800lbs under its rating) and the rear was 5940 (148lbs under its rating). Now I busted my 9500lb GVWR by 240lbs(5940+3800=9740) FWIW I also weighed just one side of the trailer to determine how well I had it balanced side to side and the passenger side was 3400lbs so the driver's side would be 6780-3400=3380 so it was balanced to within 20lbs side to side. Now this is for having almost 60gal of diesel onboard and extra food (like 4 cases of seltzer and 3 good sized boxes of food) so my van weight will go down and I usually don't keep the extra 20gal of diesel in the Van (almost 180lbs) after my first cheap fuel stop.

The Max Trailer Wt. charts that Carol posted are really hard to use and often way off since IIRC they are usually based on only like 5 gal of fuel a 150lb driver and for the lowest trim and least optioned vehicle with that power train. Every pound in the vehicle comes off that MTR. If you take your vehicles GVWR and subract the 1640 cargo/passenger number you will come up with a curb wt. of around 5060 (6700-1640) and subtracting that from your 11,700 you will get a trailer wt. of 6,640 or close to that 6700 in the chart Carol posted.

One final set of numbers that I've haven't seen discussed is what size and the ratings of the receiver is on your truck. There should be a sticker on it and have two sets of wt. for tongue and trailer wt. One should say "weight carrying" and the other for "Weight Distribution". Weight carrying is lower and means you just drop the trailer coupler on the ball and all the wt. of the tongue of the trailer and some of the wt. on the front will be on the rear axle of the tow vehicle. With a "Weight Distributing Hitch" (WDH(some of the trailer tongue wt. in theory will be "distributed between the rear axle and front axle on the tow vehicle and some back to the axles on the trailer. Ideally this should be around 25% to both the trailer axles and front axle of the tow vehicle and 50% to the tow vehicle rear axle. This is usually not the case with a more normal distribution being around 10% on the trailer and front axle of the tow vehicle and around 80% to the rear axle of the tow vehicle. Why am I mentioning this is that the receiver's wt. limits like the axle weight ratios on the trailer axles and tow vehicle axles should never be exceeded for safety reasons. A quirk in the receiver's rating for tongue wt. is the dead tongue wt. of the trailer is added to the weight of the WDH system if used and that can be from around 75/80lbs to over 100lbs for some of the real high end hitches.

With all these tidbits of information the very first thing you should do is to load up all passengers and cargo you plan to carry along with a full tank of fuel and hit a set of scales. If you plan to try and carry a GC in the bed I would recommend you get a set of wts. with it in the bed and then w/o. Until you get these numbers you are and we are just guessing. With these numbers you will have an ideal of what kind of trailer tongue wt you might be able to handle up to the receivers ratings for your two potential load options (GC in the bed and GC maybe in a TH type of trailer). My pure gut says if you put the GC in the bed and have a full load of fuel, cargo, passengers in the tow vehicle you will as a sage towing person said "you won't have reserve to tow anything but a rowboat" due to axle loading limits on the tow vehicle.

The good news is all this is that you don't really have the WB issues that a lot of the SUV truck wantabees have especially with full profile trailers.


Larry

 

[ftwildernessguy]

Nothing like a concise and easy to understand answer. Impressive.

 

[BradyBz12]

DH just got home. Serious gear head (works for a Ford/Lincoln/Mercury dealer and has been working on cars for about 20 years). Scott's post made him cry too and he just wanted to toss in his 2 more cents...

GVW only includes the tongue weight of the trailer, and not the trailer itself.

Kodiak makes a nice 23' hybrid which should give you plenty of room for you and your stuff, putting the cart in the truck (with WD hitche). If the truck squats they make nice air springs that go between the axle and the frame to make up for at least 2000 lbs of payload.

With a 4.6 and 3:55 gear ratio, you really shouldn't tow in overdrive at all.

Also recommend an additional super cooler for the tranny.

We have a 2000 Explorer Ltd, tow package, with a 5.0L, 3:73 and a super cooler and tow our 21' Kodiak hybrid (6000 lbs fully loaded) with no problem.