Gambling Problem Solution?

[Gracedis1]

Please educate yourself about addiction. You are enabling her. I have a relative in a similar situation and many of us have "helped" her. But after many years and many attempts to get her on her feet she is still struggling. You can give her the gift of hitting rock bottom, getting her into treatment, and getting her DH involved. I'm worried about her marriage that she reached out to you instead of him. If that were my spouse I'd be furious and not sure the marriage would survive. Your intentions to help are fantastic. Please learn about what would truly help her most right now, and that's not throwing money at the problem.

 

[amberpi]

A quick google search tells me that there are residential rehab programs for gambling addiction. Perhaps use that money to help address the root cause without bailing her out? Long term, that could be money that truly turned her life around. It’s a thought.

 

[AgentMama]

A quick google search tells me that there are residential rehab programs for gambling addiction. Perhaps use that money to help address the root cause without bailing her out? Long term, that could be money that truly turned her life around. It’s a thought.

Inpatient rehab programs only work when the patient wants to be there. From what the OP has said, I don't think her friend is seeking help for her gambling addiction, I think she's seeking ways to continue with her addiction without full disclosure to her husband. Sadly in that type of situation, rehab will not be successful.

 

[amberpi]

Inpatient rehab programs only work when the patient wants to be there. From what the OP has said, I don't think her friend is seeking help for her gambling addiction, I think she's seeking ways to continue with her addiction without full disclosure to her husband. Sadly in that type of situation, rehab will not be successful.

Absolutely. Forcing someone in is worthless. If she can realize how bad it is and go voluntarily, it’d be worth it.

Honestly, I just didn't know if inpatient was offered for gambling addictions, so I was curious.

 

[EMom]

Do not give her even one penny. Period. You will never see the money again and you will be enabling an addict. It is that simple.

 

[nkereina]

I'm in agreement with PPs that loaning her money is not the way to go. Have they filed bankruptcy? Because that will bail her out. And while it's not a place anyone wants to be, it is not the worst thing in the world either. Chapter 7 wipes out the debts and has certain requirements, but Chapter 13 has fewer requirements and will allow her to establish a repayment plan and negotiate down the balances owed. It would allow her to be in a position to afford her debts while providing relief to her financial situation, and still maintain her house and assets. It should take a big weight off her shoulders while she tries to get help for her problems, at least.

 

[DisneyHardin]

A friend/co-worker of mine had a gambling problem. She finally gave it up after going to Gamblers Anonymous meetings and putting herself on the "No Entry" list at the casino. She ended up having to file bankruptcy to get out from under the debt.

She now is very careful to not put herself in any gambling situations. Things I never even would have thought of such as raffles, door prize drawings, etc. She was afraid if she won something even as small as a door prize that she would have that "Thrill of the Win" and relapse.

 

[NYCgrrl]

Bailing her out will hinder not help. You’ve already done it once (though you didn’t know it at the time) and she is back in an even worse situation. By giving her more you will be helping to continue the cycle. I know it seems heartless to let her fall but it’s the best thing.

I do clearly hear what you are saying (all of you!) and have no intentions of bailing her out completely as I did in the past. Some time sensitive debts will be dealt with that impact her home and job (garnishments/forfeitures have been issued as well as a legal demand for rent). I'm not involving self in her other debts at this time. Her husband will be made fully aware of the the entire situation and not just the consequences of her addiction.
She has a lot of fixing to do that goes far past money and of course it must include her husband as well but the two of them trying to do this from a homeless shelter w/o one of them having a job might not be the best response.

She sent me a text today from work and I hope my answer is going to better impress on her and her DH
the severity of the situation.
(Abridged version):

She: ..."I think I should call my landlord today and buy some time...."

Me: "Your landlord already issued a 3 day notice that's expired. Give me the full legal address of your building and name(s) the lease is in so I can check to see if it's already in the courthouse".

Went thru my notes from the last time she needed money and see a definite difference in who she owes . Last time it was all c/c bills and a loan. Now she's in debt for them plus her residence. Shows me that the gambling problem touches her more than the past. I believe she is already at or close to her bottom what with her inability to open "dangerous" to her mail, or be seen socially. Not going to take all the pressure off by giving her the funds directly. Home in danger? I'll write a check directly to the landlord and utilities and note that it's a loan in the memo line. Her debtors won't read it or care but she and her husband will.
The man will speak to her husband tonight as those two know each other best. I wish the man could be here for the talk on Saturday but it can't wait until he returns to the US.

For what it's worth the ex had "multiple chemical dependencies" in the parlance of Al-anon. Unfortunately, already too well schooled in the ways of certain types of addicts and extremely sorry to hear it extends to those with gambling problems also.

I know she MUST make certain decisions for herself, what many of signs are, and sincerely thank all who reminded me.
Not looking forward to the talk but adults have to do unpleasant things at time.

PS- @DisneyHardin - No husband for me to consult. Divorced him about 30 years ago and I'm not good at repeating mistakes. I rarely discuss funds with the pool boy as I sometimes call the man; don't want to ruffle his hair fringe or glaucoma-ed blue eyes....

 

[fortwildernessishome]

I should be on vacation now but sent the man and DGD on to Europe to try and help her with this life altering problem. Maybe I'll join my family in a few days; maybe not.

I would get on the plane and join my family on vacation pronto!

Don't worry about me missing the trip as being retired has it's pluses. I'm only out one part of my plane ride and all the other components are still being used by the man and DGD.

I truly can't fathom not going with my DGD and "man" on a planned vacation because of a best friends financial situation. Now, if a friend or friends children/spouse were just diagnosed with terminal cancer with months/ weeks/days to live, I would indeed abandon any and all vacation plans.

If I were your friend, I would be beside myself with guilt over you missing your trip with family, because of me. I would be crying and begging you to go and thanking you for listening and helping me, instead of e-mailing you a list of my mountain of debt.

I get that your retired and not out any real money. I don't work either and I travel a LOT, but I can't seeing giving up time with my granddaughter to stay home and manage my friends financial situation.

Go get on a flight and go on vacation. This isn’t your problem to solve. At this point, you’re wasting your time which is so unfair to you. I hope I’m not coming off harsh, I just feel bad that you’ve been put in this spot that I think you should have never been placed in.

THIS!!!!!!

 

[Miffy]

I do clearly hear what you are saying (all of you!) and have no intentions of bailing her out completely as I did in the past. Some time sensitive debts will be dealt with that impact her home and job (garnishments/forfeitures have been issued as well as a legal demand for rent). I'm not involving self in her other debts at this time. Her husband will be made fully aware of the the entire situation and not just the consequences of her addiction.
She has a lot of fixing to do that goes far past money and of course it must include her husband as well but the two of them trying to do this from a homeless shelter w/o one of them having a job might not be the best response.

She sent me a text today from work and I hope my answer is going to better impress on her and her DH
the severity of the situation.
(Abridged version):

She: ..."I think I should call my landlord today and buy some time...."

Me: "Your landlord already issued a 3 day notice that's expired. Give me the full legal address of your building and name(s) the lease is in so I can check to see if it's already in the courthouse".

Went thru my notes from the last time she needed money and see a definite difference in who she owes . Last time it was all c/c bills and a loan. Now she's in debt for them plus her residence. Shows me that the gambling problem touches her more than the past. I believe she is already at or close to her bottom what with her inability to open "dangerous" to her mail, or be seen socially. Not going to take all the pressure off by giving her the funds directly. Home in danger? I'll write a check directly to the landlord and utilities and note that it's a loan in the memo line. Her debtors won't read it or care but she and her husband will.
The man will speak to her husband tonight as those two know each other best. I wish the man could be here for the talk on Saturday but it can't wait until he returns to the US.

For what it's worth the ex had "multiple chemical dependencies" in the parlance of Al-anon. Unfortunately, already too well schooled in the ways of certain types of addicts and extremely sorry to hear it extends to those with gambling problems also.

I know she MUST make certain decisions for herself, what many of signs are, and sincerely thank all who reminded me.
Not looking forward to the talk but adults have to do unpleasant things at time.

PS- @DisneyHardin - No husband for me to consult. Divorced him about 30 years ago and I'm not good at repeating mistakes. I rarely discuss funds with the pool boy as I sometimes call the man; don't want to ruffle his hair fringe or glaucoma-ed blue eyes....

NYCgrrl,

I wish you the best. Your heart is in a beautiful place, but your pocketbook is about to take a hit. You seem to realize you're never going to get any of the money back--and you're correct about that. You'll never see it again.

Also, and I hate to say this, but it's true--be prepared for your friend to be in this exact same situation or worse in another month or two or even another week or two. Are you going to bail her out again? And keep bailing her out? And, if so, what kind of an impact is that going to have on your friendship? Not to mention how this is actually not helping your friend. I know you don't want to see her and her husband living in a shelter, but, you know what? That would certainly wake both of them up to the immense problem they have.

Having lived with a gambler, I just know exactly what this is like. I hope your friend wants to change, but I seriously doubt she wants to change right now. Why? Because she's already showing you that she's not taking responsibility for her self-created difficulties. Calling on you for help is not the equivalent of taking responsibility. It's just more irresponsibility.

And, since we're on a Disney forum, let me just say that I hope you get away to WDW very very soon. Like tomorrow. You need a huge break from this mess.

 

[mom to minnie&mickey]

OP I have never seen such a unanimous thread with everyone on the same page and I totally agree with all the advice given to you. I just want to say that if your friend was really and truly as good a friend as you seem to think that you would cancel your vacation and empty your bank account for (figure of speech) she would never have dumped her problems at your feet a second time. It should have been anyone else but you again! If you love her walk away and let her learn to help herself and sort it out with her husband. Good luck!

 

[Imzadi]

Me: "Your landlord already issued a 3 day notice that's expired. Give me the full legal address of your building and name(s) the lease is in so I can check to see if it's already in the courthouse".

I'll write a check directly to the landlord and utilities and note that it's a loan in the memo line.

You actually do not have to write a check for the full amount owed. In court, your friend only has to show a willingness to pay. That will forestall eviction proceedings. Plus, it can take a full 6 months to evict someone in NYC. I know some people who went though this. So pay for one or two months ONLY directly to the landlord if you feel a need to help out. Then let your friend & her husband work out a payment plan with the landlord for the rest. Since the landlord probably already knows how long it takes to evict someone, and possibly get NO money for those months, he will likely settle for a payment plan.

Do NOT under any circumstances bail her out for the full amount. That is not helping her. That IS enabling her.

Frankly, she may need to lose the place where she is living, to hit bottom. You "cushioning" her is not letting her hit bottom. If you want to help, help get her a cheaper place to live. They may have to do that anyway, to pay off all the bills.

 

[Imzadi]

Having lived with a gambler, I just know exactly what this is like. I hope your friend wants to change, but I seriously doubt she wants to change right now. Why? Because she's already showing you that she's not taking responsibility for her self-created difficulties. Calling on you for help is not the equivalent of taking responsibility. It's just more irresponsibility.

Yes, one of the 12 steps in any 12 step program is rigorous honesty. Yet, she's not being honest & forthcoming with her DH. One of the other steps is making amends to all they've hurt, when possible. Again, she should start with her husband. But, if she's not going to be fully honest with him, she's not going to be able to make amends.

She's already not willing to do 2 of the 12 Steps.

OP, you need to go to an Gam-Anon meeting for family & friends. You don't really understand how you are enabling her. I get you want dearly to help your friend. Yet, your very actions now may be the ones that end the friendship between you two. Enablers often want to be saviors. And that often backfires as the person gets worse. No matter when you stop helping, you will be blamed. Yet, do so now, so she can get real, professional help SOONER.

Hold her hand, walk her to a Gamblers Anonymous meeting. Then get yourself to a Gam-Anon for family & friends to learn how to be a real support.

 

[StitchesGr8Fan]

You already bailed her out once, and she didn’t learn her lesson, she got worse. What makes you think that “loaning” her more money and telling her husband is going to make a difference this time?

 

[EMom]

.

 

[NYCgrrl]

You actually do not have to write a check for the full amount owed. In court, your friend only has to show a willingness to pay. That will forestall eviction proceedings. Plus, it can take a full 6 months to evict someone in NYC. I know some people who went though this. So pay for one or two months ONLY directly to the landlord if you feel a need to help out. Then let your friend & her husband work out a payment plan with the landlord for the rest. Since the landlord probably already knows how long it takes to evict someone, and possibly get NO money for those months, he will likely settle for a payment plan.

Do NOT under any circumstances bail her out for the full amount. That is not helping her. That IS enabling her.

Frankly, she may need to lose the place where she is living, to hit bottom. You "cushioning" her is not letting her hit bottom. If you want to help, help get her a cheaper place to live. They may have to do that anyway, to pay off all the bills.

Wasn't planning to pay in full right off the top anymore.

I owned a property mgmt business before selling the business. The way I'm looking at the rent portion of the situation, a court ordered stipulation/payment plan will give the two of them more time to talk and act on the underlying problem, and me to observe how they deal with the situation.
Absolutely any part of the rent I pay will be made directly to the landlord. I always told my buildings that it took a full year to evict anyone who was dedicated to the process; could even take longer. Con Ed is also owed and she reneged on an existing payment plan. The two of them will need to come up with an amount that's equal in payments needed to bring the old agreement up to date for that company to make a new plan. Still haven't enough information to consider the garnishment (also don't know if it's real as it's neither signed nor has an index number listed. Could be an unscrupulous collection agency but the amt owed does show up on her credit report ) sent to her job. Also don't know yet how aware her husband is of her gambling problem; I'll know this better when the man speaks to her husband. The apt is rent stabilized so losing it would just be stupid beyond the pale.

 

[Searc]

Wasn't planning to pay in full right off the top anymore.

I owned a property mgmt business before selling the business. The way I'm looking at the rent portion of the situation, a court ordered stipulation/payment plan will give the two of them more time to talk and act on the underlying problem, and me to observe how they deal with the situation.
Absolutely any part of the rent I pay will be made directly to the landlord. I always told my buildings that it took a full year to evict anyone who was dedicated to the process; could even take longer. Con Ed is also owed and she reneged on an existing payment plan. The two of them will need to come up with an amount that's equal in payments needed to bring the old agreement up to date for that company to make a new plan. Still haven't enough information to consider the garnishment (also don't know if it's real as it's neither signed nor has an index number listed. Could be an unscrupulous collection agency but the amt owed does show up on her credit report ) sent to her job. Also don't know yet how aware her husband is of her gambling problem; I'll know this better when the man speaks to her husband. The apt is rent stabilized so losing it would just be stupid beyond the pale.

Why is your boyfriend getting involved, too? You both need to take a huge step back and STOP letting her off the hook for her responsibility. She needs to tell her husband, not anyone else.

 

[DisneyHardin]

PS- @DisneyHardin - No husband for me to consult. Divorced him about 30 years ago and I'm not good at repeating mistakes. I rarely discuss funds with the pool boy as I sometimes call the man; don't want to ruffle his hair fringe or glaucoma-ed blue eyes....

Not sure why you tagged me. I only shared a story about a friend with an gambling problem - nothing about your husband or lack of one.

 

[NYCgrrl]

Why is your boyfriend getting involved, too? You both need to take a huge step back and STOP letting her off the hook for her responsibility. She needs to tell her husband, not anyone else.

I met this friend through a relationship the man has with her husband; the man was a member of their wedding party. Not trying to let her off the hook at all but understanding that others might disagree. Whether she told me before her husband regarding debt and/or addiction is not something I'll know before the man speaks to him. Normally speaking what a friend tells me is not something I divulge to their SO or anyone else. I have about one friend for every decade I've been on this earth but lots of acquaintances. "Friend" is not a word I use w/o quite a bit of thought.

Not sure why you tagged me. I only shared a story about a friend with an gambling problem - nothing about your husband or lack of one.

Thank you for your thoughtful contribution and sorry, you are 100% right. @StitchesGr8Fan asked what my husband's feeling was about this situation.


I don't want anyone who responded to this thread to think I'm not hearing and considering what they are saying. I've already modified some of my thoughts based on the insight imparted.

 

[AgentMama]

Wasn't planning to pay in full right off the top anymore.

I owned a property mgmt business before selling the business. The way I'm looking at the rent portion of the situation, a court ordered stipulation/payment plan will give the two of them more time to talk and act on the underlying problem, and me to observe how they deal with the situation.
Absolutely any part of the rent I pay will be made directly to the landlord. I always told my buildings that it took a full year to evict anyone who was dedicated to the process; could even take longer. Con Ed is also owed and she reneged on an existing payment plan. The two of them will need to come up with an amount that's equal in payments needed to bring the old agreement up to date for that company to make a new plan. Still haven't enough information to consider the garnishment (also don't know if it's real as it's neither signed nor has an index number listed. Could be an unscrupulous collection agency but the amt owed does show up on her credit report ) sent to her job. Also don't know yet how aware her husband is of her gambling problem; I'll know this better when the man speaks to her husband. The apt is rent stabilized so losing it would just be stupid beyond the pale.

I think your willingness and desire to help your friend is admirable. But you are not going to be her savior or the one that miraculously turns this around. I think you're going to lose a lot more money and possibly a friendship. If your friend truly wanted help, her husband would already be aware of how bad this situation is and working with her to fix it. She reached out to you hoping you would help her again without involving her husband. Paying down part of her debt, regardless of whether it goes directly to the creditors instead of her, is continuing to enable the situation.

I hope your friend decides to get the help that she needs. Watching people struggle with any addiction is devastating, especially when it is someone you care about.