Free Dining Value guests hoping for SSR-OKW again

[Brian Noble]

I took a look at the linked thread, and several posters referenced their reservation as "being flagged." That sounds to me like Disney took a look at how many times those folks vacationed at WDW and may be targeting those who vacationed there often as potential new DVC owners.

Or it is something that a CM at DRC/CRO made up to get these people to stop calling.

 

[crisi]

I think the real point is that Disney has XXX number of value rooms. During free dining those sell out. By "upgrading" them to DVC resorts that DVC members have used for trades - and that Disney has a hard time selling (we DVCers may know that OKW and SSR are deluxe resorts, but Disney discounts them heavily - often they are priced below moderates - to get cash guests into them) - Disney sells X,XXX value rooms - they "give" away dining (but since many guests don't make ADRs and miss out on using all their credits), and get people to buy tickets, souviniers and pay for rooms.

DVCers however already paid for their rooms. And I'm guessing the AP rate for DVCers is over 50%. So DVCers are going to spend on food (they give us kitchens) and souvieniers (how many Mickey t-shirts can a person have?).

 

[MEK]

I just joined DVC after taking several vacations at Disney. I stayed at value and moderate resorts and took advantage of any promo that was available at the time of travel. I did free dining 3 years in a row. But, honestly, it is exhausting looking for and waiting for promos to be announced. And I honestly did not want to continue to book every future vacation by looking for the best deal, code, ect. I knew that sooner or later I would overlook something or the prices would get out of hand. I"ve already noticed that the mod resorts where much more affordable when I first started going to Disney than they are now.

I bought DVC because I thought it was a good product and it would take the stress out of "waiting for the next deal". I could plan a vacation around my schedule and I would always have access to nice accomodations. Is it the best use of my vacation dollar - I really don't know. Only the future will tell me that. But I don't begrudge Disney for offering promos. If I hadn't taken advantage of those same promos I would not have ultimately made a decision to join DVC.

 

[dzorn]

Yes It was a marketing thing but I think the it has some flaws. Some when from a POP room to a two bedroom then were allowed to add addition people to the room reservation. So then you are getting 8 people free dining for the cost of a value room and tickets. I also remember some added days to their vacations. I doubt disney made any money off that. It would have been better from a marketing standpoint to move people from Moderates to DVC the moving people from POP to the moderates. This would have some people a chance to experience the moderates and possible upgrade their next reservation from value to moderate. Those paying rack rates at a moderate have more of a financial advantage when running the numbers to justify DVC purchase.

Though DVC members are a captive audience it does still pay to offer an upgrade when possible. We purchased with the idea go for one week in a one bedroom once a year during any season except the highest. We banked our first year point and are spending our first trip home in a two bedroom with additional family. If this works out I could see us doing an add on at some point in the future. They know we will be back so getting us to like larger units will result in some "addonitis" for some members.

I don't feel cheated in any way, but I do think from a marketing standpoint it was a bad move. I do also feel that members and those paying DVC cash prices are more likely to treat the room with some care than those paying POP prices. (NO disrespect to anyone who enjoys staying at POP) But when you are paying a lot for something you tend to take better care of it.

Denise in MI

 

[johde]

I think last year was a fluke where Disney had a large number that they couldn't rent for bash because of points from trades, and SSR being almost fully built but not fully sold out. I'm sure they also looked at September being a low occupancy month. So, instead of letting those points go to waste, the decided to upgrade people during a month DVC member weren't filling anyways.
Fast forward a year and things are different. Disney has added fees to stay at WDW resorts, dropped CC hotels, given double developer points, now giving SSR points to AKV-KV purchasers. All of those have the effect of Disney having fewer points to rent out for cash reservations or use to "upgrade".

 

[spiceycat]

DVC is a valuable Disney brand - but, IMHO, they need to protect the image of DVC villas as deluxe-level Disney accomodations. Do upgrades from other deluxe resorts (a 1 bedroom at a DVC from a regular room) or charge cash rates for DVC accomodations that are on par with deluxe resort rates.

no you are allowing people, who won't even consider a timeshare, a chance to see what they are missing.

besides Marriott, Hilton, Hyatt have been doing in for years. and very, very successfully - all timeshares do this. Do you really think if it endanger their brand names (which by the way is much, much more successfully than DVC in the timeshare business) they would do?

disney is just approaching it different. instead of offering the public discount rates. they are offering it to people who love disney and go often, also have good credit (you better believe that got checked - before disney offered anyone an up grade). They are also offering the upgrade. If someone doesn't want it - they don't have to take it.

the more timeshares that DVC sells the better off we all are. because the more DVC resorts they will build. (okay my opinion).

It is not an insult to you. It is just marketing. Like the free tickets we got years ago. It is marketing.

now the guides don't like it - because these guests are hard to sell too - even if they take the tour (which no one is forced to do - another thing DVC does differently). but I don't want that to change.

now if DVC started to tell you that they would give your friends and family a nice discounts on the WDW or DVC resorts if you could get them to take a DVC tour. - would that be insulting?

this is the same thing. Instead of a personal recommendations from a DVC members. they are going with Pop Century (who many DVCers love) and getting recommendation (I think) from it.

 

[starbox]

no you are allowing people, who won't even consider a timeshare, a chance to see what they are missing.

besides Marriott, Hilton, Hyatt have been doing in for years. and very, very successfully - all timeshares do this. Do you really think if it endanger their brand names (which by the way is much, much more successfully than DVC in the timeshare business) they would do?
QUOTE]

I don't buy this argument. Every single one of us, when someone poses a question on the board about whether or not DVC ownership makes sense for their family - we all say that it makes sense financially if you stay in moderates or deluxes for about a week a year. And I can't count the times posters have written that if you are happy looking for travel deals and staying in values, DVC is not a good fit - because it's a vacation upgrade.

I agree with the PP that said upgrade the moderate guests to DVC and move the value folks to a mod. You're marketing will be much more financially lucrative - moderate vacationers are much more likely to consider the permanat upgrade of DVC ownership - and you may convince value guests to start booking moderates.

As for all the other timeshare programs that offer deals - yup, they sure do - and three hour high pressue sales pitch is the "price" for that discount vacation. You know why they do that, because nobody on earth would stay in a 2-bedroom Fairfield timesahre for 4 nights at $159 and then, totally on their own, decide "Hey, we could only afford this trip because they practically gave it to us - lets go spend 16,000 so we can do this every year!". The kind of people that are going to drop 16,000 on a timeshare are the type of people that are already spending relatively big bucks on travel each year.

DVC has done very well without resorting to those tactics - and I think many of us bought in simply because they don't do that sort of thing.

There was no sales presentation attached to the upgrades. I seriously doubt there were many - if any sales - hence the "watching for another upgrade" thread.

 

[spiceycat]

you are forgetting what I say - DVC looks at the guests - it wasn't offered to every guest at Pop - just the ones they wanted.

when one of the other guest complainted then it was WDW problem not DVC. and they were offered something there. (or that is what I was reading and assuming on the resort board)

Pop is different from the other values - there are people who stay there who have money - lots of money. but they want a value for their money. Simply because they can afford the Polyn is no reason for them to stay at the Polyn.

DVC wants these people to become members. It is sold to this group.

if you don't believe me - come visit the Pop sometime. Some of these people pay more for their clothes than I do for my vacations. that takes money.

but they want value for their dollar. to me that makes sense that DVC picked these people to try to see if they would buy DVC.

this offer was not across the board to everyone at Pop at the time.

 

[DebbieB]

I think this is blown way out of proportion. It happened during a 4 to 6 week period during the slowest time of the year last year. These rooms probably would have went empty otherwise. There's no proof that they are planning to do it again this year, someone posted "what if".

I for one never intended to buy DVC until a friend invited me to stay in a 2 bedroom at OKW. A couple days there and I was hooked. Didn't take a tour, didn't talk to a salesman at that time. Less than 6 months later I was buying (over the phone using my friend's guide).

 

[Chuck S]

Pop is different from the other values - there are people who stay there who have money - lots of money. but they want a value for their money. Simply because they can afford the Polyn is no reason for them to stay at the Polyn.

I'll agree with that line of thinking. We like POP, we've stayed in tower rooms at the Contemporary, and really enjoyed them. In fact, we purchased DVC before POP was ever built. We stayed at POP once when we drove down and arrived a day a day early. We stopped at the Ocala welcome center (I miss that place. ) to renew our APs, and mentioned we'd be looknig for a place offsite for that one night. A helpful CM recommended POP, and we were able to get a great AP rate. It really blew us away for a value. Loved the food court selections, and the rooms were fine for a short stay. On another trip POP was full, and we tried All Stars. The difference was night and day. I'll stay offsite before I ever stay at All Stars again.

So it is certainly possible that a percentage of repeat POP guests have the means and vacation habits to make DVC an attractive purchase for them.

 

[spiceycat]

I think this is blown way out of proportion. It happened during a 4 to 6 week period during the slowest time of the year last year. These rooms probably would have went empty otherwise. There's no proof that they are planning to do it again this year, someone posted "what if".

really even less just the labor day week. and yes definitely blow up.

DVC has the ability to do this again if it wants too. You can't stop it. Especially if they made enough sales to do it again.

 

[TenThousandVolts]

I'm sure DVC is hoping to sell new memberships with the upgrades. Would you be more likely to buy DVC if you were put in a studio or if you were put in a 1 bedroom?

If I thought I could take a chance and get a one-bedroom with free dining for 100 bucks a night - there is no way on earth I'd plunk down 16,000 plus a commitment of 50 years of paying more annual fees every single year than my entire week of free dining vacations cost just to get the same room and no free dining.

exactly what I was going to say- but you beat me to it and said it better than I would have.

spiceycat said: they are offering it to people who love disney and go often, also have good credit (you better believe that got checked - before disney offered anyone an up grade).

I don't think they can check your credit without your permission. Disney Visa may have your credit score but they can't share that information.

 

[spiceycat]

I don't think they can check your credit without your permission. Disney Visa may have your credit score but they can't share that information.

unless you have told the credit agency not to share that information - they definitely can!

also not sure if that work with Disney if Disney can proof you are current customer - which they could.

disney has your name, address, your shopping preferences, dinner preferences, believe me they know your credit score.

 

[TenThousandVolts]

unless you have told the credit agency not to share that information - they definitely can!

Eww that's creepy- but I guess you are right- if it is that easy to get a credit score- I am sure they did. Now- that leads me to wonder- did they want people with the highest credit scores? Or would someone with good credit and a few flaws be more likely candidates to purchase. Timeshare owners traditionally have a reputation as being not sure how to say this: "not the most savy group when it comes to how they handle their money." Just wondering out loud- it is totally off topic regarding the original post.

I don't see why anyone would be upset that people were upgraded- and got free dining... but there seems to some flaws in the marketing strategy and execution.

By the way- were these upgrades considered YOMAD prizes? If so they could have given out twice as many by upgrading mod guests to DVC- and Val guests to mods. The mods crowd would seem to be the more likely group to buy in to dvc- but wwho knows.

 

[spiceycat]

dvc does it's research well.

I would also think that the moderates would be more likely to buy.

but dvc went after Pop. It has to know somethings we don't.

 

[ldo]

I might not be the typical POP person (1st time we had ever stayed at a value)---we wanted to try free dining and DH couldn't go, so I just booked a cheap place for a 4 day fling with the kids before school started. There was actually more marketing of DVC at POP (where we stayed the night before).
When we got to SSR, we got a check-in package--but absolutely no details about DVC or what they were selling or any invitation to see the presentation--sort of weird--so I really wonder if it was marketing at all. We have another timeshare and after reading disboards, I understood how it worked, so we bought over the phone in November.
The upgrade seemed to be a really quick fix--you got the email and had to call in a matter of a day or so and then the upgrade was over--and it was mostly folks at POP who were near Labor Day--so maybe it really was just computer overbooking.

 

[starbox]

dvc does it's research well.

I hate to disagree, but I think the marketing computer program ain't that smart. Disney does many things well - but they need to get their computer systems out of the dark ages. (But what do you expect from a company whose visionary Spaceship Earth, until very recently, mentioned that in the future we might have......webcams!!!! )

Case in point - about 5 years ago we paid for my parents to stay at POR for 3 nights with us. Mom and Dad are in their sixties, no kids around, and on a very limited income - dad is half-retired and mom never worked. I made the reservation for them, and paid with my credit card.

About a month before we arrived, mom and dad get a postcard offering them an upgrade to SSR if they can change their travel dates. Now, we are traveling as a family - I paid for the reservation - CRO has no social security card or credit card for my parents, just an address that I gave them.

Since then, my dad has gotten a pin code offer once or twice every single year. Seriously. He's got no intention of ever traveling to Disney unless we pay for it again .

In the meantime - here my husband and I are : dual income, two young kids, mid-thirties, homeowners, good credit. Just the kind of people most likely to buy DVC (which, of course, we did). We never got a PIN offer.

Actually, now that I write this - maybe I should book a POP free dining trip in dear old dad's name - he'll probably get upgraded to a grand villa!

 

[crisi]

dvc does it's research well.

I would also think that the moderates would be more likely to buy.

but dvc went after Pop. It has to know somethings we don't.

Maybe what they know is that if they upgrade Pop people, they can sell more Pop rooms, not DVC memberships. It could be like category 12 staterooms on DCL.

Disney has resources sitting empty (DVC rooms that they have control over because we've used the to trade or members haven't bought them yet).

They have a full value resort due to a very popular promotion.

That promotion gives away a ton of food - but since some number of guests during that period don't make ADRs and Disney absolves themselves of the responsibility of making good on the food if there isn't room in the restaurant, they really hand out a lot of counter service meals once the restaurants reach capacity - which they have every free dining promotion. Selling more promotions above capacity costs Disney in counter service meals and pop - cheap.

Selling more value rooms means the room rate per night, plus park tickets, plus souvenirs - and the cost to Disney for this is counter service burgers. Sounds like a good deal to me.

From a DVC member perspective, this benefits us twice:

The more rooms CRO uses, the more our trade values out are worth - if CRO can't sell our rooms, our cost to cruise or stay at the Poly go up - if they use our rooms, then the trade value is better.

If cash guests are staying in DVC rooms, and DVC is at all intelligent and does want to convert these folks into members - they don't know which room the cash guest will be in - they need to make sure all rooms are cleaned to cash guest standards. I'm guessing SSR will have some of the cleanest rooms at DVC in September. I'd also guess that SSR management will have a cash to member conversion goal during this period.

 

[spiceycat]

Case in point - about 5 years ago we paid for my parents to stay at POR for 3 nights with us. Mom and Dad are in their sixties, no kids around, and on a very limited income - dad is half-retired and mom never worked. I made the reservation for them, and paid with my credit card.

About a month before we arrived, mom and dad get a postcard offering them an upgrade to SSR if they can change their travel dates. Now, we are traveling as a family - I paid for the reservation - CRO has no social security card or credit card for my parents, just an address that I gave them.

Since then, my dad has gotten a pin code offer once or twice every single year. Seriously. He's got no intention of ever traveling to Disney unless we pay for it again .

In the meantime - here my husband and I are : dual income, two young kids, mid-thirties, homeowners, good credit. Just the kind of people most likely to buy DVC (which, of course, we did). We never got a PIN offer.

boy you are correct - seems they got you and your father mixed up - rather badly.

really though that there marketing was much, much better than that.

there couldn't have been a name mix up either.

 

[TenThousandVolts]

boy you are correct - seems they got you and your father mixed up - rather badly.

really though that there marketing was much, much better than that.

there couldn't have been a name mix up either.

Maybe they weren't mixed up at all- maybe they never sent Starbox a code because they knew Starbox would be coming back with or without an incentive. It was Daddy Starbox that needed the carrot dangled - ok so he didn't bite- but perhaps others did.