FP+ Frustration

[IWannaBuildASnowman]

But that is what Disney wanted....to prevent guests riding popular attractions multiple times with fastpass. as far as that goal, it's working.

And - YES. Last year I was so annoyed by the fact that I couldn't use FP+ at all, yet people who were staying onsite were getting there for their FP+ times then grabbing paper fastpasses - meaning they got two rides while others got no chance. I realize it's all survivor of the rope drop fittest, but sometimes on vacation I don't want to have to compete with people. I just want to go on rides.

 

[JennaDeeDooDah]

I understand the tiering from Disney's perspective. They have so few good rides at Epcot that they want to force people on to the other dreck. But from a user perspective it blows. Soarin *or* test track is nonsense. If they want to make sure it's "fair", then allocate less spots to FP and leave the rest of it up to standby.

But like I said. I am already a 2nd class citizen because I stay offsite. Always leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

And see, that is something I really struggle with understanding. I just can't for the life of me understand what that board meeting was like.
Member 1: So about this FP+ idea. I like it, but what are we going to do at Epcot and Hollywood Studios? It seems that Soarin' and Test Track will be the two rides that get selected the most and no one really seems to want or even need a Fast Pass for any of the other rides currently.

Member 2: I know! Let's build some more rides that people enjoy! We can reopen Wonders of Life, add in a weather area that has a Frozen Ride, redo Imagination to how it was when people loved it, and add in some more family style rides around World Showcase.

Member 1: More rides? What a terrible idea. Why would we do something like that? You are clearly thinking along the lines of "give the people what they want" but there is no need. Those chumps will keep coming even if we take away rides!

Member 3: Hey! Now there's an idea. Let's take away Malestrom and turn it into a Frozen ride. I mean, we could just update Malestrom or even turn it into a Thor ride since we own those rights and he at least as an actual tie to the country, but why? Let's just do Frozen at the expense of one of the more popular rides after Soarin' and Test Track.

Member 1: Excellent idea, but we still need to address the fact that people will only pull fast passes for Test Track and Soarin'.

Member 3: Simple. We tier the park. They have to choose one between Soarin' and Test Track. And, since we don't want them to realize that we are aware that those two rides are the only ones with any sort of demand, we can add in a couple more low demand rides like Living with the Land to that tier.

Member 1: Brilliant!

 

[MaryKatesMom]

Do you only go on rides you have a FP for? I know I certainly don't. When we head to WDW in February, we'll have our FP+ booked, but also have other plans to get to everything we want. And if we decide to hangs our minds and lose our FPs, so what? We'll find plenty of fun things to do.

Like Captain EO?

Yes, for us it was 3 and out. Everything was hurry up and wait.

OP here. Thanks to all for the replys.

It's not a situation of trying to do every major ride. Nor is it about doing rides multiple times. I know choosing to go during the holidays is going to cause hiccups. For us, Thanksgiving week is the best option. We have traveled to Disney 6-7 times at Thanksgiving. This trip is the 1st time where I feel that changing my mind has too many consequences. It is just frustrating. ADRs at 180 day. FP+ at 60 days. Park hours somewhere in between. But wait, Disney decides to adjust open hrs. Kinda throws a curve ball into plans.

When I made the fp+ plans at 60 days, i did not think about setting up for the hopper park. I just set what i thought would work for the day we planned to visit. But like i said, changing a park day comes with the penalty of losing FPs.

For me it feels more like work and less like a vacation. Everyone is different. It may be awesome for some.

Again, thanks for the comments.

PS. To those that are happy with "at least we know we have 3 fp". WOW. That is a whole lot of money for 3 rides...

I completely agree. Once our AP's run out we're done. For Thanksgiving we are going to NYC, Easter is New Orleans and Summer is London. All of the hotels we are staying at are both nicer and cheaper than WDW.

I don't get the thought process of "WOW, you're only getting to ride 3 rides." Ummm, no, those are the rides we had FP+ for, but we were able to ride more than those with minimal to moderate wait.

In late October No reason to be stressed over vacation.

I went back and checked the crowd level that week was a level 5. I spent 28 days at WDW over the last 8 months and not one day was a crowd level less than 8 which is why I stopped and chuckled . NO WAY could you do that during peak. Not stressing, just making better vacation choices.

I just booked a private tour in a major city for less than it costs for a day at the parks.

And see, that is something I really struggle with understanding. I just can't for the life of me understand what that board meeting was like.
Member 1: So about this FP+ idea. I like it, but what are we going to do at Epcot and Hollywood Studios? It seems that Soarin' and Test Track will be the two rides that get selected the most and no one really seems to want or even need a Fast Pass for any of the other rides currently.

Member 2: I know! Let's build some more rides that people enjoy! We can reopen Wonders of Life, add in a weather area that has a Frozen Ride, redo Imagination to how it was when people loved it, and add in some more family style rides around World Showcase.

Member 1: More rides? What a terrible idea. Why would we do something like that? You are clearly thinking along the lines of "give the people what they want" but there is no need. Those chumps will keep coming even if we take away rides!

Member 3: Hey! Now there's an idea. Let's take away Malestrom and turn it into a Frozen ride. I mean, we could just update Malestrom or even turn it into a Thor ride since we own those rights and he at least as an actual tie to the country, but why? Let's just do Frozen at the expense of one of the more popular rides after Soarin' and Test Track.

Member 1: Excellent idea, but we still need to address the fact that people will only pull fast passes for Test Track and Soarin'.

Member 3: Simple. We tier the park. They have to choose one between Soarin' and Test Track. And, since we don't want them to realize that we are aware that those two rides are the only ones with any sort of demand, we can add in a couple more low demand rides like Living with the Land to that tier.

Member 1: Brilliant!

LOL

You forgot to mention the Member who asked "Do you think anyone will notice we are building hundred's of resort rooms but not adding any ride capacity?"

FP+ is a result of over selling DVC and too many resort rooms.

Here is where someone will jump in and say "They must be doing something right attendance is up!" Yea, for now.

 

[Missyrose]

But that is what Disney wanted....to prevent guests riding popular attractions multiple times with fastpass. as far as that goal, it's working. Totally understandable that it's not what some guests wanted (the ones who would previously plan to ride popular attractions multiple times with fastpass.)

Except that isn't what Disney wanted, it's just an unintended consequence. Disney wants to lock people into Disney parks for as many days as possible. To do that, they need to allow pre-booked FP+ reservations and get the number of people using FP up from 45-55 percent (legacy) to 75-85 percent (new system). But the rub is Disney has a capacity problem at two of its parks.
So to have enough FP+ reservations for 85 percent of its guests, they had to set limits. Disney is rationing rides not to make things "fair," it's rationing rides to pre-book and pack as many people into the parks as possible. Disney doesn't care if the old system was more fair or less fair to this person or that person. Disney only cares that the new system is adding to its bottom line at a faster clip.

 

[summerskye]

And see, that is something I really struggle with understanding. I just can't for the life of me understand what that board meeting was like.
Member 1: So about this FP+ idea. I like it, but what are we going to do at Epcot and Hollywood Studios? It seems that Soarin' and Test Track will be the two rides that get selected the most and no one really seems to want or even need a Fast Pass for any of the other rides currently.

Member 2: I know! Let's build some more rides that people enjoy! We can reopen Wonders of Life, add in a weather area that has a Frozen Ride, redo Imagination to how it was when people loved it, and add in some more family style rides around World Showcase.

Member 1: More rides? What a terrible idea. Why would we do something like that? You are clearly thinking along the lines of "give the people what they want" but there is no need. Those chumps will keep coming even if we take away rides!

Member 3: Hey! Now there's an idea. Let's take away Malestrom and turn it into a Frozen ride. I mean, we could just update Malestrom or even turn it into a Thor ride since we own those rights and he at least as an actual tie to the country, but why? Let's just do Frozen at the expense of one of the more popular rides after Soarin' and Test Track.

Member 1: Excellent idea, but we still need to address the fact that people will only pull fast passes for Test Track and Soarin'.

Member 3: Simple. We tier the park. They have to choose one between Soarin' and Test Track. And, since we don't want them to realize that we are aware that those two rides are the only ones with any sort of demand, we can add in a couple more low demand rides like Living with the Land to that tier.

Member 1: Brilliant!

I think you actually nailed it.

 

[DISNEYD14]

That's the key! You have to be willing to plan, plan, plan and then be ok if your plans go to crud because of circumstances out of your control.

** Well I felt like I planned planned planned so much more under the old system **
I didn't like 'guessing' what my fast time was going to be. You were not given a choice in the old system
We went at the end of October and loved it so much we are going twice next year. Once in May and again in October.

I liked knowing which rides we had going into it. and for us it worked out perfect but we like to take our vacations at leisure. We got our 3 must haves each day and then if we got more great if not, we just leisurely enjoyed the ambience of the parks. Explored things we never took the time to before.

 

[summerskye]

Except that isn't what Disney wanted, it's just an unintended consequence. Disney wants to lock people into Disney parks for as many days as possible. To do that, they need to allow pre-booked FP+ reservations and get the number of people using FP up from 45-55 percent (legacy) to 75-85 percent (new system). But the rub is Disney has a capacity problem at two of its parks.
So to have enough FP+ reservations for 85 percent of its guests, they had to set limits. Disney is rationing rides not to make things "fair," it's rationing rides to pre-book and pack as many people into the parks as possible. Disney doesn't care if the old system was more fair or less fair to this person or that person. Disney only cares that the new system is adding to its bottom line at a faster clip.

B-I-N-G-O
Winner Winner Chicken Dinner
Wait - Did you make the dining reservation 180 days out? No, so sorry. We have no availability, please head to the nearest store and spend to your hearts content...

 

[JennaDeeDooDah]

LOL

You forgot to mention the Member who asked "Do you think anyone will notice we are building hundred's of resort rooms but not adding any ride capacity?"

FP+ is a result of over selling DVC and too many resort rooms.

Here is where someone will jump in and say "They must be doing something right attendance is up!" Yea, for now.

Sad, but true. My husband and I were talking about the newer additions to Walt Disney World Resort just the other day. I did my college program in Spring of '05. That's when they did The Happiest Celebration on Earth and brought in Lights Motors Action to DHS, Soarin' to Epcot, and Lucky the Dinosaur to Animal Kingdom (now gone). Since leaving in May of '05, I was thinking about what all had been added. Here is what I came up with.

Magic Kingdom: All of Fantasyland (extra Dumbo, Little Mermaid, and Seven Dwarfs Mine Train for rides)
Epcot: Mission Space - yeap, that's all I could think of as far as actual additions to the park go. If I forgot something, please let me know.
DHS: Toy Story Midway Mania, American Idol Experience
Animal Kingdom: Expedition Everest
Now, I probably forgot an attraction or two, but those are ones that came to mind.

Then I thought about all of the resorts that they added. Along with Art of Animation Resort, they added numerous Disney Vacation Club properties: Bay Lake Tower, Animal Kingdom Villas, Villas at Grand Floridian Resort and Spa, and Polynesian's Vacation Club is getting ready to open.


Additions are not proportional. They are adding significantly more places to stay and not adding in attractions to help with the crowds. Attractions that are coming seem to be replacements rather than additions, more often that not, as well.

 

[silenttuba]

No FP at all would mean that people would get to ride fewer rides than they currently do and would be standing in longer lines for many of the rides, correct? Here's the deal. That's why many people dislike FP+. With the old system, most of the people here who are opposed to FP+ were able to ride just about everything they wanted to ride as many times as they wanted to. They were able to get more done in a day and wait in shorter lines. That's why they dislike FP+. It took away the ability to ride certain rides multiple times a day and increased wait time for many rides that never really had much of a wait prior to implementation of FP+. So, your logic behind saying "Perhaps the anti FP+ crowd would prefer the ultimate fair system: no FP at all" has the same logic as switching from FP to FP+ for many of us. And, for whatever it's worth, FP was a perfectly fair system. Everyone had the same opportunity to pull the same fast passes. Some chose to sleep in, park hop, have more dining reservations, etc. which kept them from pulling as many fast passes, but that was their choice. They had the same opportunity as a person who got there at rope drop, stayed at one park, and only did counter service meals. Opportunity was always the same and that's fair. Personal choices made the outcomes different.

According to people I've spoken with familiar with queuing theory, any kind of "fastpass" system ultimately makes standby lines longer. Doing away with the fastpass will bring the average wait time down. Yes, people who used fastpasses won't be able to skip the lines and will have to wait, but overall, waits would be decreased. And no one could argue that it was an unfair system.

As far as the old FP being fair, you have a point, but in many instances, the system didn't work very well. I was at Disneyland in February 2012, and went to DCA first thing in the morning. By the time I got to Radiator Springs Racers, the line TO GET A PAPER FASTPASS was about an hour long. My wife and I hopped in the single rider line, waited about 25 minutes. I believe regular standby was about 90 minutes. Long, yes, but at least it's a line for the ride, not a line to get a pass to ride later.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

Except that isn't what Disney wanted, it's just an unintended consequence.

Yes, it is what they wanted and yes it is what they indended. Maybe not as much as they wanted to lock guests in, but if you really want to go to Universal you're going to blow off those fastpasses anyway.

 

[IWannaBuildASnowman]

I totally agree it's about driving more people to resort properties. That 30 day advantage is huge, and they make a pile more money off resort guests.

 

[jtowntoflorida]

I know some people have nothing but love for the new system and others cannot stand anything about it. But for those in between, don't feel like there aren't any other people like you. There are. We plan our trips, have our frustrations, but in the end, will make the most of it. Hang in there OP!

ITA. I don't like the new system. I think it pretty much blows. I liked the way things were before with the legacy system, but the fact is the legacy system is gone. FP+ is what it is. This December will be our third trip with FP+. It hasn't ruined any of those trips, but it has changed them, and we've had to learn how to adapt. I'll still complain about it, but I'll also still continue to go to Disney and to use FP+.

I will say that I do appreciate FP+ for arrival day. We won't be getting to the parks until around noon(ish). It's a Saturday during party season, so it's going to be BUSY. But we have FP+s for two of our favorites (Peter Pan and Splash) and for 7DMT. I can appreciate that I'd never be able to arrive at the MK at noon on a Saturday and be able to ride Peter Pan without a wait, at noon. With the old system, if there were any FP+ left for Peter Pan at noon, the return time would have been hours in the future, and thus I would be shut out of getting FPs for any other ride for the first two hours we were in the parks. So I do like having the three pre-booked, in three successive hours. But to me, that benefit doesn't outweigh the overall negatives to the system compared to the old system.

 

[agavegirl1]

Just for fun, I looked over my obsessively planned spreadsheet for my recent trip (Oct 17-26 at WDW) to see what portion of my plan was actually executed.

Day One: Made all FP+ reservation, ate at 4 out of 6 kiosks, saw no entertainment (had planned on two)

Day Two: Made 2 out of 3 FP+ reservations. Made 2 of 5 standby plans. Kept our ADR.

Day Three: Made all FP+ reservations and both ADRs. Made 4 of 9 planned standay attractions.

Day Four: Cancelled the entire morning at AK (ADR the day before). Too tired to repeat a park this early in the trip. Evening at Epcot..rode 2 of 3 FP+ and skipped the third because we were bored with the attraction. Made our evening ADR.

Day Five: EP for EMH..rode Soarin standby. By then TT was too long a wait per App. Rode Sum of All Thrills at regular park open with a 15 minute wait. Backtracked to our schedule Behind the Seeds tour. Did Ellen's Energy Adventure and left for MK. At MK we made 2 of 3 FP+ attractions and 1 of 1 standby attraction. Watched the parade while walking out of the park. Dinner at resort.

Day Six: Epcot evening. Made 2 of 3 FP+ reservations (bored again), made our ADR, watched Illuminations while exiting the park. Too crowded to stay for EMH.

Day Seven: AK morning. Rode Safari at RD, made 3 of 3 FP+, had lunch (no ADR) and left the park. Did not see the trails this time either. In fact, we never did.

Day Eight: (went to Busch Gardens, rode and saw everything we wanted, some twice)

Day Nine: Cancelled entire morning at DHS due to crowds (EMH) and being bored with the park. We did want to ride Star Tours a second time but it wasn't worth it for one attraction. Went to MK for afternoon and evening. We made all 3 FP+ reservations and 1 of 3 planned standby attractions. We made our BOG ADR then went toward Adventureland for fireworks. BTMRR wait was too long so we just stood around until we could get past the parade and left the park.

Day Ten: (departure day): made 2 of 3 FP+ attractions (we skipped SM because I didn't want my fillings to rattle out of my teeth again) and 1 of 3 planned standby attractions.

In summary, we cancelled 2 ADRs because we cancelled the entire park visit for that day. We made it to 22 of 27 FP+ reservations. They were missed because we chose not to repeat the attraction or it would conflict with an ADR or other planning. We were unable to ride planned standby attractions more often than we were able to ride them. Lines were just too long to fit into the spaces between FP+, ADRs and hopping plans. One or two days when I spaced our FP+ at more than an hour between, we had better luck fitting in standby rides.

Once I threw much of the plan into the "trash can". I just adjusted my expectations of what could be accomplished and what the impact of crowds. I realized that WDW is getting a bit stale for me, even if I only visit every 4-5 years. I quit waiting for "magic" and just let WDW enhance the experience of being in Florida on vacation with terrific weather.

The bolded parts are the key takeaways to this overlong reply.

 

[silenttuba]

Like Captain EO? Yes, for us it was 3 and out. Everything was hurry up and wait.

I genuinely do not see how it would be possible to spend an entire day and ONLY go on the attractions you had FP+ for. No one likes waiting in line, but it's a Theme Park. Waiting in line is just part of the deal.

I completely agree. Once our AP's run out we're done. For Thanksgiving we are going to NYC, Easter is New Orleans and Summer is London.

Off topic a bit, but some advice for NYC during Thanksgiving: skip the parade, and head up to Central Park the day before to watch the balloons being inflated. It's a cool sight, and you won't have to deal with the crazy crowds and bitter cold you'll likely get for the parade (if you think Disney gets crowded....hoo boy). Also, if you want to go ice skating, skip Rockefeller Center and head to Bryant Park, east of Times Square. It's less crowded (though still crowded), and free; all you have to pay for is skate rental.

 

[Laketravis]

Maybe someday somebody will be able to explain to me how making 3 FP+ reservations equates to "scheduling every minute of the day".

Feels like I've been trying for years, Wis.

I don't know that it equates to it, but at times it can certainly feel like it.

My most current example is the extended hours next week. While that's a great thing in some respects, I had previously obtained three ADR's for Crystal Palace well before rope drop. You remember rope drop, right? It's one of the elements still left to a successful touring plan.

Those ADR's were part of the rope drop strategy, which was part of the FP+ strategy, which was part of the hopping strategy, which was part of the touring strategy.

When WDW extended park hours so that the park would open while I was stuffing my face with Mickey waffles, my plan for rope drop that day went out the window. So I cancelled those ADR's in order to preserve the rope drop strategy as well as the integrity of those 3 FP's for later in the day at a different park.

But now, I have to use those ADR's somewhere - and deciding where/when not only involves current availability (which is a tale of it's own) but also what FP's are already scheduled and hope that any ADR's we might be able to get at such late notice do not overlap the FP+ reservations already made, because having to change those FP+ reservations now runs the risk of losing some of the most sought after ones.

So you see, it can sometimes seem like those puny, miniscule, insignificant just three FP's for events that last at most three or four minutes can have a huge impact on one's day and make it seem like the entire schedule revolves around them and "equates to scheduling every minute of the day".

 

[BarbieGal457]

If you are one of those people that actually wants to have a vacation and just go with the flow than Disney really isn't for you anymore.

I have to honestly disagree. We are very go-with-the-flow and we still completely feel Disney is for us. Why wouldn't it be? It won't kill me or ruin my trip if I don't get a FP for my preferred rides. We take it in stride, wait standby if we want, and if we deem it too long, we move along and will try at a different time. We were never FP warriors, so I can't imagine FP+ will be anything other than a benefit for us. So yes, our vacation will actually stay a vacation.

We like to take our time getting to parks, and when there we hated running all over the place to make sure we got FPs. We rarely would FP things (maybe 2 a day), so maybe that is skewing my view on this whole situation. If you were a person who pulled 10+ FPs a day, I could see how this would affect you. To me, it will be nice to know that after a day at Blizzard Beach, I will have my FP for Test Track already waiting for me.

ETA: I have also wanted to switch days at parks based on weather, our mood, ADRs opening up, etc and of course that is out of the question.

It stinks that you feel so obligated, but that isn't the case for a lot of people. If we want to change plans and cancel ADRs we do it within the allotted frame so we are not charged and to let other people have a chance at them. Granted, we have not used FP+ yet, but I can't imagine feeling so trapped that I believe changing plans is out of the question.

Honestly...it's a ride. I'm not going to begrudgingly go to X park because I have 3 FPs that will take a maximum of 20 minutes total to accomplish. If I don't want to do it...I will just not do it and release the FP+ to someone else. It's as simple as that for us.

ADRs are a slightly different story. If it is one I really am dying to do, and I am now under 24 hours out, yes I will honor it.

You (general) may not get FP+ for all the rides you want, but I'm guessing with paper FPs that happened as well. I just am having a really hard time grasping that people worry from 60 days out about this. What did you do when you got to a park and the paper FPs were gone? You probably waited standby. I can't imagine things do not become available the morning of, or the week of, as people like me change plans. I just can't imagine worrying myself with this, and obligating myself to this, so far out and effectively putting myself in a sour mood that "this is all HORRIBLE and NEVER AGAIN!" before I even got there.

 

[BarbieGal457]

I wanted to add: I am not negating anyone's frustration with this system and hope I didn't come off that way. I understand everyone tours totally different, and yes FP+ may not be for some, but you can't ignore that fact that for others, it is a nice new addition.

I quoted a PP saying that if you like to go with the flow, Disney is no longer for you. The counterpoint to that, I would assume, is if you like to plan a day to the minute and any change in any plan will affect you and put a damper on your mood, maybe Disney is no longer for you.

 

[mom2rtk]

I have to honestly disagree. We are very go-with-the-flow and we still completely feel Disney is for us. Why wouldn't it be? It won't kill me or ruin my trip if I don't get a FP for my preferred rides. We take it in stride, wait standby if we want, and if we deem it too long, we move along and will try at a different time. We were never FP warriors, so I can't imagine FP+ will be anything other than a benefit for us. So yes, our vacation will actually stay a vacation.

We like to take our time getting to parks, and when there we hated running all over the place to make sure we got FPs. We rarely would FP things (maybe 2 a day), so maybe that is skewing my view on this whole situation. If you were a person who pulled 10+ FPs a day, I could see how this would affect you. To me, it will be nice to know that after a day at Blizzard Beach, I will have my FP for Test Track already waiting for me.



It stinks that you feel so obligated, but that isn't the case for a lot of people. If we want to change plans and cancel ADRs we do it within the allotted frame so we are not charged and to let other people have a chance at them. Granted, we have not used FP+ yet, but I can't imagine feeling so trapped that I believe changing plans is out of the question.

Honestly...it's a ride. I'm not going to begrudgingly go to X park because I have 3 FPs that will take a maximum of 20 minutes total to accomplish. If I don't want to do it...I will just not do it and release the FP+ to someone else. It's as simple as that for us.

ADRs are a slightly different story. If it is one I really am dying to do, and I am now under 24 hours out, yes I will honor it.

You (general) may not get FP+ for all the rides you want, but I'm guessing with paper FPs that happened as well. I just am having a really hard time grasping that people worry from 60 days out about this. What did you do when you got to a park and the paper FPs were gone? You probably waited standby. I can't imagine things do not become available the morning of, or the week of, as people like me change plans. I just can't imagine worrying myself with this, and obligating myself to this, so far out and effectively putting myself in a sour mood that "this is all HORRIBLE and NEVER AGAIN!" before I even got there.

You mention that some ADRs are important to you. That's how some people feel about certain rides.

 

[Laketravis]

ADRs are a slightly different story. If it is one I really am dying to do, and I am now under 24 hours out, yes I will honor it.

While for others:

"FP's are a slightly different story. If it is one they really are dying to do, and they are now under 24 hours out, yes, they will honor it."

See how that works?

 

[snayak]

Okay, but can you at least understand why a person who was able to ride a certain ride, let's say Soarin', 3, 4, or even 5 times a day using Fast Pass would dislike FP+ and the fact that he or she can now only ride it once with a fast pass?

And can you also understand how a person might be upset that now, thanks to tiering, that person can only ride Soarin' or Test Track, not both, with FP+ when in the past, with FP, they were able to do both multiple times via fast pass?

And can you see how a person who was able to do favorite attractions multiple times and didn't have to worry about tiering would find FP+ to be considerably more restricting?

And can you see how that person is now irritated that he or she is spending the same or even more money as before to do fewer things he or she desires to do through no fault of his or her own?

And can you understand why people get irritated that they have to plan dining 180 days out, FP+ 60 days out, but Disney will then decide to shut down a ride or restaurant for refurb (that, but the way, they have known about for more than 180 days and just don't announce) and a person who has done all of that planning now has to scramble to find replacements that are rarely up to the level that they had originally chosen?

Or how a person is bothered when Disney changes operating hours or extra magic hours thereby changing what the crowds are going to do and the efficiency of certain dining reservations (prior to park open, right at closing, etc.) and then people have to suddenly change the plans that they had to make 180 or 60 days out?

1. yup
2. yup
3. yup
4. yup
5. yup
6. yup

I didn't say they couldn't be upset, annoyed or otherwise unhappy. I just said they could always use standby.