FP+ Frustration

[JennaDeeDooDah]

Hi Jenna,
Your analysis is pretty spot on. It's a simple trade-off everyone faces. Get them early and pick up a few extras, or hold them till midday and use them when it's busiest. Honestly you can't really go wrong, and whatever you pick you shouldn't approach it like you've picked wrong and might miss out on a few minutes saved. The fact that everyone will approach it with their own strategy means the usage is spread out, so there really is no optimal choice.

On my May trip I did them at all different times. When I did them early, I found plenty after. For example, one day we did Soarin, Nemo, and switched our 3rd to Figment on the fly cuz Turtle Talk had no wait but Figment did. So we knocked out that part of the park early, and were able to get Maelstrom and Mission Space after that. At the MK pretty much everything but Splash Mtn was available late into the day. At DHS, it was a Star Wars Weekend, so after we used our 3, nothing was left (expected). Other days we just picked them midday and that was fine too. I think even those days at the MK we'd still find things like HM and Small World had availability. I think that when you're going will have more impact than anything on what you will get on. We typically hit moderate times and have no trouble getting on tons. Many of the FPs we picked midday we didn't even end up using.

So to answer your question, I would mix it up and do a little of both.

** The only days we had an issue with 4th FP was Epcot even with morning FP+ selections, with that said. We were able to get 4th FP+ for 3 people on TT for a second time and 2 on Soarin ** We just split the family up for our 4th FP

I recommend early FP+ for MK and AK as we had plenty of opportunties for extra FP in both parks at 12noon-1pm

Thank you to you both! This will be my daughter's first trip where she will be tall enough to ride most of the rides as she is currently at 44". When we took her in January, she was just barely at 40", but loved Star Tours, Tower of Terror, and Thunder Mountain. She has wanted to ride Splash for years but it was down when we last went so we know that is a must-do. Snow White is her favorite princess so she really wants to do mine train and now that she is 40", Space Mountain has her really excited. I was trying to figure out how we would do Space, Splash, Thunder, Mine Train, and some of the others (ETWB, Peter Pan, Pirates, Haunted Mansion) and work in FP+ with her. Looks like mixing them up and doing a combination will work best.

Sad to hear about Epcot, though. She has minimal interest in Test Track, but we thought it might be something good to take her on. Spaceship Earth is her favorite, but Soarin' is also right up there. Looks like we might have to be prepared for her to not do Test Track which, again, I don't think she will mind too much since she has never really done it. I just wanted her to experience it so she knew for sure what she would want to do next trip.

I appreciate the responses.

 

[JennaDeeDooDah]

Here is what I would do after experiencing the parks with FP+

MK- I would go to the parks in good time and ride the rides that you know you want to experience, but don't want to waste a FP on. We didn't have problems with long lines on the "secondary" rides, but many people do and a I do believe there are many people who show up with no FP booked, so they go to the kiosk and take what is left. So, pick your 3 FP+ for a little later and do everything else first.

Epcot- We booked TT and went about 30 min after RD and rode Soarin with a minimal standby wait. We also had Figment and SE booked with FP+, but we wouldn't have needed them. I would still keep FP+ a little later and ride the other rides first.

HS- Booked TSMM and went shortly after RD and rode RNR with minimal wait. We also had TOT and Muppets. I would book the FP+ a little later so you can do GMR, Star Tours etc. before lines really start to form. We didn't do the shows this time, so that may throw your plans off a little.

AK- This park is so easy(for us). We booked Dinosaur, EE and Safari. Everything else was minimal wait. I think this park gives the most flexibility because there is no tiering and rides that can be little to no wait.

Excellent write up. Thank you. So maybe, for Epcot, pick two (such as Turtle Talk and Imagination) for early and just plan to actually use one pass for Test Track or Soarin, right? Then start trying to get a fourth earlier since I didn't need passes for the other rides?

 

[wdwcoltsfan]

Excellent write up. Thank you. So maybe, for Epcot, pick two (such as Turtle Talk and Imagination) for early and just plan to actually use one pass for Test Track or Soarin, right? Then start trying to get a fourth earlier since I didn't need passes for the other rides?

Excellent plan!

The only "but" I will add is SE. If you want to ride that, you could schedule it as it fits to your plan. That is only ride(other than TT and Soarin) that started to back up during the day.

 

[JennaDeeDooDah]

Excellent plan!

The only "but" I will add is SE. If you want to ride that, you could schedule it as it fits to your plan. That is only ride(other than TT and Soarin) that started to back up during the day.

Perfect. Thanks.

 

[Mikie]

So to answer your question, I would mix it up and do a little of both.

That's a pretty good idea, especially if you get back often enough to consider it "testing" for your next trip.

For me, we ride a little of everything and ride duplicates if lines are favorable, but don't mind getting only one trip on a ride if lines are long after that. My goal was to ride a few popular rides (I.e. Usually build long waits) with minimal waiting and to not be looking at my watch too much in the day to accomplish it. I did NOT have a goal of accumulating additional FPs unless convenient or riding almost all rides with FP and only tolerating SB waits that were practically walk on (I expect to do SOME waiting at an amusement park)

As a result, I booked my FPs after park was open at least 1.5-2 hours (use low RD crowds at first) and tried booking them around times I knew I'd want to eat/break or an existing ADR. Worked well for me - I found us using our midday FPs when the SB lines were definitely long (so it made me feel it was a "good" FP use) and I wasn't dealing with what to do to fill in an awkward amount of time between FP bookings ("I can't go to my FP yet, but I also don't have time to get in line for X"). only in Epcot did out FPs seem silly - needed them on different days for Soarin and TT, but waiting for a certain time for our others was definitely not needed (spaceship earth and figment actually did get longish waits sometimes, but if we looked again later they were back to 5 min)

I could have gotten more FPs at MK, but the actual kiosks had lines, so we just picked other rides with low SB and skipped the process. So busy at DHS anyway I didn't check for more, and short SB for Everest at AK after our initial FPs so no looking for extras there either.

 

[wisblue]

Excellent plan!

The only "but" I will add is SE. If you want to ride that, you could schedule it as it fits to your plan. That is only ride(other than TT and Soarin) that started to back up during the day.

I would second that, and also add that if she wants to do both Soarin and TT she can get a FP for one and, if she is willing and able to get to the park at or within the first 30 minutes after opening, do the other one with a reasonable wait. In that first 30-45 minutes the actual wait is likely to be shorter than the posted wait.

 

[MrInfinity]

Fuzzy, you based your entire counterpoint on the false assumption I dislike FP+ without considering the reasons I gave that indicate it is not the benefit to new or "regular" guests that supporters make it out to be. What exactly is a "regular" guest, anyway?

I guess I would call a "regular" guest a guest that goes to Disney world but does not aggressively analyze how to min/max/optimize it. Most people I know go to Disney World. But most people I know have never heard of the disboards or crowd calendars and their research more traditional... like talking among friends.

Besides - I love FP+ so there goes your counterpoint.

Well, you convey otherwise. Glad to hear this tho.

Except for Tiers, of course. Hate those. And only being able to make them in one park for the day. Don't like that at all. And that by all accounts there doesn't seem to be anything attractive left for those 4th and beyond FP's. That sucks.

I can't say I would use the word "hate" regarding tiers. We discourage the use of that word in general in our house. I don't like that I can only get TT or Soarin, yet I understand the reality of the number of ridings available, and so to me this is more of "just the way it is" than something to love or hate. That said, in 2 Epcot days, we rode Soarin twice and TT like 4 times. So in practice, the tiering is not serving to prevent one from going on these multiple times if that is your goal. You cannot lock in several, in advance, but with some good planning and general touring sense it's certainly manageable to ride the rides you want.

Seems that first-timers are portrayed as either completely ignorant or totally educated depending on which condition supports the pro-FP view. But yeah, I maintain that first-timers (which is a very large percentage of WDW visitors) would benefit much more if the FP+ choices contained some sort of guidance towards smart choices, just as TS locations contain the advice that "Advance reservations are strongly recommended".

Nah. Information is such that you make it available to those who want it, but for those who are content to not have it, you do not need to force it on them. People can study the most optimal ride if they want to. For others, (like my wife) POTC is their favorite ride, so they just pick a FP to it. Is it optimal? Perhaps not, but it's what they want. I'm a very savvy traveler but I've used FPs on suboptimal rides, and that's ok.

Most first-timers are not completely ignorant. They have phones, they'll figure out the system, and they'll change their rides around lots because the app is there, you have months to use it before your trip, and it's fun. They don't need to be told Splash Mountain goes out the quickest on hot days, because that is something they can just ascertain if that's important to them. If you tell them SM sells out quickly, all you're doing is creating false demand then because more people will pick it, and it'll sell out quicker. There is no benefit to Disney selling something as a must-have just so it'll sell out quicker, and then some ppl will be left unable to schedule it. Just letting people pick spreads the load out as well as can be done.

 

[Suvadoo]

I would say most people in the target audience that Disney markets to has a smart phone. Yes. My mom does not. But if she was to go to Disney, it would be with us, and we have one. So I would say with relative certainty that most people in Disney's target 20-something and 30-something family with kids audience does indeed have a smartphone.

Our kids are required to have google accounts at school. Homework hotline is online, Khan academy is online, grades are online, etc. Sorry to be the messenger but if you do not have a smartphone perhaps it's time to get one if you want to utilize things that are in the now.

EDIT: For certain, Disney should not be gearing their parks TOWARD people who are so out of touch with the now that they do not have internet access or a smartphone. That would make absolutely no sense to make their parks not utilize technology because the occasional person chooses not to. Disney is known for being a leader in this regard.

Wow, I can't believe that you could make such a narrow minded statement about Disney marketing. Last time I checked, the parks were loaded with people of all ages , not just 20 -30 year olds. Additionally, I would point out that most 20-30 year olds don't have the amounts of money to throw around that older people have.

I'm glad you think technology is so great and that Disney is smart for marketing to you, but I have the exact opposite point of view. I think Disney should have invested in rides that incorporate advanced technology, not a stupid app that works sometimes. I can use my iphone and computer anywhere, but I can't experience the rides and atmosphere anywhere else except a Disney park. So again, I disagree with your statement that just an occasional person does not want to use their iphone in the parks.

 

[wdwcoltsfan]

I would second that, and also add that if she wants to do both Soarin and TT she can get a FP for one and, if she is willing and able to get to the park at or within the first 30 minutes after opening, do the other one with a reasonable wait. In that first 30-45 minutes the actual wait is likely to be shorter than the posted wait.

Yep, that's what we did and it worked well. We also had to get to Epcot early pre FP+ because the lines would back up and FP would be gone early in the day. I don't see FP+ as a big change to our touring strategy at Epcot.

 

[summerskye]

OP here.

I wanted to make a few comments.
These comments reflect my opinions. They do not represent the opinions of others or this station...

My intention with this thread was to express "my" frustration with parts of the fp system. I never said I hate it nor love it. I'm sure ther are those who love it and others that hate it. Some may also feel like me and land somewhere in between.

The fact is for "my" situation I am frustrated with the lack of ability to change my mind without a penalty of losing FP choices. In the past, I could wake up and decide to change my choice of parks. I would not lose any ability to gather a few FPs, no more.

These threads seem to have a life of their own. Somewhere it took a few turns and morphed into something new. This is fine but i wanted to make it clear it was not my intention. Again, I simply wanted to voice "my" frustration with "my" situation.

I want to thank all who posted comments along those lines. I hope the snarky posts made to me or others was just a misinterpretation by me.

If you have a trip planned, i hope it is wonderful. If you don't have a trip set, then I wish you the best in setting up a trip.

Peace.

Summerskye

 

[Luckybee]

Here's an issue I'm running into regarding my FP+ selections. Maybe someone can help me out. I have no idea what time to schedule the passes for. On the one hand, if I schedule them for earlier in the day (say 10, 11, and 12ish), I have a better chance of getting a fourth or fifth fast pass. However, I have seen reports that people have had a hard time getting fourth and fifth passes for anything that is really worthy of a fast pass. I have seen other reports, though, that people were able to get fourth and fifth passes for the mountains and such. If I'm not able to get extra passes, though, that leaves me in the dead of the afternoon when lines are longest and no other option than to stand in the longer lines. Now, I can go for later passes (say around 1:30, 2:30, and 3:30), but pretty much eliminates any chance of getting more passes, from what I have read. So what do people most recommend? In the past, with legacy, I knew I would be able to collect as I went and I was also able to monitor current return times so I was better able to have an idea of whether or not passes would be available in an hour, two hours, or more. Not now.

Based on our experience, and on the various comments I've read on the boards I don't think there is a one size fits all answer. The problem is this...I am confident that D has been significantly varying the number of fp's it is releasing perhaps even on a daily basis. We were there at a traditionally slow time(end of Sept /early Oct.). We had non existent fp lines for all except 1 ride. When I say non existent, I mean not a soul in front of us , and yet really long lines for stand by. Trying to change a fp at the park was impossible, getting extras(just for 2) wasn't happening. Yet, people there just a few weeks later when it is traditionally busier apparently had much shorter standby lines and easier fp access( for add'l fp's and changes).
Imho D is tinkering with fp's while they're still "testing". This is why you'll see mass releases of TSSM, A and E, 7DMT etc. This of course makes it very difficult to decide what the best way to handle your own fp's are. YMMV on what happens when you actually get to the park.

 

[mom2rtk]

Based on our experience, and on the various comments I've read on the boards I don't think there is a one size fits all answer. The problem is this...I am confident that D has been significantly varying the number of fp's it is releasing perhaps even on a daily basis. We were there at a traditionally slow time(end of Sept /early Oct.). We had non existent fp lines for all except 1 ride. When I say non existent, I mean not a soul in front of us , and yet really long lines for stand by. Trying to change a fp at the park was impossible, getting extras(just for 2) wasn't happening. Yet, people there just a few weeks later when it is traditionally busier apparently had much shorter standby lines and easier fp access.
Imho D is tinkering with fp's while they're still "testing". This is why you'll see mass releases of TSSM, A and E, 7DMT etc. This of course makes it very difficult to decide what the best way to handle your own fp's are. YMMV on what happens when you actually get to the park.

I think you are absolutely right. And there's no way the guest can tell what is going on behind the curtain.

 

[Luckybee]

I think you are absolutely right. And there's no way the guest can tell what is going on behind the curtain.

Hopefully down the road they'll get this working the way it should. May take a couple of yrs though. I have no intention of continuing to be a guinea pig in the meantime. That said, if we decide to do another Disney holiday I may contact you for ideas about California...I've read your posts and it sounds like you have those parks down pat, whereas we haven't been in about 20 yrs

 

[Suvadoo]

That. And for international travelers, getting a data plan to use in the US (just for getting FP+) can be prohibitively expensive.

I guess Disney doesn't care about your demographic either. After all, why would they want international travelers who spend a lot of time at their resort?

 

[Csaks]

Disney has said absolutely nothing about the system "regulating everything to be more fair." Disney has one goal with the system: to make more money off guests. And the No. 1 way Disney will make more money off guests is to "lock them into" their park days. That way no one is swayed by pesky billboards to visit Universal or Sea World because their Disney days were planned 60 days before.

The consequence of all this is exactly what the OP learned. Yes, you can book things in advance. But if your plans change (or god forbid you book a last-minute trip) you will be pretty severely hampered when it comes to the more popular attractions at Disney.

I don't think this works. We planned 3 Universal days long before we picked our ADR's or FP+. Sadly we had more fun at Universal this trip then Disney and wished we had had less days at WDW and more at Universal. Uni still has that spontaneity Disney had and is working to kill off.

First time we have come home from a trip and have not talked about when we can go back. Being tied to 3 rides, in a certain park, sucks any spontaneity out of a trip. Good luck changing them the night before, unless you think Capt Eo or Figment will be lined up out the door....We go on a vacation to chill and forget real life. Some love planning everything but when the amount of planning is more than I'd ever do at work, theres something wrong with this picture. Planning your dinners is one thing, we always get PH and driving ourselves it wasn't hard to go from place to place if needed.

Plus when there are fastpasses for rides that never needed them in the past and then increasing the average stand by time on those rides. The best I ever saw on Pirates was 20 mins, usually it was around 40, never seen SB for that, past 10 minutes anytime we ever went. I get having FP on the Headliners but not on the old walk ons.

Anyway, it will just open things up for the rest of you folks cause we are not going back anytime soon. Or if we do it will be a four day thing out of two weeks with more and more Orlando area stuff thrown in than ever before. Sorry Mickey, you are losing these die-hard fans slowly.

 

[mom2rtk]

Hopefully down the road they'll get this working the way it should. May take a couple of yrs though. I have no intention of continuing to be a guinea pig in the meantime. That said, if we decide to do another Disney holiday I may contact you for ideas about California...I've read your posts and it sounds like you have those parks down pat, whereas we haven't been in about 20 yrs

I'm not an expert on DL. Yet. But I've been studying hard. We'll be back again in a couple of weeks. And feel free to ask away if you ever decide to head west.

 

[Shaden]

I think you are absolutely right. And there's no way the guest can tell what is going on behind the curtain.

And this is one of the biggest frustrations, indeed why the poster upset about WDW changing the opening time was so rightfully upset.

Its completely unfair to ask people who often start booking trips a year out, have to book ADRs at 180, FPs at 60 and then be paid in full at 45 ... to then change what you have told them would be available days before the trip, or day of the trip ... etc ?

Launch last minute tests etc (like offering FP only on some attractions) without notice ...

These aren't things Disney does (or needs to) do on the fly.
Its funny that so many people defend Disney as this huge corporation who doesn't compare about their complaints etc etc ... but can't see that this same huge corporation doesn't turn on a dime. It plans, it acts slowly, it projects. It probably knows the vast majority of these things are coming, weeks, or months in advance. They could, and should, be much more transparent to the people investing the limited time and money into their magical vacations.

 

[TowMater92]

It's regulating everything to be more fair. The system is great only people who have problems are the ones who can't decide on something and expect to do what they want. It's cutting down on the frequent number of times ppl rides an attraction but garunteed you getting to at least do three of you're choice honestly park hopper is waste of money. During the peak season it's even better cause you go in knowing you get to pass your favorite standby lines.

The system is easy to work you start with three and as the day goes you are able to try and switch if you want to change a fast pass.
Disney is trying to get more structure in the parks I hated the paper fast passes as they were always out when igot to kiosk now before I'm even in the gate I've already got three. However most ppl hate the new system because they don't get as much as they used to since Disney is leveling the playing field

Thats your opinion we've been to WDW enough that we want to go at our own pace, not have to plan out our entire trip and change parks after an afternoon break to ride a certain ride or for any other reason we want. Just because you don't like it and it doesn't fit your vacation style doesn't mean its a waste of money for other people. Planning out everyday of our trip months before we go is not fun to us and it doesn't make it a relaxing vacation its a pain in the (_l_).

 

[IWannaBuildASnowman]

I guess Disney doesn't care about your demographic either. After all, why would they want international travelers who spend a lot of time at their resort?

To be fair - Disney does have free wifi and most hotels offer it now too.

 

[SirDuff]

To be fair - Disney does have free wifi and most hotels offer it now too.

I've not been there since they started offering free WiFi in the parks - good to know it is there now.