Formal Apology to All

[CheshireVal]

CheshireVal, now that I see that was what you're trying to say, I understand what you're saying. It might have been a little helpful if you were more clear on that to begin with...because it implied that you were telling the parents "tough luck" just so no one else would be put out.

I didn't think I really need to clarify the fact that I wasn't asking parents to slowly starve themselves to death. I thought that might have been obvious!

My "tough luck" really meant that once you decide to become a parent, your leisurely uninterrupted meals might be over for a while....

 

[delilah]

Thanks for acknowleging that she might have disturbed some others' good times. While nobody likes to be around a child having a meltdown, I think we all do our best to understand when the it's a situation the parents can't do a thing about (on an airplane, when blocked by giraffes, etc.).

What I have a difficult time tolerating is parents who do have some recourse or ability to remove a melting down child from an area where they are disrupting others but choose not to (a restaurant, a bus stop, etc.). You seem pretty tuned into how your child's tantrum was affecting others so I'm sure you did your best to spare the public when you had the opportunity to do so.

Don't worry about it!

Suppose a child at WDW were having a tantrum, and the parents had come to the park by bus. Now, just how do you propose that they return the child to their room without waiting at the bus stop? Most people need to wait until the bus arrives. The only private place for a child to have a tantrum is the hotel where the family is staying. Everywhere else is public. Most hotel rooms don't have kitchens, so if the child is acting out because he is tired, hot and thirsty, parents, by necessity, will need to get food/drink in a public place. Think about it. Some people don't even have a car accessible when they are at WDW. I know I have taken the shuttle from the airport and relied completely on Disney transportation on more than one trip.

Having a little compassion for your fellow human beings goes a long way toward making the world a better place. I can ignore the young children melting down/having tantrums because, unfortunately, my son has done that, too. As many have pointed out, adults have tantrums, too. We saw a very loud and interesting meltdown at the Morroco pavilion between a woman and her husband because he wanted to have a hamburger instead of Morrocan food! Nearly every trip, I see adults behaving more badly than I have ever seen any child behave.

 

[LuvOrlando]

-

 

[ssleblanc]

I don't know about you guys but when one of my kids misbehaves in public (whether they were toddlers or now) its a lose-lose situation for me.

If I show ANY annoyance with my kids I get looks like I'm abusive and the never helpful comment of 'They're just being kids' like I was going to beat them.
Then
If I try and smooth things over I get looks like I'm spoiling them complete with noses up in the air.

I don't know the right answer but now that my kids are older I just ignore people and their opinions and get to the main business of raising my 2 beautiful, happy children.

Some places are family based and one has to expect certain things in a family place.

(bold text - "bolded" by me...)

I can SOOO relate to that. I've been avoiding posting in this thread because it has gotten just a bit out of hand. But I had to comment on this.

Not too long ago we were at the zoo here in New Orleans (HOT HOT HOT and HUMID!). I was miserable, and the kids were acting up a bit. When I saw the zoo's train approaching on the walkway we were on, I told the kids to move over to the side. My youngest (nearly 6 and my mischevious/deviant/defiant one) got one of his s***-eating grins, and stood right in the middle of the walkway. Now, there WAS time before the train reached us, but I was trying to teach them consideration and safety .... the train is coming, let's move over to the side to make room (and look - where we are moving over - there is the antelope, look how cool!). But, his defiance just struck a nerve and I'd had it (I wouldn't have lost it as much if it hadn't been SOOOO hot). I grabbed his arm, tightly, holding him so that his feet were dragging a bit. I moved him to where I'd told him to go, off to the side. I squatted down, continued to hold his arm (at that point he was squirming and trying to get away and the train was moving closer - I didn't want him to run back out in front of the train and I could see that happening). I proceeded to scold him, for not listening and for not being safe. I explained what could happen had he not listened, and told him that if he disobeyed me once more, we were leaving for the day (heck, I wanted to go home anyone - have I mentioned it was HOT??).

Anyway, the point is that he'd been acting up all day and I took this opportunity to correct him and give him his final warning. I was NOT beating my child, though having seen his behavior that day, some may have said he needed it. But the looks I got from the riders on the train had me worried that they were all going to grab their cell phones and start calling child protective services. You'd think I'd hung him up by his toenails and started whipping him with chains by the looks I got. I didn't let go of his arm until the train had passed, because I know my son and he would have tried to run (and I wasn't in a chasing mood). But what would those same people who gave me horrified looks done had I let him just stand in front of the train, and calmly and meekly said "son, don't do that. Don't stand in front of the train, let the train go by..." as he sat there pushing his limits. Either way, I'm a "bad mom" - a child beater who screams at her child or a mom who spoils her kids, lets them get away with anything and doesn't correct bad behavior.

BTW - he DID apologize to me, and acted right the rest of the day. That was just the "talking to" he needed to correct the behavior I'd experienced that day.

 

[jjarman]

To those who point out that the child won't like being restrained this way... True enough, but that is the price one pays for failing to follow Mom's no-seat-kicking rule. Wanting to avoid the hobble-pants is a really good incentive for keeping one's feet to oneself. Kids who travel with me learn REALLY quickly that you only get one chance, and if you blow it you wear the hobble-pants for the rest of the flight.

I love this. I probably would not go to that much trouble but I like the idea of only getting one chance. I don't understand parents who will just let a child continue with behavior that could be stopped. DS learned real quick what "dry it up right now" meant. He didn't have a lot of meltdowns but I swear he was 12 before he stopped tearing up at least once a day. Having a meltdown is one thing. Not much you can do to stop that. But kicking the seat in front of you can be stopped.

 

[BuzzandAriel'smom]

Once I was in the grocery with my DS2 and DD4. My DS was screaming because he didn't want to be there. It was 5:00pm the friday before Mother's Day and we had company coming and I needed 5 things. I made my DS sit in the cart instead of running a muck and he screamed at the top of his lungs. We got some of the dirtiest looks I had ever seen. One man ended up following me and he stopped me and said "I am a parenting teacher would you like some help?". Being an educated parent I resented the offer but replied "sure, go ahead." He tried his tricks of telling my 2 year old that he was being disruptful and that he was bothering everyone. Needless to say it didn't work. My son started screaming louder.

Most of the parenting books say that you should leave and walk out and that will teach your child a lesson. But if leaving is what the child wants, then in my opinion that just let's the child win. Now they think, hmmm if I cry we will get to go home. I chose to walk quickly and get my groceries as fast as I can. Then I gave him a stern talking to in the car. I now threaten him that if he cries in the grocery then that man will come up and talk to him again.

It's happened to everyone. At least you don't have to find a new grocery now!

 

[DaisyD]

I know all kid have meltdowns and mine were no exception. What we never did though was allow them to disturb others. If a kid had a meltdown then they were removed immedietely from the public area. I have 3 kids with two being older. I can't tell you how many meals DH and I ate seperately so as not to disturb other people. There is NO excuse to continue to let your child disrupt others. None.

 

[heatherfeather24]

Most of the parenting books say that you should leave and walk out and that will teach your child a lesson. But if leaving is what the child wants, then in my opinion that just let's the child win. Now they think, hmmm if I cry we will get to go home. I chose to walk quickly and get my groceries as fast as I can. Then I gave him a stern talking to in the car. I now threaten him that if he cries in the grocery then that man will come up and talk to him again.

Excellent Threat!

This thread has been so interesting -- both about what kids do and what parents do to respond to them.

Although I don't have kids yet, I try really hard not to judge the meltdown situation with one exception. It REALLY honks me off when you see parents in restaurants who are oblivious to their kids' existence. By this, I don't mean the parents who are ignoring short-term meltdowns, but the parents who never seem to acknowledge that their kids are even with them at the restaurant. I can't imagine that there exists a five year old who wouldn't act up during a 1-2 hour meal wihen he/she has received absolutely NO parental attentention throughout. Shoot, I couldn't sit through a 1-2 hour meal without melting down if nobody talked to me. If you don't want to pay attention to your kids at the restuarant, get a sitter!

 

[Chuck65]

One thing that really helped us out was, especially with my daughter, is we allowed her to pitch her fits. The rule was she could pitch one as long as she wants but she had to be in her room at our house with the door closed. Any time she started one, I would remind her that she only could only do that in her room. Granted, this took time and it may not work with every child, but it is one tool that you can use. It got to the point that when she started one, I would look at her and she would immediately stop. She figured it's just not worth the effort.

 

[disneyfan19712006]

OK, I can totally understand how there's not much you can do about the temper tantrums--it happens.

But I draw the line at letting her kick some poor person's seat for 2 hours. That you definitley could have stopped.

Hope your next trip goes better!

When a small child is in a small space they can feel confined just as an adult would. They don't always understand that they are causing a problem. I had a stewardess tell me to just let the child be instead of constantly trying to make him sit still. He was wearing his seat belt around his neck as he kept purposly sliding off the seat to the floor. He eventually quieted down and ignoring him for a little while seemed to make his recovery quicker. By the way the people in the seat he was kicking suggested it. No right or wrong answers with small children. Just deal the best you can. Most of us understand children. They don't have the self control of adults. Can't get off a plane mid-flight. LOL.

 

[darlene9947]

One thing that really helped us out was, especially with my daughter, is we allowed her to pitch her fits. The rule was she could pitch one as long as she wants but she had to be in her room at our house with the door closed. Any time she started one, I would remind her that she only could only do that in her room. Granted, this took time and it may not work with every child, but it is one tool that you can use. It got to the point that when she started one, I would look at her and she would immediately stop. She figured it's just not worth the effort.

OMG!! My DS, 28, was the same way! I told him he could pitch a fit as long and as loud as he wanted as long as he did it in the bathroom!! He would actually walk there without being told when he just wanted to scream!!!

Thanks for the memories

 

[sameyeyam]

I print up "Meltdown Coupons" for my family before we leave. They get 1 for each day. You can save them up and use multiple coupons on one day. If we are going on vacation for 7 days you get 7 coupons. The coupon entitles the bearer to "complain, yell, rant, rave, stomp their feet, etc..." for a few minutes. All you have to do is hand over your Meltdown Coupon to Mom. Everyone in the family has to stop and just listen, you can't say a word, just listen! Even us parents aren't allowed to comment afterward. It's their meltdown, not ours!

More often than not, after about 1 minute the person having the meltdown starts laughing because we are all just staring at him/her! It's actually a pretty good way to keep everyone's temper in check when dealing with hot weather, long lines, etc...

I've actually overhead the kids saying "well, I wanted to use my Meltdown Coupon, but it just wasn't worth using it for that!". I usually use at least one of my coupons in the airport!

 

[sameyeyam]

I print up "Magical Meltdown Coupons" for my family before we leave. They get 1 for each day. You can save them up and use multiple coupons on one day. If we are going on vacation for 7 days you get 7 coupons. The coupon entitles the bearer to "complain, yell, rant, rave, stomp their feet, etc..." for a few minutes. All you have to do is hand over your Magical Meltdown Coupon to Mom. Everyone in the family has to stop and just listen, you can't say a word, just listen! Even us parents aren't allowed to comment afterward. It's their meltdown, not ours and everyone needs time to vent, even 8 year olds!

More often than not, after about 1 minute the person having the meltdown starts laughing because we are all just staring at him/her! It's actually a pretty good way to keep everyone's temper in check when dealing with hot weather, long lines, etc...

I've actually overhead the kids saying "well, I wanted to use my Meltdown Coupon, but it just wasn't worth using it for that!". I usually use at least one of my coupons in the airport on the way to Disney!

 

[MartDM]

Hey Mr. Too-Much Time-On-His-Hands, Yet-don't-have-enough-time-to-read-all-the-posts...

1. I am not a man, I am a woman
2. Your insinuation that I have too much time on my hands simply because I have a differing opinion is rather illogical
3. I have read every post on this board
4. Your post illustrated the points of my previous post perfectly

 

[cleo]

This one is SO ready for closing!

But...there are a lot of great ideas from people who aren't too busy bickering at each other to keep on topic.

The idea of Meltdown Coupons made me cringe at first, thinking "Geez, it's like an invitation to behave badly!" Then I read the rest of the post and thought, "Yup, my family would end up laughing, too!" I'm going to file that one away as a terrific idea.

I personally disagree with not leaving the park just because it's 'what the kid wants'. I'd agree if it's happening at the grocery store or someplace that doesn't have the intensity of a theme park vacation, but I do think it's a kids way of telling Mom and Dad they really HAVE had enough. A day at the pool or just relaxing at your resort is probably more what they need than any 'lesson' you think you're teaching them.

Just my opinion.

 

[gymborocks]

Once I was in the grocery with my DS2 and DD4. My DS was screaming because he didn't want to be there. It was 5:00pm the friday before Mother's Day and we had company coming and I needed 5 things. I made my DS sit in the cart instead of running a muck and he screamed at the top of his lungs. We got some of the dirtiest looks I had ever seen. One man ended up following me and he stopped me and said "I am a parenting teacher would you like some help?". Being an educated parent I resented the offer but replied "sure, go ahead." He tried his tricks of telling my 2 year old that he was being disruptful and that he was bothering everyone. Needless to say it didn't work. My son started screaming louder.

Most of the parenting books say that you should leave and walk out and that will teach your child a lesson. But if leaving is what the child wants, then in my opinion that just let's the child win. Now they think, hmmm if I cry we will get to go home. I chose to walk quickly and get my groceries as fast as I can. Then I gave him a stern talking to in the car. I now threaten him that if he cries in the grocery then that man will come up and talk to him again.

It's happened to everyone. At least you don't have to find a new grocery now!

I can totally understand your situation. You really didn't have the option of leaving and, in any case, a grocery store isn't a place where someone would be forced to sit next to your screaming child for 20 minutes (or 5) while trying to eat in relative peace.
I feel for parents when they're trapped (like on the safari) but I wouldn't stay at any type of restaurant - McDonalds included - if either of my children threw a fit.

 

[mking624]

I'd be interested in hearing responses if the child was autistic....where episodes of what may appear to be a tantrum can and do happen. Should we expect the parents to always remove the child? Especially considering that the child cannot help their condition...yet I'm sure there are plenty of people who judge the parents because of the episode.

 

[MushyMushy]

I'd be interested in hearing responses if the child was autistic....where episodes of what may appear to be a tantrum can and do happen. Should we expect the parents to always remove the child? Especially considering that the child cannot help their condition...yet I'm sure there are plenty of people who judge the parents because of the episode.

Yes, I expect parents of an autistic child to be as considerate to those around them as parents of any child having a tantrum. I have a child with behavioral disorders too, so I stand firmly behind that opinion and practice what I preach (or did when he was small anyway).

 

[Frankiesmom]

As the mother of an autistic child we know all about meltdowns;but we do take turns waiting outside/removing the DS so as not to disturb others.I know how annoying it can be to have to remove a kid from a situation-but I also know that other people are not interested in hearing my DS scream. And it sometimes increases his frustration level when people are staring at him. So if any of you see a tired Mom/Dad next week @ WDW with a little blond boy waiting outside any attractions/restaurants that will be us. Kids will be kids. LOL

 

[mking624]

I just find it a shame that people stare in the first place. They want consideration for them...but they give none themselves. I find the whole thing simply amazing.