First MNSSHP - Oversold?

[StacyStrong]

Then this entire thread is a complete waste of your time. If a picture is worth a thousand words, how much would you say the TP video is worth? There was plenty there for anyone to see that the crowd level was silly for a "hard ticket event".

Cool

I'm literally not arguing that it wasn't crowded or oversold. In fact it probably was.

What I am saying is that my tolerance or goals for a party might be different than someone else's.

Not sure why that's contentious.

 

[Disneylover99]

I would be interested to hear a crowd comparison tomorrow from anyone who went to the first party and the second party tonight.

 

[OneinThree]

Cool

I'm literally not arguing that it wasn't crowded or oversold. In fact it probably was.

What I am saying is that my tolerance or goals for a party might be different than someone else's.

Not sure why that's contentious.

I can understand that, *but*, here's my issue: If the experience during a party is essentially going to mirror a typical day, I don't see the justification for the hard ticket premium. Meeting characters, seeing a parade, watching fireworks, -these are all things which have always been included as part of general admission at MK. I'm hoping to take my kids to a MVMCP for the first time later this year, also hoping that Disney does not continue to increase attendance at these parties. Otherwise, it's just not worth the ~$600 admission, IMO.

 

[WanderlustNZ]

I'm just curious for those who are dissatisfied:

Would you rather a hard cap at say 60 percent of current levels, pretty much assuring every party night is an early sell out, so getting in requires long-term advanced purchase?
or
More parties, so there are fewer "regular" days with longer hours?
or
Ticket prices increased to the point where the crowds diminish because of value?
or
WDW abandon the idea altogether?

Or if you've got another idea, please share it. Not trying to be snarky, but I can see how many people are frustrated with the event, and I'm wondering what their solution might be.

Only because you asked: All your options except the second one seem prefereable to me right now.

My preferred option would be the hard cap. If I can decide what type of food I’m going to feel like eating 180 days in advance, I can also decide in advance whether or not I want to go to a party.
I’m also happy to save harder and pay a bit more (within reason) if I could be assured that a premium price matches a premium experience.
However, given that right now I’m not convinced that the experience is premium and are skipping parties altogether, I guess I also don’t mind option 4. During my visit, TP are forecasting twice the crowd levels on non-party day’s than party days. So not only is the party experience diminishing, so is the non-party one.
People still love the parties, so of course I wouldn’t want them gone altogether (that would be selfish and I’d be flamed for the next 5 pages ), but to get better value out of my regular, yet still expensive, passes, less parties doesn’t sound too bad to me right now. Of course it’s never going to happen; Disney makes a fortune out of the parties. I just wish, for the sake of visitor experience, that that fortune had some sort of cap on it.

 

[billyjobobb]

the carts for merch and the popcorn bucket were likely longer because of people who have already sold the stuff on places like eBay.

We spoke with 2 personal shoppers who were swamped with orders.

 

[StacyStrong]

I can understand that, *but*, here's my issue: If the experience during a party is essentially going to mirror a typical day, I don't see the justification for the hard ticket premium. Meeting characters, seeing a parade, watching fireworks, -these are all things which have always been included as part of general admission at MK. I'm hoping to take my kids to a MVMCP for the first time later this year, also hoping that Disney does not continue to increase attendance at these parties. Otherwise, it's just not worth the ~$600 admission, IMO.

I'm not defending Disney though. I'm not saying it's worth the $600 admission. I'm not saying it's not too expensive or that Disney shouldn't do something to alleviate those problems.

ALL I am saying is that for me personally, it's hard for me to rely on some of the reports. I'm 29. I go to Disney with one friend my age. I don't have to push kids through packed crowds with a stroller. I won't have a toddler crying on my arm if they can't meet Moana or see over an adults head at the parade. I spend 100 for one ticket. My experience WILL differ from someone with 4 kids or someone with an ECV. I'm not saying that's okay or fair. But its a fact. If I take every persons experience and say it will be mine, that's just not true.

So yes. I believe it's crowded and I understand frustration at spending 600 for a huge crowd. I get that. I understand that. But that won't be my experience. And 100 is a lot easier to justify than 600.

So, to me, I read these threads to get an idea of what to expect, but at the end of the day, my experience won't be the same as every one else's and I need to figure it out for my situation.

And that's not defending Disney at all. So I can't understand why you're coming at me like I'm saying everyone is lying about what they experienced or like I think it's no big deal. It is a big deal. I understand that.

 

[tlmadden73]

Interesting --

Why are the parties popular?
Is it simply the "unique" experiences you get at night to celebrate Halloween (in August?) - like the parade, the costumes, the candy?
Or is it due to the perceived "it will be less crowded" because it is a special paid event?

Or a bit of both.

Frankly, if I paid that much money and had to deal with crowds equal to or more than a typical day, I would be upset and never consider a party again.

I haven't done the parties (kids too young to stay up that late to be worth it), but from the fact they are so often and so crowded, I don't see it as worth it. Heck I plan on going to MK on a Christmas Party day in November BECAUSE I've heard it is not crowded since the park closes early.

The parties seem to be a boondoggle now.
1) They close their most popular park early 2-3 times a week (or 4 times sometimes). So those guests get less value for their ticket dollar.
2) They charge almost the price of full admission to go the park for less than half a day (and I bet a lot of guests have a ticket to go to another park earlier in the day).
3) They don't seem to limit the crowds to make the "extra" things you are paying for easy to access (Candy, parades, etc.)

Would the parties be less or more popular if Disney actually released the NUMBER that they limit them too. I mean they could use it in promotion "Get your tickets for this Halloween party .. only 1000 tickets left!"

And if people knew there was a hard cap on attendance, it would be more appealing.

 

[OneinThree]

Would the parties be less or more popular if Disney actually released the NUMBER that they limit them too. I mean they could use it in promotion "Get your tickets for this Halloween party .. only 1000 tickets left!"

And if people knew there was a hard cap on attendance, it would be more appealing.

I'd rather pay $1000 for a 20,000 head hard cap than pay $600 for mayhem. It may be a higher price, but I'd know that in advance and wouldn't feel like I've been taken.

 

[tlmadden73]

I'd rather pay $1000 for a 20,000 head hard cap than pay $600 for mayhem. It may be a higher price, but I'd know that in advance and wouldn't feel like I've been taken.

Right it seems like Disney is definitely taking advantage of the popularity of something that was initially created to DRAW people to WDW during the low-crowd off seasons months. They are now so popular, those off-season events have made the months of October/November probably more crowded than some summer months!

We, as fans, have created and fed the beast

 

[rastuso]

We've been going to MNSHHP every year for - well, a long time. It remains one of our favorite events at WDW. Last year, we did two in one week. We don't do character meet and greets. We spend our time trick or treating, riding our favorite rides over and over with minimal wait times and enjoying the fireworks and second parade. We always watch the fireworks in front of the castle -- walking up about five minutes before. We always have plenty of room -- it's nothing like watching HEA. Then we enjoy the second parade, never having any trouble finding a spot in the Liberty Square area.

Every year, the first party of the season is a mess. But then things calm down and are fine. We're headed to MNSSHP Sept. 18, and we fully expect to have the same great time we have every year.

I'd love to know what alternate universe you are in where there is plenty of space right in front of the castle 5 minutes before fireworks.

Are you in a wheelchair?


I also wonder if some exclusive Nights, at double price, and half crowds may be a great idea. However, the meet and greets would still be bad. Lots of folks skip Jack and Sally because of lines, even at half crowds, they'd have a long line. Jafar, I simply don't understand. The Tweedles? No clue why they have huge lines. I don't mind spending an hour in line when that hour costs me around $35 of my ticket prices for my family. If that becomes $50, I don't know.

Clearly, Jack and Sally need to be inside, in a highly themed area, with multiple pairs. That would make a LOT of people happy.

 

[billyjobobb]

hey! Tweedles is one of my must do M&G!

 

[greg9x]

I'd love to know what alternate universe you are in where there is plenty of space right in front of the castle 5 minutes before fireworks.

If by 'In front of the castle' they meant in the hub and not right at the front, then yes, you could have gotten a space 5 minutes before. It's not as packed as HEA on a regular night. I kept waiting for people to pack in around us, and they didn't.. we were back of the circular part of hub with a good view and space around us if others wanted to stand there. Despite the crowded nature of the evening, It wasn't bad for fireworks.

Edit:
Our view during fireworks... Got space 10 minutes before... Notice space in front of us, 5-6 ft ?

 

[billyjobobb]

It looks like many come year after year and the fireworks look to be a 1 and done thing.

 

[Melanie230]

We went last year to the October 13th (I think that is right) party. WOW...SOLD OUT. It was crazy busy. We drove up from our cruise and spent the night at AOA. We met a family on the bus that was upset that they had attempted to purchase tickets to the party that morning but it was busy so they decided to wait til that afternoon to purchase them. When they went back to get the tickets they were told it was sold out. She was so upset. I told her that if we hadn't driven all the way from Ft Lauderdale and we were going home the next morning...I would sell her our tickets. It is not fun to go to a sold out event. It is crazy!

 

[OhhBother]

If by 'In front of the castle' they meant in the hub and not right at the front, then yes, you could have gotten a space 5 minutes before. It's not as packed as HEA on a regular night. I kept waiting for people to pack in around us, and they didn't.. we were back of the circular part of hub with a good view and space around us if others wanted to stand there. Despite the crowded nature of the evening, It wasn't bad for fireworks.

Yes, this exactly. We wander into the hub about five minutes before Happy Hallowishes starts. They're always at least a couple of feet of empty space around us. It's a completely different experience than watching HEA where everyone is packed in like sardines. I'd never do a dessert party during MNSSHP because, in my experience, it's simply not necessary. However, I am doing a dessert party next month for HEA. We're not particularly interested in the desserts. I just like having some elbow room to watch the fireworks.

And, to answer the previous poster's question, I do not live in an alternate universe, and I'm not in a wheelchair. I'm just telling you what I consistently experience, year after year, when I attend one to two weeknight MNSSHP events during mid-September and early October.

Here's a photo I took right before the fireworks started at last year's party on Sept 19. Plenty of elbow room. We literally walked up to this space right before the fireworks started. We came over from Tomorrowland, where we had been riding Buzz over and over.

 

[mickey0624]

So we were down in the world from Aug. 12-20 and were so excited when a few months ago we found out that the first Halloween party was scheduled for August 17th. We immediately bought tickets greatly looking forward to it. The last one we went to was about 15 years ago and it was the first time with kids. All I can say is what a HUGE disappointment.

First of all...man was it crowded. I didn't expect an empty park but it was more crowded than any day we went to the MK during the trip (3 times). I heard it was oversold. Even with the crowds, most of the ride lines were manageable with most 15 minutes or less. But we werent there for the rides.

We made this a resort day knowing it would be a late night. So we got to the MK exactly at 4:00 and immediately went over to Storybook Circus to see where the 7 dwarfs would be. The line was already over an hour long. Which means not only waiting until they came out (which was about 6:30) but an hour beyond that. The line for Jack and Sally was at almost 2 hours. Are you kidding me? So we dismissed that and figured we'd enjoy the rest of the party.

The additions to the rides were nothing to write home about. Space Mountain was cool in the pitch black, but nothing mind blowing. Adding live characters to Pirates was a good idea, but I thought there'd be more than two on the line and only one inside. And the tea cups werent even worth the wait.

Candy lines were long, but moved quick and we did come home with a lot of candy. Hocus Pocus show was good but soooo crowded (we went to first one) but I heard other two were crowded. Parade was real good too, but again super crowded. and Hallowishes was great, even though I'm not a huge fireworks fan. Dance parties were blah. Was hoping for so many more Halloween activites around the park.

So for almost $80 a person x 5 people, definitely did not think it was worth it. I don't mind paying, but the crowds and what they offered, was super disappointing. Only picture we ended up with was with the grave diggers. We stayed until about 11:30. Don't think I would do it again even if we were down there for it. So much more Disney could have done with a little more effort. And again..the crowds...I know Disney doesn't release numbers but it was absurd for an extra paying event.

 

[SaintsManiac]

There is an entire thread dedicated to this already.

 

[Love Tink]

But what would Disney's motivation be for doing this? The whole point of this thread is that Disney is selling more tickets than ever to the parties, so why spend more money on the party attractions? There have been threads like this almost every year for the past decade about how much more crowded MNSSHP is than it used to be. Disney is having no trouble selling the tickets, so why "plus" the offerings?

The reason to try to improve the parties is simple: to offer a great guest experience.

Disney World has goals in addition to making money. There is an institutional precedent on “good show” and excellent customer relations that dates back to Walt. It is as integral to their brand as Mickey Mouse.

Have you ever experienced a hiccup at a Disney park or resort? They bend over backwards to fix anything they can fix. Their customer service is legendary.

I guarantee that, beyond the lost revenue from refunds, they are not happy that guests left that first party feeling miserable about a night at a Disney park. If I didn’t believe that I wouldn’t be a Disney parks addict in the first place.

 

[Missyrose]

The reason to try to improve the parties is simple: to offer a great guest experience.

But if the parties continue to sell more and more tickets each year, how is Disney to know it isn't providing a good guest experience? Anyone who was unhappy enough to swear off the parties in past over-crowded years has been replaced (and then some) by other guests in subsequent years.

Disney World has goals in addition to making money. There is an institutional precedent on “good show” and excellent customer relations that dates back to Walt. It is as integral to their brand as Mickey Mouse.

Have you ever experienced a hiccup at a Disney park or resort? They bend over backwards to fix anything they can fix. Their customer service is legendary.

Yes, I'm quite familiar with Disney customer service. Problem is, party customer service has exactly 2 1/2 outcomes:

1. Refund
2. Tickets to another party, which only exacerbates overcrowding issues.
2 1/2: Anytime FPs

I guarantee that, beyond the lost revenue from refunds, they are not happy that guests left that first party feeling miserable about a night at a Disney park. If I didn’t believe that I wouldn’t be a Disney parks addict in the first place.

Unless people have en masse called/written Guest Relations, Disney will never know that people were miserable. Disney deals with numbers and if there's a huge drop-off between last year's numbers and this year's numbers, or if advanced sales trail off next year, then it will spur Disney to action. Otherwise, Disney is perfectly happy with the status quo.

Trust me, I wish I were less cynical about this.

 

[Missyrose]

Also, Disney has started treating the parties as a zero-sum game. Want to add another set of Jack and Sally? Find two other characters to cut. It's frustrating for guests, but it's how Disney operates at the moment.