Even Disney Is Worried About the High Cost of a Disney Vacation

[jshadd]

Wall Street journal article….

The Happiest Place on Earth has long felt like one of the most expensive spots on the planet for many Americans—but the allure of a magical family vacation kept visitors streaming in. Then, as postpandemic demand soared, Disney put price hikes into overdrive, putting vacations at its theme parks out of reach for many American families. Attendance growth has slowed over the past few years, and even some families that were once regulars are canceling their pilgrimages.

One-day adult passes to Disneyland broke the $200 mark for the first time in October. It now costs $206 on the most popular days at the theme park, more than $100 more than the price of admission on the lowest-cost day.

Five years ago, the skip-the-line feature FastPass was free. Now visitors choose from three different tiers of Lightning Lane passes for the privilege—the most expensive reaching $449 a person a day. Doing without Lightning Lane can mean spending an hour or more waiting in line for the most popular rides, eating up visitors’ vacation time.

Some inside Disney worry that the company has become addicted to price hikes and has reached the limits of what middle-class Americans can afford, according to people who have worked on park pricing. Internal discussions over whether Disney parks may be losing their grip on the hearts and wallets of families with young kids have become more frequent, some of those people said.

https://www.wsj.com/business/disney-parks-price-hikes-consumers-0bf4dbd6

 

[Minnie1222]

Internal discussions over whether Disney parks may be losing their grip on the hearts and wallets of families with young kids have become more frequent, some of those people said.

I've been going to Disney for 40+ years. There are more children in the parks than ever, as evidenced by the seas of parked strollers. If the pricing were lower, none of us would be able to navigate the park without tripping over children or strollers.

 

[thanxfornoticin]

I've been going to Disney for 40+ years. There are more children in the parks than ever, as evidenced by the seas of parked strollers. If the pricing were lower, none of us would be able to navigate the park without tripping over children or strollers.

Us, TOO! Just had this discussion 2 weeks ago when we were there for a week. We never remember seeing so many strollers. That means either lots of kids are still coming (which they are), and/or we've become so adverse to having kids walk that more people feel the need for strollers! We visit often, and there are plenty of little kids running around enjoying the magic.

 

[Gentry2004]

Agree. They can’t make it cheaper or even keep it the same because there are already too many people who want to go. If middle class families are deterred, it sure does not show. Not everyone in the parks these days can possibly be “rich.”

 

[dvc lover 1970]

I think disney in 10 years will be very different from disney today. DVC has helped to keep the parks crowded with an unending flow of people due to the DVC rooms filling up and hotel conversion to dvc. However, I do think as disney keeps building more timeshare units, we will eventually see a turn around. Agree the parks are really crowded. We go in the summer and it is miserable.

 

[Bibbidi_Boo]

Us, TOO! Just had this discussion 2 weeks ago when we were there for a week. We never remember seeing so many strollers. That means either lots of kids are still coming (which they are), and/or we've become so adverse to having kids walk that more people feel the need for strollers! We visit often, and there are plenty of little kids running around enjoying the magic.

It more people take kids under age 5 then every before and more people keep strollers for kids up to age 8-10 when you use to never really see strollers past age 4.

 

[tjkraz]

I think disney in 10 years will be very different from disney today. DVC has helped to keep the parks crowded with an unending flow of people due to the DVC rooms filling up and hotel conversion to dvc. However, I do think as disney keeps building more timeshare units, we will eventually see a turn around.

Due to the ending date of DVC contracts, the number of rooms won't continue to grow indefinitely. Right now they have unsold inventory at Poly, Riviera and FTW cabins, plus Lakeshore under construction. They only need to get to the early 2040s before Disney reclaims 4 resorts at WDW and can refurbish and re-sell.

We don't know how large Lakeshore is, but just 1 or 2 more DVC projects could be enough to fill the gap sales-wise.

Agree the parks are really crowded. We go in the summer and it is miserable.

This isn't solely directed at you but I'll never understand how the parks can be both too crowded and too expensive...

 

[Brian Noble]

DVC has helped to keep the parks crowded with an unending flow of people due to the DVC rooms filling up and hotel conversion to dvc.

There are a total of about 5,000 DVC rooms. Suppose they average 3 guests per room, and every single one of those guests visits a theme park every single day they are there. That's 15,000 guests per day.

That sounds like a lot, until you realize that the average day across the four theme parks sees north of 133,000 people.

 

[Brian Noble]

The Parks & Resorts folks are wise to pay attention to "tipping point" moments---those where a Disney vacation is no longer seen as a rite of passage for a certain set of middle-class families, and an aspirational status marker for many families of slightly lower means. They are not at that moment now, and they incessantly survey their guests to make sure they are not getting too close. It is useful to have different perspectives in the room when setting price points, etc.

But, for now, the parks do occupy that rite-of-passage/status-marker position, and that gives them significant pricing power.

Siva ko!

 

[thanxfornoticin]

This isn't solely directed at you but I'll never understand how the parks can be both too crowded and too expensive...

Because 'too crowded' and 'too expensive' are not quantifiable and are in the eyes of the guest. Some are more open to more people. Some are less concerned with how much they spend - at Disney World or most anywhere else for that matter.

But one thing is very clear to us - Disney better get moving and follow through with the park changes and expansions going on for the next year or 2. The parks seem more crowded now because there are fewer attractions right now. More attractions, new attractions, updated attractions - will help with the crowds. OR, it will bring in more people! I care much more about their parks and attractions expansion than I do their hotel/DVC rooms expansion...... of course, more crowds are likely to lead to more price increases, aren't they?!

 

[Elijah Abrams]

I wish Bob Iger would leave sooner than next year. I’m hoping though that his successor will lower prices and bring back offerings like Magical Express.

 

[HopperFan]

Was about 6x a year pre-COVID, now 3-4x a year. I've watched the crowds swell to pre-COVID sizes. I have had a few random days I felt were slow but overall those parks are not hurting for guests, so ticket prices are not a deterrent. Personally when compared to other luxury entertainment I think ticket prices are reasonable.

I think where Disney is hurting and it is very blatant is hotel rooms and table service dining. We went a time where discounted rooms were fairly minimal. Now not only am I finding rooms with lower rack rate but a slew of discounts to choose from. Weeks that were untouchable for us, now are deeply discounted. Getting Value rooms for $115-126 when offsite hotels are costing more is not normal. In planning trips spring break literally there are ADRS available all day every day for most restaurants. Also had no trouble booking tours I know for us we dropped some Table Service to pay for LL.

SO it seems parks are crowded and full, but guests are saving money by staying offsite and eating less TS. We can't know what the spending is on snacks and souvenirs (optional items) but perhaps they are lower as well. My guess is if Disney is concerned about park income, it is likely lags in areas not visible to us.

 

[tjkraz]

Because 'too crowded' and 'too expensive' are not quantifiable and are in the eyes of the guest. Some are more open to more people. Some are less concerned with how much they spend - at Disney World or most anywhere else for that matter.

My question was mostly rhetorical. (Mostly.) But you're right...there will never be a way to satisfy everyone. And that's basically where every one of these discussions ends up.

Well, except for the people who think the combination of "less crowded" and "cheaper" is a business model that Disney will pursue. And that's simply not realistic. If they lowered prices, crowds would only grow. And if they invest in major park expansions, higher prices are a given.

There are still times when business dips, prompting ticket incentives like last summer's 4 park offer. And there are many times when the parks are slow(ish) with shorter wait times. But they aren't necessarily predictable. The other day I waited 20 minutes for Rise and Smuggler's Run was a walk-on. Couple days earlier waited 20 min for Space Mountain.

As much as we're worried about Disney pricing-out some customers, the rise of the "Disney Adult" appears to be a new phenomenon. In my 50-ish years on this planet, vacation habits have changed dramatically. I grew up firmly middle class...a small house in a nice neighborhood with one TV and an above ground pool. But vacations were still a luxury. Most were road trips to nearby amusement parks or beaches. I went to WDW exactly once before age 25, staying at a condo in Ft Lauderdale and riding "If You Had Wings" over and over again because it didn't require a ticket. I'm not sure that Disney is any less obtainable these days. Deluxe hotels, Lightning Lanes and 5 visits over 3 years aren't necessary elements of the rite of passage.

 

[mgarbowski]

According to Pew Research, the percentage of people in the Upper Income tier has nearly doubled since 1971. Plus the country has grown, and even a flat percentage would have meant more wealthy families today. There are simply many more moderately to very wealthy people than ever.

My next point is more debatable, but I believe it's pretty clear that even middle class people are wealthier today and have more disposable income than when I was growing up and beginning adulthood in the 1970s and 1980s. (If you disagree, I'm not going to argue or try to prove it - I'll just rest on the first point anyway).

There's just a lot more people and much more money chasing the same WDW experience. Theme parks aren't widgets. They can't just ramp up production as demand grows. So Disney modulates demand by raising prices.

 

[HokieRaven5]

For the US at least, the top 20% of earners account for 70%+ of the total wealth. It’s not a surprise that Disney as well as many other corporations are chasing those $$s when those are the people with the most disposable income.

 

[katiebelle21]

IMO, 2008-2010 were the best Disney years--you had magical moments, it was fairly affordable, EMH, airline checkin and Magical Express. And if you were lucky, you'd get a sweet PIN code too.

 

[tjkraz]

IMO, 2008-2010 were the best Disney years--you had magical moments, it was fairly affordable, EMH, airline checkin and Magical Express. And if you were lucky, you'd get a sweet PIN code too.

There were also no MagicBands. No Disney app or online dining reservations. No “New Fantasyland” or TRON. No Galaxy’s Edge or Toy Story Land. No Cosmic Rewind, Remy or Moana, plus the “tombstones” at Epcot entrance. No Pandora. Disneyland / DCA didn’t have GE, Runaway Railway, CarsLand, Avengers Academy, IncrediCoaster, Ariel…

The most cutting edge attractions the parks were putting out back then were things like The Seas with Nemo, Laugh Floor and Lights, Motors, Action.

I guess there’s a price to be paid somewhere along the way.

 

[Minnie1222]

IMO, 2008-2010 were the best Disney years--you had magical moments, it was fairly affordable, EMH, airline checkin and Magical Express. And if you were lucky, you'd get a sweet PIN code too.

This was during the Great Recession. Many companies had to offer good discounts and perks.

 

[Cfabar1]

This was during the Great Recession. Many companies had to offer good discounts and perks.

I think this is why the execs are worried.... They are terrified about what they're going to have to do to reset when recession inevitably comes.... A big recession is not going to sell the Grand Floridian standard room at $1,000 a night without a big discount!

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

There were also no MagicBands. No Disney app or online dining reservations. No “New Fantasyland” or TRON. No Galaxy’s Edge or Toy Story Land. No Cosmic Rewind, Remy or Moana, plus the “tombstones” at Epcot entrance. No Pandora. Disneyland / DCA didn’t have GE, Runaway Railway, CarsLand, Avengers Academy, IncrediCoaster, Ariel…

The most cutting edge attractions the parks were putting out back then were things like The Seas with Nemo, Laugh Floor and Lights, Motors, Action.

I guess there’s a price to be paid somewhere along the way.

For some that is preferable, just speaking generally here. A lot of people who speak about enjoying the past times are usually speaking about the more simpler times when you didn't have most of what you mentioned; less complicated stuff going on. Until I joined the DIS I never knew nor cared about securing some supposed coveted dining reservation.

Some of your attractions are great ones but Tron isn't one I would use for "cutting edge attraction" considering how abysmally slow they were at building a clone which sums up how WDW has been doing things in recent years which is super slow paced spread out..Moana another example.

DCA is a weird one to talk about and I wouldn't count that in there, they wouldn't have overhauled a newer theme park if they didn't have to so I'd count that one as an unusual thing.