England is Vanishing...

[Feralpeg]

Awesome, do you know where the dorm is? I'll let you know what the area's like. When is she moving over?

She said it is just down the street from the London Museum.

 

[dcentity2000]

The figure is 2nd when you include all the spellings (of which there are many!).

Ah, I see! Gotcha.

[EDIT] There was one guy over here who changed his name to Mohammed and then to various variants of the name in order to rip off banks to the tune of several thousand pounds. The penny dropped, eventually.



Rich::

 

[Kath2003]

No, the demographics of England and Europe are such that in a few years there will not be a tiny minority but a majority population. The first countries that will see a Muslim majority are Italy and Spain. I find it interesting that those who have cited Real Clear Politics in the past are dismissing the essence of this article. I think that this is a particularly good quote;
"The problem for Britain and the United States isn't just the change in demographics. It is the reluctance of both countries to inculcate the beliefs, history and, yes, religious ideals, which made our nations so successful that others wanted to come and be a part of them. The difference between many of the current immigrants and those of the past is that the previous ones wanted to become fully American or fully British. The current ones, in too many cases, would destroy what makes our countries unique. And the "leaders" of Britain and America refuse to stop it."

Right: a moment ago you were talking about ONLY the Muslims who want to introduce Sharia law:

I am literally talking about those people who are at odds with the modern world. That want to introduce sharia law into western countries, and are not culturally integrated in the least.

Firstly, half the Muslim population reject the sharia law that the other half follow and vice versa - there's a huge amount of contention over it. Then of those who follow it in a particular way, there are only a tiny minority who actually want to introduce it to western countries and who don't want to integrate.

Again, I really don't see the problem. They can follow their religion and still be part of the UK - as the majority DO.

Why would it be a bad thing if Islam DID become the UK's predominant religion?

 

[Kath2003]

She said it is just down the street from the London Museum.

Awesome, so Barbican/Aldgate? That's an OK area. It's not the most upmarket of areas (unsurprisingly, as the location of a dorm ) but she'll be fine there.

 

[dcentity2000]

Awesome, so Barbican/Aldgate? That's an OK area. It's not the most upmarket of areas (unsurprisingly, as the location of a dorm ) but she'll be fine there.

Agreed.

London's an awesome place to be young - she'll love it!



Rich::

 

[DawnCt1]

Again, I really don't see the problem. They can follow their religion and still be part of the UK - as the majority DO.

Why would it be a bad thing if Islam DID become the UK's predominant religion?

It might be if following Islam became the requirement of the predominent population. It is what the Koran actually literally does require. What is Europe facing right now with its aging population and more of that population depending upon "welfare" in the sense of national health care and other entitlements and what is the result?
"Age + Welfare=Disaster for you.
"Youth + Will= Disaster for whoever gets in your way.

Which group has which?

 

[dcentity2000]

It might be if following Islam became the requirement of the predominent population. It is what the Koran actually literally does require.

You didn't make it clear why this is a bad thing. Do you hate Islam, Dawn?



Rich::

 

[Kath2003]

It might be if following Islam became the requirement of the predominent population. It is what the Koran actually literally does require. What is Europe facing right now with its aging population and more of that population depending upon "welfare" in the sense of national health care and other entitlements and what is the result?
"Age + Welfare=Disaster for you.
"Youth + Will= Disaster for whoever gets in your way.

Which group has which?

Firstly, that's quite a turnaround to go from "everyone has the right to follow whichever religion they choose" to "you must follow Islam". This is a democracy. They'd have to have a huge proportion of the population that not only follow Islam but believe this is the right thing for everyone else to believe also (most Muslims don't: they, like Christians, believe that their faith is correct, that's all). You'd have to have a huge proportion of people who don't believe in freedom of religion, leave the EU etc. It is VERY, VERY unlikely to happen and certainly won't happen in the next 100-200 years.

Again, I'm really not seeing how a change in the proportion of the population following a certain religion leads to this. You're talking about a minority of a minority religion (globally). Religion doesn't tend to come into UK politics -certainly not to the extent that it comes into US politics - anyway, so that would have to change also. Besides, the Koran preaches peace and tolerance, and that above all is what people of all faiths and none want.

An ageing population is likely to mean that everyone pays slightly higher taxes, rather than a change of religion?

What's FAR more likely is for the UK to be declared a secular state, like the Netherlands, since the number of people of all religions in the UK, particularly Christianity but also the many, many other faiths practised by people in the UK, are declining.

 

[Feralpeg]

Awesome, so Barbican/Aldgate? That's an OK area. It's not the most upmarket of areas (unsurprisingly, as the location of a dorm ) but she'll be fine there.

Thank you! That's great to know. Now, I'll let this thread return to its original agenda.

 

[eclectics]

I actually had read it a while back. Here is the link. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article1890354.ece
From The Times
June 6, 2007
Muhammad is No 2 in boy's names
Helen Nugent and Nadia Menuhin
Explore The Times Book of Names and discover what your name says about you

Muhammad is now second only to Jack as the most popular name for baby boys in Britain and is likely to rise to No 1 by next year, a study by The Times has found. The name, if all 14 different spellings are included, was shared by 5,991 newborn boys last year, beating Thomas into third place, followed by Joshua and Oliver.

Scholars said that the name’s rise up the league table was driven partly by the growing number of young Muslims having families, coupled with the desire to name their child in honour of the Prophet.

I apologize and retract my skepticism regarding your figures, Dawn. You are correct. However, the mitigating circumstances below should also be taken into account when looking at the big picture.


Overall, Muslims account for 3 per cent of the British population, about 1.5 million people. However, the Muslim birthrate is roughly three times higher than the nonMuslim one.

Statistics from the ONS show that Muslim households are larger than those headed by someone of another religion. In 2001, the average size of a Muslim household was 3.8 people while a third contained more than five people.

The different spellings of Muhammad in 2006 and the number of occurrences

Mohammed 2,833

Muhammad 1,422

Mohammad 920

Muhammed 358

Mohamed 354

Mohamad 29

Mahammed 18

Mohammod 13

Mahamed 12

Muhammod 9

Muhamad 7

Mohmmed 6

Mohamud 5

Mohammud 5

 

[DISUNC]

I spent MUCH time in the UK, my only problem with the country is their lack of Ice Cubes!

I have many friends/family who live there and no one is leaving, that I know of. As far as the article, it sounds like that can be written about every major city in America too! Things change, always have...always will!

 

[dcentity2000]

In some ways immigration is no bad thing. I, for instance, would LOVE to migrate to La Manga in the south of Spain

In fact, if you visit La Manga Club, near Murcia, quite a large chunk of the residents are British nationals - that's where we're all going!



Rich::

 

[Kath2003]

In some ways immigration is no bad thing. I, for instance, would LOVE to migrate to La Manga in the south of Spain

In fact, if you visit La Manga Club, near Murcia, quite a large chunk of the residents are British nationals - that's where we're all going!



Rich::

Someone I know just moved to Cyprus...I'm jealous of their weather

 

[dcentity2000]

Someone I know just moved to Cyprus...I'm jealous of their weather

I've never been to Cyprus, but I've heard lovely things about it

Man, I know what you mean about the weather!



Rich::

 

[Charade]

In some ways immigration is no bad thing. I, for instance, would LOVE to migrate to La Manga in the south of Spain

In fact, if you visit La Manga Club, near Murcia, quite a large chunk of the residents are British nationals - that's where we're all going!



Rich::

Why are they moving to Spain?

 

[Kath2003]

Why are they moving to Spain?

Sun, sea, and sangria.

Properties are cheap, flights home are cheap and the weather is fantastic. A lot of people move out there when they retire or own second homes in the med. Since you can work and live anywhere within the EU, no questons asked, a lot of people do.

 

[dcentity2000]

Sun, sea, and sangria.

Properties are cheap, flights home are cheap and the weather is fantastic. A lot of people move out there when they retire or own second homes in the med. Since you can work and live anywhere within the EU, no questons asked, a lot of people do.

Bingo.

I'm lucky enough to have gone to Spain and LOVED IT! Beautiful scenery, gorgeous climate, wonderful people



Rich::

 

[Charade]

I think a lot of people are in denial.

We should revisit this thread 10 years down the road. Only then we'll be able to see how true the predictions are.

 

[Disney Doll]

"The problem for Britain and the United States isn't just the change in demographics. It is the reluctance of both countries to inculcate the beliefs, history and, yes, religious ideals, which made our nations so successful that others wanted to come and be a part of them. The difference between many of the current immigrants and those of the past is that the previous ones wanted to become fully American or fully British. The current ones, in too many cases, would destroy what makes our countries unique. And the "leaders" of Britain and America refuse to stop it."

I agree with this statement. I think we are so busy being politically correct that we are losing the very nature of our countries.

 

[DawnCt1]

You didn't make it clear why this is a bad thing. Do you hate Islam, Dawn?



Rich::

Absolutely not. I think that everyone should be free to practice their religion or not practice any religion if that is there choice. If you look at the countries that are theocracies, practicing is not a choice, it is a requirement. The Koran requires prayers 5 times a day. Would it be required if that is what the majority population demanded and voted for?