Ending a marriage (long overdue update #55)

I think everyone on this thread, giving their opinions, uses the experiences of THEIR marriage in giving opinions.

Lots of women jump into divorce because their marriage isn't exciting or fun filled as their early days. Then the majority of them take a few steps back on the economic ladder.

Yes but your :sad2: Wow. and your following statement are indicating that people that expect more than YOUR husbands gives are expecting too much.

If you are happy in your marriage the way it is that is fantastic for you, but that doesn't mean that soebody that would be unhappy with your circumstances has unrealistic expectations.
 
I don't think that either I or the other posters said that this was about cards or gifts (although the OP did mention the cards herself). All we have said was that there has been a communication breakdown in this marriage. Before abandoning the marriage, it would be worth at least trying counseling to see if they could learn to reach each other. I also fail to see where there are any flames for the OP in those statements. She has many years and her children invested in this marriage. How is it flaming her to suggest that she try counseling? :confused3

The flaming part is when you say, "my dh is like that so you should accept it too". That is a dig.

As far as communication breakdown, I agree totally. The OP has 50% of the responsibility there.

I agree counseling is a good choice for her or both. Not being able to express yourself is not good.
 
The flaming part is when you say, "my dh is like that so you should accept it too". That is a dig.

As far as communication breakdown, I agree totally. The OP has 50% of the responsibility there.

I agree counseling is a good choice for her or both. Not being able to express yourself is not good.

I guess I just didn't interpret anybody's post as saying, "My DH is like that so you should accept it too". I think they were just trying to say that people sometimes look at the same thing and see it differently. :goodvibes
 
Ohhhh good grief.....

Let's just flame the OP some more...

Like she EVER indicated that she 'expected' nice gifts etc....
In fact, she admitted quite the opposite... that she had indicated to her husband that she was not excited about generic 'hallmark' (cards and chocolates) type of shows of affections.....

OP: I see that you have gone absent here...
I suggest that this is a good idea...

Do NOT get drawn in here by well meaning but very misguided and judgemental posters.


I wish the best for you, and for your DH...

:sad2: Since when is it "flaming" to offer different points of view? If I were the OP of a thread like this, I would have wanted to hear about others' experiences with situations that they found similar. The OP can do what she wants with the info people are giving her - maybe some of it will help. She's an adult and I'm sure that she can handle hearing from people who might not agree with her.

You seem so sure that you know exactly what is going on the OP's marriage and that no one who disagrees with you has a clue. Unless you are getting information about her from someplace other than this thread, you don't know any more than the rest of us. You could be right, but you could be wrong. I could be right, and I could be wrong. The only people who know the truth are the OP and her husband. And honestly it sounds like neither one of them knows the whole truth about how the other feels, which is why many of us think that there could be hope for them to learn to communicate with each other and be happy together, if that's something the OP would like. The fact that she's posting about it on here the way she is leads me to believe that she'd rather not end the marriage if it could be fixed - she just seems to think it can't be repaired. Some of us are sharing our opinions on ways it might be repaired if she chooses to attempt it. How is that a bad thing?
 

I guess I just didn't interpret anybody's post as saying, "My DH is like that so you should accept it too". I think they were just trying to say that people sometimes look at the same thing and see it differently. :goodvibes

Well that what it is.

I don't care about cards and gifts either. However my sister does.

If your spouse loves and respects you then you would be respectful of their feelings.

The OP stated the her DH does not tell her he loves her, does not kiss her. In other words there is a complete lack of intimacy.

You are oversimplifying the card/gift issue.
 
:sad2: Since when is it "flaming" to offer different points of view? If I were the OP of a thread like this, I would have wanted to hear about others' experiences with situations that they found similar. The OP can do what she wants with the info people are giving her - maybe some of it will help. She's an adult and I'm sure that she can handle hearing from people who might not agree with her.

You seem so sure that you know exactly what is going on the OP's marriage and that no one who disagrees with you has a clue. Unless you are getting information about her from someplace other than this thread, you don't know any more than the rest of us. You could be right, but you could be wrong. I could be right, and I could be wrong. The only people who know the truth are the OP and her husband. And honestly it sounds like neither one of them knows the whole truth about how the other feels, which is why many of us think that there could be hope for them to learn to communicate with each other and be happy together, if that's something the OP would like. The fact that she's posting about it on here the way she is leads me to believe that she'd rather not end the marriage if it could be fixed - she just seems to think it can't be repaired. Some of us are sharing our opinions on ways it might be repaired if she chooses to attempt it. How is that a bad thing?

:thumbsup2 :worship: ITA!!
 
We talked last night.

I told him we need to talk about things, and he asked me if I had a "master plan?". There was no anger, and, just like everything else in our marriage, I am the one to make the final decision. He finds out I am not happy, and he wants to know "the" plan. He didn't try to defend himself against what I had said. I say it's over, so it's over.

He told me the letter did take him by surprise, he did not know I was unhappy. He did realize he never told me "I Love You" but said he is not the most romantic person in the world, and that I hate everything (chocolate, flowers, jewelry). So I guess in his mind, those are the only three things you can use to express your feelings for a woman, and since I don't care for any of them, he thought he was good.

He mentioned that I never told him the words. I said I used to say them, and said, "Yeah, way back in the beginning." Well, what do you want? i say it, and don't get a response, am I going to keep saying it, and feel rejected every time? I gave up. I did give him MANY sentimental cards over the years, that said what I didn't. I have received joke cards all these years. I mentioned the cards, and he said he has given me cards. I said JOKE cards. He reminded me he gave me a sentimental card ONCE....I told him after all these years of getting a joke card, and never being told how you feel about me, I wasn't sure if the card said how you truly feel, if you just gave it to me, because I hadn't gotten one in so many years.

We were not arguing, we were talking. I asked him if he was happy. After a silent pause..he said he was content. Well, to me, content is not happy. Content means he has settled. I asked him if he thought counseling might help us...another pause....and he said "I don't know." I waited for him to expand on that, but there was a few minutes of silence. A few times during the conversation, I was ready to tell him to forget it, we will just continue on like this, since he said he was content. But I couldn't do it. I need to start making myself happy, and not everyone around me. If he doesn't want to fight for the marriage, and is resigned to it being over, then maybe he can move from contentment to happiness himself.

So, the talks have started. Now that we have had the initial talk, talking from now on will be easier for me. Probably not from him, but he will answer questions I ask him...from what was discussed last night, he will probably be the one to move out. I do know this will be amicable. He is not angy, and I am just sad. There is no need for anything to get ugly.

Thank you to everyone who has supported me through this.

This section reminded me of my husband and I when we were first married. He grew up in a home where hugs, I love yous, etc. were not a part of life. I am a demonstrative person and would say, " I love you" , hug him, peck him on the cheek and he would look at me like I was either annoying him or I was crazy. It took a long time but eventually he started hugging me and acting in a loving way. We've been married 28 years and today, he is a man who does say "I love you" and who does peck me on the cheek. He even does this in front of his family. It isn't to "show" them. It's because it has become second nature.

Don't ever give up.
 
This section reminded me of my husband and I when we were first married. He grew up in a home where hugs, I love yous, etc. were not a part of life. I am a demonstrative person and would say, " I love you" , hug him, peck him on the cheek and he would look at me like I was either annoying him or I was crazy. It took a long time but eventually he started hugging me and acting in a loving way. We've been married 28 years and today, he is a man who does say "I love you" and who does peck me on the cheek. He even does this in front of his family. It isn't to "show" them. It's because it has become second nature.

Don't ever give up.

How true. My DH and I tell each other many times a day. When the kids were little, not so much. Now that they are older, things are so nice.:thumbsup2
 
Ohhhh good grief.....

Let's just flame the OP some more...
Ummm.... No one has flamed anyone. In fact, your post comes closer than anyones to the flame.
Like she EVER indicated that she 'expected' nice gifts etc....
In fact, she admitted quite the opposite... that she had indicated to her husband that she was not excited about generic 'hallmark' (cards and chocolates) type of shows of affections.....

OP: I see that you have gone absent here...
I suggest that this is a good idea...

Do NOT get drawn in here by well meaning but very misguided and judgemental posters.
It's interesting that this is the position that you're taking given that your advice has been consistently 'divorce him' and the advice that you discount is 'talk to him' and 'perhaps counseling would help'.
 
I have NEVER said 'divorce him'.....
Not 'consistantly', and NOT EVER....

I have said, along with others, going back to the earliest posts here, that her husband appears to have all the signs of some 'issues' and deficits.

I have said that if he does not begin to acknowledge these things, and seek some assistance, that she does not have a lot to work with.. You can't have a discussion, or a marriage, with a brick wall.

I have said all along that she needs to look inside and do what is right for HER.

But, continue to flame away....
 
I have NEVER said 'divorce him'.....
Not 'consistantly', and NOT EVER....

I have said, along with others, going back to the earliest posts here, that her husband appears to have all the signs of some 'issues' and deficits.

I have said that if he does not begin to acknowledge these things, and seek some assistance, that she does not have a lot to work with.. You can't have a discussion, or a marriage, with a brick wall.

I have said all along that she needs to look inside and do what is right for HER.

But, continue to flame away....
My mistake. I apologize.

How about you answer this question:

Why are you slamming other people who give the very same advice that you have given?
 
I really appreciate everyone trying to put a different perspective on it, by sharing their marriage experience. It is just so hard to understand my situation if you don't know my husband. I am not giving just my side of the story, I am trying to explain how it is.

We went to see a lawyer today about the house. We can't sell it, because we owe more thna anything we can get for it..so we made the decision to file a bankruptcy, and let them foreclose on the house. It's going to stink, having a bankruptcy on our credit, but that only lasts so many years, then our credit can be repaired. (please, no advice about this, it is already done.) Now that we know what the house situation is going to be, DH is going to move out. The kids are going to a sleep away camp the week after next, so we are not telling them anything until after they get back. We don't want to stress them out while they are at camp. They don't need to be worrying about us, when they should be having the time of their life at camp. So, DH will move out while the kids are at camp, I think that is the best way to do it, so they don't have to be a witness to him leaving.

I am sad, but not devastated. I'm sad that DH is resigned without even trying. We have had a couple of more little talks, he has not tried to convince me of anything. (that he really does love me, he doesn't want to leave, we can work things out)none of that. Part of me wants to call it all off, and tell him we need to get help, but a bigger part of me is telling me this is part of the big problem. I am always the one to take the reins and get things done. This would just be another one of those times, only I don't want to do it anymore. I want for ONCE to know that he cares about something enough to make his own decision. (Like he has decided he doesn't want to leave his family, so he takes action and does what he needs to do for it not to have to happen). If he can't do that, then nothing will change. We will just go on the way we have for years, and I can't do that.

His leaving could have one of two end results. One, he leaves and realizes he doesn't want to be on the outside, so we get counseling, and work things out, or two, he leaves, and while he is out, he realizes that he wasn't "content" in the marriage after all, and he finds he is happier. So, just leaving could be the beginning of the end, or it could be the start of a new beginning for us. I just know that I am all done with calling the shots as to how things are. He needs to be the one to decide how he wants to live his life.
 
So sorry to hear how things turned out. Be ready to receive loads of flack about the bankruptcy, etc. But I just wanted to tell you that I wish you luck. It's a tough road ahead. I was a single mom for 2 years (really, 9 if you count that my ex-DH was another kid LOL). In the end though, I was happier but it was harder - if that makes any sense.

I hope you find true happiness either with another man in the future or on your own with your children. Hugs to you - feel free to PM if you need to chat too. :)
 
So sorry to hear how things turned out. Be ready to receive loads of flack about the bankruptcy, etc. But I just wanted to tell you that I wish you luck. It's a tough road ahead. I was a single mom for 2 years (really, 9 if you count that my ex-DH was another kid LOL). In the end though, I was happier but it was harder - if that makes any sense.

I hope you find true happiness either with another man in the future or on your own with your children. Hugs to you - feel free to PM if you need to chat too. :)

Thank you. I really hope if someone feels the need to express their opinion on the bankruptcy, they keep it to themselves. I know there are a ton of perfect, rich people on this board who could never imagine filing for bankruptcy. Some might even look down on those who do, but it is the best thing for us to do right now. No matter what advice people might offer for us to avoid it, will be moot. It is already done. (well, the lawyer has been paid, the wheels are in motion).
 
His leaving could have one of two end results. One, he leaves and realizes he doesn't want to be on the outside, so we get counseling, and work things out, or two, he leaves, and while he is out, he realizes that he wasn't "content" in the marriage after all, and he finds he is happier. So, just leaving could be the beginning of the end, or it could be the start of a new beginning for us. I just know that I am all done with calling the shots as to how things are. He needs to be the one to decide how he wants to live his life.

I'm sorry, OP. I hope this transition goes smoothly for you.

I have one suggestion, and it's worth exactly what you've paid for it. But if I were in your position I think I would tell him when he leaves that if he changes his mind, and if you haven't moved on by then, that you would consider going to counseling with him. That way he will know that there is a possiblility he could fix things. But he has to be the one to say he wants the two of you to try. If he wants to, and you want to at that point, then maybe counseling would help him learn to communicate with you. But that's only if you would be willing to go if he wanted you to. If not, then he missed his chance and that's his problem. At this point I know you've done more than your share of trying, but giving him this one last opening could make a difference since he sounds like the type to not even try if he thinks you've totally made up your mind that it's over.

Either way, I hope you'll be happy before too long. :grouphug:
 
I'm sorry, OP. I hope this transition goes smoothly for you.

I have one suggestion, and it's worth exactly what you've paid for it. But if I were in your position I think I would tell him when he leaves that if he changes his mind, and if you haven't moved on by then, that you would consider going to counseling with him. That way he will know that there is a possiblility he could fix things. But he has to be the one to say he wants the two of you to try. If he wants to, and you want to at that point, then maybe counseling would help him learn to communicate with you. But that's only if you would be willing to go if he wanted you to. If not, then he missed his chance and that's his problem. At this point I know you've done more than your share of trying, but giving him this one last opening could make a difference since he sounds like the type to not even try if he thinks you've totally made up your mind that it's over.

Either way, I hope you'll be happy before too long. :grouphug:

Yes Scurvy..thank you. I do plan on keeping the options open for a while, even after he moves out. It just has to be HIM that initiates it. If he comes to me, and says he is ready to get some help so we can work things out, by all means, I will be willing to try it. I am just not going to be the one to initiate it. This is what I have been doing, and I can't anymore.
 
Yes Scurvy..thank you. I do plan on keeping the options open for a while, even after he moves out. It just has to be HIM that initiates it. If he comes to me, and says he is ready to get some help so we can work things out, by all means, I will be willing to try it. I am just not going to be the one to initiate it. This is what I have been doing, and I can't anymore.

I understand. Good Luck to you.:hug:
 
Yes Scurvy..thank you. I do plan on keeping the options open for a while, even after he moves out. It just has to be HIM that initiates it. If he comes to me, and says he is ready to get some help so we can work things out, by all means, I will be willing to try it. I am just not going to be the one to initiate it. This is what I have been doing, and I can't anymore.

Well, seeing as how he doesn't really react to anything, why would you think he would say anything now? It seems that you are expecting him to open up all of the sudden and ask for counseling, but then again from my perception of him, he won't do that, maybe over time but not now. This is not in his personality and yet are you expecting him to? Its unlikely he actually will. It is a communication problem and he isn't opening up. You can't expect him to all of the sudden and he may be holding something back but doesn't know how to do it. It may not have anything to do with you. Give him and yourself some time to not only figure something out but to realize what needs to change. I am sure you already know what needs to be done, but I am sure he is unhappy with some of the behavior traits you have too because not everything is one person's fault in a divorce. "Well, HE has to initiate it" after he hasn't done much isn't going to solve it. Don't just wash your hands of him because he didn't initiate. There is something up here and it needs to have a closer look.
 
Thank you. I really hope if someone feels the need to express their opinion on the bankruptcy, they keep it to themselves. I know there are a ton of perfect, rich people on this board who could never imagine filing for bankruptcy. Some might even look down on those who do, but it is the best thing for us to do right now. No matter what advice people might offer for us to avoid it, will be moot. It is already done. (well, the lawyer has been paid, the wheels are in motion).


I just wanted to pipe in and say this is happening ALL THE TIME in my area. Our realestate values have fallen 30-40% here, so unless people have 75K in cash laying around somewhere, they end up having to let the house go. Houses here are just not selling, sitting on the market for a year or more. So, don't feel bad. It is what it is.
 
Yes Scurvy..thank you. I do plan on keeping the options open for a while, even after he moves out. It just has to be HIM that initiates it. If he comes to me, and says he is ready to get some help so we can work things out, by all means, I will be willing to try it. I am just not going to be the one to initiate it. This is what I have been doing, and I can't anymore.
Simply being open to counseling is a little different than what Scurvy suggested. Tell him that you are open to it.

I won't give you my standard bankruptcy speech. However, I hope that you realize the difficulties that you will face with bad credit due to a recent bankruptcy right when you are starting out on your own with children.
 















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