ECV Ran Over Little Boy Thursday Night at Epcot

[angwill]

double post

 

[angwill]

I hope the little boy is ok.

On my recent trip, I really hadn't noticed the ECV's very much until I was shopping at World of Disney. I was bent down looking at something on the bottom shelf, next thing I know I was on the ground and a lady on an ECV said to me " you should have gotten out of my way". No apology either. I think it is folks like this that give ECV users a bad name.

I had someone with a double stroller do the same thing to me only her quote was people are so stupid and need to get out of the way when they see a stroller coming. Didn't matter that I was in that row before she ever came near it.

The truth is that people just need to be more polite and aware.

I also agree with the person who suggested taking a lesson on the ECV first.

 

[taylor3297]

I had someone with a double stroller do the same thing to me only her quote was people are so stupid and need to get out of the way when they see a stroller coming. Didn't matter that I was in that row before she ever came near it.

The truth is that people just need to be more polite and aware.

I also agree with the person who suggested taking a lesson on the ECV first.

I agree.

 

[NHdisneylover]

I hope the little boy is okay

Here is an interesting tangent to the ECV debate in this thread: We spent 5 days at Disneyland Paris about 2 years ago. One thing we ALL noticed (even my kids) was how easy it was to walk around, even on a very busy holiday. The key difference that we noticed?
1. Virtually no EVCs (we think we saw two over 5 days). There were many people using canes/walkers and some in wheelchairs. Overall though, many more people finding ways to move themselves with their own power in spite of age or other issues (canes/walkers/moving slowly/etc).
2. Substantially fewer strollers. We only saw a handful of kids past toddlerhood in strollers. All but one of those were with English speaking families. The European kids all seemed to walk from about 3-4 on. Their parents slowed down to match their pace.

Iam sure there are many factors at play--including the lower temps in Paris and the European population being mroe used to walking. Overall though, it did not seem that there were fewer elderly, fewer preschoolers, etc.--just that the culture was different in how it was handled. Whatever the reason, it made a noticeable difference in how easy and pleasant it was to navigate the parks.

 

[harleyquinn]

And yes I know there are plenty that will claim that someone that needs a wheel chair can't be expected to use a wheel chair at Disney, but I only ask how does that person get around when they go to the mall or airport? If they use a wheel chair then clearly a ECV isn't a requirement it might make things easier but then how many kids need to get their angles broken so someone in a wheel chair can play mario kart.

Do you go to the airport/mall everyday or 5 out of 7 days in a week? My mom can totally go to the mall just fine, but she can't do it every day.

I wonder how many "angles" are actually broken? We hear a lot about incidents around here, but very few resulting in broken bones or heaven forbid, the poor little guy this thread is about. WDW shouldn't turn away people from using ECV because of a few bad eggs.

But again, I think they should be doing more to prevent the problems, but that doesn't have to go totally into restricted people who do really need it.

 

[SaraJayne]

How about 8 week pregnant me pushing my mom in a wheelchair in 90 degree heat in December??? Yes it did happen. My mom and I thought she would be able to handle the walking that comes with a trip to WDW, but we were wrong. So one day we rented a wheelchair and I attempted to push her around DHS, 8 weeks pregnant. It was awful. We didn't think weather would be an issue in December, but there was a heat wave. She rented a scooter every day after that.

Is it unreasonable to want to share magical memories with older or more infirm people in your family just so people don't have to worry about the (slim) possibilty of getting run into?



They are set at a low speed, but they really can move. My mom and I were both surprised and disappointed about how little instruction you get on how to use them.

I agree that change should be made. Only EVCs with approved speeds/power should be allowed in and that speed/power should be reduced. I also think they need to reduce the number of available EVCs and somehow be pickier about who can use them. Though I understand that would be very difficult.

Eight weeks or 8 months? 'Cause there's a whole lotta difference between the two.

 

[daughtersrus]

People can be rude no matter what. Whether they're in a ECV or on foot.

DD was in her wheelchair on the far right side of the ramp leading to the monorail at closing. We had numerous people literally climb right over DD as she sat in her chair in shoulder to shoulder traffic. DH was pushing DD's chair at the time and was sure to give them an "ankle check" as they stood in front of DD.
It got so bad that DH had to take DD out of her chair and try and carry her up the ramp and onto the platform.

Rudeness has no limits.

 

[NotUrsula]

A couple of years ago I was on my way to a conference in Orlando, and on the plane I ended up sitting next to a gentleman who was the head of maintainance operations for the company that supplies the WDW rental ECV fleet.

The conversation that I had with him was really fascinating. He told me that the accident rate for theme park users was huge, and that the primary reason for it was a lack of understanding by both new riders AND by pedestrians that ECV's don't have normally have conventional brakes.
They need a LOT of room to stop. He told me that the most common problem was screwing up the steering by running into and over curbs.

It is generally impossible to stop a regular scooter on a dime; you stop it by killing the drive power and letting the wheels stop rolling. (ECV's normally operate with a dead-man lever similar to what you find on a lawn mower; take your hand off and the motor stops turning the wheels.) The usual stopping distance on them is equivalent to the length of the ECV; so it normally rolls about 3-4 feet after the switch is released, and people just don't really get that. They expect them to be able to stop the way a bicycle or motorcycle would, and they just ... can't.

One thing that I think would help at least a little would be signage, both on the park maps and posted up around the parks. CAUTION: DISABILITY SCOOTERS CANNOT STOP QUICKLY. BE AWARE OF WHAT IS BEHIND YOU or something to that effect. I also agree that there should be some "traffic" rules enforced with them, so that they are not normally moving in the midst of the main pedestrian pathways.

It is my understanding that top speed of most stock scooters varies between 5-10 mph, with the larger ones having the most power. Safety advocates say that for use on sidewalks, the top safe speed is 4 mph, which would indicate that something considerably lower than that should be proper in a crowd. (The interesting thing is that it is possible to tinker with the motor on a scooter and "soup it up" so that it will go faster; I've been told that larger electric mobility scooters can be rigged to go over 25 mph if you know what you are doing.)

 

[maxiesmom]

Rudeness has no limits.

You are right. Banning ECVs won't solve that. And would make it impossible for some people to visit the parks.

I also find the idea of roped of lanes to be very silly. Do we want crossing guards to to make sure no one J-walks too? People just need to be considerate and aware of those around them. We don't need walking lanes, and wheelchair only lanes, or stroller only lanes. We just need to pay attention.

Accidents happen and there is no way to prevent them all.

 

[harleyquinn]

Eight weeks or 8 months? 'Cause there's a whole lotta difference between the two.

Point taken. I was 8 weeks, SUPER hormonal and had all day sickness. I lost 20 pounds in the the first 11 weeks. NOT a good time to go to WDW.

 

[sam_gordon]

Everyone the boy was not moving. He was in front of his Mom while waiting for her bag to be checked.
He wasn't running around like a crazy man.

He was a little boy that was hit from behind by an ECV with a very large woman driving it. The woman's weight plus the weight of the ECV I'm sure did some major damage.
She plowed into him, I'm sure not on purpose.

I don't know if it was a Disney rental or not. I do know it was very large. Headlights, baskets loaded down with items.

He was hurt and we were looking for some feed back from a friend or family member.

Can I just say the parts I bolded don't make sense. If he was IN FRONT of his mom and the ECV hit him from behind, then his mom should have gotten hit.

I feel sorry for the boy & the ECV driver. I think a one time 'qualification' class to ensure ECV drivers know how to operate their chairs isn't too much to ask. The 'check' can be done once a year and be set up outside each theme park. Just a thought.

 

[dzorn]

A couple of years ago I was on my way to a conference in Orlando, and on the plane I ended up sitting next to a gentleman who was the head of maintainance operations for the company that supplies the WDW rental ECV fleet.

The conversation that I had with him was really fascinating. He told me that the accident rate for theme park users was huge, and that the primary reason for it was a lack of understanding by both new riders AND by pedestrians that ECV's don't have normally have conventional brakes.
They need a LOT of room to stop. He told me that the most common problem was screwing up the steering by running into and over curbs.

It is generally impossible to stop a regular scooter on a dime; you stop it by killing the drive power and letting the wheels stop rolling. (ECV's normally operate with a dead-man lever similar to what you find on a lawn mower; take your hand off and the motor stops turning the wheels.) The usual stopping distance on them is equivalent to the length of the ECV; so it normally rolls about 3-4 feet after the switch is released, and people just don't really get that. They expect them to be able to stop the way a bicycle or motorcycle would, and they just ... can't.

One thing that I think would help at least a little would be signage, both on the park maps and posted up around the parks. CAUTION: DISABILITY SCOOTERS CANNOT STOP QUICKLY. BE AWARE OF WHAT IS BEHIND YOU or something to that effect. I also agree that there should be some "traffic" rules enforced with them, so that they are not normally moving in the midst of the main pedestrian pathways.

It is my understanding that top speed of most stock scooters varies between 5-10 mph, with the larger ones having the most power. Safety advocates say that for use on sidewalks, the top safe speed is 4 mph, which would indicate that something considerably lower than that should be proper in a crowd. (The interesting thing is that it is possible to tinker with the motor on a scooter and "soup it up" so that it will go faster; I've been told that larger electric mobility scooters can be rigged to go over 25 mph if you know what you are doing.)

I would say the more responsible thing is to develp them with brakes that can stop on a dime.

Disney can certainly limit the power their scooters have but cannot ban outside scooters because of ADA regulations.

If you have problems then write your legislature. They are the only ones that could limit the speeds the ECV are allowed to make.

Denise in MI

 

[Aisling]

Point taken. I was 8 weeks, SUPER hormonal and had all day sickness. I lost 20 pounds in the the first 11 weeks. NOT a good time to go to WDW.

OT, but about the all-day-sickness. I know what that's like.

And about the EVCs, maybe I just needed to get it out of my system, but I was so upset about my son being hit and from the other incidents I've seen. I don't want to be mean to people who can't walk; I'm just truly concerned that it's a scary problem at WDW. I've calmed down now.

 

[sam_gordon]

One thing that I think would help at least a little would be signage, both on the park maps and posted up around the parks. CAUTION: DISABILITY SCOOTERS CANNOT STOP QUICKLY. BE AWARE OF WHAT IS BEHIND YOU or something to that effect.

Really? I should keep track of what's travelling behind me? Sorry, don't see it happening. ECV drivers, (supposedly) knowing they require a larger stopping distance, need to leave more room in front of them. No different than someone driving a semi truck needs to leave more room in front of them than someone driving a car.

Yes, I know that won't stop someone from cutting in front (since there's now a gap), but (to a certain extent) drivers should follow the common "rules of the road".

 

[LuLuO]

That poor boy. I hope he is okay. The thought of all that weight on top of a little kid is so scary.

Aside from children/people darting across the path of an ECV, I think a lot of the problem comes from people not having enough experience with how they work. My mom has been using the EVCs in the stores for the last couple of months, and though she seems to do okay most of the time, she did knock a rack of clothes over last week while trying to back up. I think she'd have a hard time navigating WDW, especially if it were really crowded.

 

[angwill]

Really? I should keep track of what's travelling behind me? Sorry, don't see it happening. ECV drivers, (supposedly) knowing they require a larger stopping distance, need to leave more room in front of them. No different than someone driving a semi truck needs to leave more room in front of them than someone driving a car.

Yes, I know that won't stop someone from cutting in front (since there's now a gap), but (to a certain extent) drivers should follow the common "rules of the road".

True it is impossible to know what is behind you and in front at all times. If someone is in front of a person or ECV they need to have their attention on what is going on ahead and stop in time so they don't hit others.

 

[harleyquinn]

OT, but about the all-day-sickness. I know what that's like.

And about the EVCs, maybe I just needed to get it out of my system, but I was so upset about my son being hit and from the other incidents I've seen. I don't want to be mean to people who can't walk; I'm just truly concerned that it's a scary problem at WDW. I've calmed down now.

Aww thanks!

Before my mom had to use one, I felt the same way you did. I really wish there was some training invloved, but I'm sure some people will just ignore it. The problem will never go away completely, but I think there are some changes WDW needs to explore.

 

[thomas998]

Do you go to the airport/mall everyday or 5 out of 7 days in a week? My mom can totally go to the mall just fine, but she can't do it every day.

I wonder how many "angles" are actually broken? We hear a lot about incidents around here, but very few resulting in broken bones or heaven forbid, the poor little guy this thread is about. WDW shouldn't turn away people from using ECV because of a few bad eggs.

But again, I think they should be doing more to prevent the problems, but that doesn't have to go totally into restricted people who do really need it.

Of course if you want to restrict it to people that really do need it... I think it would be easier to simply ban them from WDW. Because if you think about what people REALLY DO NEED, well they don't NEED WDW... they might want to go there but it isn't anything that anyone needs.

 

[DizBelle]

I would say the more responsible thing is to develp them with brakes that can stop on a dime.

Disney can certainly limit the power their scooters have but cannot ban outside scooters because of ADA regulations.

If you have problems then write your legislature. They are the only ones that could limit the speeds the ECV are allowed to make.

Denise in MI

Of course you can't ban outside scooters.

I'd be willing to bet that those that OWN their own scooter know pretty well how to use them. It's those that RENT them that are the biggest issue. Why don't they have a 30 minute training class or proficiency course before you are allowed to rent?

 

[crashbb]

Of course if you want to restrict it to people that really do need it... I think it would be easier to simply ban them from WDW. Because if you think about what people REALLY DO NEED, well they don't NEED WDW... they might want to go there but it isn't anything that anyone needs.

So, if you are that worried about being run over by an ECV, stay home. After all, you (and your children) don't NEED to go to WDW.

Yes, I'm being facetious, but your suggestion is just as impossible.