Earn BIG money with your DVC points (and MY cash nights)

[DVCPAT]

And I doubt that any of them would call DVC and say to their guide "Gee, I want an add on...I made $XXXXX.XX last year renting out my points and selling off cash nights for a whopin profit. And now I want to double my contract cause Little Jhonnie wants to go to Europe this summer, I should be able to book up a good 30-40 weeks now..... Any tips??".

When I joined back in 98, my guide told me I could rent points for a small profit. He also said we could have five people in a one bedroom. We are a family of four, but he stated it would be OK for the kids to bring a friend.

If I can’t get reservations for specific dates, I don’t give it much thought if a member, member friend, renter or member’s neighbor is in the room. I don’t think Disney will ever become a heavy handed landlord. I think they want the room occupants to have a great vacation and spend a few Disney dollars.

 

[rinkwide]

I also don't understand the anger at a member who tries to rent their real estate interest for the "true value". It's OK for Disney to rent out a BCV studio for $300+ a night, but if a member asks for $13/pt ($156/night) for the same room, they are greedy profiteers.

My thoughts exactly.

Don't hate the player, hate the game.

 

[Dean]

"In order for you", I say to them "to have more then your fair share others have to have less than theirs......"

That's just it, your fair share is how many points you own. I'd assume you'd have the same problem with one who uses their points for holidays for a large family as the effect is the same and used for non member benefit. I'll make the point again that everyone has the ability to call and reserve at 11 months out, EVERYONE.

 

[Doctor P]

You know, all of this sounds great in theory, but in practice things can be very different. The analogy I would use is to scalping popular events. While it is true that any one can, in theory, stand in line or get on the Internet to buy tickets for popular events, scalpers have mastered the ability to get the tickets ahead of normal buyers. Many of the same tactics can apply to getting reservations for DVC resorts. If all of the for profit rental agents were just using their own points to secure reservations, that would be another point. But, the fact is that many of the for profits are using loopholes in the system to amass ungodly amounts of points (most of which are not their own in many cases) and rent out reservations. In theory, some of the larger operations could corner the entire market on some of the smaller resorts for a major holiday and prevent ANYONE else from reserving a studio at BCV or HH for example through the use of technology. Now, understand that I am not suggesting that this happens enough to be concerned, but I do have a problem with the tactics used (or apparently used) by some who rent their points. I still think that the simplest answer, much like concert tickets, is that you have a members' only reservation period where reservations must have the members' name on the reservation and no name changes are allowed without the room going back into the system. Alternatively, a limit on the number of reservations made during the period by a given member until a later window.

 

[cruise-o-matic]

You've got to admit, the person in question has become quite saavy at the rental game. I looked at the threads quadman posted. The 1st thread about 2 years ago, he was renting for $10pp. Then over time, he's been able to secure prime reservations and now offers then a $ amount but when you break it down it's now $15pp. Many think this is extortion, but when I contacted CRO for a room for 3 nights 11/4-11/7, YC was $887 and BW was $967. Studios for BCV & BWV were 58 points for those nights. So he's still offering a better deal than Disney.

He's also become quite good at buying "distressed" points that are about to expire, probably paying $5-8pp. Now is he ripping members off or providing a service? I know that if given the chance, I'd re-coup as much as I could before I'd let points expire and get nothing.

Others have posted what a hassle it is renting points. There again, would you transfer points at less than $10 and not have to go through the hassle of renting them out? Not much different than someone showing up to a football game with extra tickets and selling them at face to a scalper, or the PC term "ticket broker". Now you can use that extra time to enjoy tailgating and have cash to spend.

One could argue that he has to mark the points up to cover his risks and time to call MS (which he must do quite frequently), then have to go out and find a renter.

The Public Offering Statement from DVC does state "Purchase of an Ownership Interest or use of the Vacation Homes and facilities of the DVC Resorts for commercial purposes or for any purpose other than the personal use described in this Public Offering Statement is expressly prohibited." Now in the same paragraph, DVC's way to combat this is to limit Home resort points to 2000 and total points to 5000. In a way this makes sense, because as Dr P pointed out, someone with more points could corner the HH market during 4th of July or snag up all the OKW GV's during Easter week. (But you know, if I were going to become a professional renter, I would buy a 50-100 point BCV contract. Low initial costs and low annual MF's. Then find a way to funnel in points as I need them. Hmm, sound familiar?) BTW, how well does DVC track the expiration date and home resort of transferred points??

This being said, there is no doubt this person is a professional renter for profit. The sheer # of threads on the RTB back that up. (BTW, he had two new posts last week.) So would this constitute a "commercial purpose"? If so, can anything can be done about it? Does anybody want anything to be done about it?

I guess the analogy I would use would be like Barry Bonds' home run record. Is this guy using "steroids" (ie unfair loopholes) to secure these prime reservations? If so, should we finally get serious and ban this practice? Or would any ban cause hardship to the rest of the DVC members?

"How do you think he does it? What makes him so good?" Maybe DVC needs to look into that......Who knows, he may be "clean", and just better at keeping his eye on the ball?

 

[Peterd]

I rented some points from a few other DVC members a couple years back for a family reunion. Back then, member services told me I could only have one set of points moved into my account a year. I had one set moved into my account, and had others make resvs for different parts of my party.
Has this changed? If they went by the old rule, this problem wouldn't exist. People could still own over a 1000 points and rent out, but it would prevent someone from buying up points just for the sake of being a travel agent.

 

[Dean]

You know, all of this sounds great in theory, but in practice things can be very different. The analogy I would use is to scalping popular events. While it is true that any one can, in theory, stand in line or get on the Internet to buy tickets for popular events, scalpers have mastered the ability to get the tickets ahead of normal buyers. Many of the same tactics can apply to getting reservations for DVC resorts. If all of the for profit rental agents were just using their own points to secure reservations, that would be another point. But, the fact is that many of the for profits are using loopholes in the system to amass ungodly amounts of points (most of which are not their own in many cases) and rent out reservations. In theory, some of the larger operations could corner the entire market on some of the smaller resorts for a major holiday and prevent ANYONE else from reserving a studio at BCV or HH for example through the use of technology. Now, understand that I am not suggesting that this happens enough to be concerned, but I do have a problem with the tactics used (or apparently used) by some who rent their points. I still think that the simplest answer, much like concert tickets, is that you have a members' only reservation period where reservations must have the members' name on the reservation and no name changes are allowed without the room going back into the system. Alternatively, a limit on the number of reservations made during the period by a given member until a later window.

Since it takes time to make reservations, there's no way to corner the market compared to another member calling at 9 am 11 months out. By the time one or two reservations were made, EVERYONE else calling at the same time would have gotten the other units in short supply. Even if one had multiple people calling, there would be significant limitations. Plus, the dollars are just not there. Since there is no official definition of commercial renter everyone here has a different one. To me it's the limitation of the number of points one can own, but it's different to others.

I am reminded of other floating times and points systems. Like Club Intrawest which has no home resort priority so every member in their entire system is fighting for Xmas, and other high demand weeks in Whistler. Or the Maui Marriott where the only have one season so everyone that owns that unit type are fighting for a few prime weeks. That on top of their 13 month priority for multiple weeks makes it where single week owners simply can't get the good stuff. Or Bluegreen which gives higher priority the more points you own. Something like saying DVC owners over 500 points can reserve a month earlier and those over 1000 another month earlier still.

I rented some points from a few other DVC members a couple years back for a family reunion. Back then, member services told me I could only have one set of points moved into my account a year. I had one set moved into my account, and had others make resvs for different parts of my party.
Has this changed? If they went by the old rule, this problem wouldn't exist. People could still own over a 1000 points and rent out, but it would prevent someone from buying up points just for the sake of being a travel agent.

It did. It changed at the same time that the holding account points could be booked at 60 days out instead of 30, seems like it was about Aug/Sept of 2000.

 

[CarolMN]

IMHO (and FWIW, I've posted this before, but it bears repeating), anyone who uses the DIS Rent/Trade Forum owes this site a debt of gratitude. I find it interesting to note how few of the "DVC landlords" have an avatar that indicates they sponsor the boards.

I am personally amazed that the DIS continues to provide this service for no charge. IMHO, this activity should be relegated to the DIS Auction site and an appropriate fee charged for each transaction. As I recall, this was an announced change a while back, but posters put up such a fuss that the DIS graciously decided to back off.

Seems to me that even those who rent infrequently should be willing to pay a small fee to take advantage of the resources and traffic generated by these boards. Doubt such a move would negatively impact board traffic. And If it drives some of the more objectionable renting activity elsewhere, is that really a loss?

It is true there are other sites to rent points, but I do not think any of them generate the "Disney specific" traffic that this one does, let alone the sense of community that may alleviate some of the anxiety/risk that goes along with renting. I know I'd rent from someone here long before I'd consider renting from ebay or a site I do not visit very often! (But that's a moot point because I don't anticipate being a party to either side of a renting transaction).

Anyway, JMHO. YMMV.

 

[DisneyDVClover]

Wow I am glad I don't use this to rent mind you I just found this place recently and I shouldn't say never mind you I have a decent network of renters that are always asking for points wether I have them or not LOL. It is funny how they are upset when we use all our points and they can't get any I guess I have a loyal following atleast for my points LOL. I wouls also never let my points go for 10 dollars a point I get on average 13-15 a point.

 

[normr]

I'm going to be renting out some of my points for the first time because we wanted to go to Las Vegas for the first time and DVC's choices are pretty poor (in fact one of them has been removed from the list for not being up to DVC standards), so we felt we could rent out some points and take the cash to stay at one of the nicer hotels ourselves.

If DVC can't accomodate me for what I need then I need to protect myself, and they only have full weeks, and I only want 3 days.