DVC T &C Personal Use - Only Thread to Discuss!

[Cyberc1978]

Someone said they heard no modifying of guests. You can at least add guests to trips. Just did that.

could it be changing the lead guest?

 

[VGCgroupie]

Someone said they heard no modifying of guests. You can at least add guests to trips. Just did that.

Id really like to know if this in fact true, no modifications. But Im not willing to take one for the team and try it.

 

[Cyberc1978]

I bet it’s because of the difference in pre RiV resorts and I’m glad you found that other because the POS should always prevail.

What would or could that mean when it comes to personal use / commercial use?

 

[Cyberc1978]

How can owners on the one hand be allowed to rent - but on the other not be allowed?

I mean commercial renting is by definition getting money for the reservation.

So I'm allowed to rent or give a reservation a away as long as money is not exchanging hands?

 

[Sandisw]

We have disagreed on this before and I don’t want to take more of your time arguing about it now, but there is a strong contractual argument that Disney would be well within their rights to say that spec rentals are done to maximize income and therefore commercial in nature, even if you are allowed occasional rentals. Ultimately, we will see what Disney decides to do.

Again, our contract allows personal use and this now defines it better for owners.


One rental simply can not be considered frequent or regular…regardless of how much one is making.

But, like you said, DVC gets to decide. To me, this implies that DVC is looking for owners who are using their memberships to rent in high quantities

 

[Sandisw]

What would or could that mean when it comes to personal use / commercial use?

The RiV and beyond POS have more specific examples of what they could implement as rules and the term reasonable definition is not used.

I know we get hung up on commercial, but the issue is really about DVC defining personal use and not commercial.

And that is what they just did. If it doesn’t fit under personal than it is, by exclusion, commercial purpose.

What they did was clarify the level of renting that is not considered personal use. It now says “ personal use is not frequent and regular renting”

To me, it means that if your level of renting can’t be seen as frequent or regular, you are within your rights guaranteed to you to do that under personal use.

 

[Wakey]

POS said commercial renting is not permissible. Commercial not defined. Seems to be implied that non commercial renting is possible.
POS forms part of timeshare contract.
POS states only when someone rents in excess of 20 times a year at that point DVC can require member to prove it is not commercial.

 

[Sandisw]

Id really like to know if this in fact true, no modifications. But Im not willing to take one for the team and try it.

I just know added a guest and got my new confirmation.

ETA: And, I was able to modify a reservation to new dates.

So, the only thing I have not done is change the r lead guest name on a reservation.

 

[MarkNC2Disney]

 

[JackosinDIS]

Someone said they heard no modifying of guests. You can at least add guests to trips. Just did that.

Yes, I’ve seen reports that modifications to the lead guest are now banned. No way of testing it out though unless you call MS to change one. That would stop spec renting pretty quickly if true… but I’m also pretty sure it would face some strong challenges by members!

 

[CWTC]

Id really like to know if this in fact true, no modifications. But Im not willing to take one for the team and try it.

I just added 3 guests to a reservation I made yesterday but I did not change the lead guest which is me.

 

[Sandisw]

could it be changing the lead guest?

Trying that now!

 

[Mouseforward]

You wouldn’t be able to book for your family if you can’t change the lead guest.

 

[Sandisw]

To confirm, I just used chat and changed a Dec night to a new name. I did have to confirm it was for personal use. Said yes…and it was processed

So, I have added guests, changed lead guest, and modified dates. All worked. I do not not think we are going to see any changes made to changing lead guests.

 

[Wakey]

I suspect due to serious potential legal issues given POS wordings etc, Disney will be sensible. They will clamp down on commercial renters and most will agree that’s good. They may stop amendments to lead names, but that may cause issues such as the lead cannot go, so wife’s sister now replacing husband on booking ( or vice versa no sexism here!). That will lead to complaints, so that will be interesting to see. I can’t see them bothering with the person who rents all their points every other year, or a third of them every year as they’ve got too much. Disney won’t want to poke the membership bear too much due to concern their very loosely defined rules will be interpreted contra proferentum on the contract.

 

[Sandisw]

I suspect due to serious potential legal issues given POS wordings etc, Disney will be sensible. They will clamp down on commercial renters and most will agree that’s good. They may stop amendments to lead names, but that may cause issues such as the lead cannot go, so wife’s sister now replacing husband on booking ( or vice versa no sexism here!). That will lead to complaints, so that will be interesting to see. I can’t see them bothering with the person who rents all their points every other year, or a third of them every year as they’ve got too much. Disney won’t want to poke the membership bear too much due to concern their very loosely defined rules will be interpreted contra proferentum on the contract.

No issue just changing the lead guest on a Dec night….just had to acknowledge the new wording about being personal use.

 

[PolyRob]

To confirm, I just used chat and changed a Dec night to a new name. I did have to confirm it was for personal use. Said yes…and it was processed

So, I have added guests, changed lead guest, and modified dates. All worked. I do not not think we are going to see any changes made to changing lead guests.

Thanks for confirming it still works! At least DVC is being consistent with the terms even via chat. This should be fine for anyone not truly renting for commercial purposes.

It would be comical for DVC to question the change of a lead guest if you're noted as "traveling together" or requesting connecting villas at VGF or PVB.

 

[HyperspaceMountainPilot]

Thanks for confirming it still works! At least DVC is being consistent with the terms even via chat. This should be fine for anyone not truly renting for commercial purposes.

It would be comical for DVC to question the change of a lead guest if you're noted as "traveling together" or requesting connecting villas at VGF or PVB.

I'm not confident that the fact you can do it with MS today means you will be able to do it with MS a week or a month for now-- however, it would make sense if it can still be done manually with MS and they can quickly check that you haven't changed names on many reservations over the past year or two-- I think it would actually be the best case solution (except we will pay slightly more in dues as this will make name changes more labor intensive... though in theory they could code this but hey, we're talking about Disney IT here).

 

[Cyberc1978]

I'm not confident that the fact you can do it with MS today means you will be able to do it with MS a week or a month for now-- however, it would make sense if it can still be done manually with MS and they can quickly check that you haven't changed names on many reservations over the past year or two-- I think it would actually be the best case solution (except we will pay slightly more in dues as this will make name changes more labor intensive... though in theory they could code this but hey, we're talking about Disney IT here).

What would be the difference if you changed the name when you made booking vs changing it afterwards?

Both could be interpreted as renting?

 

[HyperspaceMountainPilot]

What would be the difference if you changed the name when you made booking vs changing it afterwards?

Both could be interpreted as renting?

"Spec renting" is very common where you don't have a renter at 11mo for the most desirable (profitable) dates but hold the rooms anyway confident you can rent them for $30 per point (or more) eventually. It mostly makes sense if your goal is to make as much money as possible on your points so it's more commercial in nature. It is a different subtype of renting that I think causes much more pain to your novice DVC owners.