DVC sales tactics on the cruise............

[momtofour]

I recently returned from cruising on the Disney Dream. I attended a sales presentation for non-DVC members interested in purchasing into the DVC. I am a very happy DVC member but was shocked at some of the sales tactics used to recruit new members. Some of the points made were the following:
1) If you use your points for cruising, it will be MUCH cheaper than what you would pay in cash.
2) This was a biggie. The guide claimed that only recently have they started to give money off for different point levels purchased. He said that they used to credit the purchaser the amount they had paid for their hotel stay or cruise. So, if you had spent $4000 at the Contemporary and purchased during your stay there, they would call the front desk and find out the amount to credit. He says that due to privacy laws they can no longer do that. So the per point reduction is now offered. I took the tour in 2000 at VWL and this adjustment was never mentioned! Never heard of it either.
3) The guide was talking about what a safe investment buying a deeded property in Disney would be. He claimed that when everything fell apart a few years back, people were buying in droves into the DVC because it was stable. Claims there was an article about this.
4) Said that Michael Eisner never wanted DVC but was overruled. (Not sure if that is true or not.) Said that Disney really doesn't want you to buy DVC because it is so much more profitable for them to have you stay on property at the regular rates. Claims they are keeping this whole DVC program sort of under the radar.
Also, he mentioned renting as an option when times get a bit tough.

Thought DVC was above some of this but I guess they are just a typical company trying to get their numbers up. Thoughts? What is going on in these sales presentations at the DVC centers?

 

[bwvBound]

2) This was a biggie. The guide claimed that only recently have they started to give money off for different point levels purchased. He said that they used to credit the purchaser the amount they had paid for their hotel stay or cruise. So, if you had spent $4000 at the Contemporary and purchased during your stay there, they would call the front desk and find out the amount to credit. He says that due to privacy laws they can no longer do that. So the per point reduction is now offered. I took the tour in 2000 at VWL and this adjustment was never mentioned! Never heard of it either.

We were given this offer somewhere between January 1997 - February 1998. At the time, it was pretty tempting to us as we were staying at the Yacht Club on our employer's dime.

4) Said that Michael Eisner never wanted DVC but was overruled. (Not sure if that is true or not.) Said that Disney really doesn't want you to buy DVC because it is so much more profitable for them to have you stay on property at the regular rates. Claims they are keeping this whole DVC program sort of under the radar.

I've heard the statement that Eisner wasn't interested in building timeshare but thought the backstory included the notion, "Who in their right mind would want to buy this?"

 

[drusba]

What you got were things that they can later say had some truth in them but they were definitely taking things out of context to provide "fluff':

1. Cruise is cheaper on points: Is it really a lie? If, like members, you look at it as the point cost is high because you could rent your points for $10 per, then the cruise is not cheaper than cash. If instead you look at it as what is the incremental cost of your points per year if you look at purchase price and spread it out over 45 to 50 years, then the value of your points for any particular year becomes a lot less than $10 and probably under $3 a point, which makes the cruise cheaper than cash.

2. Using your regular WDW trip cost as down payment: That was in fact the sales technigue used in the early DVC period through a significant part of the 1990s. Then they changed to charging you regular stated price but you could sell back first year points for a set sum and apply the amount to your down payment (it varied over time but got to $15 per point for HH and VB, $10 for WDW resorts but at times only 5$ apoint for BCV when it was new). Thus there was no actual discount off the price per se during that period which lasted from the late 1990s to about 2003. It was not until SSR that Disney changed its sales tactic to charge a high price but then always discount it for resorts still selling. None of the changes had anything at all to do with privacy laws so that was truly just made up. The changes were made because Disney viewed the discount off stated price way as a better way to sell more points.

3. DVC flourished during recession: DVC did actually survive the 2008 to 2010 period much better than others and continued fairly robust sales even while it raised prices several times during that period.

4. Eisner story: this one appears made up but then it really has little to do with whether you should buy DVC. Eisner was reticent to go with DVC originally but so was everybody else on the board at Disney because they were introducing it at a time when the words "timeshare" and "crooks" were thought interchangeable. However, it would never have been approved without Eisner so to say he was overruled is incorrect. As to "so much more profitable" to rent you a room," that is more fluff that really compares apples to oranges -- it is literally true that for one single trip Disney could make more off of you renting a room than the incremental cost of DVC but the big picture when considering all factors including gathering a loyal member base that will always come to Disney leads to a different conclusion. DVC has been hugely profitable for Disney and it is telling as to what it thinks is more profitable right now because it keeps building more DVC resorts but not any new hotels.

 

[Deb & Bill]

We bought our first 175 points at OKW in 1997 with a discount for our stay at the Polynesian.

 

[JimMIA]

Sounds to me like DVC hired a Wyndham or Wastegate sales weasel!

 

[bobbiwoz]

My biggest eye opener regarding Disney timeshare selling tactics was also on a cruise. Members already knew about the first of the more recent point chart increases, but they were selling points as if the present years point allotment was what was to be. I mentioned to them privately that I thought it was misleading not to give the following years point chart.

 

[OKW Lover]

Other than the Board, nobody could have "overruled" Michael. He had a reputation for being rather autocratic, especially in the last half of his years at the helm. So, I'm not believing that part of the pitch.

 

[momtofour]

OP here. I am glad to hear that some of what I heard does have an element of truth to it. However, this presentation was so different and somewhat misleading compared to the meeting I had with a guide in 2000. Would love to hear feedback as to what is being said at the DVC sales centers.

 

[CMOORE185]

Here is a take on the cruise part. For example I was looking at a 7 night Alaska cruise for Aug. 2013. The cash price was $8450, the points cost was 1144 for a family of four in a verhanda room. My dues average $5.30 per point. Now you need to factor in your inital investment. I paid 35,480 for my 500 points. Over the live of my contract I will get aprox. 25,000 points. So I paid about $1.42 per point. So for the cruise I am paying about 6.72 per point. 6.72×1144= $7688+the $95 transaction fee= $7783 I am paying for cruise using my points, a savings of $667 over the cash price. Everyones numbers are going to be different than this depending what you paid per point and your dues. Some will have more savings than me, some less. One thing is for sure though, it is not a huge savings if any at all.

 

[papertraveller]

What were the offers on the cruise?

And what were the giveaways? Wondering if this will be worth our time ...

 

[arthur06]

4) Said that Michael Eisner never wanted DVC but was overruled. (Not sure if that is true or not.) Said that Disney really doesn't want you to buy DVC because it is so much more profitable for them to have you stay on property at the regular rates. Claims they are keeping this whole DVC program sort of under the radar.

This is my favorite.

If by "under the radar" he means on nearly every bus and bench at WDW, then yes "under the radar". There are DVC sales booths in every park, DTD, and most, if not all hotels.

Sounds about as under the table as a Wilt Chamberlain lover.

 

[momtofour]

OP again. Concerning the offers, I believe it was what is listed on dvcnews. com. In addition, they were giving $500 Disney gift cards for contracts of 160 points or above. Concerning handouts, the only gift I saw was a DVC bag for groceries etc.

On a previous cruise, I also noted that a reallocation was done for the following year. They did not pass out the chart for the upcoming year. Claimed they didn't have it! A little sneaky in my opinion. I would be quite dismayed if I purchased and then found out I did not buy enough to vacation when I wanted to.

Also, the guide kept emphasizing how busy he is...better grab your time off the board right now. Then a bit later he was interrupted by another guide who indicated that there were only a few spots left. Not sure we can fit everyone in. It was getting pretty tacky in my opinion after hearing a number of mistruths......... It was a real turnoff to me.

 

[OKW Lover]

OP again. Concerning the offers, I believe it was what is listed on dvcnews. com. In addition, they were giving $500 Disney gift cards for contracts of 160 points or above. Concerning handouts, the only gift I saw was a DVC bag for groceries etc.

No hat?

 

[momtofour]

Hats were given out at the meeting for existing DVC members. The comments and sales tactics that I am referring to were at the meeting for new recruits.

 

[OKW Lover]

Hats were given out at the meeting for existing DVC members. The comments and sales tactics that I am referring to were at the meeting for new recruits.

Thanks for the clarification!

 

[DebbieB]

What they probably didn't say is that cruise availability on points is limited. You usually have to book far in advance from what I've seen posted.

 

[com_op_2000]

When I bought in, in the first year of availablity, I got a credit/discount from being at DL-AB at the time.

 

[JimMIA]

1. Cruise is cheaper on points: Is it really a lie? If, like members, you look at it as the point cost is high because you could rent your points for $10 per, then the cruise is not cheaper than cash. If instead you look at it as what is the incremental cost of your points per year if you look at purchase price and spread it out over 45 to 50 years, then the value of your points for any particular year becomes a lot less than $10 and probably under $3 a point, which makes the cruise cheaper than cash.

Only if you completely ignore annual dues, which range from about $4-$6 per point. Those are the most important component of any subset of DVC points, and they bring the real cost up quite a bit.

DVC is no different from any other timeshare in that the best use of the points is within the internal timeshare system itself. Any time you branch out into "other options" you're rarely getting a good value for the points...in anybody's timeshare program.

 

[tjkraz]

We were on the Dream a week ago and our experience couldn't have been more different. The sales staff there mentioned the incentives right at the start of the meeting and it was so brief that I didn't even get to jot them down properly. No powerpoint slides. No promo videos. Just a quick mention of add-on prices and then it was on to the fun and games.

Of course, this was at the session for existing members.

We traveled with some friends and one of them is in sales. I told him later that I thought it was almost too low key. He agreed and said they could have done a much better job of presenting the special incentives and encouraging add-ons.

I should add that they did spend considerable time talking about the referral program, encouraging members to recruit their fellow passengers to buy into DVC. Perhaps that's where most sales come from so they played it pretty low key with the current members.

 

[momtofour]

I agree TJ. We must have been on the same cruise. The meeting for existing members was SO low key. In fact, after the meeting I stopped by the DVC desk to find out what the incentives were for existing members because the details really were not presented. They wouldn't tell me but wanted me to schedule a meeting with the guide. So imagine my surprise when I attended the meeting for new recruits. It was so different and obviously full of mistruths.

Another point mentioned in that meeting is that one of the big reasons Disney agreed to DVC is because they were losing so many guests to offsite resorts due to cost. Isn't that why they built the Value resorts?