DVC has lost focus

[dianeschlicht]

Does it seem that recently DVC has lost its way. It seems to me the focus is no longer on its members and the Disney way but on making the most money it can. Recently we have seen the benefits decrease. To where there is no real advantage being a DVC member. The prices have gone up at a increased level that is unjustified. It seems pure greed is taken over at DVC.
The member cruise last year was a disappointment. Disney cruise line was great the DVC part was lacking. The incentives were a slap in the face.

Us DVCers come to WDW on a regular basis and spend alot when we come. DVC has forgotten that.
They sell rooms for cash when they tell us their full. We are not paying dues so they can sell the rooms to cash customers.

I could not DISAGREE more! There are far better benefits now than there were 15 years ago when we first joined. The AP benefit alone is by far the best one.

Sure, my dues have gone up, but so has the maintenance costs on my house. I don't think that's out of line. Besides, Disney has to follow rules, and they can't just "charge more" for the profit of it. They have to have checks and balances to show that the fees charged are going toward the operation of the resort you purchased into.

As for member's cruises....DCL is NOT part of DVC...yet...and as an exchange option, you will always pay more for those than an in system exchange like to another DVC resort.

 

[vacationer1954]

I've been a DVC member since just about the beginning. Their focus hasn't changed.

 

[HayGan]

I think DVC's focus has always been on being a profitable business. That doesn't mean for one minute that I don't enjoy being a DVC member. I enjoy many of the perks that go along with membership but I don't for one minute think that they will always be there.

 

[matthew517]

Incentives were a slap in the face? That sounds like how dare they not give me the sale price I think is justified? Really?

No they offered better incentives on other cruises and the incentives offered prior to the cruise were better. For 100 add on points you got a littogragh.
They were only selling AK & BLT. They wouldnt talk other properties.
For the 20th year everyone was expecting more than what they gave.
Their attitude was this is it take it or leave it.

 

[matthew517]

Sure, my dues have gone up, but so has the maintenance costs on my house. I don't think that's out of line. Besides, Disney has to follow rules, and they can't just "charge more" for the profit of it. They have to have checks and balances to show that the fees charged are going toward the operation of the resort you purchased into.

The dues is not an issue. It is the cost of points that is rising at an alarming rate. Soon the price will be over 200 for Grand floridian.

 

[bumbershoot]

But 100 price increase in less than 6 years is excessive.

In 92 we got park tickets as a benefits.

How is this changing your enjoyment of it, though? Why would a long established owner even CARE about what they are charging now? We only bought in '09, but unless/until we want to buy more points, the price they are charging now doesn't change our experience in any way, shape, or form.

I have no problem with this if the rooms are open. But I know a few DVC members that tried to get in AKKV and couldn't.

Well, tell those people to go book one of the at-least two available at AK at this exact moment (er, 2 minutes ago, so 1:03pm Pacific time) for Feb 10-17. (and that's just 2 of 4 choices that I'm seeing for our dates! alas, we do not have the available pointage for even the OKW one, sigh)

They were only selling AK & BLT. They wouldnt talk other properties.

Same as when we bought on land. Same resorts, actually. And when we first took the tour, 1.5 years before, they ONLY talked SSR. I would have had to force my guide to talk other resorts. For a cruise salesperson, of course they want to only talk about the current ones.



But for us, DVC was ONLY ever a timeshare at a place we wanted to be. ONLY. The perks are extra!

 

[MsTessP]

"Greed" is not involved at all - fiduciary responsibility to shareholders is the reality.

I'm a Disney shareholder - I've given them my hard-earned investment funds, and I expect them to wisely use them to increase my value. Let's say the CEO were to tell me "you know, Tess, our marketing folks researched the issue and reported that we could easily sell the new DVC at $XX/point. However, we decided that we would be too "greedy" if we did that, so we are going to sell at a price point considerably less. We have also decided to be less "greedy" in many of our other operations here at Disney. We're sure that you and your other shareholders - incuding retirement plans with fixed income retirees - want to share the "magic" with everyone and will not mind us essentially reducing your share value."

If that happened, I would 1. sell my shares and/or 2. get involved with a hostile investor movement to kick management to the street.

This is a free country, and free enterprise is still the best working model, despite what you might hear from Washington. Prices should be determined by what the market will bear. Nobody, including Disney, is holding a gun to anybody and making them pay those (agreeably insane) direct prices. If they cannot sell them at those prices, the prices will come down.

As a Disney shareholder, and DVC owner by resale, I am currently very happy with my DVC and with Disney corporate.

 

[matthew517]

People will continue to buy points at any cost.
And yes I am happy I bought when i did. Dont get me wrong I love DVC. I am happy with the price I paid for the value. My points have all ready paid for themselves.
I love the AK my home resort. And I love DCL.

I was wrong for using the term slap in the face for the DVC Member cruise.
I was told by others on this board how awesome the member cruises were and how awesome the incentives were. And being the 20th every one thought it would be great. The cruise like I say was great. The incentives were not. The reps were there to sell what they were given to sell.
My rep is awesome he was not on the cruise.
That the incentives and gifts would justify the extra cost. I hear people say well the tips are included.
But to me the additional cost was not justified in my opinion. It was nice being with majority DVC members. And Ducky Williams was great. I know that alot of people were disappointed from all I spoke to on the cruise last year and I believe that is why they are having a hard time selling the member cruises out this time.
One point I want to make. We DVCers are their most valuable asset they have. We are the ones who share with non members and I believe we account for 40 to 70% of their new sales. I have lead many people to DVC who have purchased and will continue to do so. If we tell DVC we want better benefits they will offer them. If we go along with the thought of being sheep and accepting what we get we will continue to get barley anything.
When I’m on a DCL and have the DVC lanyard on and people on the ship ask I tell them all about DVC. And my last trip to WDW I shared with at least 10 families about DVC. I end up spending at least 10 minutes explaining it and how I have used it. We are in fact DVC salespeople.

 

[hjgaus]

When I’m on a DCL and have the DVC lanyard on and people on the ship ask I tell them all about DVC. And my last trip to WDW I shared with at least 10 families about DVC. I end up spending at least 10 minutes explaining it and how I have used it. We are in fact DVC salespeople

I agree with matthew517's last statement. I talk up DVC to all I know but only those DIEHARD DISNEY lovers are the ones who really are interested in DVC. We recently had a chance to bring other than family on DVC property (VGC) and they LOVED IT!!! My Disney fanatic friends are AP holders like us & live close by (15 minutes to DLR - we live 30 minutes) They have never taken a vacation in hotel atmosphere so I said "it cost me nothing to add you to the list & you don't even have to stay over night if you're uncomfortable." She agreed - not sure what to expect but ended up having an awesome time!! They experienced DVC for the 1st time in the GRAND VILLA! I mentioned that it won't always be THIS good (staying in the 3 bed) but the benefits to staying on property are fun even though we live close by. They would love to be DVCer's but for right now thier finances say otherwise. She said "I heard you go on & on about this and kept thinking must be nice but until I actually did it I couldn't grasp the concept of this! It's wonderful!" I'm sure when finances for them get better,they will be DVCer's like us! So now she knows how I felt when we would meet for just a day visit & you just want to go back to the room and relax for a little bit! She felt like it was home too!! I LOVE TAKING MINI STAYCATIONS!! So sometimes I feel like a DVC sales person but I don't mind!!

 

[RobDoc]

How many grandvillas at BLT? If they only offer 4 percent to cash how do they rent out several Grandvillas for cash?

How many Grandvillias at AKKV? Let's say there are 50. When I was last there 5 were filled by cash paying families I spoke to at the pool. That is 10%. There were very few DVC owners at the pool. The majority were cash paying customers. I have no problem with this if the rooms are open. But I know a few DVC members that tried to get in AKKV and couldn't.

BLT has a total of 14 GVs. AKV has a total of 22 GVs.

Since neither of those resorts are sold out, DVD still owns the all of the inventory not yet declared as member inventory and those units are available for cash rental thru DRC. In addition, any villas unreserved using DVC points at 60 days are made available for cash reservations thru DRC and any DVC points used by members at those resorts are also available to reserve DVC villas as cash reservations (and thus no longer available for DVC point reservations).

I do find it a little hard to believe that you were able to interview enough guests staying at the resort to know that the majority of the registered guests had payed cash but, certainly in chatting with a few families at the pool, it's possible that the "majority" of those "were cash paying customers".

It's entirely possible that 5 GVs could be available for cash reservations at certain times of the year. In addition, DVC members benefit from the cash reservations made from any villas unreserved 60 days before arrival. That income even appears in the annual budget as "Breakage Income" and is used to offset member fees.

If you, or anyone else, feels that DVC is not honoring it's fiduciary responsibility to members you should provide your evidence to the contrary to Florida government officials that oversee such matters. You can even request those numbers from DVC. I would not expect to find anything out-of-the-ordinary, but you never know.

Good luck!

 

[CarolMN]

....(snip).......In the past year I have gone on a DCL cruise on points ........

Cruising takes a lot of points and many members use points to cruise. The VAST majority of the DVC rooms available to the general public for cash are there because of members like you, who choose to use their points for non-DVC options like cruising.

In order to pay for the member's choice, DVC sends the equivalent number of DVC room nights to the cash inventory. The proceeds of those cash rentals (less a commission for CRO/DRC) are used to pay for the non-DVC resort choices.

There is nothing wrong with using points to cruise or stay at non-DVC resorts. But that is why so many DVC rooms are available for cash when rooms for points are sold out. I am pointing this out because there are so many members who do not understand how this system works.

Without the ability to turn points into cash by sending rooms to CRO, members would not be able to use their points to cruise or stay at non-DVC WDW resorts.

 

[DebbieB]

People will continue to buy points at any cost.
And yes I am happy I bought when i did. Dont get me wrong I love DVC. I am happy with the price I paid for the value. My points have all ready paid for themselves.
I love the AK my home resort. And I love DCL.

I was wrong for using the term slap in the face for the DVC Member cruise.
I was told by others on this board how awesome the member cruises were and how awesome the incentives were. And being the 20th every one thought it would be great. The cruise like I say was great. The incentives were not. The reps were there to sell what they were given to sell.
My rep is awesome he was not on the cruise.
That the incentives and gifts would justify the extra cost. I hear people say well the tips are included.
But to me the additional cost was not justified in my opinion. It was nice being with majority DVC members. And Ducky Williams was great. I know that alot of people were disappointed from all I spoke to on the cruise last year and I believe that is why they are having a hard time selling the member cruises out this time.
One point I want to make. We DVCers are their most valuable asset they have. We are the ones who share with non members and I believe we account for 40 to 70% of their new sales. I have lead many people to DVC who have purchased and will continue to do so. If we tell DVC we want better benefits they will offer them. If we go along with the thought of being sheep and accepting what we get we will continue to get barley anything.When I’m on a DCL and have the DVC lanyard on and people on the ship ask I tell them all about DVC. And my last trip to WDW I shared with at least 10 families about DVC. I end up spending at least 10 minutes explaining it and how I have used it. We are in fact DVC salespeople.

Do you seriously think we have leverage with DVC to demand better benefits? They are selling out resorts as fast as they can build them! They keep raising the prices and are still selling!

So what will happen if the members demand more benefits and don't get them? Sell? They'll buy back the points and sell them to someone else for a higher price.

 

[keishashadow]

The annual pass discount was recently increased 49% ($100 to $149).

I've been a member for almost 13 years and have no complaints. Probably because I know what I bought into and don't expect more than that.

They were very smart to increase the AP discount. I'll finally be redeeming my voucher that's been launguishing since last year and will upgrade unused tix on hand to buy one for the mr too for next year's trip. We'll be doing an extra WDW trip (or two) equates more $s spent in the parks vs elsewhere and we're revisiting adding on to cover the vacation points needs.

I think DVC's focus has always been on being a profitable business. That doesn't mean for one minute that I don't enjoy being a DVC member. I enjoy many of the perks that go along with membership but I don't for one minute think that they will always be there.

If it wasn't we'd all be complaining. I don't need DVC to hold my hand, If I didn't think it was a good value i've had cut my losses and run. I'm well past the 7 year itch and am well aware of it's flaws but still get that special feeling when I think of our DVC vacations and WDW in general.

 

[edk35]

Disney does sell rooms for cash when there are no DVC rooms. There are two separate inventories, Disney retains about 4% of each resort and rents rooms that DVC members have traded into Disney for other vacations such as cruises and Adventures By Disney. Those rooms should not be available to DVC members because they are not part of DVC inventory. It has nothing to do with greed, it's the way the system works. I have been a member for 11 years and have seen benefits come and go. When you sign the contract benefits should not be part of the decision because they are not part of what you're purchasing. Benefits are to be considered only a perk. Frankly the benefits levels have stayed pretty consistent. One benefit that I use that wasn't available when I purchased is the discount on AP's. The addition of the ability to purchase the TIW card when you don't have an AP or are a Florida resident was a nice addition to the benefits as well.
DVC is not a not for profit business. As with all businesses they will charge as much as the market will bear. Maybe you've lost some of that magic feeling you had when you purchased, but DVC hasn't changed. The member cruise has always been like a floating advertisement for add ons. I have done two and the fun I had meeting other members is why I went on.

WAIT can we get the TIW card now without an AP? We got AP's in Jan. and of course got it because we had multiple trips this year. Is this a new thing??

 

[vicki_c]

WAIT can we get the TIW card now without an AP? We got AP's in Jan. and of course got it because we had multiple trips this year. Is this a new thing??

Newish, but not that new. I'd say the beginning of the year? It's $100 for DVC members.

 

[matthew517]

I talk to people. I talk to them at the pools in the lobby, on the buses at the bus stops in the restaurants in the hallways.

I enjoy talking to people. If more people talked to others the world would be a better place.

 

[RobDoc]

WAIT can we get the TIW card now without an AP? We got AP's in Jan. and of course got it because we had multiple trips this year. Is this a new thing??

You paid $75 with the AP discount. The DVC rate (and the FL Resident rate) is $100.

 

[gonzalj1]

I am happy with my DVC.
What I am talking about the unjustified price increases is based upon this. In 1992 the pp was around $46. Then in 2007 AK was selling for 94. In 2008 the price was 98. Last year it was 120. This year 140. I hear GF will be 200.

This is what im talking about greed.
In 15 years from 92 to 07 it went up less than $50. In three years it has risen $50. And it looks to go up another 50 in a year. I understand DVC is in it for profit. But 100 price increase in less than 6 years is excessive.

In 92 we got park tickets as a benefits.

Matt,

I'm assuming you are not working for the same salary as you were in 92. Should we consider that greed as well? I don't think so. You are simply taking what the market will bear. That's exactly what Disney is doing.

As a stockholder, I would be extremely upset if Disney was not maximizing profit at every opportunity as long as it did not hurt quality. We can argue the quality issue back and forth ad nauseum and never agree. I am happy with my purchase and happy with the quality of my Disney vacations. If you are not you can certianly vote with your wallet.

 

[edk35]

You paid $75 with the AP discount. The DVC rate (and the FL Resident rate) is $100.

Okay gotcha. Thanks

 

[disneychic]

We've been members since 2000 and we are as satisfied with DVC as we were 12 years ago.