DVC Customer Loyalty

I’m stuck on the loyalty thing because a recent leadership presentation put on by Disney for my office (not Disney) claimed this is part of the Disney values and their logic model to profit.
If not, then fine. If it is, then how does it show up in their action steps? That’s what I want to know...and I want to hear all of your stories!
i definitely dont think they are about customer loyalty anymore, at least not with their Parks and Resorts. Having a strong brand to go off of? yes. but customer loyalty? havent felt that in at least 2 years
 
This was a huge deal for my family of 5, trying to navigate the airports with 3 little kids is very difficult, and not having to worry about our luggage was a big deal and one of the reasons we bought DVC. Now they are making it harder to go, and more expensive.
Yep!

We'll pay you in DVC points. 1 point per kid per lap around World Showcase.

Head of Customer Loyalty, pay attention...the masses have spoken. Would love to see Auntie’s Beachhouse childcare open again. When my husband and I did a monorail date, I took my daughter to the Poly childcare- awesome for her to say the least... but so sad that it and the others closed soon after.
Maybe they were listening a little because I got a DVC-only advance booking ABD email today. Maybe that is their loyalty olive branch. Hmm
 
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We'll pay you in DVC points. 1 point per kid per lap around World Showcase.

Reminds me of the time after having just completed the entire World Showcase in the heat of July and my youngest...4 at the time...discovered the Kidcot stops. She had been such a trooper that we did the entire thing again just so we could get the mask and pieces for each country.

We still have that and all I can say, while she was excited, her older brother and sister were not..they were 8 and 12!
 
Ok first of all, I want to know how all you 20 somethings were doing all this international travel?? LOL. I don't think I've been overseas (like, other than Caribbean cruises) since I was 18, and that was a family trip. I was working an entry level job with low pay and no PTO in my 20s.

I am a younger GenX with youngish kids. I had a few trips to Disney as a kid, and a few in my 20s with family - which were a blast. My husband never went and had no interest until a work conference there that he came home all excited about and started being open to the idea of Disney trips.

I came at this from a different direction from many of you - My ten year old has special needs. I'd never even consider a trip of this kind before now. Crowds, heat, loud noises, long lines, flashing lights.... a perfect storm of things we avoid. My dad was a rope drop to fireworks Disney goer. And, especially spending the kind of money to go there, that's how I want to do it too. But I know he can't handle it. And honestly, my husband can't either. Even my 6 year old is beat by 4 or 5. I knew I couldn't do a blow out one-and-done-do-it-all every few years trip to Disney. And we certainly aren't doing any exotic travel... Dvc gives me a way to know that what we didn't get to this trip, we will be back again to see. It allows us to stay in what is essentially an apartment, where we have a full kitchen, a dishwasher, laundry, two bathrooms, two tvs, easy transportation where we want to go on property, room to spread out. We live in Georgia so it is easy and inexpensive to get there.

Having done a trip now, he actually exceeded my expectations. The worst infraction was him trying to climb out of the boat in living with the land to touch the sand, and again later in Frozen ever after to touch the snow. Most of the restaurants have been incredibly accommodating to his food eccentricities (shout out to Garden Grill for getting him hamburgers from God-knows-where when it wasn't on their menu), but when they haven't, we have a kitchen to make him something he will eat. My six year old was the one who had a foot stomping showdown in Animal Kingdom, and fell asleep on the ride back. I didn't even get to see Pandora. In Magic Kingdom, we walked through Fantasyland and never even entered Frontierland.... And I am shrugging it off and making a better plan for "next time". My husband and I are talking about Aulani next year, even coming to WDW just the two of us, and I can see that resort only or one park stays would work too. It may have been over ambitious to try to fit all the parks in one trip. The kids have loved the pool and there are a lot of activities going on. My older son has shown interest in the science and history in the parks, and my younger son has loved the princesses and all the characters he has seen. I think as we move into the teenage years there will be short trips to New England as my son has a desire to see all the historical sites he is interested in, but yeah, I don't know that fancy Europe trips are in our future. I don't know. Over the years I've worked on being ok with what is easy. Realizing we could stay like this made this possible and bearable for all of us.

All that said, it isn't the same WDW I remember. And I don't think it is just because of Covid. I did like the cavalcades and characters on balconies - better than parades. That's an improvement. And they came around often. The lines were actually really good overall. The waiters were very accommodating. But it doesn't have the same magic. Is it because I'm now the one so aware of the price tag? Or because I feel like there is less offered for higher prices? I'm a cynical adult? Maybe I've been following too closely and know too much about money grabs. Even with the DVC hikes lately, who are the people so eager to spend more for less? I am one of those that feels we should be treated well specifically because we have chosen to put so much of our money with Disney. It wouldn't take much, as others have pointed out plenty of things in threads that would be low or no cost but make us feel like we are valued for paying their upkeep and spending our money there. Disney used to be all about service. Do they want unhappy visitors - DVC or not - to feel like it is not as innovative as it used to be, way too over priced, and poor customer service? That really will reflect poorly on them and bring down their reputation and brand. I know they have lost a lot of money this year, but I think using it as an opportunity to monetize everything will end up shooting themselves in the foot. They need to go back to their roots.
 
Ok first of all, I want to know how all you 20 somethings were doing all this international travel?? LOL. I don't think I've been overseas (like, other than Caribbean cruises) since I was 18, and that was a family trip. I was working an entry level job with low pay and no PTO in my 20s.

Some things my current self might consider as essentials were optional - like my own bed, a hot shower, a non-stop flight (long layovers can be used as a tool!) It was often easy to find rountrip flights for dirt cheap but it was a lot of:

"Leaves tonight at 10pm, you in?"
"We can land Monday morning at 5:30am, gives us 3 hours to get into work"
"Flight is $20 roundtrip but we have to leave from [two states over]" "If we can hit the road by 5:30pm we can get there in time for boarding"

We also made use of work trips. If any one of us had a work trip, we generally were all going since lodging and (most of the) food was paid for. We just needed to figure out how to work remote or take time off and cover the plane ticket.

Lodging was a perpetual game of sardines as we were very focused on $/pp that includes driving 15 hours to the port of call and squeezing 4 adults in a standard interior cruise cabin...we made it work. It was fun and I could never travel like that again.
 
I’m a Gen-Xer/“Oregon Trailer” who opted to have my kids in my late 20s (okay technically I turned 30 with my youngest), so both of my boys are teens and my oldest becomes a senior this fall (how did that happen?!?!). I (and DH) had only been to Disney once as kids, but it was the first big vacation we took together (and also where he proposed). We fell in love with how magical it all felt, and because we had booked it in under 6 months, we needed to resort hop,which also had us fall in love with the resort theming. Disney created magic and told wonderful stories and we were hooked. We even got married at Disney (it was surprisingly affordable in 2001. Now… well, we looked at a vow renewal for our 20th and wow, not remotely in our budget)! We’re actually relatively new to DVC, bought in 2018, though we’ve been considering it since 2001. It just wasn’t in the financial cards till now and part of why we bought in was because we had realized Disney was pricing us out but we weren’t willing to let go yet. DVC gave us a chance to afford Disney, as we bought direct for Gold APs. As the kids move into college, we envision many short trips, and as we move towards retirement eventually our hope is to spend several weeks each winter. Maybe someday there will be grandkids. We hope to leave our contracts to our kids, should they want them, or let them sell them if they don’t.

Disney is not our only travel destination. My husband and I want to visit every National Park and so many of our family vacations were there. My second job as a travel agent afforded many opportunities to travel I wouldn’t have otherwise have afforded. About 10 years ago I got really into “the points game,” as my husband calls it, trying to maximize the travel reward points across credit cards and airline/hotel loyalty rewards programs, which let us take trips to New Zealand, Japan, Hawaii, and other places. Travel is my passion and where we spend our discretionary spending, as I wanted my kids to see the world, whether it’s Yellowstone (where we’re going this summer) or Barbados or Australia or Scotland (all places we’ve been). When my kids were little and we had little money, we were crazy budget travelers - squeezing into tiny cheap rooms and diving long car rides over flying - and we look back at the hoops we jumped through to travel and give experiences with the kids and realize that’s not what we want to do anymore. That’s one reason for DVC - villas. A kitchen. Washer and dryer. Separate bedroom for us.

But Disney is like coming home for us, a place to relax and enjoy family time, and so DVC allows us those moments in addition to our other travels. In years we don’t go, we’ll either bank the points for a bigger trip or rent them out to cover other travels (and dues.)

We WANT to keep going back to Disney. And we’re still those people that even with a kitchen will enjoy a couple of character meals each trip, buy souvenirs, pay extra for the holiday parties, etc. But we also come to enjoy the ambiance, the “happiest place,” the shows and the characters and the fireworks, the activities outside of the parks, like arts and crafts and sing-a-longs at the campfire, etc. Our worry is that Disney is not as interested in those of us who want a lifetime of memories and want to pass along that desire to our children, and that they are rising prices and limiting experiences such that the only people who will get to experience the Magic we once knew as part of the whole experience are those with lots of money. The biggest perk we used to use - evening hours - is now a pay for event. They raised the price of holiday parties and stopped limiting attendance such that it’s an hour to get hot chocolate a MVMCP, or three hours to get a photo with a character at MNSSHP. Dues go up and up with less perks to show for it, and don’t even get me started on what Disney tried to pull with the 2020 point chart and now again with the 2022 points chart.

Maybe as another noted above that I’m becoming old and jaded and have seen too much behind the curtain. I still want to believe in the Magic, though, and for that we are still holding onto our DVC and still planning future years of travel, but I do worry it is heading in a direction that will make it so that it stops feeling like coming home, stops giving us “we’ve escaped the grind of every day” feeling, and that some day we no longer feel that giddy feeling once we arrive.

We’ve got a huge trip planned in February to celebrate our anniversary - we’re bringing all my immediate family and several of our friends - so I’m hopeful we’ll have some magic then.
 
Ok first of all, I want to know how all you 20 somethings were doing all this international travel?? LOL. I don't think I've been overseas (like, other than Caribbean cruises) since I was 18, and that was a family trip. I was working an entry level job with low pay and no PTO in my 20s.

made use of work trips. and then we also just shopped really really smart. given we didnt have kids, nor did we have a job that held us to travel to only certain times of year, we were able to travel during off times
 
Our worry is that Disney is not as interested in those of us who want a lifetime of memories and want to pass along that desire to our children, and that they are rising prices and limiting experiences such that the only people who will get to experience the Magic we once knew as part of the whole experience are those with lots of money.

That sums it up for me. I work for a very large organization and part of our internal issues is that branches have operated in silos and start to protect their own. I want to know if Disney is working together for all of us and if DVC’s only relationship is with ABD. I want to know DVC can be on the forefront of other departments decisions because they have listened to members who represent Customer Loyalty as this demographic can happily bring in others to the experience if taken care of. As it stands, I can’t tell others about an overpriced stay (that I dearly love and can afford) that may bring them in debt. I can but I would feel like a jerk showing a hungry person a golden, slightly rotting fruit that is on a branch too high for them to reach.
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Haven't read the replies and will go back and do that but wanted to share my perspective.

Not sure what generation I am...GenX maybe. But the husband and I are 47. Our 3 kids are 22 (twins) and 24. We bought DVC 15 years ago (almost to the day...when closed). And we kept adding and adding points to end up with 650. My sis in law also bought DVC. Her and BIL are 5 years older than us and their 3 kids are stair step ages with ours (23, 26 and 28). We took many a trip all together.

Now, recently, I have sold off a big bit of our points. Down to 275. My kids aren't super stoked to go that often. And the hubs and I wanted more year round ownership so we bought a vacay house down by WDW (20 mins away).

But...sis in law's kids do still love going. Every chance they can they go. SIL books them rooms. Two of her 3 have long time significant others they bring and they love it to. Their kids (not really kids now that they are pushing 30) like it because they don't have a lot of money and if they go to WDW my SIL foots the bill. She books the room and pays for their annual passes and likely books their airfare for them. If she is on the trip then she even sets the bands to her CC for charging. Those GenY (or Millenials....not sure) love that. Free trip and food and booze.

My kids, though, never ask me to book them a stay. And sometimes when we ask if they want to come they are very monotone about it...like they say 'maybe' in a very robot way. No emotion. Much of the time they say they can't come. BUT...having said that, there are times when DH and I are planning they will say they wish they could go. And when they can come, they have very strong opinions on what they want to do.

Of my 3 kids, and also add in SIL's 3 kids, only 1 wants to travel the world. One of my DDs is itching to go and see. Actually just booked a trip to Mallorca (on her own dime). The others are happy to go wherever...if it's free (paid for by parents).

But my kids and SIL's kids do have some sense of nostalgia for WDW too. And I suspect some will eventually buy DVC points too. And will go often. Maybe not the 3 times a year we did, maybe just once a year. But, yes, DVC will continue to be relevant. The younger folks will age too and have families and want to show their kids what they experienced as kids...will want the grandparent/aunts/cousins trips they had as kids. I mean, when I was about 20 I would have so poo poo'd a trip to WDW. Heck, when DH booked our 1st trip in 2003 (we were 30) I grumbled about it. Going to a 'kiddie' place. But after that 1st trip we were hooked.
 
I was going to post another question about does Disney know its people but you know, I think attendance is up and that’s what matters. I do know DIS definitely does. I watched a back to back of Pete and Off the Rails yesterday. I hope Disney is supporting them in some way because they are doing a huge service in building authentic community among the fans.
I just hope everyone at Disney can expand, stretch and think creatively (and survey) to reach other previously neglected markets and build loyalty there. I know social media is another huge road in but there is even more to be done with added value.
 
Ok first of all, I want to know how all you 20 somethings were doing all this international travel?? LOL. I don't think I've been overseas (like, other than Caribbean cruises) since I was 18, and that was a family trip. I was working an entry level job with low pay and no PTO in my 20s.

This is all I was really thinking about, too. lol
 
This is all I was really thinking about, too. lol
One of the pps gave a good summary. You can travel really cheap if you take flights with too many stops and weird layovers, stay with friends to split accommodation costs in a cheap part of town (airbnb), use public transportation to get around town at your destination and don’t eat anywhere fancy. We also were stupid about money—when DH and I traveled we would literally empty our savings account (which was pretty tiny, couple thousand dollars).

Only did this a couple of years in and just after college/law school. Once I started working I didn’t have time to travel and then the kids arrived. But those were happy times. I’d hate the same trips now even if I didn’t have the kids in tow because I value comfort and cleanliness a lot more, but when you’re young and carefree you don’t really care about staying in a dive part of town if you’re having fun.
 
I did the miles game for the last 12 years so didn’t need hotel funds. Our Disney adventures were always off site. Eventually we moved to Value hotels. Low cost trumped high convenience. I am finally tired of doing the extra work and will pay for the convenience of direct booking. Still that strategic saver on the lookout for value will always be in my ear as I make each decision no matter how “high” in the food chain I go.
 
Ok first of all, I want to know how all you 20 somethings were doing all this international travel?? LOL. I don't think I've been overseas (like, other than Caribbean cruises) since I was 18, and that was a family trip. I was working an entry level job with low pay and no PTO in my 20s.
This is all I was really thinking about, too. lol
The way I traveled then was really, really cheap. Drove when we could. Took red-eye or multi-stop flights - often meant losing a day+ for traveling but made it affordable (though an 12-hour layover in an airport with a 2 and 5 year old was not a fun experience). Cheap motels. Eating ramen noodles for a month to save up, lol. Making use of mini fridge and microwave in hotel to not eat out, and living on peanut butter & jelly sandwiches for lunches when out sightseeing. Picking destinations where we could explore on our own without needing tours or guides or high admission tickets. All things admittedly we wouldn’t do now; we favor convenience and comfort and admittedly have gotten “spoiled.” That’s part of why we bought into DVC. Sure, we could do the Values forever - or even offsite 1 but that’s not the experience we want.

It is a rabbit hole, I’ll warn you, and can consume a lot of your time, but the “points game” is worth it in terms of enabling travel for cheap. I drive my husband crazy, because we have multiple credit cards that each have different earnings, and I literally have labels on the cards to help him know which card to use for which purpose so we maximize earnings. And I’m always pushing him to buy online so we get the shopping portal bonuses on top of the credit card earnings. We’ve taken several trips where our hotels, airfare and car rentals were covered by points - and in some situations, where our tours were too! It can take time, but I try to turn every dollar we spend into travel rewards so that we can travel more frequently, or at least travel to destinations we otherwise couldn’t afford.

This actually becomes part of my challenge with DVC, too, because I’m used to min-maxing points and that point difference between a studio and 1BR is a killer. It’s actually led me a few times to book 2BRs instead, especially when we want to spend more time at the resort - yes ultimately more points than a 1BR but such a better value per point. But it’s also led me to book studios when I really want a 1BR because in some seasons I just can’t justify the point difference when the 1BR is more than 2 studios.
 
We are Boomers and have been DVC members since 1995 when our only daughter was a toddler. We have used our points to make wonderful memories at WDW, VB, HHI, DL, Tokyo Disney and once we became empty nesters, on a number of long DCL cruises with friends.

But we have no particular loyalty to the Disney brand / company. We would NEVER have bought DVC if we had not been fortunate enough to have the resources to travel the world as a family all those years, as well as enjoy Disney vacations. By the time our daughter left college, she had traveled to about 35 countries and absorbed their history, culture, art, food, architecture and met amazing people.

DVC today is definitely not the product that we bought in 1995 when OKW was the entire DVC. The increasing lack of flexibility and availability, the decline in service and maintenance standards, high point requirements, exorbitant prices of the parks and restaurants, and locating all new DVC properties within WDW has made it a far less desirable to us. Our now-adult daughter has no interest in more than an occasional short visit to WDW, so we will be selling our points in the near future since it has admirably served its purpose for our family.

When we are asked about DVC (usually by young couples with a small child to two), we always advise against buying. We tell them by all means go to Disney, but put all their resources possible into experiencing the world--the London that Peter Pan flew over, Simba's African savannas, the Bavarian castles that inspired Walt, the real Tatooine in North Africa, etc.

Back to loyalty; Disney is a corporation--no more, no less. Their decisions are motivated by their bottom line; to expect their 'loyalty' to DVC members or any other group, if it reduces profits, is misguided.
 
Great thread! Thank you, @808blessing!

My thoughts are more on the "Customer Loyalty" component than the generational dialog simply because I wasn't thinking of the latter before reading this thread.

Like many of you, I've been noodling Chapek's comments regarding Customer Loyalty (as related to future AP/Membership plan) since the Quarterly Earnings Call. A thought hit me this morning while cleaning my horse paddock: Club 33 might be as close to a 'perfect' model for generating per-visit-revenue as one might find. Let's break this down a bit:
  • Disney receives a significant upfront cost for the membership.
  • Disney receives a signifiant annual fee for the membership.
  • Disney gives away free park entrance for each visit tied to a Club 33 reservation. (This is my personal understanding of how it worked in the past. This may have changed ...)
  • Disney receives margin on Food & Beverage (an expensive experience) with each Club 33 reservation.
Thus, I'd imagine that each Club 33 member is a 'valued' guest' from a monetary view. And there is high demand (at least at DLR) to join. No worries for filling vacancies.

So, how can this model be expanded to more communities w/in the brand? I'm hoping DVC is seen as the next "like kind." DVC has some elements in common with Club 33 (upfront purchase and annual fees) ... but we aren't guaranteed to spend on incidentals while using our points at DVC Resort properties in the same way a Club 33 reservation guarantees F&B revenue. I'm not sure what value to place on the question of DVC Resale and its impact on lost upfront revenue to Disney overall.

Assuming Club 33 is a good model in Disney's view ... I'm wondering how could they shape/incentivize other Disney products/affiliations to act similarly?
Hmmm. Need more thought. I've hit a huge gap attempting to parallel DVC to Club 33 ...
 
Ok first of all, I want to know how all you 20 somethings were doing all this international travel?? LOL. I don't think I've been overseas (like, other than Caribbean cruises) since I was 18, and that was a family trip. I was working an entry level job with low pay and no PTO in my 20s.
I was lucky in that I graduated with a 4 year degree at 20, worked in the financial sector for a big firm and made crazy money working a crap ton of hours while living at home. I banked it all as my only expenses were my clothes, cell phone, gas, and insurance. When I went back to school (at a state school) at 22, I was still living at home and my only expenses were clothing, gas, insurance, cell phone, tuition, and books but I was working as an instructional assistant in a school while getting my teaching degree and also worked summers for a nearby city in their Parks and Rec office as a front desk assistant. Together, those salaries were enough to cover a year of tuition, books, gas, and insurance, while still allowing me to save more than I expected.

When I graduated with my teaching degree and became a teacher, I had no debt, a car that was newer (was new when I graduated the first time), and a solid bank account (I never touched my savings account until I needed to put down a security deposit and buy some furniture for my first apartment), plus I was able to negotiate myself up the pay scale with two degrees and my experience in schools. And beginning teachers in CT make decent money. Plus I made extra cash by calling the lines for home volleyball games, working the football games selling entry tickets, and teaching in alternative evening programs for students who were overage and under-credited. That made it possible for me to travel a lot and it was no big deal in my early to mid 20s to grab a late flight from two states away because it fit my budget. I would just find where ever was cheapest to travel around my work calendar and off I went. I had to adjust a bit when I bought a home and adopted a dog but even that was minor because a friend and I would trade dog sitting duties or a good friend of mine (who lived at home) would come and dog sit for me for free just to get away from her parents and siblings.
 













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