Dues by Resort

[PolyRob]

Why does it seem that some of the more expensive resorts per point have cheaper dues per point? Coincidence, size of resort/staffing, number of members, etc? Just curious.

 

[BillPA]

Most require more points to stay in a unit. So you actually end up paying about the same to stay in those resorts.
If your units 'costs' 25 points at $6 vs. a resort that only 'costs' 20 points at $7.4 you end up paying $150 vs. $148.
It all comes out about the same in the end.

 

[PolyRob]

Most require more points to stay in a unit. So you actually end up paying about the same to stay in those resorts.
If your units 'costs' 25 points at $6 vs. a resort that only 'costs' 20 points at $7.4 you end up paying $150 vs. $148.
It all comes out about the same in the end.

Ahh, excellent point! Makes sense. Thank you

 

[crvetter]

In fact some of the “cheaper” dues resorts are the more expensive ones when you convert to cost per night, VGF and PVB are the two that come to mind.

 

[PolyRob]

In fact some of the “cheaper” dues resorts are the more expensive ones when you convert to cost per night, VGF and PVB are the two that come to mind.

Those are the two resorts I had been pricing so I guess it wasn't as apparent to me

 

[Great3]

Also, it's a function of the market. There are two group of people: one group that buys where they want to stay, and another group that tends to buy the cheapest MFs dues resorts, that cause those resort prices to rise.

Great3

 

[PolyRob]

Also, it's a function of the market. There are two group of people: one group that buys where they want to stay, and another group that tends to buy the cheapest MFs dues resorts, that cause those resort prices to rise.

Great3

Good point. I remember SS being significantly less than most and now it seems to have caught up with VGC, VGF, BLT, etc

 

[bdphill22]

For those who have had points for a while...

What is the average yearly increase in maintenance fees as a percent? Is the approx. 7% across the board I see this year about normal?

What were the maintenance fees early on, say OKW when is started?

Trying to do some calculations.

 

[crvetter]

For those who have had points for a while...

What is the average yearly increase in maintenance fees as a percent? Is the approx. 7% across the board I see this year about normal?

What were the maintenance fees early on, say OKW when is started?

Trying to do some calculations.

Here is a post I did where I have the average YOY increase since inception for each resort along with the average YOY increase since 2017.

So here are the dues history:

https://dvcnews.com/index.php/dvc-p...content/2494-historical-annual-dues-by-resort

And here is an idea for the average annual YOY due increase for each resort for 2017 to 2019 (only the copper creek timeline):

View attachment 401225

For fun here is the average yearly increase in dues since inception for each resort

View attachment 401236

 

[bdphill22]

Thank you crvetter! I really appreciate it!

Is there a reason for the large across the board increase for 2019?

Is there any determinant why one resort would consistently have higher increases than another?

Why are some years for specific resorts higher than another for that same resort? Such as a refurb or something?

 

[crvetter]

Thank you crvetter! I really appreciate it!

Is there a reason for the large across the board increase for 2019?

Is there any determinant why one resort would consistently have higher increases than another?

Why are some years for specific resorts higher than another for that same resort? Such as a refurb or something?

The large increase was mostly stemming from the increase in the minimum wage. See the post below that discusses the impact that the minimum wage might have had. Overall DVC did also get a bit more aggressive with their refurb schedule. The original estimate was at the half life of the resort to do a full refurb with a refresh/soft goods quarter life. They are now doing soft goods every 7 years and full refurb every 14. This brings the DVC resorts much closer in line with the refresh cycle of the cash side of the resorts.

As for why some resorts have higher increases than others you might be better looking at the increase of the total resort budget, not measured per point. Some resorts have significantly more points to spread across more stable costs (roofs, etc) while other resorts have much less points. So resorts where a room costs less per point might see higher nominal increases in dues per point but in actuality your effective cost (MF cost when measured per night) might be rising similarly. Also this brings up a good point resorts like VGF and PVB have low dues but looking at the cost per night that the MF contribute they quickly become some of the more expensive resorts.

Yeah my point is that the actual costs are likely going to be higher for Riviera on the salary expectation because the average salary cost per day for Riviera is higher than that of all the WDW resorts; I wasn't suggesting it was artificially inflated (As an aside actual costs aren't truly known, DVC sets an estimated cost for the line items, for instance they likely don't have a final tax assessment; also Capital Reserves can be freely set since DVC owns the entire resort).

The minimum wages the resorts are working with for this year are:

January & February - $11
March through August - $12
September through December - $13

So for a hypothetical minimum wage employee at the existing DVC's is costing MF on average (2/12)*($11) + (6/12)*($12) + (4/12)*($13) = $12.17. While for Riviera it is $13 for the same hypothetical employee which if everyone was paid minimum wage (which we know isn't the case but likely the case for a majority of the positions) that is about a 7% increase in the employee costs. So as I said this explains some of the $1 difference but not all of it.

As an aside the 2020 budgets, for all resorts, will have that hypothetical minimum wage employee averaging (9/12)*($13) + (3/12)*($14) = $13.25, since the next raise is October 2020. So the current WDW resorts, excluding Riviera, should see a YOY increase of about 9%, while Riviera will see just about 2% for this line item. For comparison 2018 to 2019 saw about a 21% increase in the per hour rate for this hypothetical employee (2018 - using $10 an hour on average, 2019 - stated above).

As I stated above the tax is likely estimated on the conservative side (just like it was for CCV) since the tax assessor doesn't finalize the number until after construction is completed. If I recall correctly, this was the reason between 2017 and 2018 you saw CCV MF drop because it's tax assessment was lower than expected/budgeted. Also why you saw a lower overall increase to CCV MF between 2018 and 2019 (no where near the level of the other resorts).

 

[bdphill22]

Thank you very much again, crvetter!