Down Syndrome child, corporal punishment & school.. need input.. long

[StrwLady]

I'm amazed that spanking in schools is still allowed. Regardless of the option of opting out.

Ilovejack02, I think if I was you I would contact your local news paper or TV news. Who knows if they will find anything wrong with this but you just might get someone to jump on this and run with it.

 

[crashbb]

I dont think this is the issue.. she is always with an aide.


I know the parents must have signed it.

I give up trying to explain what I need.

Heading to the disabilities board with my question.

So, you are trying to go over the parents' authority? I'm sorry, I'm really not understanding what you are trying to do.

If parents weren't able to opt out/didn't have to give permission, I could see banding together to fight the school board, but since they are, I'm really not understanding.

 

[harleyquinn]

If you really are upset of the thought of it happening to any student then just google Corporal punishment in schools. You'll get lots of links with research and info including groups working to outlaw it in the remaining 22 states. Those groups might be able to help you get it outlawed in your parish.

I couldn't find anything with CP and Downs specifically, but I know there's a lot of info that mentally challenged students are more likely to face CP.

I would hope this is a case of the parent mistakenly not signing a letter, but it's crazy to me how that works. Someone should have to sign in order to let the child get CP NOT just to opt out. Messed up logic.

 

[harleyquinn]

The national media might find it a juicy topic to tackle.

Seeing as how it's 2009 and not 1909.

They already are, just google it.

 

[Cindy B]

If the parents signed this "corporal punishment letter" than I am not sure what complaining to the school board will do. The parents are allowing this for THEIR child, you aren't allowing it for YOUR child.

Speaking to the school about the fact that your son (and any child in the office) could overhear things, is something you could speak to them about.

If the parents agreed to it, then it is "allowed". I certainly don't agree with the practice.

If you can overhear things, I would definetely say that it is inappropriate. It should be a private matter.

Corporal punishment is legal in the OP's state. The parents agreed. I think the OP thinks that because she has Down's she should not be punished? (Although I am not sure?)

 

[Holly]

Do you know this child IEP plan?? If not then you can't say what works for her can you

No IEP could convince me that a child should be physically hit by a school principal.

 

[goofy!]

Parent of a DD with Down syndrome.

For your questions about children with Down syndrome - spanking will work just about as well with a child with Down syndrome as it does with "typical" children. The outrage should be at the magnitude of the punishment of any child, not just the child with Down syndrome.

Yes, Ds does affect the speed at which a child learns, however they do learn. And their social emotions are much the same as their peers. Most people with Ds are only mildly to moderately developmentally delayed. As more and more inclusion and better schooling happens, and better medical care, it is being found that people with Down syndrome are way more capable than anybody thought even 10 -20 years ago. Of course, just as in a typical population, the abilities of the children are going to vary widely. But statistically, the typical bell curve has the majority of people with Ds only mildly to moderately delayed, with a few on either end; very involved to normal intelligence.

That child with Down syndrome was just as terrified and was experiencing exactly the same emotions as any of her classmates would have been if they experienced the same punishment. That part of their psyche is not affected at all.

That said, there are many parts of the law that protect a child with special needs from abuse.

One thing is that children with Ds often have speech delays, so although they know perfectly well what is going on, they often cannot verbalize it. So, people with Down syndrome are sometimes abused because the abuser believes they will not be able to tell. So, perhaps a harder spanking, more punishment, etc.

If the punishment was out of line, I would report it to child services or your state special education department. Going against the school district won't do anything because even the board will not admit if they are violating IDEA. You would need to call your state department of education, dept of special services, and report it.

 

[RadioNate]

No IEP could convince me that a child should be physically hit by a school principal.

But that isn't really your call for someone else's child. These parents DIDN'T opt out. Do I AGREE with you? Of course. I don't believe any child should be hit in school. And I only believe in very rare parental spanking.

However, the reality is that it is legal and the parents of this child allow it.

It doesn't matter what you or I or the OP think.

Now the OP can work to get it outlawed in their area but in that case it shouldn't matter if the child had Down's or not.

 

[KirstenB]

Schools just shouldn't be in the business of spanking kids, period.

As far as it being a special needs child, I try very hard to treat our dd (not Downs, but mildly autistic) the same as her sister, as far as appropriate behavior/consequences. So, I'm not so much upset that she was punished, as long as she understands the action/consequence.

 

[lifeafterkids]

I tend to agree with everyone here... no child should be hit in school... usually there is some kind of Parent organization (we have a PTA at our schools)... I would start there and see what the other parents think

 

[goofy!]

There is a rare form of Down Syndrome where the child presents with the physical appearance of Down's but is not mentally impaired.

That would be mosaic Down syndrome. It means that not every cell has the third copy of the 21st chromosome. However, depending on where the abnormal split started occurring, IQ and physical appearance is just as varied as those with the more common trisomy 21.

 

[ilovejack02]

If the parents agreed to it, then it is "allowed".

If you can overhear things, I would definetely say that it is inappropriate. It should be a private matter.

Corporal punishment is legal in the OP's state. The parents agreed. I think the OP thinks that because she has Down's she should not be punished? (Although I am not sure?)

NOOO it is not that I dont think a child with Down's shouldnt be punished.
I know NOTHING of Down's .

I would like the system as a whole to change.

I think allowing spanking of children with handicaps would be an issue that would need to be addressed along with all the other reasons to stop it.

ALSO I am very upset that this was not done privately.

 

[Goofyluver]

Corporal punishment in schools is outdated and should no longer be allowed. IMO.

I'd be visiting my superintendent.

 

[ilovejack02]

Parent of a DD with Down syndrome.

For your answers about children with Down syndrome - spanking will work just about as well with a child with Down syndrome as it does with "typical" children. The outrage should be at the magnitude of the punishment of any child, not just the child with Down syndrome.

Yes, Ds does affect the speed at which a child learns, however they do learn. And their social emotions are much the same as their peers. Most people with Ds are only mildly to moderately developmentally delayed. As more and more inclusion and better schooling happens, and better medical care, it is being found that people with Down syndrome are way more capable than anybody thought even 10 -20 years ago. Of course, just as in a typical population, the abilities of the children are going to vary widely. But statistically, the typical bell curve has the majority of people with Ds only mildly to moderately delayed, with a few on either end; very involved to normal intelligence.

That child with Down syndrome was just as terrified and was experiencing exactly the same emotions as any of her classmates would have been if they experienced the same punishment. That part of their psyche is not affected at all.

That said, there are many parts of the law that protect a child from abuse.

One thing is that children with Ds often has speech delays, so although they know perfectly well what is going on, they often cannot verbalize it. So, people with Down syndrome are sometimes abused because the abuser believes they will not be able to tell. So, a harder spanking, more punishment, etc.

If the punishment was out of line, I would report it to child services.

THANK YOU!!

I would like all spanking to stop in our school district.

 

[harleyquinn]

NOOO it is not that I dont think a child with Down's shouldnt be punished.
I know NOTHING of Down's .

I would like the system as a whole to change.

I think allowing spanking of children with handicaps would be an issue that would need to be addressed along with all the other reasons to stop it.

ALSO I am very upset that this was not done privately.

I think you would be better off addressing the issue as a whole and not focusing of the handicap issue. Like I said before there are a bunch of sites and groups dedicated to outlawing it and states have decided to do so. i think with a little inspiration from those sites/groups you might be able to get your parish to have a law seperate from the state law.

 

[ilovejack02]

I think you would be better off addressing the issue as a whole and not focusing of the handicap issue. Like I said before there are a bunch of sites and groups dedicated to outlawing it and states have decided to do so. i think with a little inspiration from those sites/groups you might be able to get your parish to have a law seperate from the state law.

 

[Cindy B]

NOOO it is not that I dont think a child with Down's shouldnt be punished.
I know NOTHING of Down's .

I would like the system as a whole to change.

I think allowing spanking of children with handicaps would be an issue that would need to be addressed along with all the other reasons to stop it.

ALSO I am very upset that this was not done privately.

So you are upset at the concept of corporal punishment in schools? I would be. It has been outdated in my state for over a hundred years.

Is it still legal in the state? Yes, LA is one of the 21 that still allow it.

Do I agree? NO!

The school board, superintendent and local and state authorities are the ones in charge of allowing this to still occur. It would be best for the OP to get this type of punishment outlawed in her district.

 

[jackskellingtonsgirl]

I think lobbying for "opt IN" as opposed to "opt OUT" would be successful.
I also think addressing the privacy issues would be successful, because it is really inappropriate for everyone within hearing range to know what is going on. Secondary to that is the issue that a school administrator was shouting at a child and hitting her hard enough to make a loud sound.

That treatment is wrong for ANY child.

 

[creativeamanda]

Regardless of what anyone thinks of corporeal punishment, most schools do not do it anymore because parents who have given permission sued districts over giving what they felt was excessive force. IMO, if you do believe in corporeal punishment, and I am not going to get in that argument, a person other than a parent should never give it, and then the use of an object is completely wrong.

My children are not spanked. And no one better touch them, either.

 

[daisax]

I don't think ANY child should be physically corrected by any adult other than a parent, but I also know that the "hook" in getting people's attention in this story is the child's disability. Because even people who have no problem signing such letters for their own children might very well draw the line at spanking a child with Down's syndrome.

And if the parents won't defend their child, I applaud the OP for wanting to do so.