Does David's tell you if the renter cancels?

[fsjking]

Points are still available to be used.

You said you were paid for supplying points. Did you supply them the points? If not, your own argument is void.

You can argue that you supplied the room reservation you were required. If you try to argue you were paid to supply points, you will lose that one as you legally could never do that.

 

[McCrae]

You can’t sell something that has no value, Points only have value when they are attached to the reservation for a resort stay,

Using your dining reservation, if you paid for it and the restaurant is closed, you think your contract is fulfilled?

Again, owners with rentals can certainly want to stand behind the non refundable aspect of the contract, But then we shouldn’t have owners also demanding that DVC must fix the issue with expiring points when our contract clearly state the rules for those points,

If a renter isn’t entitled to a refund because the resort was closed, and signed a non refundable agreement then why would DVC owners be entitled to having their contracts amended because “this is not just a normal situation”.

i am coming from the angle that I will try and help because it’s the right thing to do. I am not obliged to.

Providing I am not responsible for a reservation being cancelled. Be it DVC or a restaurant reservation because of the no refunds clause I am not responsible. Renters are encouraged to take out insurance to protect them from unexpected problems, if they don’t they are taking a gamble. DVC owners are not necessarily getting all their points back if the vacation is cancelled. Some because of use year will be impossible to bank or use. DVC owners contract are not being amended.

 

[Sandisw]

i am coming from the angle that I will try and help because it’s the right thing to do. I am not obliged to.

Providing I am not responsible for a reservation being cancelled. Be it DVC or a restaurant reservation because of the no refunds clause I am not responsible. Renters are encouraged to take out insurance to protect them from unexpected problems, if they don’t they are taking a gamble. DVC owners are not necessarily getting all their points back if the vacation is cancelled. Some because of use year will be impossible to bank or use. DVC owners contract are not being amended.

Many renters took out insurance and are being denied. So, that’s really not a fair argument IMO for this situation because they did everything right,

Some might still say that being non refundable does not supersede the right for a renter to receive what they paid for,

The argument comes down that owners believe because DVC made the decision, even though our contract says we give them the right to act on our behalf, including instituting emergency powers, it insulates them and they can claim it’s not their fault.

Like I said. Im still not conviced the contract isn’t null and void, even with what has been shared, but, I’m not the one Making the decision for anyone else,

Unless I saw a ruling from a judge on this specific case, with a renter suing an owner and the owner winning, I reserve judgement,

 

[McCrae]

You said you were paid for supplying points. Did you supply them the points? If not, your own argument is void.

You can argue that you supplied the room reservation you were required. If you try to argue you were paid to supply points, you will lose that one as you legally could never do that.

As a renter I am paid per point, not by the length of stay. The points have multiple uses, Disney resorts, Cruise, RCI etc. I am asked to help the renter make a reservation for what ever they decide they want to use their points. The points were supplied at the time of reservation. Whilst because of the unusual circumstances I am willing to try and help, the buyers also accepted that no changes to reservations or refunds will be made/given.

 

[DGsAtBLT]

I understand the points obviously can not be given back to renters directly given how DVC works, but if the argument is that a contract is for points not a stay, what does that mean in a situation where points are returned to the owner and the renter is left with nothing?

I don’t think there is a clear answer here. Nobody expected anything of this nature and to some extent all 3 parties are a little unprepared and unprotected despite their best efforts, IMO.

 

[fsjking]

As a renter I am paid per point, not by the length of stay. The points have multiple uses, Disney resorts, Cruise, RCI etc. I am asked to help the renter make a reservation for what ever they decide they want to use their points. The points were supplied at the time of reservation. Whilst because of the unusual circumstances I am willing to try and help, the buyers also accepted that no changes to reservations or refunds will be made/given.

The rate you are paid is based on points because thats the rate that the timeshare association you are an owner of sets for room reservations. You are not asked to help them make a reservation. You have to do it. DVC will not allow them to do it, contact them, nor possess points. You cannot transfer point to them, so your agreement never could be for points. The agreement says they are purchasing a reservation paid for using your points. They are not purchasing points. I'm not sure what you are trying to gain by arguing something that is verifiably inaccurate. You can make an argument about no refundable. You can't argue they bought points.

 

[DGsAtBLT]

The rate you are paid is based on points because thats the rate that the timeshare association you are an owner of sets for room reservations. You are not asked to help them make a reservation. You have to do it. DVC will not allow them to do it, contact them, nor possess points. You cannot transfer point to them, so your agreement never could be for points. The agreement says they are purchasing a reservation paid for using your points. They are not purchasing points. I'm not sure what you are trying to gain by arguing something that is verifiably inaccurate. You can make an argument about no refundable. You can't argue they bought points.

My contract says something along the lines of being an agreement to rent points that represent accommodations. Probably where that’s coming from.

 

[Deb & Bill]

If the renters (non-owners of the points) bought an insurance policy recommended by David or the other brokers and it wasn't good for the pandemic, wouldn't the broker be responsible for recommending a product that didn't cover all needs?

 

[McCrae]

The rate you are paid is based on points because thats the rate that the timeshare association you are an owner of sets for room reservations. You are not asked to help them make a reservation. You have to do it. DVC will not allow them to do it, contact them, nor possess points. You cannot transfer point to them, so your agreement never could be for points. The agreement says they are purchasing a reservation paid for using your points. They are not purchasing points. I'm not sure what you are trying to gain by arguing something that is verifiably inaccurate. You can make an argument about no refundable. You can't argue they bought points.

If the renter is a DVC member you can transfer points to them. If the purchaser of the points is not in the position to accept delivery of points its there problem.

 

[fsjking]

If the renter is a DVC member you can transfer points to them. If the purchaser of the points is not in the position to accept delivery of points its there problem.

Does your contract with DVS allow you to sell points to non-owners? If not, and you are going o stick to your "I'm just selling points" idea. You could be on the hook for fraud.

 

[DGsAtBLT]

If the renters (non-owners of the points) bought an insurance policy recommended by David or the other brokers and it wasn't good for the pandemic, wouldn't the broker be responsible for recommending a product that didn't cover all needs?

That's an interesting question. I hope for the broker's sake the answer is no.

 

[Sandisw]

If the renters (non-owners of the points) bought an insurance policy recommended by David or the other brokers and it wasn't good for the pandemic, wouldn't the broker be responsible for recommending a product that didn't cover all needs?

It certainly has to make it harder to explain to a renter that they are still not entitled to recover.

 

[Marionnette]

If the renters (non-owners of the points) bought an insurance policy recommended by David or the other brokers and it wasn't good for the pandemic, wouldn't the broker be responsible for recommending a product that didn't cover all needs?

David’s recommends getting insurance but not a specific policy.

 

[marie1981]

I made a reservation coming on april 16. If the park is closed, after I receive the last 30% and the points are back in my account, I will offer David to rent those points again and keep the money to reimburse the first renter. I would not feel right to be paid twice for the same points. I rented many times with David, It has always been a very good experience... I want him to stay in business until 2042, when my contract will expire

 

[DebbieB]

I made a reservation coming on april 16. If the park is closed, after I receive the last 30% and the points are back in my account, I will offer David to rent those points again and keep the money to reimburse the first renter. I would not feel right to be paid twice for the same points. I rented many times with David, It has always been a very good experience... I want him to stay in business until 2042, when my contract will expire

From what I’ve read, they will not send you the 30% if the owner cannot check in. They will hold it until everything is settled, possibly sending it back to the renter.

 

[toniosmom]

From what I’ve read, they will not send you the 30% if the owner cannot check in. They will hold it until everything is settled, possibly sending it back to the renter.

I have a renter scheduled to check in on April 2nd. If the resort is closed, I do not expect to be paid the 30%, but would offer to reschedule the vacation in order to be paid the remaining 30%. I emailed David's over a week ago to see if the renter wants to reschedule, but never heard back. Now I see they don't want the owners or renters to contact them, but rather to wait until they contact us.

I see on the DVC site that they are accepting reservations dated April 1st or later, so its still unclear what's going to happen. I guess we'll find out within the next week whether or not they are planning to reopen the resorts on April 1st. Ironically, I had a resort stay of my own on April 1st that I cancelled and got all my points back (with borrowed reports returned to 2020). My renter's stay is all 2019 points and my UY is December, so I'm fortunate that I've got some time to get them re-scheduled. I guess it's all a waiting game for now.

 

[starry_solo]

I have a renter scheduled to check in on April 2nd. If the resort is closed, I do not expect to be paid the 30%, but would offer to reschedule the vacation in order to be paid the remaining 30%. I emailed David's over a week ago to see if the renter wants to reschedule, but never heard back. Now I see they don't want the owners or renters to contact them, but rather to wait until they contact us.

I see on the DVC site that they are accepting reservations dated April 1st or later, so its still unclear what's going to happen. I guess we'll find out within the next week whether or not they are planning to reopen the resorts on April 1st. Ironically, I had a resort stay of my own on April 1st that I cancelled and got all my points back (with borrowed reports returned to 2020). My renter's stay is all 2019 points and my UY is December, so I'm fortunate that I've got some time to get them re-scheduled. I guess it's all a waiting game for now.

I think once Disney tells us the resort will remain closed in April, that might be the time to reschedule (cancel) even without hearing from David's. Glad your use year is far out!

 

[toniosmom]

I think once Disney tells us the resort will remain closed in April, that might be the time to reschedule (cancel) even without hearing from David's. Glad your use year is far out!

My guess is that Disney will cancel the reservation outright, like they did with the March reservations, and the points will go back to my 2019 UY, where they came from. Hopefully, I'll hear from David's soon thereafter. My guess is that they are swamped with March people trying to reschedule.

 

[Mickey of the Villages]

Am I missing something (very likely)?

I have not rented points in the past nor used Dave's as a broker. But if the contract is final and non-refundable and no cancellations are permitted then that's the end of it.

I don't disagree that this is a very real hardship for folks.

I've signed contracts for things in my life that turned out to be bad deals. I had to keep paying.

 

[Sandisw]

Am I missing something (very likely)?

I have not rented points in the past nor used Dave's as a broker. But if the contract is final and non-refundable and no cancellations are permitted then that's the end of it.

I don't disagree that this is a very real hardship for folks.

I've signed contracts for things in my life that turned out to be bad deals. I had to keep paying.

The discussion is that when the resort closed, and the room the renter paid for can’t be delivered, does it then still meet the legal requirements of a contract if it no longer provides what the renter paid for,

Typically, if the product is not given, then it voids the contract. An email from David’s seems to suggest he may have be informed the contract is void,

I also am aware that renters who have disputed the charge via CC have won. That puts the broker on the hook.

The waters are muddy because the owner isn’t the one who closed the resort so should they be responsible?

But I doubt any renter went in assuming that the money is lost even if they can go but the doors are shuttered. I doubt any owner did either and I wonder how many renters would have still rented if that was made clear from the start