Do You think DISNEY has gone down hlll the last few years?

[brunette8706]

Increasing prices while cutting maintenance, food quality and quantity, homogenizing merchandise, reducing decorations, increasing the number of hard ticket event nights which require a separate ticket, reducing the number of full time dedicated CM's and increasing the number of part time, contracted, and collage CM's is going down hill in my book.

Bill

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Hey Bill !

I couldn't have said it better. You're exactly right.

 

[KSDisneyDad]

I discussed last 5 years, because you postulated that WDW's current way of doing business by raising prices, was a recipe for disaster, and you used last year's attendance figures as proof that WDW is in trouble.

In order to properly use the TEA statistics that you referenced, you have to use them as an overall figure on an annual basis, and compare to say the last 5 years, in order to properly compare growth and decreases, as a way of proving whether your theory is correct.

WDW attendance has gone up since approx. 5 years ago, and has stayed steady each year. So, even though there was a slight crowd decrease in 3 of 4 parks in 2010, overall, WDW is doing just fine when compared to the last 4 years.

If attendance had actually gone down on an overall basis each of the last 4 years since they started raising prices and changing menus, then this would prove your theory that they are in trouble.

The TEA numbers disprove your theory from a mathematical standpoint; therefore, you can't use them to prove your theory that WDW is going downhill for attendance due to raising prices, as almost 50 million guests are still coming to the parks annually despite Disney raising prices, changing menus and cutting services.

This whole discussion and an analysis of the numbers shows that Disney seems to be different than most busineses, and that is probably because they have such a huge first/only timer base to draw from, as well as a huge DVC membership.

As has been said repeatedly on this thread, most WDW guests do not notice the things that we notice, and despite your opinion that Disney is not following a good business model, the attendance figures show otherwise. Numbers are staying steady, and in tough economic times, that says a lot about the Disney product. People are still coming to the parks, as the numbers show a steady pace, with no overall decreases in the past 4-5 years. Disney recognizes this, which is why they continue to do business in this manner.

We will have to wait for 2011 figures to see how this year shapes up, and then we can continue this discussion with hard evidence, Tiger

I agree with you.

But why look at these unofficial estimates when you can go to Disney's SEC filings. Here is what they said for the first nine months of their 2011 fiscal year.

Parks and Resorts revenues increased 9%, or $726 million, to $8.7 billion due to an increase of $675 million at our domestic operations and an increase of $51 million at our international operations.

Revenue growth at our domestic operations reflected a 6% increase driven by higher average guest spending and a 3% increase due to volume driven by higher passenger cruise ship days as a result of the launch of our new cruise ship, the Disney Dream, in January 2011 and higher attendance. Higher guest spending was primarily due to higher average ticket prices, daily hotel room rates and food, beverage and merchandise spending.

They also added a table that showed some key statistics:

Increase in domestic park attendance: 1% (same as prior year increase)
Increase in Per Capita Spending: 7% for 2% in the prior year
Hotel Occupancy: 82% in 2011 vs 81% in 2010
Per Room Guest Spending: $246 in 2011 vs $229 in 2010 (includes DVC as well as food, beverage and merchandise at the hotel)

Higher park attendance, higher hotel occupancy and higher spending.

We can speculate and hypothesize about all the attendance factors, but why not go right to the actual filings and see the statistics and impact on their net income? Granted, this combines DLR, WDW and DCL, but it does give some good overall direction.

For more info, just go to the Disney investor relations website. A summary of their full year info should be available in about 10 days.

 

[KSDisneyDad]

Yea but how does increased prices mean that Disney is going downhill? The ticket prices are ridiculous, and so is everything else in WDW. However, everything else in the world (the real world, not Disney) is increasing in prices as well. They will keep improving Disney to make people want to keep coming back. I don't see how any of this could be considered "going downhill."

I agree. Disney is still a great vacation "value" for our family when compared to alternatives that we like. And our last vacation was our best ever. YMMV

That is just crazy,12 million, really.You know I can never stomach what they pay ceo's in this country.These people are getting alot of the credit for what the people in the trenches do every day.You know if you took about 10 million of that bonus and paid the cast members better how much better would disney be!Then the poor guy would have to live on a meager 2million dollar bonus!How would his family make ends meet?

12 million isn't too much? Really?

Is this the DIS or Occupy Wall Street? Shareholders do get a say on pay annually for Disney now so vote your proxy next year if it upsets you.

 

[brunette8706]

I discussed last 5 years, because you postulated that WDW's current way of doing business by raising prices, was a recipe for disaster, and you used last year's attendance figures as proof that WDW is in trouble.

In order to properly use the TEA statistics that you referenced, you have to use them as an overall figure on an annual basis, and compare to say the last 5 years, in order to properly compare growth and decreases, as a way of proving whether your theory is correct.

WDW attendance has gone up since approx. 5 years ago, and has stayed steady each year. So, even though there was a slight crowd decrease in 3 of 4 parks in 2010, overall, WDW is doing just fine when compared to the last 4 years.

If attendance had actually gone down on an overall basis each of the last 4 years since they started raising prices and changing menus, then this would prove your theory that they are in trouble.

The TEA numbers disprove your theory from a mathematical standpoint; therefore, you can't use them to prove your theory that WDW is going downhill for attendance due to raising prices, as almost 50 million guests are still coming to the parks annually despite Disney raising prices, changing menus and cutting services.

This whole discussion and an analysis of the numbers shows that Disney seems to be different than most busineses, and that is probably because they have such a huge first/only timer base to draw from, as well as a huge DVC membership.

As has been said repeatedly on this thread, most WDW guests do not notice the things that we notice, and despite your opinion that Disney is not following a good business model, the attendance figures show otherwise. Numbers are staying steady, and in tough economic times, that says a lot about the Disney product. People are still coming to the parks, as the numbers show a steady pace, with no overall decreases in the past 4-5 years. Disney recognizes this, which is why they continue to do business in this manner.

We will have to wait for 2011 figures to see how this year shapes up, and then we can continue this discussion with hard evidence, Tiger

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Hi Tiger-

Yeah, it looks like there is an increase in profits and sales of the Disney "product" I would suspect because of the Free Dining discount. But I will say that even though attendance has increased the quality of some of the products within Disney has diminished.

Disney is using the business model to increase attendance, it seems to be working but they are also cutting some things to increase that profit.

Brunette

 

[Tiger926]

I agree with you.

But why look at these unofficial estimates when you can go to Disney's SEC filings. Here is what they said for the first nine months of their 2011 fiscal year.



They also added a table that showed some key statistics:

Increase in domestic park attendance: 1% (same as prior year increase)
Increase in Per Capita Spending: 7% for 2% in the prior year
Hotel Occupancy: 82% in 2011 vs 81% in 2010
Per Room Guest Spending: $246 in 2011 vs $229 in 2010 (includes DVC as well as food, beverage and merchandise at the hotel)

Higher park attendance, higher hotel occupancy and higher spending.

We can speculate and hypothesize about all the attendance factors, but why not go right to the actual filings and see the statistics and impact on their net income? Granted, this combines DLR, WDW and DCL, but it does give some good overall direction.

For more info, just go to the Disney investor relations website. A summary of their full year info should be available in about 10 days.

Thanks for the link - I also read all of those as well, but I was only looking for specific WDW gate attendance figures, as the ones above are for all worldwide Disney parks. But very interesting info, nonetheless, but I just didn't feel it was specific enough for our discussion on WDW

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Hi Tiger-

Yeah, it looks like there is an increase in profits and sales of the Disney "product" I would suspect because of the Free Dining discount. But I will say that even though attendance has increased the quality of some of the products within Disney has diminished.

Disney is using the business model to increase attendance, it seems to be working but they are also cutting some things to increase that profit.

Brunette

Yup, you and I have agreed and will continue to agree on this too. With more guests in the parks, Disney is hoping they will spend money, and from what I see for the several weeks each year I'm in the parks during peak seasons, guests are spending on merchandise and dining. They also can't notice cutbacks if they have never been before, and they won't care even if they did see them, if they aren't going to WDW ever again.

First/only timers make up the majority of the almost 50 million guests who visit WDW annually, and since they are buying and eating the subpar merchandise and food, then Disney has no reason to change that business model at this time.

Last quarter, numbers were up, so it will be interesting to see how this quarter shapes up.

Tiger

 

[flicx]

Is this the DIS or Occupy Wall Street? Shareholders do get a say on pay annually for Disney now so vote your proxy next year if it upsets you.

Shareholders get a say! Wow you do live in fantasyland my friend.The board is the one who usually sets these salaries.The board is usually friends with the ceos and give them free reign until they really screw up or enough shareholders complain.But please explain how Mr. Iger is worth a 12 million dollar bonus! Also when they(disney) say domestic parks this includes disneyland,so because attendance was up in domestic parks that doesn't mean disney world had a higher attedance.Again for the fifth or sixth time according to TEA they had LESS!!! attendance at three of the four parks last year.Look it up yourself!

 

[KSDisneyDad]

Thanks for the link - I also read all of those as well, but I was only looking for specific WDW gate attendance figures, as the ones above are for all worldwide Disney parks. But very interesting info, nonetheless, but I just didn't feel it was specific enough for our discussion on WDW

Actually, the numbers in the report are separated between Domestic and International. I only referenced the Domestic numbers and ignored the International. For the past two years, Disney is saying that their combined domestic attendance is up 1%.

True, it is not WDW only, but I can't imagine that DLR changes the overall numbers that much.

When looking at the hotel numbers particularly, WDW eclipses DLR with it's three hotels.

My point in posting the link is that WDW does not publish specific attendance numbers. There is some speculation that the recent attendance numbers are trending down (not true for domestic combined per Disney's SEC filings). And even if it were, Disney is reporting increased attendance, increases in per guest spending, higher hotel occupancy and higher guest spending per hotel night. Again, all for DOMESTIC. I ignored the international parks as this is mostly about WDW.

We will never be able to get specific WDW attendance. Yes, some independent sites speculate, but that's all it is - speculation.

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Hi Tiger-

Yeah, it looks like there is an increase in profits and sales of the Disney "product" I would suspect because of the Free Dining discount. But I will say that even though attendance has increased the quality of some of the products within Disney has diminished.

Disney is using the business model to increase attendance, it seems to be working but they are also cutting some things to increase that profit.

Brunette

And don't forget they are adding things too! In the last few years, they've added TSMM, Star Tours 2 and a new evening show. They are adding a new value resort with mostly family suites (finally). They've added another DVC property on-site. They have done some excellent rehabs on certain attractions IMO. They are expanding FL. They are adding to Animal Kingdom. They are investing a lot into their NextGen technology - per public filings, they are spending up to $1 billion on this technology.

And that is just WDW. Let's not forget the DCA expansion, building new international parks, building two new cruise ships at a billion each, etc.

Yes, Disney is cutting costs and doing some things that aren't favorable, but we can't forget the positives too IMO. Each person can weigh the pros and cons and make up their mind if that means things are getting better or worse. I think for the casual visitor like myself, I see improvement. If I went several times a year, I might think differently. Going so often is sometimes like having the curtain removed in the Emerald City.

 

[KSDisneyDad]

Shareholders get a say! Wow you do live in fantasyland my friend.The board is the one who usually sets these salaries.The board is usually friends with the ceos and give them free reign until they really screw up or enough shareholders complain.But please explain how Mr. Iger is worth a 12 million dollar bonus! Also when they(disney) say domestic parks this includes disneyland,so because attendance was up in domestic parks that doesn't mean disney world had a higher attedance.Again for the fifth or sixth time according to TEA they had LESS!!! attendance at three of the four parks last year.Look it up yourself!

But according to Disney's public filings with the SEC that are independing audited, they are showing increased attendance for 2010 and 2011 in their domestic parks (i.e. WDW and DLR combined).

As far as i know, TEA is simply estimating and has no access to the actual numbers.

But even if TEA is right, Disney's per guest spending is increasing not only at the parks, but at the hotels too. Plus, they have higher occupancy rates with higher per night spending at the hotels. So even with "free" dining, overall spending per guest is higher. I'd say that the various discount and dining promotions have been successful from a financial perspective only.

That said, as a guest, I hate the free dining promotions and what they've done to food quality. We avoid buffets anymore as they are too high priced and yes, I agree that the quality seems to be suffering. We also limit our Table Service to lunch. We have had great luck at finding some good counter service restaurants that are "reasonably" priced for a vacation destination. Overall, the prices have caused us to change our behavior a little.

With respect to shareholder say. Yes, shareholders do have a say, but to be effective you have to own a lot of stock or be a very vocal shareholder activist. I was being a little "tongue in cheek" when I inferred that a single shareholder has much of a say, but as a group, yes they do have a say on pay. Just read the proxy statement. There are plenty of shareholder activists out there and independent advisors (Glass Lewis and ISS) that recommend to shareholders how to vote. Many institutional holders vote based on these reports. I haven't read the Glass Lewis and ISS reports for Disney, but I'd be curious to know if they recommended any changes to the board composition or executive pay.

 

[KellyNY]

My point in posting the link is that WDW does not publish specific attendance numbers. There is some speculation that the recent attendance numbers are trending down (not true for domestic combined per Disney's SEC filings). And even if it were, Disney is reporting increased attendance, increases in per guest spending, higher hotel occupancy and higher guest spending per hotel night. Again, all for DOMESTIC. I ignored the international parks as this is mostly about WDW.

We will never be able to get specific WDW attendance. Yes, some independent sites speculate, but that's all it is - speculation.

.

And it all thanks to deep discounts. Take them away and what you will get. Truth is numbers were down few years ago and this is when they started all the crazy promotions and it works BUT now people are used to idea of discounts and many will not go with current regular prices or go but stay offsite. Promotions was a temporary remedy but it one of those remedies that makes things only worse.

 

[Disney Von Drake]

For the past two years, Disney is saying that their combined domestic attendance is up 1%.

True, it is not WDW only, but I can't imagine that DLR changes the overall numbers that much.

This should help explain the change in attendance reporting:

http://www.ocregister.com/news/attendance-279102-disney-parks.html


HP is killing them in WDW.

 

[Tiger926]

But according to Disney's public filings with the SEC that are independing audited, they are showing increased attendance for 2010 and 2011 in their domestic parks (i.e. WDW and DLR combined).

As far as i know, TEA is simply estimating and has no access to the actual numbers.

But even if TEA is right, Disney's per guest spending is increasing not only at the parks, but at the hotels too. Plus, they have higher occupancy rates with higher per night spending at the hotels. So even with "free" dining, overall spending per guest is higher. I'd say that the various discount and dining promotions have been successful from a financial perspective only.

That said, as a guest, I hate the free dining promotions and what they've done to food quality. We avoid buffets anymore as they are too high priced and yes, I agree that the quality seems to be suffering. We also limit our Table Service to lunch. We have had great luck at finding some good counter service restaurants that are "reasonably" priced for a vacation destination. Overall, the prices have caused us to change our behavior a little.

With respect to shareholder say. Yes, shareholders do have a say, but to be effective you have to own a lot of stock or be a very vocal shareholder activist. I was being a little "tongue in cheek" when I inferred that a single shareholder has much of a say, but as a group, yes they do have a say on pay. Just read the proxy statement. There are plenty of shareholder activists out there and independent advisors (Glass Lewis and ISS) that recommend to shareholders how to vote. Many institutional holders vote based on these reports. I haven't read the Glass Lewis and ISS reports for Disney, but I'd be curious to know if they recommended any changes to the board composition or executive pay.

Yup, I saw the inaccuracies too, as this is the first time I actually closely analyzed the numbers (both TEA and Shareholder's Report) together. There is confusion there, so I can't continue the discussion, as we really don't have the proper info to do proper comparisons for determining if Disney is going downhill, IMHO.

And it all thanks to deep discounts. Take them away and what you will get. Truth is numbers were down few years ago and this is when they started all the crazy promotions and it works BUT now people are used to idea of discounts and many will not go with current regular prices or go but stay offsite. Promotions was a temporary remedy but it one of those remedies that makes things only worse.

How do you truly know that people still won't come? That is a prevalent theme on this thread, because that is how many of you feel, but as I've stated, I've met many people who pay rack rates or are just fine with a small discount.

Again, none of us have the true numbers. Obviously, Disney knows that discounts have worked, and that is why they are reluctant to cease offering them at this time, but we none of us really know just how the numbers would shake up, since most of WDW's guests are first/only timers who have no problem packaging up a dream trip to Disney. I've met many of these people - none of them knew about the DIS or looked out for discounts, so, I know there are still lots of people who would come to WDW, but I don't know an exact number; therefore, I'm not qualified to make a statement that people will stop coming or will only stay off-site.

As I've said many times, I go during peak seasons, when there are virtually no discounts, or, they are very minimal, and resorts are full, parks are jammed, registers are ringing and restaurants are crowded beyond belief. Based on what I see and experience at the parks during these times, WDW is busy!

This should help explain the change in attendance reporting:

http://www.ocregister.com/news/attendance-279102-disney-parks.html


HP is killing them in WDW.

Thanks for the link. That being said, how do we know Universal is accurately reporting their numbers?

If the their numbers are true, then HP is doing very well, as it should. If I had spent millions upon millions to make an attraction of that calibre, I would absolutely expect it to do well.

It's interesting as I've analyzed the numbers, and found discrepancies, which is why I won't discuss attendance figures any further, as I don't feel I have the correct info. We can postulate about numbers, but without hard evidence, it's all pretty much opinion.

And to be honest, I'm not sure even if Disney gave actual numbers, it would make any difference for some on this thread? There are some very passionate people here who truly believe that Disney is going downhill and in a real heap of trouble. This is their opinion, and so I'm not really sure what actual numbers would do? I've seen people presented with evidence, who still feel the opposite way, despite evidence to the contrary. My point is that Disney is a very personal place for so many of us, and with that, comes a multitude of feelings and opinions about that place.

For me, based on my vast experience in travelling to the parks very often over the past 10+ years, I see declines in certain areas, but then see upswings in other areas. I would never say that Disney is in a state of decline that is non-repairable, as I don't have the numbers nor the experiences to back that up.

Life is so much about perception, and so that is why I think this discussion still continues. It's interesting to read people's varying opinions about the same place, and that is why I continue to come here!

Tiger

 

[KellyNY]

How do you truly know that people still won't come? That is a prevalent theme on this thread, because that is how many of you feel, but as I've stated, I've met many people who pay rack rates or are just fine with a small discount.

Again, none of us have the true numbers. Obviously, Disney knows that discounts have worked, and that is why they are reluctant to cease offering them at this time, but we none of us really know just how the numbers would shake up, since most of WDW's guests are first/only timers who have no problem packaging up a dream trip to Disney. I've met many of these people - none of them knew about the DIS or looked out for discounts, so, I know there are still lots of people who would come to WDW, but I don't know an exact number; therefore, I'm not qualified to make a statement that people will stop coming or will only stay off-site.
As I've said many times, I go during peak seasons, when there are virtually no discounts, or, they are very minimal, and resorts are full, parks are jammed, registers are ringing and restaurants are crowded beyond belief. Based on what I see and experience at the parks during these times, WDW is busy!

Because if they felt there is no problems and people would pay anything, they would not run discounts all year long, even in July when you go.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

And it all thanks to deep discounts. Take them away and what you will get. Truth is numbers were down few years ago and this is when they started all the crazy promotions and it works BUT now people are used to idea of discounts and many will not go with current regular prices or go but stay offsite. Promotions was a temporary remedy but it one of those remedies that makes things only worse.

I think your argument here is flawed. If per guest SPENDING is up, it's up - period. ATTENDANCE can be up largely because of promotions, but if SPENDING per guest is up this is not entirely the case. Spending includes accommodations, food, etc. Would stand to reason that w/o the current hotel discounts people might shorten their trips (i.e. total days ATTENDANCE would decrease), but no reason to think they would spend less OVERALL per person on a Disney trip. They're spending because 1) they have the disposable income, and 2) they find the offerings to be worthwhile consuming.

Now, those taking advantage of value resort discounts may stay offsite when hotel prices go up. But more likely every other category would just downgrade their hotel category rather than go offsite (after having that onsite experience). So resort revenue would decrease, primarily on the lower-end accommodations.

HOWEVER, presumably if prices go up (i.e. promotions decrease), it's largely going to be based on observed or forecast economic growth. That growth in the general economy would result in increased tourism to places like WDW. Those who "dropped out of" or "scaled back" in this market will be replaced be new entrants.

In short, IMHO, overall, they'll be just fine.

 

[flicx]

Because if they felt there is no problems and people would pay anything, they would not run discounts all year long, even in July when you go.

I agree,without discounts disney is in for a real drop in attendance.If they cut discounts back all together they will see a substantial loss IMO.

 

[bookgirl]

No I think as the human race we have gone downhill in the past few years, hence society in general and by extension parks have gone downhill.

 

[KellyNY]

I think your argument here is flawed. If per guest SPENDING is up, it's up - period. ATTENDANCE can be up largely because of promotions, but if SPENDING per guest is up this is not entirely the case. Spending includes accommodations, food, etc. Would stand to reason that w/o the current hotel discounts people might shorten their trips (i.e. total days ATTENDANCE would decrease), but no reason to think they would spend less OVERALL per person on a Disney trip. They're spending because 1) they have the disposable income, and 2) they find the offerings to be worthwhile consuming.

Or they spend more because prices are up. They may have discount for room and pay for food which was up lately, or fd and full price of room, which was again up lately. While they have discounts they still pay more for non discounted part of the trip and lets not forget that when they raise the prices and applied discounts, final price was about the same like we had without discounts before price raise. just do the math. people do not spend more, they are charged more.

Now, those taking advantage of value resort discounts may stay offsite when hotel prices go up. But more likely every other category would just downgrade their hotel category rather than go offsite (after having that onsite experience). So resort revenue would decrease, primarily on the lower-end accommodations.


Not really, I see many posters on resort board, who say they would never downgrade, not everyone spends all day in parks, for many of us accomodations are very important and we would reather stay offsite and rent a car then downgrade, even after years of onsite.

.

 

[brunette8706]

This should help explain the change in attendance reporting:

http://www.ocregister.com/news/attendance-279102-disney-parks.html


HP is killing them in WDW.

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Hey there Disney Von Drake.

Wow, what an eye opener....Thanks for enlightening us on this. Here's an excerpt from Disney Von Drakes' link.

Disney traditionally has been reluctant to release any numbers, including how many people visit the parks. Industry watchers, instead, rely on private estimates by the Themed Entertainment Association. Last year, Disneyland drew about 16 million visitors, compared to 6 million at Disney California Adventure, according to the association.
Disney's annual report showed the following for U.S. parks overall:
•Attendance declined 1 percent during the fiscal year, ending in October.
•At the same time, visitors spent 3 percent more money.
•Occupancy was 82 percent in 2010, compared to 87 percent in 2009.​

 

[brunette8706]

Actually, the numbers in the report are separated between Domestic and International. I only referenced the Domestic numbers and ignored the International. For the past two years, Disney is saying that their combined domestic attendance is up 1%.

True, it is not WDW only, but I can't imagine that DLR changes the overall numbers that much.

When looking at the hotel numbers particularly, WDW eclipses DLR with it's three hotels.

My point in posting the link is that WDW does not publish specific attendance numbers. There is some speculation that the recent attendance numbers are trending down (not true for domestic combined per Disney's SEC filings). And even if it were, Disney is reporting increased attendance, increases in per guest spending, higher hotel occupancy and higher guest spending per hotel night. Again, all for DOMESTIC. I ignored the international parks as this is mostly about WDW.

We will never be able to get specific WDW attendance. Yes, some independent sites speculate, but that's all it is - speculation.




And don't forget they are adding things too! In the last few years, they've added TSMM, Star Tours 2 and a new evening show. They are adding a new value resort with mostly family suites (finally). They've added another DVC property on-site. They have done some excellent rehabs on certain attractions IMO. They are expanding FL. They are adding to Animal Kingdom. They are investing a lot into their NextGen technology - per public filings, they are spending up to $1 billion on this technology.

And that is just WDW. Let's not forget the DCA expansion, building new international parks, building two new cruise ships at a billion each, etc.

Yes, Disney is cutting costs and doing some things that aren't favorable, but we can't forget the positives too IMO. Each person can weigh the pros and cons and make up their mind if that means things are getting better or worse. I think for the casual visitor like myself, I see improvement. If I went several times a year, I might think differently. Going so often is sometimes like having the curtain removed in the Emerald City.

*
Hey there.

Yes, I do agree Disney is building new products such as the Disney Cruise ships which costs billions of dollars to make. They're going to expand Fantasyland, and add Avatar. These are all GREAT THINGSj and you do make some valid points. But my contention is why can't they maintain what they have before they create "more". For instance the holes in the screen at Soarin, the monorail maintenance issue, some resorts that are in dire need of repair (Grand Floridian premiere rooms need refurbishing as does some of the DVC rooms, some say are very tired looking.) The old swan boat pavillion is in dire need of a paint job, the O'Canada movie clip is still from 1983 as in the video clips in France and China. Personally, in my opinion I would think Disney should stay current with State of the Art Technology. I know some things they do a wonderful job in. I would say most things they do a wonderful job in, but there are the above issues, just to name a few that really do need to be repaired/refurbished etc. It does sadden me a bit to see this because when I first went to Walt Disney World as a child, Disney was State of the Art! It was a definite WOW factor.

Brunette

 

[flicx]

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Hey there Disney Von Drake.

Wow, what an eye opener....Thanks for enlightening us on this. Here's an excerpt from Disney Von Drakes' link.

Disney traditionally has been reluctant to release any numbers, including how many people visit the parks. Industry watchers, instead, rely on private estimates by the Themed Entertainment Association. Last year, Disneyland drew about 16 million visitors, compared to 6 million at Disney California Adventure, according to the association.
Disney's annual report showed the following for U.S. parks overall:
•Attendance declined 1 percent during the fiscal year, ending in October.
•At the same time, visitors spent 3 percent more money.
•Occupancy was 82 percent in 2010, compared to 87 percent in 2009.​

Hi brunette,hope you didn't get alot of the snow we got here in maryland!Yes very interesting indeed! Gonna read the whole thing!

 

[flicx]

Disney for whatever reason will never release individual park numbers.I really don't know what they are afraid of.I personally think they want to keep any declines on the down low.TEA I believe must have some way of estimating,but in the end who knows.Seems to me like someone at TEA or at disney has trouble counting!

You know I'm not the only one who had this idea.Seems the people who wrote the article in von drakes post have the same idea!Hmm very interesting indeed, and no I did not read the article before I posted the above!