Do you think a PhD earns people the right to be called doctor in a social setting?

[tinkerrn]

They have earned a docorate in their field, why not call them doctors. My brother has a docorate in divinity. He is called Dr.~~~~. I don't see the big deal. He is posing as a Physician??

 

[tinkerrn]

I also work with a nurse practioner who has her docorate in psychology, she is refered to as Dr.~~~~~. The patients and their families are informed that she is not a doctor of medicine, but a doctor of psychology.

 

[NMAmy]

They have earned a docorate in their field, why not call them doctors. My brother has a docorate in divinity. He is called Dr.~~~~. I don't see the big deal. He is posing as a Physician??

I don't think anyone is suggesting that a person with a doctorate is posing as an MD. What I am saying is that to require someone to call you Dr. Lastname socially is pretentious. Unless they'd like to refer to me as Ms. Lastname, too.

Frankly, if someone I met socially asked me to call them Dr. instead of by their first name and then referred to me as Amy, I'd correct THEM and ask them to call me Ms. Lastname. If they want me to address them formally, then I'd prefer that they not call ME by my first name.

 

[DisneyPhD]

If I have to call you Doctor then you have to call me Queen of the Universe. I'v eearned that right.

Myst

Well since there is a church in Orlando that says I am I figure I must be.

"Mary Queen of the Universe."

I remember I was in H.S on a spring break trip and the bus drove by that Church. Everyone started yelling. I thought it was fitting. To this day I smile when I see it. Much better then DisneyPhD if you ask me. And more fitting.

 

[DisneyPhD]

From Crane's

My father has a Ph.D. does he use "Doctor" on my wedding invitations?

Ph.D. is an academic title that is used only in academic settings. The use of "Doctor" on wedding invitations is reserved for medical doctors and ministers with advanced degrees.

http://www.crane.com/etiquette.aspx?C=WeddingEtiquette&S=WeddingInvitation&I=Invitational_Line

Truthfully, that's what I've always learned and I find the use of Dr. by someone with a Ph.D. to be boorish and attention getting. I know several Ph.Ds and only one uses Dr. at every opportunity. We snicker. It's just pretentious as hell.

Someone might of published that, but I don't see it as right and neither do must people I know. Just because you read it on the internet doesn't make it true as we all know. In formal settings it should be used as a mater of respect, if you know it. I think that people who are not aware don't need to.

Besides it is rather archaic for women too. If a women is a Doc, PhD or other title like judge we address her as such.

Many of my friends and family have PhD's. My Dh's best friend was married last year and they both are PhDs. It was Dr and Dr. It would be very rude to call him one and not her. The wedding was in Kenya.

 

[smartestnumber5]

From Crane's

My father has a Ph.D. does he use "Doctor" on my wedding invitations?

Ph.D. is an academic title that is used only in academic settings. The use of "Doctor" on wedding invitations is reserved for medical doctors and ministers with advanced degrees.

http://www.crane.com/etiquette.aspx?C=WeddingEtiquette&S=WeddingInvitation&I=Invitational_Line

Truthfully, that's what I've always learned and I find the use of Dr. by someone with a Ph.D. to be boorish and attention getting. I know several Ph.Ds and only one uses Dr. at every opportunity. We snicker. It's just pretentious as hell.

I don't understand why Dr. isn't also a medical title and a divinity title, hence inappropriate, but whatever. As I've said before, I'd snicker and think someone pretentious if they were any kind of doctor and using the title in a social setting.

Anyway, I was looking at the url above and it got me quite angry. I'm not one for etiquette at all, but it really burns me up when sexism is recommended as ettiquette. The url, which was talking about wedding invitation etiquette, stated that if both parents are medical doctors the male should definitely be referred to as Dr. but the female can be referred to either as Mrs. or as Dr. (No possibility that a woman might choose to be referred to as Ms. I guess.) Another question is what to do when one's mother has kept her maiden name. The 1st answer is to try to convince your mother to pretend she has a different name for your invitations!! The 2nd answer (clearly the non-ideal one according to the source) is to actually write the mother's actual name on the invitation!!

How is not the epitome of rudeness to ignore a woman's degree while noting a man's or asking a woman to pretend she has a different freakin name???! What century is this?

 

[kimberlym4]

I have a Ph.D. in psychology and never use Dr. in social settings. The only place I insist on it is with my students. I get tired of get e-mails from students I don't even know well that start "hey Kim..." I couldn't imagine starting a conversation with a professor using their first name unless they had requested me to do so.

I do wish that there was another title for Ph.D.'s other than Dr. because I do think it's confusing to people. Once and a while my friends will introduce me as Dr. to someone and I always have to clarify that I'm not "that kind of doctor". Not that one is better or worse - just that they are different and it would be nice to be able to convey that with the title.

 

[declansdad]

Have you earned the write to use the title - yes.


Using it in social settings - a bit pretentious in my opinion.

 

[katerkat]

Emily Post disagrees with Crane. http://www.emilypost.com/etiquette/everyday/forms_of_address.htm

A woman who outranks her husband: professional or educational degree
Dr. Jane Kelly and Mr. John Kelly

Both are doctors (PhD or medical) and use the same last name
The Doctors Kelly (omit first names)
Drs. Jane and John Kelly / Drs. John and Jane Kelly
Dr. John Kelly and Dr. Jane Kelly / Dr. Jane Kelly and Dr. John Kelly

 

[PrincessKitty1]

Now would I use the title in public, probably not. It does seem pretentious, for any type of doctor. That being said I believe that a PhD and MD both have the right to use the title if they want too.

Agreed. Every Tom, Dick, and Harry in my city has an MD or PhD, including the long-hair driving the 10-year-old pick-up truck at the farmer's market . And whether an MD or PhD, anyone who expects to be called "Dr." in a social setting is considered laughably pretentious or merely elderly.

 

[Becky2005]

I would be in sad shape then. DH's sister got her PhD a while ago but I've never called her Dr. anything. That would just be TOO weird for me.

I don't know of any other doctors I deal with in a social setting. So, never gave it a thought. Honestly I would never even think to address anything formal to her as "Dr." -- I have a hard enough time addressing envelopes to them as she kept her last name when she got married and I tend to list her first than her DH last because she is our blood relative. Luckily, we have never had anything formal to invite them to yet. EEK!!

I know growing up one of my friend's dad was a college teacher but I don't know if he had a PhD or not...I know he was called "professor" -- to which I didn't believe him when he told me when I asked what he did (he always had the summer off so we were baffled what he did). My brain at the time thought of a professor as on Gilligan's Island so I didn't belive him until he showed me a piece of mail addressed to "Professor X" -- then when I went to college he was one of my teachers -- it was weird!

 

[tink1978]

I am working on my doctorate and I think that I would only want people in my professional world to call me Doctor....everyone else please call me by my first name....thank you.

 

[Val]

I have a PhD in neuroscience, and I have my students address me by my first name generally. I work with mostly men, including a number of neurosurgeons, etc.....thus, the exception is students who insist on calling their MALE professors Dr. and their female professors Mrs.....what, I don't get the same title because of my gender??? It also REALLY irks me when my MIL calls my husband Dr. (he has the same degree) but calls me Mrs. because she knows that women just shouldn't go by their degrees! (and that's a whole 'nother story!).

I admit I occassionally use Dr. in social settings when I need an air of authority- with the auto mechanic or computer tech who assumes I am a dumb girl, with the service rep who is giving me a tough time, etc......I am not stupid and generally DO know what I am talking about. To my kids' friends and at their school I am just Mrs. Y, even though my name is hyphenated, so at work I am Dr. X-Y.

It does bother me that individuals with medical or divinity degrees are considered "real" doctors, while those with PhD's are not....what it the difference? I went to college for 8 years, did a 3 year post-doc, and have far more knowledge about psychotropic drugs, the physiology of some diseases, and treatment than many of the physicians I work with.....that's why they call me in for consultation. At least respect my degree....but I would really you just call me Val!

 

[#1MMFan]

Val, I have no problem with people with PhDs etc, as long as they don't think just because I have medical degree that this is less worthy. We both have areas of knowledge that do and don't overlap.
And the point about "real" doctors is probably stemming from the fact that "Doctor" used to be a job title as opposed to just a title whereas in the States particularly it seems you differentiate much more now by using the term "Physician". In the UK, it still tends to be "Doctor". So whilst you would be right to call yourself Dr if you had a PhD for example, you can understand why people might react on further questioning by saying "oh, you're not a real doctor" when what they mean is "your job is not that of a medical doctor". Does this make sense?

 

[Val]

I only have a problem when I bail an MD out from a bad med combo (because that is my specialty and not theirs) and in the next breath they are complaining because I am not a "real" doctor (in their case, it is a good thing I was around, or they wouldn't be a "practicing" doctor anymore!).....

....not a problem with most MDs, and I don't really care to be addressed as "doctor" (I am forever correcting my students that I am just "Val"), well, except that I would prefer that my MIL would call me doctor once in a while- just to acknowledge that I have the SAME educational level as her DS! Of course, this is the same woman who called the other night and asked ME to do the shopping as it was snowing and she didn't want DS to be killed on the road!!!!

Most of the people I work with- MD, PhD, PsyD, BA, MS, no degree, or whatever, are truly good people who are VERY knowledgeable about what they do. Some are, well, pains in the rear for lack of using a "better" word, but I have a feeling that regardless of their degree they wouldn't be any different. Degrees don't make the person, but they can be a sign of hard work and perseverance. Using titles can be a way of respecting and rewarding that. Too bad that the titles "Mr." and "Mrs." have lost the respect they deserve, as well. Maybe that is the REAL problem- we have lost respect for one another in general, regardless of titles or status.

 

[Va-bear]

A Ph.D. being called Dr. at church is no different than an MD being called Dr. at church. BOTH earned higher degrees - BOTH are asking to be adddressed by their formal title in a social situation. No difference - at all. Most docs I know (and working in a University clinical research lab I know a TON!) wouldn't ask their friends to call them Dr. period.

 

[DisneyGirl]

I'll call a ph.d "doctor" when they start addressing me as "juris doctor". what the dang! are we gonna start wearing our diplomas on our foreheads?

My favorite is when other lawyers sign their name (on non-legal documents) as Firstname Lastname, Esq. Yep... not trying to flaunt your degree, huh?

 

[goofygirl]

I work with MDs and the unwritten rule is we call them by first names when no patients are around, and call them "Dr. SoAndSo" when patients are around.

Anyone who insists on being called "Doctor" 24/7 needs to get over themselves.

 

[Mono~rail]

Interesting thread

I'm a nurse, and I could never imagine calling an M.D. by their first name in a social situation. Even in the nurses station away from pt's, they are still Dr. Lastname. We have a few sets of M.D.'s at our hospital that it gets tricky with. One set is a father and son. The father is Dr. lastname and his son is Dr. Firstname. We have another set of M.D.'s that are married and use the same last name. The wife is Dr. Lastname and the husband is Dr. Firstname. The wife goes berserk if someone calls her Dr. firstname!

I do know several M.D. Dr.'s socially. I always call them Dr. whatever they prefer. Maybe I'm just a strange bird, but I go with the most formal until they tell me do otherwise. This goes for Ph.d's also.

 

[booger73]

Work/teaching students/Professional situation - Dr. (for any professor, physician, phd, md, etc)

Social situation with 'same age people/older' - It should be.. 'Hi, let me introduce you to my husband (firstname).. or my wife (firstname).. or my bro/sis (firstname)' Anything other than that is *really* strange, imho..

One of our favorite jokes actually is to call someone 'doctor doctor X" (MD/PhD)... it's very silly and I think anyone who would even think about going like that has got some ego problems.