Do you think a college professor has the right to do this?

[Big Cuddly Bear]

Last night I was chatting with a niece of mine. She's 31 years old, has a FT job, and is a mom to 3 kids. She attends college PT.

Her job requires her to stay until 7PM... she gets to class at 7:40, but class starts at 7:30. She tells me that she slips in the door and quietly takes a seat in the back row, so as to cause as little disturbance as possible.

During last week's class, the professor told her to leave the class, and that she was no longer welcome. My niece told me that she told the professor that if he wanted her out of the class, then he had better call security and the dean, because she wasn't leaving. The professor said he would talk to the dean, and then make a decision on whether she would be allowed back in class. Then he resumed teaching.

So she and I were discussing what the outcome might be. She goes to this class on Thursday nights. I'm guessing that it will be a non issue. She's not so sure.

Whaddya think?

BTW, not that it really matters, but she said she was feeling like she was going to earn a "B", in class... and now, if she stays, she's wondering if she will still get the grade she expects.

From post #8:

Ah well, when she started class her hours were different. This has been for the last 4 weeks.

 

[tlbwriter]

The legal right? Possibly. What does her syllabus say?

ETA... If I was going to be 10 minutes late to every single class, I would have talked to the professor about it a LONG time ago.

 

[Carly_Roach]

Last night I was chatting with a niece of mine. She's 31 years old, has a FT job, and is a mom to 3 kids. She attends college PT.

Her job requires her to stay until 7PM... she gets to class at 7:40, but class starts at 7:30. She tells me that she slips in the door and quietly takes a seat in the back row, so as to cause as little disturbance as possible.

During last week's class, the professor told her to leave the class, and that she was no longer welcome. My niece told me that she told the professor that if he wanted her out of the class, then he had better call security and the dean, because she wasn't leaving. The professor said he would talk to the dean, and then make a decision on whether she would be allowed back in class. Then he resumed teaching.

So she and I were discussing what the outcome might be. She goes to this class on Thursday nights. I'm guessing that it will be a non issue. She's not so sure.

Whaddya think?

BTW, not that it really matters, but she said she was feeling like she was going to earn a "B", in class... and now, if she stays, she's wondering if she will still get the grade she expects.

Class starts at 7:30. No matter how unobtrusively she's "slipping in", she's going to cause a disruption. The professor might have let it slide the first time or two, but when it started looking like it was going to be a habit he let her know he wasn't going to tolerate it.

Does he have a right to do that? Yes, definitely. Starting time is starting time. Everyone else can make it there on time. If your niece can't then she shouldn't have tried to take the course.

 

[Tink888]

Not sure if the professor can do that but I can understand him being put off about her arriving late to class all the time.

Since she knew that her job was going to cause her to come late to class all the time, did she talk to the professor and give him the heads up beforehand? Most professors I've dealt with are pretty understanding when it comes to things like that.

Regardless of whether or not the professor was within his rights, she definitely didn't do anything to help herself in that class with the way she handled herself when he told her to leave.

 

[golfgal]

Most colleges take attendance and drop grades if you are not attending class. I can't believe that she did not talk to the prof before class started to explain the situation but I do think it is rude on her part to do this for EVERY class without having notified the prof.

 

[Scoutn757]

The class is the professor's and he/she may do as he/she wishes. The Dean will more than likely issue a refund/change her class. It isn't like she is getting doped up and coming to class last just to. Either way I do not see her staying in that class. IF she does then odds are her papers and assignments shall be examined with a fine toothed comb as an ego complex of the professor.

 

[castmember19]

I've known plenty of college professors who have kicked students out of class for various reasons- usually they feel disrespected. Would it be safe to assume that the professor does not know of her situation? Usually situations like this should be discussed at the very beginning of the semester so that the professor understands should the student be repeatedly late. Most professors are understanding.

Unless something in the syllabus clearly states that grades depend on attendance, her grades should just be her grades. No way he can take off points just for repeated lateness- unless of course he has the attendance rule. He can deem being repeatedly tardy as being "absent" if that's how he feels about it. It is his syllabus.

If she explains her situation, I don't think it'll be an issue but I think she should have definitely discussed the situation with the professor from the beginning to avoid a situation like this altogether. Had she done that and the professor still had a huge problem, she may have been able to transfer classes.

 

[Big Cuddly Bear]

The legal right? Possibly. What does her syllabus say?

ETA... If I was going to be 10 minutes late to every single class, I would have talked to the professor about it a LONG time ago.

Ah well, when she started class her hours were different. This has been for the last 4 weeks. I have no idea what the syllabus says, and she made no mention of it.

My thoughts are that she is an adult woman, with adult responsibilities, doing all she can to further / improve herself. It isn't like she is an 18 year old kids who is a wiseguy. In her shoes, I do believe I agree with what she said, entirely. Plus, she paid the money, so she's supposed to get taught.

BTW, this is a community college class we are talking about, not Ivy League or anything. To me, it just sounds like a professor that is too full of himself.

 

[msmayor]

Where my daughter attends college, all classes run 2.5 hours long. If you are 15 minutes late to any class, for any reason, you are considered absent for the entire class. No exceptions.

It won't matter if you sat there for the remaining 2 hours and 15 minutes. You're considered absent, and after four absences you automatically fail the class. This is ANY class, regardless of who is teaching it. School policy.

That being said, I do think the professor had every right to do as he/she did. Think about it....if you were late to work every single day don't you think your boss would have a problem with that? No different in college.

 

[CurlyGirl]

First off, being habitually late for a class makes it seem (to the professor at least) like she doesn't have a vested interest in this class to make it on time. No matter how quietly she slips into class, she's obviously still noticed (and probably distracting) her professor, not to mention other students in the class. I find it annoying and distracting when people are late for class. Even though they think they're being quiet, you still know.

If she knew she'd be late for every class, she should've brought it up to the professor on the first day of school and explained her situation. Most professors, if given an explanation, will be ok and let it slide. Maybe he wouldn't have such an issue with it and would've been a lot more understanding.

Put the shoe on the other foot. Would she be ticked if her professor showed up 10 mins. late for every class? Probably. Would she go complain to the dean if he did? Probably. So, can you blame the guy for being ticked off when his student does it?

 

[DSNY4ever]

I would certainly think the professor would have the right to do that. I am not sure why she would have signed up if she could not get there on time. She should have discussed that with the professor or with her boss before signing up for the course.

It also seems like she handled it the wrong way by saying "security would have to take her out." That comes across as quite rude in addition to being late. She should have exited and tried to talk to the professor after class about the situation. I couldn't imagine him being understanding at all after that response.

 

[Tink888]

Ah well, when she started class her hours were different. This has been for the last 4 weeks. I have no idea what the syllabus says, and she made no mention of it.

My thoughts are that she is an adult woman, with adult responsibilities, doing all she can to further / improve herself. It isn't like she is an 18 year old kids who is a wiseguy. In her shoes, I do believe I agree with what she said, entirely. Plus, she paid the money, so she's supposed to get taught.

BTW, this is a community college class we are talking about, not Ivy League or anything. To me, it just sounds like a professor that is too full of himself.

Exactly the reason she should've gone straight to the professor and talked with him once she knew she'd be consistently late.

And her reaction was that of an 18 year old wiseguy. Community college or not.

 

[msmayor]

Ah well, when she started class her hours were different. This has been for the last 4 weeks. I have no idea what the syllabus says, and she made no mention of it.

My thoughts are that she is an adult woman, with adult responsibilities, doing all she can to further / improve herself. It isn't like she is an 18 year old kids who is a wiseguy. In her shoes, I do believe I agree with what she said, entirely. Plus, she paid the money, so she's supposed to get taught.

BTW, this is a community college class we are talking about, not Ivy League or anything. To me, it just sounds like a professor that is too full of himself.

With all due respect, it makes no difference whether it is community college or the Ivy League. Its college...period...and no one should think that when attending a community college the rules of class attendance are more fluid.

Yes, she paid money. But by doing so she agreed to attend the class and abide by the professor's classroom rules.

 

[CurlyGirl]

My thoughts are that she is an adult woman, with adult responsibilities, doing all she can to further / improve herself.

She's an adult who should've known enough to discuss the situation with the teacher when her hours at work changed and this became an issue.

It isn't like she is an 18 year old kids who is a wiseguy.

Could've fooled me with her response to the professor.

 

[mamacatnv]

Ah well, when she started class her hours were different. This has been for the last 4 weeks. I have no idea what the syllabus says, and she made no mention of it.

My thoughts are that she is an adult woman, with adult responsibilities, doing all she can to further / improve herself. It isn't like she is an 18 year old kids who is a wiseguy. In her shoes, I do believe I agree with what she said, entirely. Plus, she paid the money, so she's supposed to get taught.

BTW, this is a community college class we are talking about, not Ivy League or anything. To me, it just sounds like a professor that is too full of himself.

So what if she is an adult woman, why should she be treated differently than any other adult student? You are suggesting the Prof. make some sort of exception based on a perception of her age.

She should have given her Prof. a heads up. A bit of communication can go a long way. I would be very surprised by a Prof. that would have an issue if told by a working adult that her schedule has changed and she will habitually be 10 minutes late.

I'm assuming she did not have this conversation and her habitual tardiness has been noted. Now, she argued with the Prof in front of the class which is not going to help her cause any.

This is a classic lesson of how a bit of courtesy can go a long long way.

Can he take it out on her grade?
Probably not, as long as nothing she turns in is subjective. If everything is subject to an answer key, then she should be okay but she put herself in a precarious position when she argued with his request that she leave.

 

[Carly_Roach]

Exactly the reason she should've gone straight to the professor and talked with him once she knew she'd be consistently late.

And her reaction was that of an 18 year old wiseguy. Community college or not.

 

[LuvLDM]

My thoughts are that she is an adult woman, with adult responsibilities, doing all she can to further / improve herself. It isn't like she is an 18 year old kids who is a wiseguy. In her shoes, I do believe I agree with what she said, entirely. Plus, she paid the money, so she's supposed to get taught.

BTW, this is a community college class we are talking about, not Ivy League or anything. To me, it just sounds like a professor that is too full of himself.

Why do you think her age makes a difference in this situation? Late is late whether you are 18 or 31.
I also don't think a community college professor is less worthy of respect than an Ivy league professor
I think your niece really should have discussed this w/ her professor as soon as she realized she had a scheduling conflict.

 

[hj0519]

Yes, like others have said she should have talked to her professor as soon as she knew she was going to be regularly late. Most professors I have would get pretty ticked if you consistently came in ten minutes late. No matter how "quietly" you slip in, it's a disruption and distracts everyone in the room. IMO, it's really rude to be late to class like that all the time. I understand that she has reason for it, but it's still rude.

 

[Ephany]

If I was going to be consistently late I'd of talked with the professor before classes started for the term or when her hours changed and gone from there. I've had professors lock the doors when the class was supposed to start, if you were late too-bad-so-sad.

 

[bellarella]

Absolutely the professor has the right to do it. I had a class in college where the doors were basically locked at the time class started. You came on time or you didn't come at all.

Paying money doesn't buy the right to disrupt class. There are all sorts of policies that I might not agree with, but I do think the professor has the right to create the teaching environment they wish to engage in (ie, some professors will allow laptops, some won't; some schools have internet access in class, some don't). As a student you have a right to take that class or not. You "buy" the class as offered.