Do you believe misogyny exists and people should be protected from misogyny?

[barkley]

Misandry is not the solution to misogyny

absolutely.

further I believe that the extent to which women are overly judgemental and very forthcoming in those judgements towards other women is an issue that has long been unaddressed. from little girls on the playground to grown-a..women through their attitudes, words and actions making others feel less than, shamed and questioning of their own capabilities. excusing it away as an acceptable form of socialization and 'just how friend groups work' (when did 'friend group' replace the word 'clique'). as an example-I was thrilled when moms working outside the home were no longer as frequently negatively judged and shamed by other women but then it became popular to do the same to the sahm's and so it goes back and forth. body shaming, sexuality, marital status (or lack of), career/non career, having children/choosing to be child free...I've seen/experienced far too many women INTENTIONALLY prejudicial towards one another and that is something that must end.

 

[LuvOrlando]

I take exception to the bolded. If a woman has chosen a husband whose expectations of her and the relationship are oppressive, that's on her. We don't have quite the same ability to choose our bosses/corporate cultures, although I suppose on some level, quitting is always an option. Not that it should have to come to that and I truly don't believe there are many reputable companies in 2025 that haven't cleaned up their acts a lot since the 80's.

Come off as a bit tilted towards the, "blame the victim" mentality because the same argument could easily follow for an abusive husband. Was this your intended slant?

 

[ronandannette]

Come off as a bit tilted towards the, "blame the victim" mentality because the same argument could easily follow for an abusive husband. Was this your intended slant?

{{sigh}} No it wasn't. Get over yourself. If you've never been emotionally taunted or physically attacked by a husband, maybe you don't see the difference between that and having one lay on the couch watching baseball while the wife cleans out the fridge. I doubt you are calling men who live in couples where the domestic duties aren't shared equally (for whatever reason) abusive. Or that you consider their wives, who are presumably adults with free agency, to all be victims.

 

[Moliphino]

Lately, I point out that the greatest inventions that we all enjoy and take for granted were invented by men such as lights, cars, trains, airplanes, the internet and air-conditioning.

Any of these replies usually gives them a nice warm cup of shut the fark up.

And how much of that is because women weren't allowed an education, and even if they had it their discoveries were often stolen by male colleagues?

 

[ruadisneyfan2]

And how much of that is because women weren't allowed an education, and even if they had it their discoveries were often stolen by male colleagues?

We have no way of knowing for sure because back when electric lights and AC were being invented, societal expectations were very different so it's hard to compare to modern times. How many women back then wanted to burst out of their life and act like a man, so to speak?

Birth control didn't exist so even if a woman wasn't wanting children, it was much harder to avoid becoming pregnant. Most people did what was expected of them at the time.

 

[LuvOrlando]

{{sigh}} No it wasn't. Get over yourself. If you've never been emotionally taunted or physically attacked by a husband, maybe you don't see the difference between that and having one lay on the couch watching baseball while the wife cleans out the fridge. I doubt you are calling men who live in couples where the domestic duties aren't shared equally (for whatever reason) abusive. Or that you consider their wives, who are presumably adults with free agency, to all be victims.

Get over myself? What are we in the 8th grade? Back in the schoolyard I remember "I know you are but what am I," being a favorite comeback too.

For the adult takeaway, do you mean a woman deserves everything she gets up to a certain threshold for marrying a guy? If there is a threshold, what is it?

If you have something to say just make it plain as day.

 

[Allison]

Of course it does.

 

[EilonwyWanderer]

All of this is unacceptable behaviour - may I ask how you responded to it? Long gone are the days that women should be putting up with anything like this. It's not right that we need to contend for ourselves in such basic ways, but sometimes still necessary.

I went to HR with a 14 page file, time stamped documenting all of his behavior.

Three times.

Each time they acted horrified. Then he'd be promoted out of trouble. That happened twice. After the first time each time I went back they told me they had no record of any complaints.

I still have to interact with him on a daily basis, but I no longer report to him.

 

[EilonwyWanderer]

At least 10x per day I have hear about how a man must have invented mammography equipment and if they had to have it done, they would have come up with a better way to do things

I would say that this is pretty true, though. Historically there is a huge amount of investment into men's health studies and very little into women's. Women also tend to not be listened to by doctors (both male and female) and it's honestly shocking how many very wrong things are still in current practice despite loads of evidence to the contrary--like how a cervix doesn't have nerve endings so it's fine to insert a UID without any sort of numbing agent. Except that for a lot of women it's EXCRUCIATING. If you've ever had a cervical check while you're pregnant it is HORRIBLE. But the doctor will still just thrust their fingers up there like it's no big deal and chastise you when you say how it hurts.

I just constantly think back to how they invented that birth control shot for men, but it sometimes caused headaches so they just stopped with it. Women die from birth control pills. I'm not allowed to take them because I had a blood clot when I was in college from them. But no, no, let's not put that burden on the men because they could get headaches.

It's that sort of thing that causes a lot of women to look askance at things and they aren't wrong to do so.

Another example from my own life: after I had my second child I had a lot of trouble losing the baby weight. In fact, I gained some and I was tired all the time. When I told my doctor he looked at me from over his file folder and said condescendingly, "Welcome to motherhood. Lose the weight."

My thyroid wasn't working. It took him two years to catch it.

 

[Smugpugmug]

Ugh unfortunately I can see that being commonplace as well gaming can have some really awful toxicity.

I played a few matches last night and while I stopped talking in voice chat permanently, another person on my team, who was female, said something and two guys on my team immediately went "GIRL GIRL GIRL GIRL" and later in the match she was called a slut by one of those guys for not healing them when they went in alone and died

Don't even get me started on how games that predominately have a female audience get routinely mocked and made fun of by the gaming community (biggest example being the Sims). And games that star a female protagonist like the new GTA cause these boys (refusing to call them men) to have toddler meltdowns.

 

[ClaraOswald]

Of course it exists. People would need to be delusional to think otherwise.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I played a few matches last night and while I stopped talking in voice chat permanently, another person on my team, who was female, said something and two guys on my team immediately went "GIRL GIRL GIRL GIRL" and later in the match she was called a slut by one of those guys for not healing them when they went in alone and died

Don't even get me started on how games that predominately have a female audience get routinely mocked and made fun of by the gaming community (biggest example being the Sims). And games that star a female protagonist like the new GTA cause these boys (refusing to call them men) to have toddler meltdowns.

So gross that it happens and many other non-DIS friendly things I could say

 

[LuvOrlando]

I like the fact that the younger generation has carved out a term for all the little subversive digs women enure, it is called micro-aggression. The younger women are feisty in a way I wasn't permitted to be.

 

[sam_gordon]

Micro aggression isn't just against women.

 

[ronandannette]

I would say that this is pretty true, though. Historically there is a huge amount of investment into men's health studies and very little into women's. Women also tend to not be listened to by doctors (both male and female) and it's honestly shocking how many very wrong things are still in current practice despite loads of evidence to the contrary--like how a cervix doesn't have nerve endings so it's fine to insert a UID without any sort of numbing agent. Except that for a lot of women it's EXCRUCIATING. If you've ever had a cervical check while you're pregnant it is HORRIBLE. But the doctor will still just thrust their fingers up there like it's no big deal and chastise you when you say how it hurts.

I just constantly think back to how they invented that birth control shot for men, but it sometimes caused headaches so they just stopped with it. Women die from birth control pills. I'm not allowed to take them because I had a blood clot when I was in college from them. But no, no, let's not put that burden on the men because they could get headaches.

It's that sort of thing that causes a lot of women to look askance at things and they aren't wrong to do so.

Another example from my own life: after I had my second child I had a lot of trouble losing the baby weight. In fact, I gained some and I was tired all the time. When I told my doctor he looked at me from over his file folder and said condescendingly, "Welcome to motherhood. Lose the weight."

My thyroid wasn't working. It took him two years to catch it.

And I've always been completely mystified why women doctors are seldom one bit better than men in regard to these things.

 

[ruadisneyfan2]

I would say that this is pretty true, though. Historically there is a huge amount of investment into men's health studies and very little into women's. Women also tend to not be listened to by doctors (both male and female) and it's honestly shocking how many very wrong things are still in current practice despite loads of evidence to the contrary--like how a cervix doesn't have nerve endings so it's fine to insert a UID without any sort of numbing agent. Except that for a lot of women it's EXCRUCIATING. If you've ever had a cervical check while you're pregnant it is HORRIBLE. But the doctor will still just thrust their fingers up there like it's no big deal and chastise you when you say how it hurts.

I just constantly think back to how they invented that birth control shot for men, but it sometimes caused headaches so they just stopped with it. Women die from birth control pills. I'm not allowed to take them because I had a blood clot when I was in college from them. But no, no, let's not put that burden on the men because they could get headaches.

It's that sort of thing that causes a lot of women to look askance at things and they aren't wrong to do so.

Another example from my own life: after I had my second child I had a lot of trouble losing the baby weight. In fact, I gained some and I was tired all the time. When I told my doctor he looked at me from over his file folder and said condescendingly, "Welcome to motherhood. Lose the weight."

My thyroid wasn't working. It took him two years to catch it.

I agree that birth control falls mostly on women but I also read that the birth control for men had a lot more side effects than just headache. It caused mood disorders and depression which for some brought on suicidal thoughts. If men told us to just deal with all that, we wouldn't be ok with it either.

I hope you can find a doctor that actually cares for you. I've never had those experiences but I'm not surprised some doctors say some mean things. My sister had a mean doctor with a 'suck it up' kind of attitude and she dumped him. I've also had female gyno's say some snarky comments too. They also got the boot.

 

[EilonwyWanderer]

I agree that birth control falls mostly on women but I also read that the birth control for men had a lot more side effects than just headache. It caused mood disorders and depression which for some brought on suicidal thoughts. If men told us to just deal with all that, we wouldn't be ok with it either.

I mean. They do:

"Side effects​

Combination birth control pills can cause side effects such as:

• Bleeding while taking the active pills — called breakthrough bleeding or spotting — that is more common with continuous-dosing or extended-cycle pills.
• Breast tenderness.
• Headaches.
• Nausea.
• Bloating.
• Increased blood pressure.

Some side effects — including nausea, headaches, breast tenderness, bloating and breakthrough bleeding — might get better after you've taken the pill for a while.

Possible risks​

Combination birth control pills increase the risk of certain conditions, which can be serious. They include:

• Blood clots in the legs, called deep vein thrombosis.
• Heart attack and stroke, especially if you smoke.
• Liver disorders."

 

[ruadisneyfan2]

I mean. They do:

"Side effects​

Combination birth control pills can cause side effects such as:

• Bleeding while taking the active pills — called breakthrough bleeding or spotting — that is more common with continuous-dosing or extended-cycle pills.
• Breast tenderness.
• Headaches.
• Nausea.
• Bloating.
• Increased blood pressure.

Some side effects — including nausea, headaches, breast tenderness, bloating and breakthrough bleeding — might get better after you've taken the pill for a while.

Possible risks​

Combination birth control pills increase the risk of certain conditions, which can be serious. They include:

• Blood clots in the legs, called deep vein thrombosis.
• Heart attack and stroke, especially if you smoke.
• Liver disorders."

I'm very much aware. I took the pill for a long time. Many years ago I x-rayed a 42 year old woman who had a severe stroke on Christmas Day from BCPs. Back in the 80's and 90s the patient instructions leaflet gave stern warnings to not smoke while on the pill and advised that risks increase much higher after 35. I went off of them by 28. Not everyone has all of these side effects. I had none at all. If it listed depression and suicide also, would you want to take it?

Who knows, it could have been mild mood swings or could have been life-altering severe depression.
It was severe enough that huge numbers of men dropped out of the clinical trials. Drug manufacturers are not going to persue any new drug that they can't even get people to stay in the clinical trials.

 

[Moliphino]

I'm very much aware. I took the pill for a long time. Many years ago I x-rayed a 42 year old woman who had a severe stroke on Christmas Day from BCPs. Back in the 80's and 90s the patient instructions leaflet gave stern warnings to not smoke while on the pill and advised that risks increase much higher after 35. I went off of them by 28. Not everyone has all of these side effects. I had none at all. If it listed depression and suicide also, would you want to take it?

Who knows, it could have been mild mood swings or could have been life-altering severe depression.
It was severe enough that huge numbers of men dropped out of the clinical trials. Drug manufacturers are not going to persue any new drug that they can't even get people to stay in the clinical trials.

Depression is a possible side effect of the one I take.

Other Side Effects​

• Spotty darkening of skin
• Having trouble wearing contact lenses
• Change in sex drive
• Acne
• Change in appetite
• Higher blood pressure
• Depression
• Yeast infection

Along with all of this:

Serious Side Effects​

Contact your healthcare provider immediately if you experience any of the following.

• Heart attack: chest pain, stomach discomfort, sweating, nausea, dizziness
• Stroke: sudden numbness or weakness in one arm or leg, numbness or weakness on one side of the face, severe headache, confusion, trouble seeing, trouble walking
• Deep vein thrombosis (blood clot in the leg): leg cramp, swelling, or pain; muscle tightness
• Pulmonary embolism (blood clot in the lung): cough, chest pain, trouble breathing, racing heart
• Serious liver problems: yellowing of the skin or the whites of the eyes, tiredness, stomach pain

 

[JediBonas]

I played a few matches last night and while I stopped talking in voice chat permanently, another person on my team, who was female, said something and two guys on my team immediately went "GIRL GIRL GIRL GIRL" and later in the match she was called a slut by one of those guys for not healing them when they went in alone and died

Don't even get me started on how games that predominately have a female audience get routinely mocked and made fun of by the gaming community (biggest example being the Sims). And games that star a female protagonist like the new GTA cause these boys (refusing to call them men) to have toddler meltdowns.

Yup, I stopped playing my favorite game for awhile because of the absolute toxicity of the "men" telling me that they were going to find and rape me, that I shouldn't be allowed to play video games, etc. (I guess they were mad they got beaten by a woman). Then I joined a clan where you had to be over 30 and OMG what a difference, brought joy back to gaming for me. I can't believe that this nonsense is still going on, I've been gaming for over 40 years and it's disgusting to still put up with this crap.