Do People really believe this?

[BuckNaked]

No, I didn't. I was merely making a point that there appear to be religious zealots with questionable messages on both sides of the aisle. The minister at Obama's former church does not have a monopoly on using the pulpit as a podium to further an agenda.

Very true - but he's the only one that had a future Presidential candidate sitting quietly in his pew for 20 years, listening to the hate-filled, racist sermons.

 

[FayeW]

Very true - but he's the only one that had a future Presidential candidate sitting quietly in his pew for 20 years, listening to the hate-filled, racist sermons.

Are you sure? You have transcripts of every sermon given by every minister that McCain may have listened to in the last 20 years? What about the sermons from the nut they chose to speak on McCain's behalf at the rally?

Since I have not been privy to the 1000+ sermons Rev Wright gave during that same time period, I will assume that the only ones that were "over the top" were the ones that made youtube. Unless and until the other 1000 are released, we have no idea what Obama heard. Maybe the first 10-15 years were all sunshine and roses. Who knows?

 

[corndog]

I definitely disagree with the minister. An Obama victory will be damaging to all religions.

 

[Holly]

I definitely disagree with the minister. An Obama victory will be damaging to all religions.

Why?

 

[tw1nsmom]

Very true - but he's the only one that had a future Presidential candidate sitting quietly in his pew for 20 years, listening to the hate-filled, racist sermons.

I personally think the whole Rev. Wright thing is a non-issue. However, if you're going to use this line of reasoning, have you looked up some of the sermons that Palin's ministers have given? Her current minister, that she hasn't denounced, has recently given an antisemitic sermon saying that the Jews deserve any suffering they receive because they haven't accepted Christ as their savior. We couldn't even count the number of other antisemitic and homophobic sermons that either minister gave, not to mention that visiting minister diatribe on "witchcraft".

I also think it's telling that people are upset about Rev. Wrights supposed anti-American sermons yet see no problem with Palin's husband having been a member and Sarah herself giving a supportive speech to a secessionist and anti-American organization.

I disagree with most organized religion...particularly the more conservative/radical ones. I was raised in the Catholic church, and I can't tell you the number of times I was uncomfortable with what the priest said. We forgive our religious leader of many transgressions at the pulpit and it takes time to become disillusioned and disassociate ourselves with a pastor. If we're to hold our public officials accountable for everything their personal religious leaders say, we first need to look carefully at what our own religious leaders are saying and make sure that others wouldn't find offense in that. Since that's an impossible task, we need to keep religion private and out of public life and policy.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Very true - but he's the only one that had a future Presidential candidate sitting quietly in his pew for 20 years, listening to the hate-filled, racist sermons.

Well what is good for the goose is good for the gander. The Right Wing Christians have met their match.

Seriously I think of the Christian religion as insane right now so don't see too much difference.

If you want to think about that, the fact that he is in such a "radical Church" if you will, may appeal to people on a certain level. Maybe?

None of it appeals to me so you understand my issue. All churches look nuts to me right now. I am not knocking your method of faith, to each his own.

Pray for Obama lose, Abortion to be eradicated, whatever....I don't see prayer as something that you order thru the Drive-Thru.

I am more of a meditative, finding peace thru quiet "prayer", instead of a laundry list.

 

[DawnCt1]

We have no idea what McCain has been hearing in church, just as we don't know every one of Rev Wright's sermons for the past 20 years, nor how many of them Obama was in attendance to hear.

He heard enough of Wright's sermons to quote him in his book. He knew enough about him to have him marry he and his wife. He was familiar enough with his preaching to feel comfortable in Wright baptizing his children. I believe Oprah attended that church for two years and left because of the inflamatory nature of Rev. Wright. If Oprah could figure it out in two years, why didn't Obama in 20?

 

[soupy11]

Yeah, I think there's plenty of folks whose God is better than other folks' God.
If ya don't believe me, just ask some folks, they'll tell ya their God is better than other folks' God.

No kiddin!

 

[Uncle Remus]

Well what is good for the goose is good for the gander. The Right Wing Christians have met their match.

Seriously I think of the Christian religion as insane right now so don't see too much difference.

If you want to think about that, the fact that he is in such a "radical Church" if you will, may appeal to people on a certain level. Maybe?

None of it appeals to me so you understand my issue. All churches look nuts to me right now. I am not knocking your method of faith, to each his own.

Pray for Obama lose, Abortion to be eradicated, whatever....I don't see prayer as something that you order thru the Drive-Thru.

I am more of a meditative, finding peace thru quiet "prayer", instead of a laundry list.

Allow me!

 

[Tigger Woods]

Apparently a minister giving the invocation at a McCain rally delivered a prayer indicating that a win for Obama would be a blow for the God of Christians. From CNN.

DAVENPORT, Iowa (CNN) – A minister delivering the invocation at John McCain’s rally in Davenport, Iowa Saturday told the crowd non-Christian religions around the world were praying for Barack Obama to win the U.S. presidential election.
“There are millions of people around this world praying to their god—whether it’s Hindu, Buddha, Allah—that his opponent wins, for a variety of reasons. And Lord, I pray that you will guard your own reputation, because they’re going to think that their God is bigger than you, if that happens,” said Arnold Conrad, the former pastor of Grace Evangelical Free Church in Davenport...



The McCain campaign has distanced itself from the remarks, but this is shocking to me. How does a man invited to make the invocation at public McCain rally come to believe somehow that the God of Barack Obama and the God of John McCain are somehow different?



Is this what it is going to come down to?



I am not voting for McCain, but I hope and pray (to the same God that Obama and McCain worship) that this great and courageous man does not allow his legacy to become one of hatred and loathing. If the people introducing the candidate are making these crappy references, what are the rank and file adherents thinking?

Read it again. Where does he say anything about Obama's God? He's talking about 'people around the world' praying that Obama becomes president.

 

[Chuck S]

Let us not forget that McCain actively solicited endorsements from a minister who believes that the Holocaust was just "God's way of moving the Jews into Palestine, and out of Europe to fulfill prophecy" McCain was "honored" by the endorsement for 2 1/2 months, and had even appeared on stage with him to accept the endorsement, until John Hagee's banter garnered bad publicity. Then McCain suddenly rejected Hagee's endorsement. Never mind that if anyone at the McCain campaign had done a little research they'd find Hagee has a history of anti-Semitic and anti-Catholic remarks.

Or that McCain himself in 2000 said Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell and their ilk were "agents of intolerance" and compared Robertson to " ''union bosses who have subordinated the interests of working families to their own ambitions.'' Oh, John McCain, when did THAT "Maverick" disappear? Why are you pandering to these types of religious leaders, now?

 

[yeartolate]

He heard enough of Wright's sermons to quote him in his book.

Were the quotes in his book hate filled? (I ahave never read his books, so this is a honest question)

 

[Charade]

Do I believe that it would be an affront to the Christian God if Sen. Obama wins? I have no idea.

Do I pray every single day that Sen. Obama loses? You bet.

Oooo... you're such a meanie!!!



and a racist! (just tossing that in there for good measure)

 

[Alaska DogCat]

Do I pray every single day that Sen. Obama loses? You bet.

I was brought up in my Christian church that asking God to grant your wish was using the Lord's name in vain. I would no sooner pray to God that McCain or Obama does not win than I would pray to God to give me a red Corvette. I pray to God to give each man guidance, to lead our country in His direction and to give me guidance in voting for a leader who will further His will.

 

[DawnCt1]

Were the quotes in his book hate filled? (I ahave never read his books, so this is a honest question)

The name of Obama's book is the "Audacity of Hope". It was sermon from Rev. Wright. I don't know if that sermon was "hate filled" or not but it is evidence that he heard enough of the sermons to remember the title of at least one and have the pastor marry him and baptized his kids. After Wright became "visible" in the media, he 'sanitized' the church's website of the Black Liberation Theology" doctrine. Doctrine, that if any predominantly white church had posted, would have been considered extremely racist.

 

[basas]

Yea, if only McCain would go to his church until 2028 and it would be the same.

And you notice in the OP he doesn't say that Obama's God is different than McCain's God. He just said that other people are praying to THEIR god for Obama to win. Whether it was true or not, I don't think it was a smart thing to say, but to each their own.

Well said.

The two situations are not even comparable.

 

[DawnCt1]

I was brought up in my Christian church that asking God to grant your wish was using the Lord's name in vain. I would no sooner pray to God that McCain or Obama does not win than I would pray to God to give me a red Corvette. I pray to God to give each man guidance, to lead our country in His direction and to give me guidance in voting for a leader who will further His will.

I was brought up in my Christian church to believe what Psalm 37/4 has to say;
4 Delight yourself in the Lord,
and he will give you the desires of your heart.

Its fine to ask the Lord for your hearts desires, even for material things. It doesn't mean that you are going to get them but it is not taking the Lord's name in vain. Asking for a leader that you feel will best serve the country is also not selfish. This is what the Vatican had to say about Biden and Pelosi. Given that, I would guess that they do not support the Democratic candidates in their prayers.

The former St. Louis Archbishop Raymond Burke, now prefect of the Vatican’s Supreme Court of the Apostolic Signature, told a Catholic newspaper Avvenire that the U.S. Democratic Party is becoming “a party of death.”

Burke is attacking the Democratic Party on bioethical issues – specifically abortion. He attacked Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi for misrepresenting Church teaching on abortion.

He said Biden and Pelosi, “while presenting themselves as good Catholics, have presented Church doctrine on abortion in a false and tendentious way.”

 

[Chuck S]

Burke is attacking the Democratic Party on bioethical issues – specifically abortion. He attacked Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi for misrepresenting Church teaching on abortion.

He said Biden and Pelosi, “while presenting themselves as good Catholics, have presented Church doctrine on abortion in a false and tendentious way.”

Interesting, as I've never seen either of them try to give the impression they are presenting official church doctrine about anything. I'm pretty sure almost every breathing American knows the Catholic church is officially opposed to legal abortion. But yes, let's have him attack the entire Democratic party. But then, by the same token, I'm sure he'd also be agreeable to holding the entire Catholic church equally responsible for the actions of some of their clergy.

 

[DawnCt1]

Interesting, as I've never seen either of them try to give the impression they are presenting official church doctrine about anything. I'm pretty sure almost every breathing American knows the Catholic church is officially opposed to legal abortion. But yes, let's have him attack the entire Democratic party. But then, by the same token, I'm sure he'd also be agreeable to holding the entire Catholic church equally responsible for the actions of some of their clergy.

Nancy Pelosi for example, feels she is a "good Catholic" and then she did at least two interviews in which she said that even the Catholic Church is conflicted about when life begins". That isn't true at all. The Catholic Church is very direct in their stand about when life begins. It begins at conception.

 

[Chuck S]

Nancy Pelosi for example, feels she is a "good Catholic" and then she did at least two interviews in which she said that even the Catholic Church is conflicted about when life begins". That isn't true at all. The Catholic Church is very direct in their stand about when life begins. It begins at conception.

Actually, both statements are true, aren't they?

The church's official doctrine states life begins at conceptions, I think everyoe knows that.

But the individual church members, which also are "the church", are conflicted, especially in the US.

Is the church the people, the doctrine, the Pope or the building? And how do we know to which Pelosi was referring?

Certainly one definition of "church" is the "body of its membership."