Disturbing Issue

[tup1830]

I'm sorry, but its really astonishing to see so many people saying its "no big deal"

Regardless of if errors can be reversed, it IS a big deal. If you never authorized a charge, verbally or written....even IF the op signed a paper, the agent never finalized any terms with the op...how could they just assume anything and/or charge a credit card for the amount?

The headache, time and effort to reverse this "issue" is a big deal to people that don't have the time to sit there and deal with dvc all day.

To say not a big issue, its a TRUST issue. If trust is no big issue, then to me thats a big issue.

 

[LisaS]

Legalities aside, this sounds like a misunderstanding to me. Perhaps there was malicious intent on "Kristie's" behalf--thinking she would be closer to making a sale by just processing the payment. Or it could be an honest mistake where she confused specifics with another client. Or she may have thought she was acting in OP's best interest by locking-in the points when they came available rather than risk having them sold to another buyer.

I agree with Tim's comments. I think Kristy was locking in the points so that they weren't snatched away by another guide for some other DVC member on the wait list. I seem to recall that this was standard practice back in the days when members waited months, over a year in some cases, for BCV add-on points. If you were serious about adding on, you gave your guide your CC number so that they could grab the points for you if and when they became available rather than risk losing them while they tried to reach you by phone.

I could imagine a scenario where Kristy grabbed the points, charged the deposit to the CC number the OP provided, then contacted the OP to finalize the exact number of points the OP wanted to purchase, at which point the paperwork would be generated and mailed to the OP. When the OP didn't call back, Kristy should have called again or at some point cancelled the CC charge rather than continue to wait for a response. It's possible she just forgot -- not good but not an act of fraud either.

ETA: OP, did you ever figure out how 29 points from that new 150 point contract were already used? That's very odd.

 

[tjkraz]

If you never authorized a charge, verbally or written....even IF the op signed a paper, the agent never finalized any terms with the op...how could they just assume anything and/or charge a credit card for the amount?

Then why was credit card info given in the first place? DVC didn't just grab the billing info off of OP's hotel reservation...it was specifically provided in association with some desired add-on purchase.

Some misunderstanding occurred. If you don't want people charging a credit card, don't give them the card number.

The headache, time and effort to reverse this "issue" is a big deal to people that don't have the time to sit there and deal with dvc all day.

The size of the "deal" is proportionate to what it takes to resolve. If the charge is reversed after a 2 minute phone conversation, it's a little deal. If multiple phone calls, letters or other correspondence are required, obviously it's a much bigger deal.

 

[connorlevismom]

I agree with Tim's comments. I think Kristy was locking in the points so that they weren't snatched away by another guide for some other DVC member on the wait list. I seem to recall that this was standard practice back in the days when members waited months, over a year in some cases, for BCV add-on points. If you were serious about adding on, you gave your guide your CC number so that they could grab the points for you if and when they became available rather than risk losing them while they tried to reach you by phone.

I could imagine a scenario where Kristy grabbed the points, charged the deposit to the CC number the OP provided, then contacted the OP to finalize the exact number of points the OP wanted to purchase, at which point the paperwork would be generated and mailed to the OP. When the OP didn't call back, Kristy should have called again or at some point cancelled the CC charge rather than continue to wait for a response. It's possible she just forgot -- not good but not an act of fraud either.

ETA: OP, did you ever figure out how 29 points from that new 150 point contract were already used? That's very odd.

I never did get an answer about the 29 points. I did write an email to member satisfaction today so we will see what they say.

Then why was credit card info given in the first place? DVC didn't just grab the billing info off of OP's hotel reservation...it was specifically provided in association with some desired add-on purchase.

Some misunderstanding occurred. If you don't want people charging a credit card, don't give them the card number.



The size of the "deal" is proportionate to what it takes to resolve. If the charge is reversed after a 2 minute phone conversation, it's a little deal. If multiple phone calls, letters or other correspondence are required, obviously it's a much bigger deal.

The credit card given had stipulations with it. The number one priority was to get this October reservation and it was made very clear that we were not interested in anything unless that could happen. In fact that is why we left empty handed, she could not make the reservation happen. No reservation, no sale. Again - we were very clear about that. No mention of the reservation in her voicemail to me and clearly none had been made on my behalf. The mystery 29 points that were missing never got an answer.

So IMO - she had no right to charge my card because my #1 stipulation for purchasing a contract was not met. She knew we wanted a reservation and did not want to purchase points unless we could get it. She did write that down on paper, I remember that. She was going to keep checking to see if she could make it work. Never heard from her again until her phone call a month later with no mention of the reservation being able to be made.

My contract was gone by Tuesday, but my card still has not gotten the credit. The man I spoke with said it could take a month. My bill is due before then so it looks like I am going to have the shell out $4700 to avoid paying finance charges on this if it does not resolve itself by the due date. I don't keep a balance on my CC's so that is not even an option.

In the end - I think she was wrong. If others don't I guess maybe you would feel different if it was your CC that was charged without authorization.

 

[tup1830]

if you challenge the charge, then it doesn't accrue interest...they basically take it off right away while the investigation process happens and then reapply it if it is proven that it wasn't a fraudulent charge.

 

[connorlevismom]

if you challenge the charge, then it doesn't accrue interest...they basically take it off right away while the investigation process happens and then reapply it if it is proven that it wasn't a fraudulent charge.

Ahh ok - good to know. Thank you!

 

[Dean]

I'm sorry, but its really astonishing to see so many people saying its "no big deal"

Regardless of if errors can be reversed, it IS a big deal. If you never authorized a charge, verbally or written....even IF the op signed a paper, the agent never finalized any terms with the op...how could they just assume anything and/or charge a credit card for the amount?

The headache, time and effort to reverse this "issue" is a big deal to people that don't have the time to sit there and deal with dvc all day.

To say not a big issue, its a TRUST issue. If trust is no big issue, then to me thats a big issue.

As I stated, it's likely an in between issue. However, this is only one side of the story and I am reluctant to accept just one side of the story as absolute, esp in this situation where there are clearly nuances that we don't have. While the OP's top issue may have been the Oct reservation this may not have been heard by the guide to the same level. A CC was given and a purchase was agreed to in some capacity. The OP felt like there were clear conditions on that issue that were not met, the guide may not have heard the same info. Were those conditions in writing? Did the OP sign anything that would initiate a purchase, IIRC the OP is not even certain on that aspect. I am confident that if DVD thought it was fraud on the part of the guide, it would have been handled differently thus at the end of the day it's just a misunderstanding. There are mechanisms to handle this issue that are effective and that need not get to the level of all these mental gymnastics.

As for disputing the charges, it could also cause issues as I don't believe they'll be able to process the refund in a timely manner if it's under investigation.

 

[bumbershoot]

As for disputing the charges, it could also cause issues as I don't believe they'll be able to process the refund in a timely manner if it's under investigation.

Agreed. Also, when you dispute a charge (at least with my bank CC and my credit union CC) it tells you clearly that the FIRST step is to try to take care of it with the merchant. You have to click the box to say that yes, you tried to take care of it first.

 

[connorlevismom]

Well, today is my 5th business day and I was supposed to hear from someone within 5 business days. I specifically asked for someone to contact me. Soooo disappointed in their complete disregard for my issue. Never will I purchase again direct from Disney. They clearly don't give a crap about their members.

 

[Dean]

Well, today is my 5th business day and I was supposed to hear from someone within 5 business days. I specifically asked for someone to contact me. Soooo disappointed in their complete disregard for my issue. Never will I purchase again direct from Disney. They clearly don't give a crap about their members.

Did they promise 5 business days or was that your imposed deadline? I'd call corporate as I suggested previously. Did they refund the money, take back the points and cancel the contract?

 

[connorlevismom]

The email I got back said I would hear something within 5 business days. So they gave me that deadline. And I asked in my email to hear something back-so I was expecting to hear something.

They did reverse the charge and took away the contract, but their whole no big deal attitude has just really irritated me. When they say they will get back to me, I expect them to get back to me.

 

[Dean]

The email I got back said I would hear something within 5 business days. So they gave me that deadline. And I asked in my email to hear something back-so I was expecting to hear something.

They did reverse the charge and took away the contract, but their whole no big deal attitude has just really irritated me. When they say they will get back to me, I expect them to get back to me.

Thanks, I agree they should follow through on their end if they made a commitment. It just wasn't clear from your previous post what had happened.

 

[disneynutz]

The email I got back said I would hear something within 5 business days. So they gave me that deadline. And I asked in my email to hear something back-so I was expecting to hear something.

They did reverse the charge and took away the contract, but their whole no big deal attitude has just really irritated me. When they say they will get back to me, I expect them to get back to me.

Was the email an auto response, if so the number of days doesn't really mean anything. The possibility exists that it is taking awhile to research what happened.

The reality is, we all think that we are special, we are members, when in fact we are just another sale, someone that they are paid to process.

I'm okay with that, all businesses are the same way. The problem is that we have been trained that Disney is different and we expect something more as we hold them to a higher standard.

Bill