Dissapointment for Hawaii bound DVC

[Mouseaholic!!!]

Or is Disney smart enough to begin construction when contractors' bids are likely to be much lower than when everyone else is building?

And is Disney smart to finance the project when interest rates are very low, but financing is hard to get -- unless you're a company like Disney?

And is Disney smart enough to complete the construction in 2011, as planned, when the economy is likely to be in much better shape than right now?

I have no idea if Disney will begin serious construction this year or not. It's even possible that Disney may not proceed at all. Since the beginning of DVC, there have been several DVC projects that were announced by Disney or by other companies that were involved, but that never proceeded to actual construction.

However, Disney would not have to be "stupid" to proceed in bad times in anticipation of opening in better times.

You are true....they would be financially reckless!!!

 

[tjkraz]

You really think Disney is stupid enough to begin construction right now? Have you taken a peek at the markets this morning? Have you looked at your 401K or retirement account? You can't possibly think this hasn't affected Disney's investments as well.

I think we ALL will be changing our travel plans and retirement plans for a few years.

That may well be true but Hoarace's point is completely valid. There is little historical precedent for believing that our economy will still be limping along 3 years from now. The prime time for Disney to be investing in projects like this is when labor is cheap and interest rates are low.

I certainly hope that Disney execs don't let fear motivate their decisions. Delaying progress now means it will only cost more to complete when they do decide to move forward.

Our debt will be transferred to our children and grand-children.....and it's big debt now!

Whose debt are you referring to and what is the relevance to Disney investing in a Hawaiian resort complex?

 

[Uncleromulus]

Mouseaholic and kaohu24:
Just curious and wondering what isn't safe about that part of the island? Hoping you aren't going to tell me it's as bad as downtown Baltimore, or York Pa...

 

[Horace Horsecollar]

Mouseaholic and kaohu24:
Just curious and wondering what isn't safe about that part of the island? Hoping you aren't going to tell me it's as bad as downtown Baltimore, or York Pa...

I'm not Mouseaholic or kaohu24, but I'll offer my answer to that question.

If you head along route 930 beyond the exit for Ko Olina, you would drive up the west coast of Oahu through Nanakuli, Waianae, and Makaha. Although there are supposed to be some excellent beaches on this coast, the area has a reputation for poverty and homelessness.

There have been some well-publicized cases of crime and violence against tourists. Last year a visitor from North Carolina was fatally punched on the beach by a Nanakuli resident. See http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2007/May/04/ln/FP705040371.html

Although there are a couple of resorts on this coast, it's really not a tourist destination. The road eventually ends, so tourists don't even drive through on their way to someplace else.

I understand that many of the low-paid service employees who take such good care of us tourists live in this area.

Around 900,000 people live on Oahu. Just as major cities throughout the rest of the United States have better and worse neighborhoods -- sometimes very close to each other -- Oahu has them too.

 

[kaohu24]

I'm not Mouseaholic or kaohu24, but I'll offer my answer to that question.

If you head along route 930 beyond the exit for Ko Olina, you would drive up the west coast of Oahu through Nanakuli, Waianae, and Makaha. Although there are supposed to be some excellent beaches on this coast, the area has a reputation for poverty and homelessness.

There have been some well-publicized cases of crime and violence against tourists. Last year a visitor from North Carolina was fatally punched on the beach by a Nanakuli resident. See http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2007/May/04/ln/FP705040371.html

Although there are a couple of resorts on this coast, it's really not a tourist destination. The road eventually ends, so tourists don't even drive through on their way to someplace else.

I understand that many of the low-paid service employees who take such good care of us tourists live in this area.

Around 900,000 people live on Oahu. Just as major cities throughout the rest of the United States have better and worse neighborhoods -- sometimes very close to each other -- Oahu has them too.

Yes I agree, Horace actually provides very accurate information. Ko Olina is a perfectly safe neighborhood. It's a gated community that has it's own guard patrol. Many of our politicians (including my aunty) live in this neighborhood. It is a nice tourist destination.

However, travel on the freeway past Ko Olina and you hit the cities with the worst reputation. Not everyone is bad there, my dad's side is from Waianae and so is my dh. Nanakuli to Makaha does have nice beaches, but over the past few years our housing prices has risen so much that people have resorted to permanently camping out on the beach. They are our huge homeless problem that makes the beaches unsafe. There have been measures to clean up the beaches and some of the major beach parks have been cleaned completely of the homeless.

There is a running joke here....if you aren't born and raised in Hawaii or you don't know anyone in Waianae, don't go there alone. Visit with someone else who knows the area. People have great pride in the area and unfortunately some bad eggs like to pick on tourists.

This is completely off topic though because Ko Olina is nothing like these cities. That is why many locals like to go to Ko Olina beaches instead of other ones on the leeward coast.

Horace, have you lived here before? You know quite a bit for someone from the mainland

 

[mkymsehi]

Updated at 4:55 p.m., Thursday, March 5, 2009
Disney begins preliminary site work for project at Ko Olina


Advertiser Staff


Walt Disney Parks & Resorts has begun preliminary site work at its first family destination resort in Hawai'i at Ko Olina. This work includes excavation, laying underground utilities and establishing where the foundations will be placed, said Djuan Rivers, vice president, Disney Vacation Club and Resort, Hawai'i.


"This is an important milestone for the project, as we continue to look forward to sharing the magic of Disney with Hawai'i's residents and visitors alike," he said.

The resort is scheduled to open in 2011. The new family-friendly destination is planned to include 350 traditional hotel rooms and 480 vacation villas dedicated to Disney Vacation Club, Disney's rapidly growing timeshare business.

Plans call for an expansive pool and water play area, an 18,000-square-foot spa, a wedding lawn, an 8,000-square-foot convention center, a children's club and two restaurants, one with an ocean view.

 

[Mouseaholic!!!]

Updated at 4:55 p.m., Thursday, March 5, 2009
Disney begins preliminary site work for project at Ko Olina


Advertiser Staff


Walt Disney Parks & Resorts has begun preliminary site work at its first family destination resort in Hawai'i at Ko Olina. This work includes excavation, laying underground utilities and establishing where the foundations will be placed, said Djuan Rivers, vice president, Disney Vacation Club and Resort, Hawai'i.


"This is an important milestone for the project, as we continue to look forward to sharing the magic of Disney with Hawai'i's residents and visitors alike," he said.

The resort is scheduled to open in 2011. The new family-friendly destination is planned to include 350 traditional hotel rooms and 480 vacation villas dedicated to Disney Vacation Club, Disney's rapidly growing timeshare business.

Plans call for an expansive pool and water play area, an 18,000-square-foot spa, a wedding lawn, an 8,000-square-foot convention center, a children's club and two restaurants, one with an ocean view.

As the wife of a castmember (who's Husband survived January and February layoffs) and a person who without medical insurance will not have to worry about planning any more Disney trips, I find this news as offensive as Bob Iger's $38 million year end bonus (weeks before he told 10% of disney staff -- bye bye).

My opinion - Disney DESERVES all the bad press it's getting right now.

 

[Mouseaholic!!!]

WOW, I just pulled up a photograph from the air in the Honolulu paper...the property is TEENY. My visits to Hawaii have been to far more expansive places and with much better beaches....but hey....they will find some people to buy it!

Rumor in many places now is they are already having problems keeping up with projections for BLT and don't forget the Grand Cali.

But hey --- build it.....maybe they can run it with only 35% normal staffing.....because going the way they are right now, that's the operating income they will have by 2011.

Why don't they visit the Harry Potter thread and realize....they need to make some investments in WDW.

NO,no....I forgot, these are probably the same people who came up with the brilliant concept of Stitch's Great Escape!

 

[Horace Horsecollar]

As the wife of a castmember (who's Husband survived January and February layoffs) and a person who without medical insurance will not have to worry about planning any more Disney trips, I find this news as offensive as Bob Iger's $38 million year end bonus (weeks before he told 10% of disney staff -- bye bye).

You find the news "offensive" that Disney is investing in the future by building a spectacular resort that will allow families and others to enjoy great Hawaiian vacation? You find it "offensive" that DVC is being expanded to provide an excellent new DVC destination?

WOW, I just pulled up a photograph from the air in the Honolulu paper...the property is TEENY. My visits to Hawaii have been to far more expansive places and with much better beaches....but hey....they will find some people to buy it!

Please suggest another location where Disney could have found a buildable 21-acre site in Hawaii that's part of a larger, high-quality, master-planned resort area.

It appears to me that the Disney resort at Ko Olina will be absolutely beautiful. Ko Olina is an excellent site in terms of weather and beaches. The island of Oahu offers more family attractions than any other island in Hawaii.

My opinion of the site is from having stayed at Ko Olina, not just from looking at "a photograph from the air in the Honolulu paper."

Rumor in many places now is they are already having problems keeping up with projections for BLT and don't forget the Grand Cali.

As most people are aware, the economy right now is in a deep slump that's still getting worse. Any timeshare resorts opening this year -- from Disney or any other brand -- are going to have a tough time for a while. That's a business reality.

If Disney's resort at Ko Olina were opening this year, I would agree that the timing would be unfortunate for Disney. However, the resort is not opening until 2011. I can't predict exactly where we'll be in terms of economic recovery, but it's highly likely that the economy will look much better by then.

I guess nobody is claiming that Disney will not go ahead with construction, now that actual construction work is underway (not just the ceremonial start of construction).

 

[tjkraz]

You find the news "offensive" that Disney is investing in the future by building a spectacular resort that will allow families and others to enjoy great Hawaiian vacation? You find it "offensive" that DVC is being expanded to provide an excellent new DVC destination?

Not only that but this sort of development and economic expansion is the surest way to get us out of our current crisis. Construction of the resort is going to employ hundreds--if not thousands--of individuals over the next 2+ years. And the resort has 1000 permanent positions to fill come 2011.

This is the sort of growth our economy needs right now.

 

[Mouseaholic!!!]

Want to know why this is offensive......ask some Orlando castmemnbers.

While you are posting this.....this news story has just broken on the ABC's Orlando Affiliate (yes, ABC affilliate ,----hummmm, and WHO owns ABC....take one guess! ---- did I hear you say DISNEY?????)

Disney Layoffs Massive, Employees Say
Posted: 8:36 am EDT March 10, 2009

ORANGE COUNTY, Fla. -- Sources close to Eyewitness News inside Disney World say there are massive layoffs going on at Central Florida's number one employer.

Employees at the theme park tell us the number of people let go in recent weeks is in the hundreds. However, Disney would not confirm the layoff numbers, saying only that those figures are speculative.

One man told us his friend was among those recently laid off from managerial positions.

"Disney is pretty much what brings tourism here and if people are laid off, that means there are not a lot of people coming into town right now," said John Carol, friend of Disney employee.

In February, Disney said a major reorganization of the company would lead to some job cuts.

Disney will not say how many Central Florida employees will be affected.



....but hey, go dig a hole in Hawaii......who needs castmembers in Florida?

Now do you understand?

Let's not forget we are talking about people and families here....not that the big guys at the Disney motherhouse care so much about people beond how much $$$ we carry in our wallets.

Sorry folks, I have spent this morning comforting a co-worker who's husband (with a heart condition) has lost his job and health care....the second co-worker this week who has faced this.

 

[aspry]

Want to know why this is offensive......ask some Orlando castmemnbers.

While you are posting this.....this news story has just broken on the ABC's Orlando Affiliate (yes, ABC affilliate ,----hummmm, and WHO owns ABC....take one guess! ---- did I hear you say DISNEY?????)

This is a little bit misleading.

ABC doesn't own the Orlando affiliate, only the network programming. The local news would be produced in house with little regard to what network they are affiliated with. Cox owns the Orlando ABC station, which is probably why they're so quick to break the story, I'd bet ABC owned stations will avoid this story altogether.

This isn't denying the story or that the layoffs are occurring, only that the relationship between the affiliate & Disney isn't really relevant.

 

[Mouseaholic!!!]

This is a little bit misleading.

ABC doesn't own the Orlando affiliate, only the network programming. The local news would be produced in house with little regard to what network they are affiliated with. Cox owns the Orlando ABC station, which is probably why they're so quick to break the story, I'd bet ABC owned stations will avoid this story altogether.

This isn't denying the story or that the layoffs are occurring, only that the relationship between the affiliate & Disney isn't really relevant.

Hey, you are absolutely right....so the Affiliate's have far more freedom to report the truth about a Disney story vs. playing the "party line".....but being a "cousin" to the network, they have a much better understanding of what is going on....inside.

 

[lxh11]

Want to know why this is offensive......ask some Orlando castmemnbers.

This is laughable - why do you pretend you have any concern about castmembers, when all you do is continually post doom & gloom about the current lay off situation. You always want to be first to post in an "I told you so" type way, even tho much of what you have posted has been inaccurate.

And for the person who claimed that 600 executives were laid off, even when it was pointed out that 619 had been OFFERED and not all could possibly take the package - Iger has just said during the Q&A session of the shareholder meeting, that 50 FIFTY executives took the package.

"Massive" layoffs, is misleading, that does not accurately represent the number of layoffs to date.

 

[tjkraz]

Let's not forget we are talking about people and families here....not that the big guys at the Disney motherhouse care so much about people beond how much $$$ we carry in our wallets.

Sorry folks, I have spent this morning comforting a co-worker who's husband (with a heart condition) has lost his job and health care....the second co-worker this week who has faced this.

That's truly unfortunate but Disney is not immune to what is happening in our economy.

But the part of this thread that I find truly objectionable is the notion that these layoffs have anything to do with Disney's Hawaii development. The two are completely unrelated. Even if Disney were not in the process of investing $800 million in Hawaii, that doesn't change the fact that Florida business is down. If Disney were not spending money in Hawaii, they would not be using it to subsidize further losses in Florida.

Additionally the project in Hawaii is an attempt to both grow Disney's business and to grow the local economy there. Yes it's unfortunate that Florida Cast Members are losing their jobs. We all know those are real people with real families.

But there are also real people with real families in Hawaii who would be out of work if they weren't running bulldozers and excavators on Disney's 21-acre plot.

Corporate investments and economic growth should be applauded now more than ever. Postponing the Ko Olina development wouldn't have done a single thing to save your friends' jobs.

 

[Mouseaholic!!!]

This is laughable - why do you pretend you have any concern about castmembers, when all you do is continually post doom & gloom about the current lay off situation. You always want to be first to post in an "I told you so" type way, even tho much of what you have posted has been inaccurate.

And for the person who claimed that 600 executives were laid off, even when it was pointed out that 619 had been OFFERED and not all could possibly take the package - Iger has just said during the Q&A session of the shareholder meeting, that 50 FIFTY executives took the package.

"Massive" layoffs, is misleading, that does not accurately represent the number of layoffs to date.

Funny thing, I happen to have been proven right and my concern for everyone experiencing layoffs....or the threat of them is genuine - as you know personally.

So if the ABC Affiliate has mis-quoted the layoff number by describing it as Massive, why don't you make it easy for everyone to understand and post the actual number of layoffs and YOUR source. You seem to know more than anyone else here or published.

Today I am defaulting to my source by a simple cut and paste technique.....I remain patiently awaiting your numbers and source. This way no one can say YOU are only speaking of rumors.

 

[aspry]

but being a "cousin" to the network, they have a much better understanding of what is going on....inside.

I would doubt this & the fact that they used a "friend of Disney employee" as a source would tend to back that up. It really doesn't matter what there relationship is with Disney, it doesn't change the point of your post.

There's no doubt layoffs are happening, they're happening everywhere.

Please don't call me a Kool-Aid drinker

 

[lxh11]

No you have not been proven right, but you are incapable of understanding what anyone else says, because you are too busy trying to make up another answer. In my very first post, I stated that you were taking pieces of information for a variety of sources and making up your own ending, which adds fuel to the rumour mill, of which you seem to find glee in perpetuating.

You took info that you knew to be true from your husbands business unit (which is NOT WDW parks & resorts) and tried to apply the same to the WDWP&R, to make it sound as tho you had insider info. You didn't. Remember this one you claimed to be true:

Mouseaholic rumour - "Annaheim will be sending letters to cost centers today, deadline February 16 -DIDN'T HAPPEN!"

 

[jimmymac]

This is a little bit misleading.

"Yellow"] Cox owns the Orlando ABC station, which is probably why they're so quick to break the story, I'd bet ABC owned stations will avoid this story altogether.[/COLOR]


That's not how the news biz works. If ABC ignores this story because of their ownership, they shouuld resign their positions. News is news. When corporate ownership interrupts the news filter, the process is broken beyond repair

 

[Mouseaholic!!!]

No you have not been proven right, but you are incapable of understanding what anyone else says, because you are too busy trying to make up another answer. In my very first post, I stated that you were taking pieces of information for a variety of sources and making up your own ending, which adds fuel to the rumour mill, of which you seem to find glee in perpetuating.

You took info that you knew to be true from your husbands business unit (which is NOT WDW parks & resorts) and tried to apply the same to the WDWP&R, to make it sound as tho you had insider info. You didn't. Remember this one you claimed to be true:

Mouseaholic rumour - "Annaheim will be sending letters to cost centers today, deadline February 16 -DIDN'T HAPPEN!"

I will never discount the anguish of those laid off or facing that. I will discount the text of someone who does not qouote his source.

I have listed mine. If you do not like what ABC tv in Orlando has said.....take it up with them. Today I am only the "cut and paste" lady due to personal attacks in the past - obviously.

I'm still waiting YOUR reliable source.