Disney requires too much planning? Are they shooting themselves?

[mshanson3121]

Another complaint I hear is how much everything costs. Granted, the tickets are expensive. But, when you take into account that paying for a 4 day-5 day ticket is getting you an entire week's worth of park time, and even more so when you add park hoppers, it is really worth the price. My brother was complaining about the cost of food and sodas after our last trip. I asked him if he knew what the same items or similar would cost at Six Flags, and when I told him it was about the same, it made my point. People will complain about how much a Coke is at WDW. A regular size soda is $3.29. I believe a large is $3.69(?). The other night I bought a *small* diet coke at Regal theatre and that thing was $5.50. It kills me how people will spend $30 on snacks at a movie that cost them $13 a person and then complain about the price of food at Disney. Yes, it's expensive, but I expect it...it's a theme park.

One criticism I can concur with is how much advanced planning you have to do now. I don't like that I have to sit down and plan basically every day and where I will be in order to get FP for the rides that will be hour long waits. Not only that, but I have to preplan all my meals and make the ADRs and in order to do that, I have to know where I plan to be and what FP I have so that they won't interfere with each other. I enjoy planning my trips, but if I were a first-timer, I might get totally overwhelmed with all of it.

I'll admit, I'm one of the ones, who I'm not sure if Disney is worth the price. Being Canadian with the exchange doesn't help, but 5 day base passes for our family of 4 are $2150. And that's just tickets. Not lodging, food, travel or spending. To put that in perspective - we are spending 8 nights in a 1800 sq ft townhouse in New Hampshire this summer, spending 3 days in theme parks, with some other activities planned, and our grand total including travel, lodging, food, entertainment etc... will be $1800. We can do a 5 night all-inclusive cruise (with a balcony room) for $2000, including our flights to get there. We could Lego Land, Discovery Cove, Sea World, Aquatica and Busch (with multiple trips for the latter 3) for only $1350. Given the Disney reviews lately of ride breakdowns, crazy wait times, reduced capacity etc... I'm not convinced it's worth it. Hence why we canceled our trip for November. While the nostalgic part of me still really wants to go back, the practical part of me realizes we can have just as much fun, and honestly, probably even more when you consider we won't be standing in huge crowds, long lines after planning for months, for far less, elsewhere. And yet, I won't say I won't ever return, either...

As far as the cost of food, we're oddballs, but again, coming from where we live in Canada (where food is very expensive), we actually found Disney food very reasonably priced. Where we live a meal at McDonald's for the 4 of us costs $30. Your average diner food costs $50-60 for our family, so Disney was no more expensive than eating out here. But I realize for you Americans where you're used to cheaper food prices, it probably seems quite exorbitant.

As for the planning, I definitely got overwhelmed with our first trip. I had never, ever, had to plan that much for a trip. And never have since, either. Any other place we go, we are able to just wing it - show up, and have fun, do whatever we want, when we feel like doing it. The most planning we do is finding a place to stay, what area attractions there are that we would be interested in (hours of operation etc), climate/weather, and that's about it.

 

[Tiki_Sara]

We didn't plan our first visit- we were in Florida for a conference the following week and had a vague idea of stopping in at Disney but no firm plans at all. We literally turned up in Orlando, got a hotel (ASMu) on the same day and next day bought park tickets at the gate of MK and got fast-passes on the morning of our park visits. It was brilliant and we loved every minute. No, we didn't get to do every attraction or eat at some places we might have wanted to had we researched beforehand but it was a fantastic three days and we can't wait to go back next year for our (much more planned) second visit.


I think the PP who said it's all down to attitude was absolutely right. You don't have to plan a Disney trip, you can just turn up, go with the flow and enjoy yourselves immensley, but if you don't have the right attitude and see everything as a chore then you're never going to enjoy it. We didn't know if we were going to be Disney people before our trip, my guess would have been "not really" but it turns out we SO ARE and I think a lot of that is down to our outlook on vacations and life in general. Turns out the best parts of our trip were nothing to do with Fastpasses or ADRs but just the general Disney atmosphere and the taking time to look around us.

 

[mshanson3121]

What happens when the kids who experienced miserable trips become the adults planning trips for their families? Will it still be something they want to share with their kids?

Hard to say. My guess is though - they don't go. If a place doesn't leave a favorable impression on you, or make fond memories, chances are you're not going to be interested in trying to recreate it for your child.

That's a bad one given the website gives you that information..but I will say silver lining is if everyone used FP.....

That's a bad one given the website gives you that information..though to be fair no other theme park or amusement park that I've been to requires ADRs let alone 6 months in advance. People should be seeing this information on the website though it's just I wouldn't expect you to know.

My take is Disney doesn't require soooo much planning. It does taking knowing basics like how FP works (and that it exists), that sit-down places will require ADRs, and what rides you and your traveling party are interested in. Most other stuff is personal preference.

In a nutshell for majority of folks the WDW website gives you all the information you need. But for me I go to websites, I go to TripAdvisor, I go to tourism websites others may just not do that. They should for WDW though.

What I gathered from the comments was:

- Very few were actually able to use FP+, because they didn't realize when you could make them. So some tried to do them day of when they arrived, some the night before. None of whom were able to get much, if anything. One commentor was only able to get on 2 rides in 6 hours (Easter Monday). Another who went spring break week, said that in 3 days, they were only able to see/do a total of 8 attractions/rides. The rest of their time was spent trying to navigate through the crowds and in lines. I'm going to assume they didn't know about rope dropping, EMH etc...

- Exactly as you said re: dining. Very few, if any other similar destination, is going to require ADRs, so they're not going to think about it.

- As far as the information is readily available on the website - it is, and it isn't. They aren't exactly forthright with their information. Yes, the website says you "can" make dining reservations, but it doesn't tell you that the parks are so busy that if you don't make the reservations 4-6 months beforehand, your chances of actually getting one, are slim to none. Likewise, information on FP+ is very scant. On the ticket purchase page, it says nothing about it, not even under "View Important Details". On the main park pages, there is nothing about it. Only when you click onto the Rides page from the main page, under the list of rides, there, finally, in small print, in a list of other features about the ride, does it say FastPass+. But if you don't know what FastPass+ is or what that means, or that you even have such a thing... Even on the resort pages... there is nadda. I just went in to "book" a package. I clicked on all the information links, including rate details and package inclusions... not one word about FP+. Now, they advertise the perk in their tv commercials, but for the average newbie coming to the website, there is nothing about it at all, that they are going to see, unless they really do some digging.

 

[SaintsManiac]

Other than character meals I don’t find Disney food prices to be over the top. However, I’m from a tourist destination city and maybe I’m used to it?

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

**I couldn't fit all the screenshots into one quote so I'm having to do two quotes**

Yes, the website says you "can" make dining reservations, but it doesn't tell you that the parks are so busy that if you don't make the reservations 4-6 months beforehand, your chances of actually getting one, are slim to none.

Well if you go to the website one of the tabs will be:


If you select dining and a particular place it will tell you reservations strongly recommended generally speaking:

50s Prime Time:


Be Our Guest:


clicking "Read More" gets you this:


If you go to this:
and select the highlighted "View All"

You can see this:

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Likewise, information on FP+ is very scant. On the ticket purchase page, it says nothing about it, not even under "View Important Details". On the main park pages, there is nothing about it. Only when you click onto the Rides page from the main page, under the list of rides, there, finally, in small print, in a list of other features about the ride, does it say FastPass+. But if you don't know what FastPass+ is or what that means, or that you even have such a thing... Even on the resort pages... there is nadda. I just went in to "book" a package. I clicked on all the information links, including rate details and package inclusions... not one word about FP+. Now, they advertise the perk in their tv commercials, but for the average newbie coming to the website, there is nothing about it at all, that they are going to see, unless they really do some digging.

Well if you go to the website of the tabs will be:


MDE isn't too hidden really though I can understand aprehension about creating a profile.

There is also this too for FP:


Click on the highlighted question and you get:




Scroll down to the bottom of the page and you'll see this:


So there are several ways to get to the FP information.

Truly the website is all you need for the average person. Sure belonging to the DIS allows you a lot of good information that can be very helpful but the website gets you the basics. The thing is I'm an inquisitive person by nature. I'd be looking at the website and the tabs available. FAQs are also a go-to for me.

The thing that you're doing above with booking a package is not really using the website for information you're just using it to book. If you go to the website you'd have to be utilizing extreme tunnel vision in order to not see that there is more to it than just open website-book resort/package exit website. Now the difference is if people don't care to peruse the website and I don't say that meanly just that some people don't think to look over websites very much. Some people love going to a place with little knowledge and that's cool by them but I can't imagine poking around a website to find out some things. Do I think the website will tell you that 7DMT is a hard to get FP or that BOG is considered the hardest ADR to get? Nope but it will give you some background information. I totally agree planning is needed but the planning that I personally did with the spreadsheets, color-coded and all multiple MS Word documents, a travel binder, etc is not needed for the average guest.

 

[Roxyfire]

Well if you go to the website of the tabs will be:
View attachment 315577

MDE isn't too hidden really though I can understand aprehension about creating a profile.

There is also this too for FP:
View attachment 315578

Click on the highlighted question and you get:
View attachment 315579
View attachment 315580


Scroll down to the bottom of the page and you'll see this:
View attachment 315581

So there are several ways to get to the FP information.

Truly the website is all you need for the average person. Sure belonging to the DIS allows you a lot of good information that can be very helpful but the website gets you the basics. The thing is I'm an inquisitive person by nature. I'd be looking at the website and the tabs available. FAQs are also a go-to for me.

The thing that you're doing above with booking a package is not really using the website for information you're just using it to book. If you go to the website you'd have to be utilizing extreme tunnel vision in order to not see that there is more to it than just open website-book resort/package exit website. Now the difference is if people don't care to peruse the website and I don't say that meanly just that some people don't think to look over websites very much. Some people love going to a place with little knowledge and that's cool by them but I can't imagine poking around a website to find out some things. Do I think the website will tell you that 7DMT is a hard to get FP or that BOG is considered the hardest ADR to get? Nope but it will give you some background information. I totally agree planning is needed but the planning that I personally did with the spreadsheets, color-coded and all multiple MS Word documents, a travel binder, etc is not needed for the average guest.

Not only that, if you book through WDW they do send you emails to tell you "Hey starting today you can make dining reservations, here's how!" and "It's time to make your Fast Passes!" Granted, it's not right at when the window opens, but if someone isn't aware, that would prompt them to look at it if a) they read their email and b) they notice that it's telling them to do something special. Obviously the people left out here are the ones who are buying tickets online or from other places as Disney has no idea when to tell them to do this. I don't know if they provide any documentation in the email (they should). But you'd think if someone is spending that much per ticket they might read through it. Consequentially, a coworker told me she wants to go to one of the Disney parks for one day with her partner after a conference. And she hasn't been in like 30 years. So that was fun explaining how things are now vs when she was a kid.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Not only that, if you book through WDW they do send you emails to tell you "Hey starting today you can make dining reservations, here's how!" and "It's time to make your Fast Passes!" Granted, it's not right at when the window opens, but if someone isn't aware, that would prompt them to look at it if a) they read their email and b) they notice that it's telling them to do something special. Obviously the people left out here are the ones who are buying tickets online or from other places as Disney has no idea when to tell them to do this. I don't know if they provide any documentation in the email (they should). But you'd think if someone is spending that much per ticket they might read through it. Consequentially, a coworker told me she wants to go to one of the Disney parks for one day with her partner after a conference. And she hasn't been in like 30 years. So that was fun explaining how things are now vs when she was a kid.

I did think about mentioning the e-mails because you're right they do send that to you.

It still works if you don't buy tickets from Disney. I bought my tickets from UT and didn't link them until 6/27 with 7/10 being my FP date. Now on my FP date I did get an e-mail about it being time to book them but it was hours after my window had opened. When I initially linked my tickets I did get a confirmation e-mail that mentioned being able to utilize FP.

Linking tickets is something reading about MDE would be good for.

Now maybe having an onsite stay prompted the information.

 

[Roxyfire]

I did think about mentioning the e-mails because you're right they do send that to you.

It still works if you don't buy tickets from Disney. I bought my tickets from UT and didn't link them until 6/27 with 7/10 being my FP date. Now on my FP date I did get an e-mail about it being time to book them but it was hours after my window had opened. When I initially linked my tickets I did get a confirmation e-mail that mentioned being able to utilize FP.

Linking tickets is something reading about MDE would be good for.

Now maybe having an onsite stay prompted the information.

Yeah I'm thinking it does because I bought tickets from Undercover Tourist for this upcoming trip as well. Of course, I linked them right away but I'm pretty sure they give you information on how to do that. Not sure if other resellers do that (or if people would know about resellers either).

 

[queenofthehive]

I am just back from a trip last week and I have to say this was the most busiest/crowded Spring Break I have ever experienced. I have gone the week after Easter almost every year for the past 10 years. It was CRAZY crowded even at rope drop. Lines filled extremely quick. I know how to plan, use fast pass plus, and make ADRs but this Spring Break was something I have never seen before... I really am thinking of seriously not going next Spring Break. I felt like I could not do as much as I wanted to do due to the crowds. In my opinion, it is just poor management and greed on Disney's part. Fast pass plus system is not helping at all with the lines and in fact is just making it worse. I have another trip this summer and if it is the same experience as Spring Break, I will be going elsewhere for vacation. Increasing costs is one thing but delivering a lesser experience with increased costs - well, there is just so much a customer will take before they take their business elsewhere and I am pretty close to that point.

 

[mshanson3121]

**I couldn't fit all the screenshots into one quote so I'm having to do two quotes**



Well if you go to the website one of the tabs will be:
View attachment 315576

If you select dining and a particular place it will tell you reservations strongly recommended generally speaking:

50s Prime Time:
View attachment 315568

Be Our Guest:
View attachment 315569

clicking "Read More" gets you this:
View attachment 315570

If you go to this:
View attachment 315573 and select the highlighted "View All"

You can see this:
View attachment 315574
View attachment 315575

Well if you go to the website of the tabs will be:
View attachment 315577

MDE isn't too hidden really though I can understand aprehension about creating a profile.

There is also this too for FP:
View attachment 315578

Click on the highlighted question and you get:
View attachment 315579
View attachment 315580


Scroll down to the bottom of the page and you'll see this:
View attachment 315581

So there are several ways to get to the FP information.

Truly the website is all you need for the average person. Sure belonging to the DIS allows you a lot of good information that can be very helpful but the website gets you the basics. The thing is I'm an inquisitive person by nature. I'd be looking at the website and the tabs available. FAQs are also a go-to for me.

The thing that you're doing above with booking a package is not really using the website for information you're just using it to book. If you go to the website you'd have to be utilizing extreme tunnel vision in order to not see that there is more to it than just open website-book resort/package exit website. Now the difference is if people don't care to peruse the website and I don't say that meanly just that some people don't think to look over websites very much. Some people love going to a place with little knowledge and that's cool by them but I can't imagine poking around a website to find out some things. Do I think the website will tell you that 7DMT is a hard to get FP or that BOG is considered the hardest ADR to get? Nope but it will give you some background information. I totally agree planning is needed but the planning that I personally did with the spreadsheets, color-coded and all multiple MS Word documents, a travel binder, etc is not needed for the average guest.

I knew someone would dig around until they proved me wrong

Clearly, the website isn't all you need for the average person, when you read many of the negative reviews, because.... they didn't know. Yes, you can dig around and find the information under the Help section and the FAQ, or you can go to MDE - if a person knows what that is for, or even clicks on it. I never did when I was initially planning. But you already know that FP+ exists, and what it's for. Thus, you know to keep looking for the information (and where). Clearly, a lot of newbies don't. Heck, I had my tickets for over a month, before I just happened to come across this group in a search, and found out about what MDE is for, about making FP+, ADRs etc... So my point was that on the main pages and the main links, that an unexperienced guest is most likely to visit - it is NOT mentioned. There are many people who are never going to step foot in the FAQ or Help section, unless they're having problems of some sort. I was definitely one of them.

As far as reminder emails, that must be something new, because we bought direct from Disney, and never received emails on any of that. That said, that's only going to work if you have a resort stay, and a lot of people stay off site (which some of the commenters did for sure), so they wouldn't receive anything.

At any rate, I'm not disagreeing that the information is there, but it's not as up front and centre as it could/should be. Yes, most of these people should have dug around more and looked harder for information. But again, on the flip side - if you've never had to before, you don't necessarily think you need to now.

 

[dreiwhit]

Definitely. But I think the problem is, from what I'm seeing, a lot of people don't realize that.

My wife and I are planners by nature. But, no other vacation or even business trip that I have taken matches the level of planning required for a WDW vacation. I only half jokingly tell my wife that the only thing that equals planning for a Disney vacation is planning a military campaign! I'll be honest, the level of planning required to maximize the money we spend on tickets has really gotten old to both of us.

Before out last trip, my wife was on her laptop and she happened on a travel related website. She looked up Disney World and most of the reviews were scathing. They were from a lot of first time visitors and people that hadn't been to WDW since the 80s or 90s. The reasons were the same as what the OP had given - crowded parks, long waits, et al.

I once shared this on Disboards, and I had one person ask me if I would go to Paris without planning. Although I would plan more if I was going to Paris, I wouldn't have to plan it to say "be at the Eiffel Tower at 9:30am, then the Arc de Triomphe at 11:15, and the Louvre at 1:05, with lunch from 11:45 at this place until 12:05. That's the kind of planning we have to do for WDW.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I knew someone would dig around until they proved me wrong

It wasn't about proving you wrong it was about the fact that Disney does give quite a bit of information on their website. Disney's website may not always work well lol but it does have basic information.

Clearly, the website isn't all you need for the average person, when you read many of the negative reviews, because.... they didn't know. Yes, you can dig around and find the information under the Help section and the FAQ, or you can go to MDE - if a person knows what that is for, or even clicks on it. I never did when I was initially planning. But you already know that FP+ exists, and what it's for. Thus, you know to keep looking for the information (and where). Clearly, a lot of newbies don't. Heck, I had my tickets for over a month, before I just happened to come across this group in a search, and found out about what MDE is for, about making FP+, ADRs etc... So my point was that on the main pages and the main links, that an unexperienced guest is most likely to visit - it is NOT mentioned. There are many people who are never going to step foot in the FAQ or Help section, unless they're having problems of some sort. I was definitely one of them.

At any rate, I'm not disagreeing that the information is there, but it's not as up front and centre as it could/should be. Yes, most of these people should have dug around more and looked harder for information. But again, on the flip side - if you've never had to before, you don't necessarily think you need to now.

1) You're never going to get all the guests to have knowledge and to be honest you don't want it that way. Would you really want the tens of thousands of guests each day to all have FP and ADR knowledge? It works to everyone's advantage to not have everyone read up-doesn't mean my advice changes just that I know it's better that a certain percentage of guests stay in the dark.

2) It is up front and center:


It really doesn't take much digging at all. But again if all you're going to use the website for is booking.

On that point we'll just not be able to agree. Like I said extreme tunnel vision. How can one not see the tab "Things to Do" or "Help" or My Disney Experience"..how do you not question..."hmm what's this?" One of my basic advices is figuring out what types of rides and shows and attractions your traveling party wants to do. Well that's under "Things to Do" tab which I personally think makes sense. If someone wants to treat WDW's website like it's just for booking that's totally fine and maybe that plays into your viewpoint of front and center. It doesn't mean that the website doesn't have the information that could be useful to them. In other words that's on the guest not on the website.

3) Actually I didn't know a thing when I went to WDW's website. I joined MDE in August 2015- I saw that I could make an account with Disney and was in the very early stages of planning a trip for 2 years later. It was months later that I found the DIS through a blog on Pinterest and joined up in October 2015. I knew about the concept of FP based on Legacy FP back in 2011 but didn't know about FP+ until I saw it on the website. I was already saving attractions and shows and whatnot to my Wish List on my MDE account before even signing up for the DIS. I didn't know about ADRs before WDW's website. I never booked them back in 2011. But like I said I'm an inquisitive person. I know not everyone is like that and that will play a role into what you see and do.

 

[michbaron]

I didn’t thoroughly read every other response but I would agree with someone saying it’s about your attitude, I’m definitely a planner in all aspects of my life so disney vacations are so fun for me to plan for our family but with as much planning as I do I understand there needs to be some wiggle room, positive thinking, and an overall “go with the flow” attitude especially since we have kids

I feel people who complain about Disney planning probably do the same for other trips too, I mean if I were going to Italy I would do the same research of hotels, place to eat, transportation, prices, opening times of museums etc and at least with Disney if you’re not the planning type you can book with a Disney travel agent for no additional cost which again brings me back to attitude/perspective, you can plan it yourself or have someone else do it but if you’re not going to be open minded and easy going of course you’re not going to enjoy but I think that would be on any trip

 

[nkereina]

Agreeing with PPs. I'm definitely in the camp that if you are spending thousands on a vacation, a quick google search about the place you're going to would behoove you. And I'd venture to say that a lot of these people who didn't bother to do that would have even gotten a kick out of the researching and planning aspect of it, because that's some of the fun of it!

I'd also ask what if these people were vacationing in Myrtle Beach - would they at least check to be sure their hotel was on the beach? Would they research other things to do in the area besides the beach? Quite possibly, so Disney should be no different.

I do sympathize with people who decide now that they want to go to Disney in July. They are behind the eight ball in ADR bookings and maybe even resort availability as well. They think they are planning in advance and for some, this might be how/when they can plan vacations. I'm sure there are people who decide on 5 months or less notice that they want to visit WDW, start to do some research, and then realize ADRs open at 180 DAYS and they never stood a chance of getting a Be Our Guest reservation at all. They're too late.

 

[SaintsManiac]

As others have said, who wouldn't just go to Google and type "Disney World trip?" I mean that's what I did in 2009 for my first trip in many years. That's what I did in 2014 when I was planning a trip after 6 years of not going. Who doesn't do a simple, first few results Google search on ANY vacation? If you don't then you're setting yourself up for failure.

 

[Hoodie]

I'm a planner for everything, not just Disney so it doesn't bother me. And despite all the planning websites, MDE, Disney's site, etc. every trip I STILL hear someone comment about paying for fastpasses.

 

[SaintsManiac]

Agreeing with PPs. I'm definitely in the camp that if you are spending thousands on a vacation, a quick google search about the place you're going to would behoove you. And I'd venture to say that a lot of these people who didn't bother to do that would have even gotten a kick out of the researching and planning aspect of it, because that's some of the fun of it!

I'd also ask what if these people were vacationing in Myrtle Beach - would they at least check to be sure their hotel was on the beach? Would they research other things to do in the area besides the beach? Quite possibly, so Disney should be no different.

I do sympathize with people who decide now that they want to go to Disney in July. They are behind the eight ball in ADR bookings and maybe even resort availability as well. They think they are planning in advance and for some, this might be how/when they can plan vacations. I'm sure there are people who decide on 5 months or less notice that they want to visit WDW, start to do some research, and then realize ADRs open at 180 DAYS and they never stood a chance of getting a Be Our Guest reservation at all. They're too late.

It's really not true that you need to do ADRs at 180 to get what you want. If it isn't PPO, CRT or maybe BOG dinner it's quite possible to get ADRs. I saw so many openings the night before during Thanksgiving week.

I book at 180, because it's usually fun (MDE issues aside) and I am very particular about times. Someone planning 4 months in advance probably doesn't care about specifics.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

It's really not true that you need to do ADRs at 180 to get what you want. If it isn't PPO, CRT or maybe BOG dinner it's quite possible to get ADRs. I saw so many openings the night before during Thanksgiving week.

I book at 180, because it's usually fun (MDE issues aside) and I am very particular about times. Someone planning 4 months in advance probably doesn't care about specifics.

I've even seen people say they've gotten BOG a day or two before they went to MK.

I think my basic thought is know that if you want a sit-down place it will require a reservation--that to me is unique as vast majority of places I go to eat don't and other theme or amusement parks likely don't either even at Universal it's not the same as WDW. The other component is knowing that you can book 180 days in advance-whether we all agree with that long window or not--it's just knowing that you can book starting 180 days from your trip. That's important because if you book under 6 months in advance then you know you can immediately being booking ADRs should you choose to. Whether the restaurant is available or not for the exact date or time that you want isn't something an outsider can help with but at least knowing you needed to reserve vs walk up in order to eat there is important.

 

[nkereina]

It's really not true that you need to do ADRs at 180 to get what you want. If it isn't PPO, CRT or maybe BOG dinner it's quite possible to get ADRs. I saw so many openings the night before during Thanksgiving week.

I book at 180, because it's usually fun (MDE issues aside) and I am very particular about times. Someone planning 4 months in advance probably doesn't care about specifics.

I never said you NEED to book at 180 days. Going with my example, someone traveling in peak season July wanting a hard to get ADR like BOG - there's a good chance they are out of luck if they try to book well after the 180 day mark. My point was that everyone starts somewhere, even the uber planners, so I do feel for the people who think they are planning and are just late to the game. For instance, I have a friend who is a planner and researcher and decided a few weeks ago to make her first visit to Disney in August while in town for a wedding. She was bummed to learn that planning 5 months out is actually late by Disney standards and couldn't get the BOG reservation she wanted. She'll continue to check every day, but she never would have guess she was actually starting planning late rather than early.

Just because someone makes the decision to travel to WDW 4-5 months in advance, it doesn't mean they don't care about specifics. Perhaps they couldn't make any plans or arrangements until work and school schedules were in place. Perhaps they didn't know what their budget would be. There's a whole host of reasons.

And FWIW, there were likely ADR openings the night before during Thanksgiving week because that's when people who are there need to cancel by. You have to cancel by midnight the night before your ADR. So its a great time to check for an opening the next day.