Direct Purchase benefits announced!

[TyGuy]

If VGC is full, resale buyers (after 3/20) simply won't be able to book at DL on points. Same is true of Walt Disney World, even though there are more destinations available. Currently members can choose to bite the proverbial bullet and spend points on a Moderate, Poly or Grand Flo if all of the DVCs are full. It does happen. Going forward that won't be an option for impacted resale buyers.[/QUOTE]

We did this on our last trip. We couldn't get the full week at BWV and BCV wasn't available either. We ended up booking our last three nights at YC because we wanted to stay in the Epcot area. I like having the option to book into one of the traditional hotels without the hassle of renting and paying cash. Our initial 160 points and our 50 point add on were direct and I will probably go direct again when I'm ready to add on.

Ty

 

[Corwin]

just the way we see it.

we think it's a positive measure & hoping more to come. now
that's based on the main reasons we purchased. [ we didn't buy
to sale or to start a point-renting business.].

what we like to see in the future....resales only be able to book outside
their home resorts a week later than owners. [ many here posted
they never stay @ ssr, just to get low cost points and to book
else where. way too many, that it no longer easy for regular owners
that just want to try out the other resorts. ] referring to the
7-mos. period.

also if they restrict the renting of points from resales, just for their
home resorts. then that would opened up more rooms for regular/
disney purchases instead of these renters. and that too will
make those owners @ the more desirable/expensive resorts to
rent @ higher prices.

we just did a 2 weeks stay @ our home resort. the damages being
done is something dvc need to stop. we were shocked, the type
of "guests' that we saw. [ not family types, for sure.] fyi,
i asked some if they were dvc memebers, & no surprise when
they said no. if we wanted "animal house" , we would have
rented the moivie. blt, won't last long if this isn't stop.

also, dvc should respond to make sure dvc remains what it promised the
owners.

This is a remarkably short-sighted point of view (not to mention remarkably poorly written).

You keep distinguishing between so-called "owners" and "resales." Everyone who purchases a DVC timeshare interest, whether directly from DVC, or on the resale market, is an "owner." We all pay the same dues, you know.

Realize that the only way you can have a resale owner in the first place is because they bought the ownership interest of some direct purchaser.

Anyway, you want to penalize the SSR owners who bought "low-cost points" to stay at other resorts, but see no problem with so-called "regular owners" (presumably direct-purchase owners) doing the exact same thing, except that you characterize it as "just want[ing] to try out the other resorts."

Then you want resale purchasers to no longer be able to rent out points at other resorts. How do you propose to enforce this, unless by prohibiting resale purchasers from staying at other resorts entirely? Realize that if this restriction is put into place, you will just make it that much harder for people to get a reservation at that person's home resort.

For example, I purchased my membership at VWL via resale. If DVC ever tried to prevent me from staying at other resorts, it would make it that much harder for me to get a reservation during the times available for us to vacation, so to avoid losing my points I would be forced to rent out a reservation at VWL, instead of staying somewhere else. This would make it that much more difficult for you to ever use your points for a stay at VWL. Don't you realize that all these changes you are demanding can hurt you, too?

Finally, I've never heard of any particular difference between renters and owners on potential damage to the units.

 

[CALIFLADY]

Some clarification...

For the speculation about "Disney dragging their feet for the next two months and not moving on ROFR decisions".

I have a resale in progress via The Timeshare Store right now. ROFR was sent to Disney on 14 January (last Friday). I just spoke with TTS and they said Disney has told them, so long as the ROFR paperwork is with Disney by 20 March 2011, you're on the grandfathered side. You don't need to close by then or have your deed registered by OCC by then or have your points in the system by then, etc. Disney just needs to have the ROFR request on their desk. And this makes sense. Some people have resales that can't close until June or July 2011 because of seller's upcoming reservations. But Disney will honor all of these.

So actually, everyone has about two months to decide if they want to buy resale and stay on the grandfathered side of things.

 

[drusba]

We are not impacted in our personal use. We have never even used the Disney collections. Holwever, this new policy does harm to all owners. Everyone faces the possiblity of selling their interest in the future. In doing so, sellers will now have to reveal that resale buyers cannot use the Disney collections. That can have an impact on market value. The problem I see with this is that this change is a take away of benefits that does injury to all owners by impactimg on their ability to resell and that it proves beyond any doubt that DVD will maliciously act in its own interests and against the interests of all owners when it thinks something is impacting its sales of new units. In other words, it proves, in fact, that DVD really does not care about owners.

 

[Sid74]

DH and I were just starting to look into an add on. I had shown him the resale listings, and we were seriously considering which resort to add to our OKW direct sale points. Then this announcement was made.

We are in the UK, so sometimes it is not possible to get to WDW as often as we would like. We have used expiring banked points at Disneyland Paris twice in the last couple of years. This announcement means we would be unable to do that in future, if we needed, or wanted to.

I understand that using our points for Disneyland Paris is considered a bad decision, but we love it there and we joined DVC to prepay our holidays, so why shouldn't we be able to use our points there? We were also planning a trip to Disneyland to stay at the GCV.

I understand that we can still use our OKW points for these trips, but we wanted to add on to enable us to stay longer, or in larger accomodation.

DH is now talking about adding on through Disney, so I suppose the new announcement worked in their favour in our situation.

It does make me wonder what is next.

 

[tjkraz]

Some clarification...

For the speculation about "Disney dragging their feet for the next two months and not moving on ROFR decisions".

I have a resale in progress via The Timeshare Store right now. ROFR was sent to Disney on 14 January (last Friday). I just spoke with TTS and they said Disney has told them, so long as the ROFR paperwork is with Disney by 20 March 2011, you're on the grandfathered side. You don't need to close by then or have your deed registered by OCC by then or have your points in the system by then, etc. Disney just needs to have the ROFR request on their desk. And this makes sense. Some people have resales that can't close until June or July 2011 because of seller's upcoming reservations. But Disney will honor all of these.

So actually, everyone has about two months to decide if they want to buy resale and stay on the grandfathered side of things.

I also asked this question and was specifically told that contracts must CLOSE by the 20th in order to qualify. Not saying that you are wrong but obviously we got two different answers. IMO anyone reading this who is considering buying in the next few weeks would be wise to get something in writing from DVC clarifying their position if this is a deal-breaker.

 

[CaptHomer]

After the deadline, the resale prices will definitely go down. If you only stay in DVC locations it will be better for you, but they would be the only ones benefiting other than DVC sales people.

 

[GoofItUp]

I also asked this question and was specifically told that contracts must CLOSE by the 20th in order to qualify. Not saying that you are wrong but obviously we got two different answers. IMO anyone reading this who is considering buying in the next few weeks would be wise to get something in writing from DVC clarifying their position if this is a deal-breaker.

A seller accepted my offer on a resale contract yesterday. I got the e-mail about this change and the acceptance e-mail at the same time! The agent I'm working with sent me an e-mail this morning stating that Disney sent an e-mail to her saying it just had to be to ROFR by 3/20. Here's an excerpt from the Disney e-mail:

The changes will affect resale contracts only, any contract submitted on or before March 20, 2011 will not be subject to the changes.
I think there was some confusion or mis-information, so Disney clarified this today.

 

[johde]

I don't like the idea of "second class" ownership for resale purchasers. I think Disney is doing it more for it's benefit than our benefit. That being said, it doesn't surprise me.

If you look at what's being eliminated, it is the options where Disney gets the point then turns around and rents those units to the general public. Over the long run, this will lead to fewer points being used for Disney Collection, Cruises, etc. Which in turn would be fewer points for Disney to need to rent out.

RCI on the other hand is an exchange between members of DVC and members of a different timeshare. Disney is only acting as an intermediary between the owner and RCI. RCI is doing most of the work. I also wonder if RCI's contract with DVC grants membership to all owners and until the contract comes up for renewal they can't make changes to it.

 

[Y-ASK]

This is a remarkably short-sighted point of view (not to mention remarkably poorly written).

Very well written but I will refrain from responding to the poster you are referenceing for fear of writing something that would put me in the timeout chair.


Y-ASK

 

[crisi]

Of course they are doing it for their own benefit and of course they will act in their own interests. As a Disney shareholder, I expect no less from them. As an owner, its nice when our interests dovetail and they can keep both me the shareholder happy and me the DVC owner happy - but that won't always be possible. And their fiduciary obligation is to their shareholders, not to DVC owners.

 

[dizfan]

RCI on the other hand is an exchange between members of DVC and members of a different timeshare. Disney is only acting as an intermediary between the owner and RCI. RCI is doing most of the work. I also wonder if RCI's contract with DVC grants membership to all owners and until the contract comes up for renewal they can't make changes to it.

If there are fewer DVC points that can be traded to RCI, wouldn't it make it more difficult for RCI owners to trade into DVC?

Perhaps DVC believes people have been buying RCI and trading into DVC instead of buying DVC?

 

[Y-ASK]

I don't like the idea of "second class" ownership for resale purchasers. I think Disney is doing it more for it's benefit than our benefit. That being said, it doesn't surprise me.

It's very similar to what Marriott did quite a few years ago. If you bought resale they took away the ability to trade your timeshare week in for Marriott points that could be used at regular Marriott hotels.

They recently made an even bigger move last summer when they introduced a points system for new Marriott developer purchases. But unlike Disney, Marriott made the cutoff for resale owners being able to join their new points club the day or week the annoucement was made. If you hadn't closed right at the moment you were locked out of joining the system. Again making the resale purchaser a "second class" owners. At least Disney has given everyone who wants to buy resale a couple of months to complete thier purchase.

As many have stated Disney is now just another timeshare developer. No different than Marriott or Sheraton or Diamond Resorts. This was the one thing that made Disney different from all other timeshare Developers, all members/owners were the same whether they purchased direct or resale and were treated as such.


Y-ASK

 

[Deb & Bill]

If there are fewer DVC points that can be traded to RCI, wouldn't it make it more difficult for RCI owners to trade into DVC?

Perhaps DVC believes people have been buying RCI and trading into DVC instead of buying DVC?

DVC owners have to trade out to RCI in order for there to be availability in DVC (unless DVC is turning over lots of unsold inventory to RCI).

This new deal doesn't affect RCI trades at all. Just Disney Collection - non-DVC WDW resorts, non-DVC DL resorts, DCL, ABD, etc.

 

[mickey&minniealways]

They stated that this is a direct result of what current dvc members wanted to see. I am wondering how many they actually polled and got this feedback from. Did they hand pick a group of 20? It seems that most don't like the idea. Yet Disney states that they are just giving dvc members what they asked for.

 

[Deb & Bill]

They stated that this is a direct result of what current dvc members wanted to see. I am wondering how many they actually polled and got this feedback from. Did they hand pick a group of 20? It seems that most don't like the idea. Yet Disney states that they are just giving dvc members what they asked for.

You are a newer member, correct? We get that same statement each and everytime there is a change. Whether or not it's true.

 

[marynvince]

I initially purchased direct without knowing how to buy in the resale market and about the potential cost savings. Also received the "loaded" points contract and a couple of free annual passes. Purchased with the intent on staying predominately at DVC but was swayed by the 500 other places. Was also attracted by the notion that one could sell and not take a beating on price relative to many other timeshares.

I subsequently learned of the timeshare store and the values to be had regarding resale. Initial buyin at SSR 225, recent add-on at HHI of 220. The thinking here is that when kids are off on their own and family vacations are less frequent, we can gang up the points and try the adventures by disney. I am glad that i am getting in just in time to be able to do that with my points. Bought HHI because it is drivable and we really like it there abnd wanted the 11 month booking window.

This recent move diminishes both the value of resales and the value of direct purchase in my opinion.

 

[LouisianaDisneyFan]

They stated that this is a direct result of what current dvc members wanted to see. I am wondering how many they actually polled and got this feedback from. Did they hand pick a group of 20? It seems that most don't like the idea. Yet Disney states that they are just giving dvc members what they asked for.

The problem here is that most folks do not write to Member Satisfaction unless they are unhappy about something. Let's face it... we all know there are some members who bought cheap points at a resort where they never intend to stay simply so they would have the points to book elsewhere at a lower overall cost. Consumers are self-serving just like Disney. I have no idea how many of these folks are using the points to trade in to Concierge or any of the other programs affected by these changes. But, if enough direct-purchase owners write in to MS saying they can no longer get the bookings they want because folks with cheap points have grabbed up the space (whether it's true or not), it will appear to Disney that direct purchase owners are unhappy with the current situation. Why? Because it's pretty unlikely that many direct purchase members have been writing in to MS saying "We love the DVC exchange programs just like they are!" As I said... most folks do not write unless something is wrong.

I'm not saying Disney is some benevolent entity that's really out to give us all warm fuzzies 24/7.; they are a for-profit business. But, I am still naive enough to hope they didn't outright lie.

 

[psac]

They stated that this is a direct result of what current dvc members wanted to see. I am wondering how many they actually polled and got this feedback from. Did they hand pick a group of 20? It seems that most don't like the idea. Yet Disney states that they are just giving dvc members what they asked for.

Agreed that most feedback they hear would be complaints. It would probably behoove people to complain now about this if they do feel it is negative, just so at least these complaints are logged.

In terms of members asking for this, I'm sure those that had would really be those who bought direct and felt bad (cheated?) afterwards that they didn't know about the resale market, or at a time the resale market didn't exist or wasn't as robust as it is today.

The exception may be those hit by the cruise moratorium. In that case, if there really is a capacity issue, maybe this does make sense.

Our resale just closed today (woo hoo!), so even though we don't plan on using any of these perks, it is nice to be grandfathered, just in case.

PS -- does anyone think if the resale market really starts to tank and more people end up buying resale because of lower costs (opposite effect of what might be intended), that Disney might revoke this change?

 

[childsplay]

PS -- does anyone think if the resale market really starts to tank and more people end up buying resale because of lower costs (opposite effect of what might be intended), that Disney might revoke this change?

It's possible that the lower resale prices go the more ROFR's Disney will exercise.

Also, I would add that if this new policy does not produce the intended effect (driving sales to Disney) it is more likely that Disney would tighten the vice further, as oppossed to retreating. Meaning that if this new policy doesn't swing prospective buyers from resales to Disney maybe Disney's next move is to not allow resales to book anywhere other than home resort, and so on, until they have achieved the desired effect.