DD wants a purity ring

[luvsJack]

Actually it was 12 and 13 year olds but we don't need to split hairs. And again, you are taking what was said all to personally. If you know your 12/13 year old has no opportunities to experiement because you know exactly where she is, and what she is doing then great. I would bet that the vast majority of parents of kids that age aren't supervising their children 24/7 and those kids, if they wanted to, would have opportunities to fool around. Does that mean they all do, of course not. Does that mean that your dd does, of course not. But, if you don't think there is opportunity for that age group to experiment then yes, you are naïve in your thinking.

I think (could be wrong) that the difference of opinion here is that when you say the kids have the "opportunity" to fool around, maybe some are taking that to mean they DO fool around?

I do get what you mean, now. And sure dd would have that opportunity if she wanted to take it. And she would have a year or two ago. They go to the mall, to the skating rink and to the movies all the time. While there is some supervision, its not 100% so sure the opportunity is there.

I am going to guess and say this is why someone thought that an 11 year old needed to hear that message--before the opportunity presented itself.

 

[luvmy3]

I think (could be wrong) that the difference of opinion here is that when you say the kids have the "opportunity" to fool around, maybe some are taking that to mean they DO fool around?

I do get what you mean, now. And sure dd would have that opportunity if she wanted to take it. And she would have a year or two ago. They go to the mall, to the skating rink and to the movies all the time. While there is some supervision, its not 100% so sure the opportunity is there.

I am going to guess and say this is why someone thought that an 11 year old needed to hear that message--before the opportunity presented itself.

All I know is that "argument" started when a pp asked where 12/13 year olds would be experimenting, and thought that it just doesn't happen where she is because they are always being transported somewhere by their parent.

 

[Momvic5]

Actually it was 12 and 13 year olds but we don't need to split hairs. And again, you are taking what was said all to personally. If you know your 12/13 year old has no opportunities to experiement because you know exactly where she is, and what she is doing then great. I would bet that the vast majority of parents of kids that age aren't supervising their children 24/7 and those kids, if they wanted to, would have opportunities to fool around. Does that mean they all do, of course not. Does that mean that your dd does, of course not. But, if you don't think there is opportunity for that age group to experiment then yes, you are naïve in your thinking.

I am not taking anythig personally. I did not post anything regarding those thoughts. I was just giving EMHDad the general idea of the conclusions reached concerning his question. Pre-teens have opportunities to fool around. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[luvmy3]

I am not taking anythig personally. I did not post anything regarding those thoughts. I was just giving EMHDad the general idea of the conclusions reached concerning his question. Pre-teens have opportunities to fool around. Nothing more, nothing less.

I apologize then, to me the bolded sounds as if you took it personally.

Go back about 5-6 pages....basically it is argued that - we are naive if we do not think that our pre-teens do not have many opportunities to experiment in sexual activities.

 

[Momvic5]

I apologize then, to me the bolded sounds as if you took it personally.

Not sure how it sounds personal....was my conclusion wrong?

 

[chobie]

I am not taking anythig personally. I did not post anything regarding those thoughts. I was just giving EMHDad the general idea of the conclusions reached concerning his question. Pre-teens have opportunities to fool around. Nothing more, nothing less.

It seemed like you were trying to say that some of us are ok with 11year olds having sex,but not ok with them abstaining until marriage.

I don't think anyone is ok with kids that young having sex, but we acknowledge that some kids will be experimenting at the age.

I don't think anyone said there is something wrong with a person choosing to abstain, but some us believe these purity rings and rituals are forcing kids to make a personal decision in which they are too young to fully understand it, thereby setting them up to feel "impure," later on.

And many of us do not like people's "pureness" being based on whether they have sex or not

And not everyone thinks that waiting to be married to have sex is the best decision, but merely one's personal choice.

 

[luvmy3]

Not sure how it sounds personal....was my conclusion wrong?

If you are speaking in a general sense, as in a collective "we" and a collective "our", then no your conclusion is not wrong. Although I'm not sure I'd say "many" opportunities, but opportunities none the less. Oh, and also that 13 is no longer a pre-teen.

 

[Momvic5]

It seemed like you were trying to say that some of us are ok with 11year olds having sex,but not ok with them abstaining until marriage.

I don't think anyone is ok with kids that young having sex, but we acknowledge that some kids will be experimenting at the age.

I don't think anyone said there is something wrong with a person choosing to abstain, but some us believe these purity rings and rituals are forcing kids to make a personal decision in which they are too young to fully understand it, thereby setting them up to feel "impure," later on.

And many of us do not like people's "pureness" being based on whether they have sex or not

And not everyone thinks that waiting to be married to have sex is the best decision, but merely one's personal choice.

In the end, the general conclusion is still the same.

Too young for purity rings but not too young for sex.

 

[luvmy3]

In the end, the general conclusion is still the same.

Too young for purity rings but not too young for sex.

Who said it was okay for them to be having sex at that age, because I must have missed that here.

 

[chobie]

Who said it was okay for them to be having sex at that age, because I must have missed that here.

You didn't miss it. It didn't happen.

 

[Momvic5]

If you are speaking in a general sense, as in a collective "we" and a collective "our", then no your conclusion is not wrong. Although I'm not sure I'd say "many" opportunities, but opportunities none the less. Oh, and also that 13 is no longer a pre-teen.

My turn to apologize - I did not think to indicate that I was speaking in the general sense.

 

[Momvic5]

Who said it was okay for them to be having sex at that age, because I must have missed that here.

Live Birth charts for 10-14 year olds were posted.

 

[luvsJack]

All I know is that "argument" started when a pp asked where 12/13 year olds would be experimenting, and thought that it just doesn't happen where she is because they are always being transported somewhere by their parent.

Yeah, and I "kinda" see where they are coming from because that was my first thought too. And then I really thought about where dd goes or doesn't go. And while I do transport her most anywhere she goes, I don't stay there with her and I didn't at 12/13. So, imho, you are correct in that the opportunity is probably there for most kids and I think, parents do need to be aware of that and not assume that because they think they are with them all the time that nothing could ever happen. That would be as naive as thinking just putting a ring on someone's finger is going to keep them from having sex.

 

[chobie]

Live Birth charts for 10-14 year olds were posted.

But who said that was ok?

 

[Momvic5]

But who said that was ok?

Where did I say that someone said it was ok? I just gave a poster the general conclusions of this thread.

 

[luvmy3]

Live Birth charts for 10-14 year olds were posted.

I think the pp was just acknowledging that kids that age do have sex, which is true. However I think we all can agree that they are still too young to understand the complexity of a sexual relationship and even though they are physically doing the act, they are hardly ready for it. In the same way they are too young at 11 to understand the complexity of a promise of "purity" and waiting until marriage.
I cant speak for them, just sharing how I am taking what has been said here. I'm more of a non supporter of purity rings for any age kid/teen.

Yeah, and I "kinda" see where they are coming from because that was my first thought too. And then I really thought about where dd goes or doesn't go. And while I do transport her most anywhere she goes, I don't stay there with her and I didn't at 12/13. So, imho, you are correct in that the opportunity is probably there for most kids and I think, parents do need to be aware of that and not assume that because they think they are with them all the time that nothing could ever happen. That would be as naive as thinking just putting a ring on someone's finger is going to keep them from having sex.

I just hope parents who don't think its happening in their town don't find their own child is unable to handle the pressure because they weren't prepared for what might be happening out there.

 

[chobie]

Where did I say that someone said it was ok? I just gave a poster the general conclusions of this thread.

Yes, but if one were not to have read through all comments one might conclude that the consensus is people think 11 is too young for a purity ring but not too young to have sex. That is a false equivalency; just because we acknowledge some kids are experimenting at the age, doesn't mean we don't think that is too young to have sex.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

In the end, the general conclusion is still the same.

Too young for purity rings but not too young for sex.

Are we forgetting the research that shows that many parents seem to think their kid is "all set" once the ring goes on, and therefore don't worry much about it anymore? That these are the same kids who are less protected than others against pregnancy and STIs? That they themselves have SAID they take them off when they want to have sex?

Or the FACT that in the past decade or so, more children are having oral and other types of sex THINKING IT ISN'T SEX, or doing it that way in order to keeps their pledge of "virginity" alive? And that this is, in part, why pregnancy rates have gone down?

People (who may not have read this thread from the beginning) want to make this a simple issue, and it's simply not a simple issue.

 

[Momvic5]

Yes, but if one were not to have read through all comments one might conclude that the consensus is people think 11 is too young for a purity ring but not too young to have sex. That is a false equivalency; just because we acknowledge some kids are experimenting at the age, doesn't mean we don't think that is too young to have sex.

If one read through all of the comments they would see who and what was being addressed through each post and the splitting of hairs of who and what is being replied to would be more clear. Throughout this thread, it has been discussed that pre-teens (general sense) are too young to make decisions concerning their future sexual activities/relationships. I agree...However, it eventually turned into our preteens have opportunities and could be having sex so we (general sense) should not be naive. Birth charts and kissing games were posted to support the discussion. It is harsh, but the general conclusion we reached is ...preteens are too young to understand purity rings, but they are not too young to experiment in sexual activities.

 

[chobie]

If one read through all of the comments they would see who and what was being addressed through each post and the splitting of hairs of who and what is being replied to would be more clear. Throughout this thread, it has been discussed that pre-teens (general sense) are too young to make decisions concerning their future sexual activities/relationships. I agree...However, it eventually turned into our preteens have opportunities and could be having sex so we (general sense) should not be naive. Birth charts and kissing games were posted to support the discussion. It is harsh, but the general conclusion we reached is ...preteens are too young to understand purity rings, but they are not too young to experiment in sexual activities.

Again, you are making it seem like people think its ok for preteens to have sex. We don't, we all think they are too young for sex and for purity rings. Acknowledging it happens is not sayong we think its ok. We no more think its ok for them to choose to have sex than we think its ok for them to make a longtime commitment to not having sex.

Either way preteenage is too young to make decisions about sex.

There was no general consensus that 11 years old was old enough to have sex, not one person said that.

That kids are having sex at young ages is not an opinion, it's a fact. That kids are too young to have sex at 12 and/or too young for a purity ring is an opinion.