Davids DVC: Rental reimbursement or rescheduling?

[YourEveryDayAdam]

deleted

 

[Sandisw]

I am in a similar situation (mid-May reservation and also having reached out to renter offering to reschedule but they don't want to travel in next 12 months and already cancelled air, dining plan, etc.) In my case, half my points are banked points expiring this Aug. and half are current UY points that can still be salvaged if I bank by April 30. I am leaning towards cancelling my reservation rather than waiting for Disney to do so so that I don't miss the banking deadline. I would be returning my 70% to David's. I realize I am breaching in this scenario but I am also returning the money. The renter is super nice and we have exchanged multiple texts so I am pretty she won't come after me, in fact she indicated she would love to rent directly from me in the future once her family feels safe to travel again, so any other risk I need to worry about?

Well, if you do the canceling, the renter is entitled to a refund, not a voucher,

If you are returning the money, Davids could still try to go after you for other things, but given the time sensitive matter of your banking window, I’d probably risk it. I would include that in the email as well that you decided you needed to mitigate your losses and are returning the money.

 

[YourEveryDayAdam]

deleted

 

[tubtruck]

Maybe David will end up on Judge Judy.

 

[Amymouse13]

Hmm I'm waiting for the commercial on TV... Were you a dvc owner who was not paid by David's? Were you a renter who got nothing? Call the so and so law firm today. We are pursuing a class action suit... Lol

(This isn't real... Yet??)

 

[Grumpy by Birth]

Hmm I'm waiting for the commercial on TV... Were you a dvc owner who was not paid by David's? Were you a renter who got nothing? Call the so and so law firm today. We are pursuing a class action suit... Lol

(This isn't real... Yet??)

Dewey, Cheatem, and Howe.

 

[Dracula]

I am in a similar situation (mid-May reservation and also having reached out to renter offering to reschedule but they don't want to travel in next 12 months and already cancelled air, dining plan, etc.) In my case, half my points are banked points expiring this Aug. and half are current UY points that can still be salvaged if I bank by April 30. I am leaning towards cancelling my reservation rather than waiting for Disney to do so so that I don't miss the banking deadline. I would be returning my 70% to David's. I realize I am breaching in this scenario but I am also returning the money. The renter is super nice and we have exchanged multiple texts so I am pretty she won't come after me, in fact she indicated she would love to rent directly from me in the future once her family feels safe to travel again, so any other risk I need to worry about?

The renter may not be able to come after you if she tells you to cancel, but once you cancel she would have a very strong case to go after David with a credit card chargeback, and David would likewise have a very strong case to go after you for whatever other losses he incurred as part of the chargeback alleging you breached his contract.
It would be better to get David onboard with this plan as well, and sign a 3-way amendment to the contract outlining the new plan, and who pays back what money to whom.
On the other hand, if you wait there is still a chance the resorts would open mid-May and you would collect the remainder of 30%.

 

[cmrdgrs]

Hmm I'm waiting for the commercial on TV... Were you a dvc owner who was not paid by David's? Were you a renter who got nothing? Call the so and so law firm today. We are pursuing a class action suit... Lol

(This isn't real... Yet??)

I say it's time to hire Saul Goodman. He'll do a bang-up job for sure! But, there is always Hamlin, Hamlin & McGill.

 

[izzy]

Hmm I'm waiting for the commercial on TV... Were you a dvc owner who was not paid by David's? Were you a renter who got nothing? Call the so and so law firm today. We are pursuing a class action suit... Lol

(This isn't real... Yet??)

Morgan and Morgan. For the people.

Couldn’t resist. I get so tired of their commercials on the Orlando tv stations!

 

[Grumpy by Birth]

(insert first name here) "The Hammer" (insert last name here)

 

[LAX]

I feel the same. I prefer to use a broker and I haven't seen anything yet which makes me think any of the others are better.

I don't rent on a regular basis, so I prefer using a broker, too. Plus, I thought the commission I would be paying provides the peace of mind (evidently not the case with David's). However, I have read at least one other broker that keeps paying the owners (the residual percentage at check-in date) through the closure. I am not sure what that broker has been doing for impacted renters, though. From an owner's perspective, that's a broker I would be more interested in working with in the future if I decide not to take on the risk myself. If I have to worry about some rare events (one in a lifetime perhaps) happening 11 months after I rent out my points, that's no more useful than trying to figure out how I can use instead lose them.

LAX

 

[cmrdgrs]

I don't rent on a regular basis, so I prefer using a broker, too. Plus, I thought the commission I would be paying provides the peace of mind (evidently not the case with David's). However, I have read at least one other broker that keeps paying the owners (the residual percentage at check-in date) through the closure. I am not sure what that broker has been doing for impacted renters, though. From an owner's perspective, that's a broker I would be more interested in working with in the future if I decide not to take on the risk myself. If I have to worry about some rare events (one in a lifetime perhaps) happening 11 months after I rent out my points, that's no more useful than trying to figure out how I can use instead lose them.

LAX

I'm sure we would all like to know which broker that is. I have not heard this reported from any of the brokers.

 

[mustinjourney]

Thank you! I enjoy writing them. Any hypothetical cases are DEFINITELY going to be decided on many facts. Many I likely can't even imagine. I don't think it would necessarily come down to how many times an owner has rented. Here's why I think that:

From David's agreement between the DVC owner and David's:


This basically says that everyone is responsible for knowing HOW DVC works. No one can claim ignorance.

I do have another legal theory that I might write up later about this particular clause in David's contract that might shift more responsibility between David's and DVC owners towards David's. I do admit, it's a long shot and not likely...which is why I haven't written it up yet. It's far more likely a court would just declare the contract to be frustrated/impossible and void the whole thing.

im sorry. But you have admitted you have zero legal training.

Even if you were a law student I would tell you to be careful bc there are rules about unauthorized practice of law. Researching on Wikipedia is not legal research.

you keep talking about how you’re not giving legal advice, yet you keep making opinions where you declare what is or isn’t legal.

The topic at hand is very complex. You have international laws, contract disputes, timeshare laws, state laws, choice of venue, choice of law, collections, escrow laws, General contract interpretations, etc. just to name a few issues.

This is not something an armchair lawyer that reads a few wiki articles should be pontificating on what is and isn’t legal OR guesstimating how a court would rule.

 

[LAX]

I'm sure we would all like to know which broker that is. I have not heard this reported from any of the brokers.

Admittedly, it was based on a post in one of the threads, so I am not even sure if it's an isolated case or "standard" practice at that particular broker. Unfortunately, I can't remember which thread it was to find out which broker that might be.

LAX

 

[DisneyBB]

Why is a David going after some to get the 70% back with a ‘lawyer’ type letter. While others are keeping theirs? Some with distressed points are still being asked to return the money. If in an email he said the 70% can be kept for distressed points. Is that an agreement that would stand up?

 

[McCrae]

Why is a David going after some to get the 70% back with a ‘lawyer’ type letter. While others are keeping theirs? Some with distressed points are still being asked to return the money. If in an email he said the 70% can be kept for distressed points. Is that an agreement that would stand up?

In my emails from David’s they state they will keep the 30% due to me on Check in date to be used to compensate my renter. I would only get this 30% back if I agreed to re-rent my points. They have accepted I can keep the 70% already paid. My points are not distressed.

 

[LawrenceFamily]

it's all relative though. If you had 500 ressies at 200 points for one month -- then presumably you have been doing that same business for quite some time. If so -- you SHOULD have a significant savings to weather this storm.

500 reservations at 200 points at $20 per point yields $2million in cash coming in. $4.5 per point goes towards his operating revenue ($450k), and $14.5 per point goes to the owners (70% now and 30% SHOULD be in an escrow account of some sort) -- So $14.5*200*500*.7 is $1.015 million to owners and $435k to his escrow account.

Maybe I'm crazy -- but I would think that a company with this type of revenue would want to keep at least 3 or 4 million in the bank as a rainy day fund.

And let's not forget he also should have money coming in from his travel agent side as well.

Notwithstanding the above -- the actions currently being taken are incredibly short sighted. He's managed to completely alienate his suppliers (owners) and piss off the buyers. Even if he can get past the closings -- I'm not sure he's going to make it long term. And it certainly won't be at the same level he was previously at.

Yes of course, this makes sense based on the assumption that he has 500 bookings every month at 200 points, retaining $4.50 per point. But I just threw that figure out there because I literally have no idea. Even on those numbers though at $450k a month, that's gross margin, not profit. You're not taking into account costs to the business.

With 30 staff, they'd have significant overheads such as salaries, rent, advertising, phones, systems, website, tax etc, so my point was more.....has David got millions of dollars sat in a business bank account ready to pay out all of the renters who want their money back? My guess would be no, because they are not big enough to have that amount of retained earnings after tax sat in a bank 'ready for a rainy day'.

 

[DisneyBB]

In my emails from David’s they state they will keep the 30% due to me on Check in date to be used to compensate my renter. I would only get this 30% back if I agreed to re-rent my points. They have accepted I can keep the 70% already paid. My points are not distressed.

That's good to know but I am sure I have seen posts where owners are asked to return the 70% as well.

 

[Maddiesmum03]

That's good to know but I am sure I have seen posts where owners are asked to return the 70% as well.

David's cannot expect to have the money returned and use of the points as well.....talk about double dipping!!!!

 

[DisneyBB]

David's cannot expect to have the money returned and use of the points as well.....talk about double dipping!!!!

I see sorry I phrased that badly. I meant if the points were distressed he was still asking for the money back in some posts. I may have read it wrong though. In my case if I wait for Disney the points are distressed and I can no longer use them. But will he argue I can put them in RCI? If not distressed then you are right he either re-rents or gets them money back.