DAS changes coming WDW May 20/ DL June 18, 2024

[ClaraOswald]

I’m just curious, at what age was your son able to forgo the wagon? His autism sounds more profound than my son since he doesn’t talk. Mine just doesn’t have the core strength to walk far. And likes to block out sensory in a stroller, usually on a device.

Also, has anyone ever suggested he use an AAC or does he?
They’re trying to get my youngest one. No ASD but palate issue and hard to understand.

My son does have an AAC device (Wego7 with Proloquo 2 go on it) but he isn't a huge fan of it. He can respond to some questions, thankfully. And we've come to understand his core needs fairly well. As for a stroller, he actually stopped wanting to use a stroller by age 5. I remember bringing it to Disneyland when he was 5 and he refused to sit in it at all. We just pushed an empty stroller the whole time. So we never needed a wagon or a special needs stroller for him. (Though I have several friends who use both for their large kids.) Sensory issues are difficult because he doesn't like to wear noise cancelling headphones. He'll usually just cover his ears and make sounds to try to block things out.

 

[Gentry2004]

It's too much accommodation for people who are still able to wait in lines, whether with or without any other accommodations. It is reasonable for people with disabilities that make it impossible to wait in anything longer than a lightning lane length line (say that 5 times fast, it was hard to even type lol)

And it's too much when the one system they use for almost every disability (the DAS blanket) can both be accessed easily by, and is very attractive to, those that want to cheat the system to either save money or ride more rides

But the new system does nothing to change any of those problems. The system is still attractive to cheaters and requires no proof. And the LL are very unlikely to get meaningfully shorter, if at all. So congrats Disney?

 

[SueM in MN]

It's against Board rules to discuss circumventing Disney's rules thus why I said that. I can't speak to an exception Disney would make and as a Mod mentioned it would typically need to demonstrate high medical equipment needs but it's on the prohibited list so talking about bringing one when you know that isn't something I'm personally delving into.

Guests trying to sneak a wagon in without authorization for disability is against Disney policy.
Disney does have a policy/procedure for approval of wagons for disability related needs where a regular stroller won't work. Telling people about the policy is not against rules. People trying to get a wagon exemption also need to have a backup plan because many wagons are not approved, even with medical needs

We'll be there 10 days. It's a 5-5 split, though that didn't matter in the past. 5/5-15.

I agree about HIPPA as it stands now. I said fine line, because if the "potty pass" is going to be for people with IBS or something similar then everyone will pretty easily be able to deduce what issue I have. This is not something I share with people (except you fine people now), and I can envision holding a card up walking back through the long line saying "I have a pass" so, hopefully, someone doesn't try to clothesline me for skipping the line. Should be great fun...

I understand why people are making assumptions about how a 'potty pass' would work, but it may not work the way people think at all. Or, it may work one way for guests who just need to leave the line unexpectedly, unrelated to disability than it will work for people with conditions/disabilities

 

[10CJ]

I am still trying to catch up, but did want to comment on a few things.

I think the idea of having a waiting area/room with bathrooms is fine. However I do not like the idea of requiring people to use it. I don't think this is what the OP was trying to say, but requiring it seems like you are forcing the disabled people out of sight so the general public does not have deal with or think about them.

Rider Switch in its current form takes time! Not sure it is a great option for a group who all can/want to ride. I was thankful for the Rider Switch option when my kids were smaller and we needed. My oldest may be gotten in some extra rides because of it. Overall though, it takes longer to tour with Rider Switch.

Is there anyone happy with the current Genie+ program? I think the fact that G+ is so bad is a big part of the problem. Many have said they were able to make FP+ work for them. When the replacement is worse and costs money, of course there are going to be issues. While I don't think you should have to pay for accommodations, I think if you are offering a paid service, there needs to be some value to it. It G+ was a better maybe demand for DAS would be less.

They can expand capacity by keeping the parks open longer. This will spread out crowds.

 

[nighttowll]

I understand the anxiety of not knowing how it's going to work, but it could be that the RS allows you to go in the LL and meet up with the rest of your party as they are about to board so that you can then ride together.

Agree, we don't yet know how anything is going to work, but that is what everyone is upset about. Disney is taking away accommodations with no clear information on how the new accommodations are going to work.

In addition, this comment was simply responding to someone who said that a person needing RS for a disability was the same as a regular guest who is using it for small children, and it really isn't because a regular guest will not need RS for every single attraction but a guest using it for a disability will.

Being separated while queuing is a relatively small amount of time in the grand scheme of things.

It's not actually. I knew it was a significant amount time, but I wasn't sure how much, so I did a quick search.

"The average wait time for a Disney World attraction is 36 minutes, while the average ride is just 8 minutes long. For each ride you want to visit, prepare to spend 82% of your time in line." - https://financebuzz.com/disney-wait-times-study

So we should just be ok with being separated for 82% of the day? And that's the average, not the time you would experince for more popular attractions which would skew that to a way higher percetage.

https://financebuzz.com/disney-wait-times-study

 

[Tatebeck]

But how can DAS be providing "too much" if Disney is still offering it as "reasonable." It can't be both "too much" and "reasonable" at the same time.

But the new system does nothing to change any of those problems. The system is still attractive to cheaters and requires no proof. And the LL are very unlikely to get meaningfully shorter, if at all. So congrats Disney?

Sorry to reply again to the first one, I was trying to think of a decent analogy!

If everyone's problem could be represented by a nail: Right now it's like they are using a sledge hammer to hammer in every nail they come across. Every person's problem is a different size and shape of nail, no 2 are the same. The big problems are big nails, and they do need the sledge hammer. Other problems are a bit smaller and could be fixed with a still heavy, but one handed hammer. Other problems are small and could be handled with a standard hammer or a small ball-pein hammer. And others are saying that they have problems, but when the hammer swings, it turns out there wasnt a nail at all. This is causing the system (the arms swinging the hammer) to fail, so they need to get rid of the fake nails, and use the appropriate hammer for each job or the swinger will collapse.

The combination of making it slightly less valuable (getting rid of preselects, increasing delays before the next selection, etc) and being more strict (approving less applications, and hopefully severely punishing fakers) will hopefully reduce the fake application rate.

If a coin flip is heads (free faster rides) and tails (normal park day) a lot of people are going to flip that coin
Now if the new coin flip is heads (slightly less additional rides than before, and you must flip 3 more heads in a row to succeed) vs tails (banned from the parks for life), hopefully a lot less fakers will want to flip that coin

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Guests trying to sneak a wagon in without authorization for disability is against Disney policy.
Disney does have a policy/procedure for approval of wagons for disability related needs where a regular stroller won't work. Telling people about the policy is not against rules. People trying to get a wagon exemption also need to have a backup plan because many wagons are not approved, even with medical needs

I agree there should be a backup plan, would be a huge disappointment to get there and it be denied without a backup.

I just didn't want to jump into a conversation about how to discuss with a CM to get authorization for a stroller wagon because only Disney can make that decision and they are the ones to be discussing it with the person and even if that person gets approved and reports back another person with the same explanation to a CM may not get approved. I agree saying that there is a process Disney has for when a stroller wagon is needed for a medical need isn't an issue but with the poster saying "I’m still trying to bring my wagon next trip." (with saying their special needs stroller didn't come in time and acknowledging that "they’re strict. Many wagons are turned away. Even, apparently, those for medical needs.") I didn't feel comfortable with the Board rules discussing that further. That was me being cautious but I appreciate you giving your comment here

 

[lowlight]

w if the new coin flip is heads (slightly less rides, and you must flip 3 more heads in a row to succeed) vs tails (banned from the parks for life), hopefully a lot less fakers will want to flip that coin

The punishment was always a permanent ban from parks, yet here we are. One thing my career has taught me is that you cannot dissuade people out of crime by listing punishments.

 

[10CJ]

That would probably be the worst way to try to catch someone, IMO.

yeah, not all lines are created equal. Just because someone can wait in a longer line for ride X does not mean they are lying when they need an accommodation for ride Y. Add in the fact that people have conditions that flare or vary in severity day to day. Sometimes you are ok to wait in a longer line, others times you are not.

 

[SueM in MN]

Our dates are 5/5-15, 5/5 split stay. We've gotten all days in the past, only the first 7 (last July) and now the four. We rarely use them, so I didn't even ask about it. Only one of the times we got actually works for what we have planned. I almost didn't sign up for any, but I was already 2.5 hours invested.

Disney started doing only 7 days of DAS Advance Selections at least a year ago, but it was not consistent. From reading about people's experiences, it seems they became much more consistent at doing no more that 7 days worth last Fall.
From what I can see, they were an administrative hassle for Disney. People didn't write about them much here, but I saw a lot of Facebook and other posts where people were angry they didn't get the ones they wanted or the times they wanted. A lot of people apparently contacted Disney multiple times to try to get 'better' ones, change their time, change their day, change the number of guests on it.
There were also a lot of misunderstandings about it. Some people thought they had to use them before getting a DAS Return Time in the park. I read quite a few Facebook posts where people said DAS was useless because they only got those 2 attractions per day - they didn't read the information on the Disney pages

I asked Disney in 2023 an got this answer:

Dear ………,

Thank you for contacting the Walt Disney World® Resort!

We are thrilled to be welcoming international Guests back to Walt Disney World® Resort. We apologize for any confusion. However, at this time, we do not offer pre-registration for the Disability Access Service (DAS) on our international website. You are welcome to register for DAS in person with a Cast Member at Guest Relations on the day of your visit.

We do not recommend using a VPN. The reason the service is not offered is due to laws put in place by countries that are not the USA that limit the kind of personal information that can be shared online.

Thank you for posting this.
I had seen other people post they received the same email when they asked about using a VPN

 

[Tatebeck]

The punishment was always a permanent ban from parks, yet here we are. One thing my career has taught me is that you cannot dissuade people out of crime by listing punishments.

If they are indeed serious about fixing the system and cleaning it up, hopefully we should see some enforcement!

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

The punishment was always a permanent ban from parks, yet here we are. One thing my career has taught me is that you cannot dissuade people out of crime by listing punishments.

I do think when I look at various news sources that line about banning has gotten a lot of attention often front and center. Even with it being part of past language most of the time people only saw someone get banned they went into an unauthorized area, climbing the pyramid in Epcot, fighting or combativeness with Disney employees or security or extreme drunken behaviors and even then for the most part that was limited to Disney fan sites less blasted out in the news.

Now the spotlight is on this DAS adjustment and suddenly there's a high focus on the language about banning and the like.

It's really only as good as Disney enforcing it and applying that to all should they actually find issues (and I hope they don't go extreme here but that they do actually put in some teeth) but I think at least at the moment the word is out about the possible consequences in a very public way.

 

[mom to minnie&mickey]

It's also a FAMILY vacation. We vacation primarily at WDW because DAS has made is feasible for us to do so. If we have to split up (likely a parent and our DAS user, and the other parent and kiddo), it's no longer a family vacation. So we would no longer find WDW a place we can easily navigate for vacation.

But Disney has said it will allow DAS user plus 3 or immediate family which I think is still very generous. But, to touch on this point that I have read often in this thread, I don't get this thinking that IF a party is separated for just the DAS rides (maybe 3-5 per day, some users say even less than that) their vacation is no longer a family one. You are still together (if you want to be) the entire day from the hotel part to swimming, meals, snacks, shopping, fireworks, shows, transportation, hotel touring and so on. The things to do together at Disney as a family are endless. Not to mention all the other rides with low wait times a family might do together while waiting on their DAS time. It seems that for some that no change Disney will bring about will be good enough unless it is the status quo which shows you how superior the DAS really is and thus the over use and abuse it gets.

 

[notatallmagic]

This is just horrible and makes me so mad. The abusers ruin everything for those who actually need it.




Exactly, the card is only supposed to be to verify you have a disability. Lots of people don't understand that. They say, "Hey, look, I got approved. I'm in", and sadly, they will discover when they arrive, they are not. The initial card doesn't guarantee you anything. It only grants the opportunity to plead your case. Universal looks at each person on a case by case basis, and from what I have seen, they turn most down because purchasing EP does about the same thing DAS is doing now.

We HAD been Uni annual passholders when they changed their rules less than a week before our trip. We WERE able to get the "medical" card, but as the poster stated, there was no guarantee of a pass - just "go to Guest services when you arrive "

Being out of state with non refundable hotel reservations, we asked for a prorated AP refund. Nope.
So they "let us" upgrade to a Deluxe resort that included free" express passes. And she was granted the pass too, but we weren't willing to take that risk...sigh.

After that, we came back to Disney, thinking it would be different...if they needed to make a change, I get that. But the terrible communication and lack of real information makes even Universals mess look professional by comparison.

We've used our passes a bunch over the past year, so her existing DAS hasn't "expired". She just calls and asks to renew it. Not sure if that's why, but it dies seem more streamlined...

 

[Rowab]

It’s just how the law works in the US. I agree it would cut down on abuse.

I get the law aspect, and why universal brought in a third party. So that makes it trickier, I just don't agree forgery etc would be a huge issue

 

[OurBigTrip]

But how can DAS be providing "too much" if Disney is still offering it as "reasonable." It can't be both "too much" and "reasonable" at the same time.

Yes it can - it can be reasonable for some needs and too much for other needs.

 

[Rowab]

That's interesting I didn't know they did that in the international parks.
It could be that they want to ask about evidence/diagnosis here in the USA but are afraid because of US law, since some of the other .

 

[OurBigTrip]

Agree, we don't yet know how anything is going to work, but that is what everyone is upset about. Disney is taking away accommodations with no clear information on how the new accommodations are going to work.

In addition, this comment was simply responding to someone who said that a person needing RS for a disability was the same as a regular guest who is using it for small children, and it really isn't because a regular guest will not need RS for every single attraction but a guest using it for a disability will.



It's not actually. I knew it was a significant amount time, but I wasn't sure how much, so I did a quick search.

"The average wait time for a Disney World attraction is 36 minutes, while the average ride is just 8 minutes long. For each ride you want to visit, prepare to spend 82% of your time in line." - https://financebuzz.com/disney-wait-times-study

So we should just be ok with being separated for 82% of the day? And that's the average, not the time you would experince for more popular attractions which would skew that to a way higher percetage.

https://financebuzz.com/disney-wait-times-study

So all you do is stand in line and ride? You don’t eat meals together, you don’t spend time at the resort or hotel? You don’t go through shops or see shows?

 

[GoingSince1990]

and it really isn't because a regular guest will not need RS for every single attraction but a guest using it for a disability will.

But would a guest who needed disability rider swap really need it for “every single attraction”? If that guest is able to wait in lines of less than about 20 to 30 minutes (which is the wait time in a typical lightning lane) then they should be OK with standby lines of a similar length, where the whole party can still stay together. For example, right now (I just looked) only 4 rides in MK have standby lines longer than 30 minutes. That leaves a lot of rides where DAS rider swap would not be needed if the DAS user is OK with lines of 30 minutes or less.

 

[Rowab]

It probably does seem quite backwards but because in the U.S. documentation for medical things just in general is controversial and can depending on the situation run afoul with the law (that's why you see mention of the lawsuit against Six Flags using the same documentation requirement as Universal).

I know on our searching for our Europe trip (next month) there are plenty of discounts available to those with needs but they almost always require documentation to be provided to obtain that discount....that would just not be something you see here in the U.S.

The points brought up by posters over time on threads about burdens to gain documentation are valid and often sited.

I do think you're correct that there is probably more stricter qualifications on conditions outside of the U.S. that may be part culture part laws for why we have broader applications in the U.S.

Difficulty obtaining documentation is one thing I can understand why it would be tricky in the US, I just think for those who do present it, forgery is not an issue. "Not everyone can get documentation" is a reason for it not to an absoulte requirement, "CMs shouldn't have to deal with medical info" another valid one, but "it could be easily faked" isn't to me, I think that would be exceedingly rare.

With the third party being brought in, I feel like the OPTION to share documentation (with the third party medical professional, to lessen the burden on CMs) would just make sense for those who can provide it and otherwise fear they may not get the right accomdation.