D23 Expo a bust!

[Donut23]

I have always felt D23 was just a marketing scam to get people to spend more money... Money to join... money for 'exclusive items'... money for the EXPO's where they have lots of other things to sell.... Just invite some Disney Artists to show up and talk for an hour and people will pay too much!

BING! Give the little lady a stuffed Tigger!

Oh wait, that budget has been cutback.

How about a fastpass ----- which credit card would you like to use?

 

[lockedoutlogic]

One slight disagreement with above statement the new Star Tours is awesome....also

Remember Disney is a business. Obviously when running a theme park, merchandise is your key cash cow. So you are correct to an extent. I disagree with what you said about shows/attraction not being a primary motivator. Ak and MGM are poor examples because they were thrown up by Eisner to best competition (Universal Buesch Garden) my primary beef with Disney is how they throw up parks around the world like 1950's real estate unfinished and move onto the next park while we continue to go to two essentially half day parks at the World.

MGM is 22 years old...I think we can be confident that it will never be more than what it is...and since they haven't exactly hit a Homerun with animals either...I. Would think AK will be identical.


Seriously...how good can star tours be? Motion simulators were so cornythey don't even exist anymore...the concept was bad from the start

 

[The Duck]

I've been going back/forth about becoming a D23 member but was waiting to see how this Expo turned out. Nope, not going to do it this year.

 

[ASteelersMidget]

It just goes to show you. Bob Ogre "needs to be about 20% cooler"

P.S. ten coolness points for getting the reference

 

[alexsdc2]

No offense but you guys expect way too much. Who said they were going to announce anything at all? This event is not a development announcement thing... Its just a fan event. The fact that we get any information is really a bonus.

I am a member of d23 and yes it is about making money for Disney but if you don't want to be a member then don't join. I love Disney and I understand they are a business in it to make money. I also come to this site because i like talking and hearing from other Disney fans. But lately it seems like all anyone does is complain and be negative. You all set your expectations way too high and need to appreciate the Disney we do have. Its not perfect button know what it makes me happy and gives me joy and that is truly what it is about.

 

[ASteelersMidget]

No offense but you guys expect way too much. Who said they were going to announce anything at all? This event is not a development announcement thing... Its just a fan event. The fact that we get any information is really a bonus.

I am a member of d23 and yes it is about making money for Disney but if you don't want to be a member then don't join. I love Disney and I understand they are a business in it to make money. I also come to this site because i like talking and hearing from other Disney fans. But lately it seems like all anyone does is complain and be negative. You all set your expectations way too high and need to appreciate the Disney we do have. Its not perfect button know what it makes me happy and gives me joy and that is truly what it is about.

I see where u r coming from, but there is a reason we have such high standards, and his name is WALT DISNEY. He was far advanced in the business of them parks and such. We expect Disney to continue to be on the forefront of technology. They aren't. Its less we are negative, its more we expect better.

Well that's my $.02

 

[lizabu]

Disney sold out to the Chinese government...'nough sad. that's the main reason were not seeing any love more than the FLE, theyre breaking ground on the Shanghai resort, which apparently will have the biggest Disney castle in the world.

http://www.****************.com/new...eleased-shanghai-disneylands-storybook-castle

Not just that, but its also said to be the largest, and most interactive Disney park ever. Looks like they're turning this project into a technological flagship for the others...

It makes sense though. China is the fastest growing emerging market. Every company I can think of is turning towards China and translating their publications into Chinese and finding ways to make Chinese come to their properties and feel comfortable. In just a few years China will be spending way more than the US on entertainment and travel so why wouldn't Disney want a piece of it?

 

[dronein7g]

Okay as far as DHS is concerned it has some good stuff where it needs to expand though is at Streets of America! That part of the park is 100% useless and a total bore until Christmas time when we get the lights. Well this to me would be the obvious thing to do....... when Universals contract with Marvel runs out Disney should say "These characters belong to us now we wont renew" After that turn the streets into Marvels New York! Add the spidey ride if that's possible make a tour through Stark industries to replace the back lot tour. Replace LMA with a Marvel stunt show. New Marvel based gift shops! How about an X Men danger room simulator? Or a Thor coaster? Really Disney needs to know the possibilities are endless with this Marvel merger and need to jump on it! They have MILLIONS of dollars they could make just from that. But thats my .02

 

[ASteelersMidget]

Okay as far as DHS is concerned it has some good stuff where it needs to expand though is at Streets of America! That part of the park is 100% useless and a total bore until Christmas time when we get the lights. Well this to me would be the obvious thing to do....... when Universals contract with Marvel runs out Disney should say "These characters belong to us now we wont renew" After that turn the streets into Marvels New York! Add the spidey ride if that's possible make a tour through Stark industries to replace the back lot tour. Replace LMA with a Marvel stunt show. New Marvel based gift shops! How about an X Men danger room simulator? Or a Thor coaster? Really Disney needs to know the possibilities are endless with this Marvel merger and need to jump on it! They have MILLIONS of dollars they could make just from that. But thats my .02

1 small problem. Apparently US's contract has no set end date. They can just keep renewing......

 

[mitros]

I mean, come on....what did you expect, people?

They will not...i repeat NOT add anything of significance for probably several years.

Rides don't make money...and we should all know far too well by now.

What about fantasyland? Well...first off i think its a good thing.
But this isn't to give the kids new things to excite them covered by their ticket (though that damn well should be the driver at those prices)

I don't have the numbers in front of me...but i've studied them before...and the real profits come from Magic Kingdom, EPCOT, and Downtown - specifically the marketplace.

It's about the GIFTSHOPS!!! all decisions are giftshop based and have been for 20 years. DVC? more people for the giftshops more parks? longer stays - more browsing in the giftshops. Downtown Disney "redevelopment"? ya..that ones a softball.

The only moves we've seen at the two "lesser" parks have been just for credibility on the surface...and they need them to be viable choices to keep the people on property for 7+ days...I wonder why?

Look at it:

MGM opened with few attractions in 89...star tours in 90 (which sucks and undoubtedly still does)...major addition in TOT in 94 (5 years)...major addition in Rockinrollercoaster in 99 (5 years)...sporadic minor additions and kids attractions here and there....car show in 2005 (ok...a clone but a decent sized deal...6 years)...major addition in TSM in 2009 (4 years)...and not much else - show replacements and shutdowns.

AK:
Opened rushed with little in attractions in 98...Asia opened in 99 due to the rush opening in 98...chester and hester was thrown up in 01 to cover the lack of substance in the park (because of declining attendence...a then unknown phenomena for disney that has repeated itself several times since)...Everest was to save face again in 2005 (that's a novella unto its self)...and nothing else...some show replacements and shutdowns.

They know exactly what they're doing...get them outta mgm and ak and to these places in the pm

1. DTD
2. MK
3. EPCOT

in that order...or even better:

1. MK then EPCOT
2. MK then DTD
3. EPCOT then DTD
or the coup de gras: MK then EPCOT then DTD!! oh, the revenue!

oh...and few humans can run for 8 hours and have anything left in the tank in the florida weather at the waterparks. So you know what those thrillseekers do after typhoon or blizzard. Alot of them "take it easy" in the evening. ya know what that means at WDW? i think the imagination can answer that question, right?

So back to fantasyland...i think it will be nice. but we all know its to keep more bodies in the park so they eventually gravitate to the registers, right?
Well if you didn't - then now you do.

But they are also going to suck the life out of it and call it "new" for probably a decade...or at least until all the paint has faded in the sun/ been chipped off and they cut the budget so it can't be repainted...

So it is still a dream at this point...another land to AK, IJA at DHS, "lucasland", Monster Inc Coasters, Rides in the World Showcase, new countries in the world showcase, new imagination!...villian's parks...new PI...

It's all really a fantasy.

MAYBE in 3 to 4 years you might get your monsters inc coaster...but i would expect more likely some kinda Cars ride. It's backwoods friendly and they are obviously gonna make a couple more of those doozie movies with southern fried comedy,

But you will see DVC...then DVC...then probably a DVC. And you'll see more outsourcing of stores and restaurants. and you might even see more stores and restaurants built.

But disney is over the ride and the show as their passion. There is no desire to innovate or add or create and certainly no will to put the capital in to do so. that worm has turned...
and then it was sold to the top bidder at property control.

But all the real additions that we...the fans...appreciate are merely thrown out as bones for PR purposes on an increasingly infrequent schedule. It's a shield for the money people.

I before i get jumped...i do think the expansion in fantasyland will be well done....I just have no illusion as to why its done or what it represents.

Regarding the gift shops, they can open as many as they want, but if they do not add any new and unique merchandise as opposed to the same old tired crap at every single shop, nobody is going to buy. We rarely purchase any merchandise at the parks any more because it is all the same. At one time, you would find different items at each store, whether at the parks or the resorts. Now, it's the same old Chinese garbage no matter where you shop on property.

 

[SmilingGrump]

Regarding the gift shops, they can open as many as they want, but if they do not add any new and unique merchandise as opposed to the same old tired crap at every single shop, nobody is going to buy. We rarely purchase any merchandise at the parks any more because it is all the same. At one time, you would find different items at each store, whether at the parks or the resorts. Now, it's the same old Chinese garbage no matter where you shop on property.

Bingo! They can line the walkways with merchandise from the turnstyles to each attraction, but if it's all the same stuff then they won't sell much .... unless those were Dole Whip stands

 

[Donut23]

Regarding the gift shops, they can open as many as they want, but if they do not add any new and unique merchandise as opposed to the same old tired crap at every single shop, nobody is going to buy. We rarely purchase any merchandise at the parks any more because it is all the same. At one time, you would find different items at each store, whether at the parks or the resorts. Now, it's the same old Chinese garbage no matter where you shop on property.

Fellow Castmember Bob must be pea green with envy. Harry Potter's merchandise sales increased by 70% last year....and that's for plastic wands people waited in line to buy.

Disney has defaulted to the cheep at every level of operation and this is what it looks like.

I'm not ashamed to say shopping was part of my Disney experience. Thanks to Disney's low quality merchandise, they are saving me BUCKETS of $$$ on a Disney trip.

We were waiting for the ferry to the MK very late in the day on the last trip. There were FAR more people returning to the parking lot than guests riding to the MK side. Funny thing? Very few people were walking off the ferry with bags of purchases in their hands. Now I suspect a majority of these guests were day guests heading back to the parking lot vs. resort guests who would have sent their packages back to their resorts.

Remember the day when your shopping bags took up room on the tram seat?


Oh well.....it's the long way of saying I agree with you, Mitros.....sadly.



......all sidewalks lead to the gift shop <----use to be my mantra.

 

[Cheshire Figment]

And there is a long thread in the disABILITIES! Forum about how the Expo is having multiple extreme violation of the ADA and it is not safe or workable for people with disabilities! Here is a link to that thread. It is primarily posts by two people who have attended; one of the two was with one of the disABILITIES Forum Moderators.

 

[Donut23]

And there is a long thread in the disABILITIES! Forum about how the Expo is having multiple extreme violation of the ADA and it is not safe or workable for people with disabilities!

Shame on Disney for this.

There was a time I would not have given it a second thought......then I was in an accident and now travel with a scooter. I'm ok day to day....but long walking days are impossible for me.

One of our Disney travel friends is there and begged me to go with him....now I'm glad I didn't.

 

[umichigan10]

Fwiw lockedout, I disagree with you on a few things but I don't see how you've been out of line at all and even though I didn't see your shot at southern people I'm sure ive seen worse insults on the boards

I'd lime to say I see your point on the whole gift shop thing since about every ride empties into one. But then again that is how you make money to run the park.

Also about the whole outdated motion simulator thing isn't the Simpsons ride a simulator along with the new Dispicable me one? Just saying that they're not as rare as you believe .

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Fwiw lockedout, I disagree with you on a few things but I don't see how you've been out of line at all and even though I didn't see your shot at southern people I'm sure ive seen worse insults on the boards

I'd lime to say I see your point on the whole gift shop thing since about every ride empties into one. But then again that is how you make money to run the park.

Also about the whole outdated motion simulator thing isn't the Simpsons ride a simulator along with the new Dispicable me one? Just saying that they're not as rare as you believe .

But they did see a huge reduction in usuage to almost nothing didn't they?

disney even eliminated one of their own...if i do recall. and that one was better.

that's what i'm saying...until they made those 3 atrocious prequels...star wars deserved something with a track and a little more juice...
now since those god awful movies...the ones that made Mark Hamill look like Sir Laurence Olivier...maybe star tours is just right.

Nevermind...i take it all back.

But aren't both star tours and the indy stunt show heavily in the camp of "pathetic"?

I mean...20 years and no changes? Of course maybe lucas knew he had nothing and any new movies would be horrible in comparison with the originals...

cuz they was.

but it was probably just money between Mikey I and GL...which has always been the conventional wisdom....

So the fact another vulture was picking the bones gives disney a little pass...i guess?

now i'm completely batty

 

[umichigan10]

no need to take any back

I agree the Indy show needs to go. It's ok and everything but seriously? DL gets a cool ride and we got...yeah

I also love how China gets all this cool groundbreaking stuff and I get the same

Thanks for the love Disney if it wasn't for us back home you'd never be building that park but I digress

.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

no need to take any back

I agree the Indy show needs to go. It's ok and everything but seriously? DL gets a cool ride and we got...yeah

I also love how China gets all this cool groundbreaking stuff and I get the same

Thanks for the love Disney if it wasn't for us back home you'd never be building that park but I digress

.

WDW is simply to generate operation income to fund the other units...that is the bottomline.

No...i'm serious - that is the bottomline. As their financials bear out. If only they were a private company - boy the doozie excuses we'd be choking on.

They use the money from WDW to support every bad ABC show, every bad Nick Cage movie (notice how nobody else will hire him...probably because they don't want the IRS hanging out on the studio lot), and every overpaid NBA announcer on ESPN.

I guess the philosophy is "we built it...now we should get to sit back and use it"

And i may even see a sliver of the point there...they did build something massive...but it does not bode well for the fans in the future.

Which is full circle back to my original point: the walt disney company does not want to build new rides for you in WDW...unless it leads directly to profit.

And it doesn't...construction and re-investment is heavily subterfuge now.

 

[Bella the Ball 360]

I mean, come on....what did you expect, people?

They will not...i repeat NOT add anything of significance for probably several years.

Rides don't make money...and we should all know far too well by now.

What about fantasyland? Well...first off i think its a good thing.
But this isn't to give the kids new things to excite them covered by their ticket (though that damn well should be the driver at those prices)

I don't have the numbers in front of me...but i've studied them before...and the real profits come from Magic Kingdom, EPCOT, and Downtown - specifically the marketplace.

It's about the GIFTSHOPS!!! all decisions are giftshop based and have been for 20 years. DVC? more people for the giftshops more parks? longer stays - more browsing in the giftshops. Downtown Disney "redevelopment"? ya..that ones a softball.

The only moves we've seen at the two "lesser" parks have been just for credibility on the surface...and they need them to be viable choices to keep the people on property for 7+ days...I wonder why?

Look at it:

MGM opened with few attractions in 89...star tours in 90 (which sucks and undoubtedly still does)...major addition in TOT in 94 (5 years)...major addition in Rockinrollercoaster in 99 (5 years)...sporadic minor additions and kids attractions here and there....car show in 2005 (ok...a clone but a decent sized deal...6 years)...major addition in TSM in 2009 (4 years)...and not much else - show replacements and shutdowns.

AK:
Opened rushed with little in attractions in 98...Asia opened in 99 due to the rush opening in 98...chester and hester was thrown up in 01 to cover the lack of substance in the park (because of declining attendence...a then unknown phenomena for disney that has repeated itself several times since)...Everest was to save face again in 2005 (that's a novella unto its self)...and nothing else...some show replacements and shutdowns.

They know exactly what they're doing...get them outta mgm and ak and to these places in the pm

1. DTD
2. MK
3. EPCOT

in that order...or even better:

1. MK then EPCOT
2. MK then DTD
3. EPCOT then DTD
or the coup de gras: MK then EPCOT then DTD!! oh, the revenue!

oh...and few humans can run for 8 hours and have anything left in the tank in the florida weather at the waterparks. So you know what those thrillseekers do after typhoon or blizzard. Alot of them "take it easy" in the evening. ya know what that means at WDW? i think the imagination can answer that question, right?

So back to fantasyland...i think it will be nice. but we all know its to keep more bodies in the park so they eventually gravitate to the registers, right?
Well if you didn't - then now you do.

But they are also going to suck the life out of it and call it "new" for probably a decade...or at least until all the paint has faded in the sun/ been chipped off and they cut the budget so it can't be repainted...

So it is still a dream at this point...another land to AK, IJA at DHS, "lucasland", Monster Inc Coasters, Rides in the World Showcase, new countries in the world showcase, new imagination!...villian's parks...new PI...

It's all really a fantasy.

MAYBE in 3 to 4 years you might get your monsters inc coaster...but i would expect more likely some kinda Cars ride. But you will see DVC...then DVC...then probably a DVC. And you'll see more outsourcing of stores and restaurants. and you might even see more stores and restaurants built.

But disney is over the ride and the show as their passion. There is no desire to innovate or add or create and certainly no will to put the capital in to do so. that worm has turned...
and then it was sold to the top bidder at property control.

But all the real additions that we...the fans...appreciate are merely thrown out as bones for PR purposes on an increasingly infrequent schedule. It's a shield for the money people.

I before i get jumped...i do think the expansion in fantasyland will be well done....I just have no illusion as to why its done or what it represents.

I could not agree with you more! Just came back yesterday and really the whole thing is beginning to be very lackluster. As for Fantasyland well, it is all bout shops, stores and those stupid character meet and greets. Really? You pay a couple of thousand to come down and see a bunch of college students dressed for Halloween. Not me. While I would love Fantasy land to be wonderful it will not. Where are the rides? I want rides, I want shows.

I went to Harry Potter at Universal and at LEAST they added a ride but here too they just recycled Dueling Dragons and the Unicorn Rollercoaster. AS for the Three Broomsticks well it was barely done over also.

I had heard that tourism in Fla was up both this year and last so if the money is there then improve the parks OR build a park in Brazil and at least cut down on the lines that we have to wait in.

 

[Bella the Ball 360]

One slight disagreement with above statement the new Star Tours is awesome....also

Remember Disney is a business. Obviously when running a theme park, merchandise is your key cash cow. So you are correct to an extent. I disagree with what you said about shows/attraction not being a primary motivator. Ak and MGM are poor examples because they were thrown up by Eisner to best competition (Universal Buesch Garden) my primary beef with Disney is how they throw up parks around the world like 1950's real estate unfinished and move onto the next park while we continue to go to two essentially half day parks at the World.

Star Tours is OK in my opinion it is not in my opinion AWESOME.