Cruise CM's- Poorly Underpaid or Living Large

[mark & sandra]

Having not yet cruised and just getting my information from what I read here, I have a question. I've read on several sites and threads that the "poor CM's" are poorly paid and survive almost entirely on tips. I'm sure that they work extremely hard and deserve every penny they get, but I was wondering if any one knows about how many tables per seating the servers take care of or how many staterooms the host/hostess are in charge of. If the servers take care of about 20 people per seating and the hosts have about 10 staterooms per sailings, they "should" receive tips of between 800.00-1000.00 for a 7 day cruise + pay. Again, I'm not questioning if they deserve it or not, just the distinction that they are poorly underpaid, instead of saying they are very hard working people who make very good money.
Mark

 

[MarkRG]

All the discussions on here seem to stress the same thing- they are poorly paid by Disney and we should tip reasonably fair for all the hard work they provide us. Which I agree with.
n
Mind you its a very hard job - they sped usually 6 month streches on the ship where the only time they might possibly see family is for a few hours when they're back in port canaveral, maybe. A lot of the peopel are straight from their countries supporting a family back home.

 

[aprilgail2]

For all the hours they work to only make 800.00 is not great....Though if they are sending it back to their homes in other countries I am sure it is worth more there than here but to live here and only make 800 a week is just squeeking by....

 

[WDWLVR]

Just to add one point of clarrification - employees of all cruise lines in the typical "tipped" positions are paid a very small salary. It isn't just a Disney thing. That is one of the reasons you see so many foreigners in these positions - they will work for much less than US employees would.

They do work very hard and I think the reason everyone brings it up is because believe or not that there are people who do stiff them. I know that some lines have gone to adding the tips into the bill which might be the way to go.

That's why when we get good service we tip above and beyond by adding things like a phone card to our cash tip.

 

[max123]

We were on the Magic in August 03 for the Western cruise and I had the opportunity to have a massage. My therapist had only been on the Magic a few weeks, but he stated that Disney pays the best of all the cruise lines, and he had worked quite a few.

He also stated that the living arrangements, and time off were the best, making DCL the line most folks in their industry tried to obtain a contract with.

The crew on the Magic have their own pool and leisure areas. He also stated that they will make arrangements for the crew to have their family aboard at various times.

There were numerous married couples working on our cruise and they had private quarters and seemed reasonably satisfied with them.

Our asst server was working this summer as he saved for Law School in Cal. He was from Brazil and fully intended to have his entire year's tuition saved???

He claims it has been done before, by working only the summer college break.

So, for what it is worth, the folks we interacted with were not all dissatisfied with their salary or perks.

thanks

 

[GenieDana]

The cabin staff in the categories 4 - 11 typically take care of 15 staterooms per cruise, (so I was told by our "veteran" stateroom host of 3 years of service with DCL).

With an average (estimate) of three guests per stateroom, and If everyone tips the recommended amount, a stateroom host looks to make $1136.25 for a 7-day cruise in tips alone. Some tip more, some, less, some not at all but it probably averages out.

Since they work, typically, a 10 month contract, that would be about $45,450 annually in tips alone. The staff also gets a salary, and I presume it is also US tax free (Bahamas registry and income not earned on US soil, non-citizen, etc.).

The situation may not be as doom-and-gloom as some may report, but may not be a rosy either (considering the a$$ kissing some have to do and the hours worked). Anyhow, 40K+ beans goes a long way in Eastern Europe, the Phillipeans, or India.

These folks work HARD to keep these jobs, the consequences of losing the job is unthinkable.

 

[mark & sandra]

Thanks for your replys. As I thought, many of these CM's work very hard to please the passengers that they are caring for, and receive a decent wage for it. Although the amount is not terribly high, making 40k-50k clear is by no means squeeking by. I think we should continue to tip these people accordingly but we should expect a higher level of service from people who have the ability to earn a good living by doing their jobs well, instead of feeling that we should tip them well, because of their low paying jobs.

Mark

 

[alexandrew]

Yes, the CM's in tipped positions work very , very hard....but, compared to the deplorable working conditions in, for example, Bulgaria,or Croatia, with 25%+ unemployment, it is a godsend that the CM's can earn a very respectable living, even by US standards....and pay 0 taxes as well...the odds of making 50k in these countries is slim and none....

Do you have any idea the % of US workers that even make 50k annually....maybe 20-25%....3% of US workers earn over 100k annually....I am glad that a tipped CM can work for DCL. bust *** and make some good $ for their families, or to pay for their education...

anyone who "feels sorry" for them needs to take a prozac

 

[din]

1. We are assuming that they get tips from most of the customers, which I do not think is the case! So the amount stated here may be less than mentioned.

2. Even if it is the range discussed here, we are talking working 7-10 days morning to evening straight before getting a day off. For example our server, we saw during breakfast, lunch and dinner raning from serving, seating customers, to cleaning the buffet tables.

3. As alexandrew mentioned they work hard and probabaly make more money that they would in their home country, but I am most certainly sure that they put up with a lot in dealing with the customers!! I can't say that I worked on a cruise but having put myself through school working in service industry, let me tell you there are some nights I go home wondering what I worked for!

 

[my3kids]

So if they *could* make about $45,000 a year...and they likely make more than half that..(I don't think half stiff them, and probably some tip extra)....so lets say $25,00-$30,000.....Isn't all their food, all their housing, medical care, etc. all paid in full? That amount with nothing coming out doesn't sound dismal to me.

Yes, they do work hard, but so do lots of US workers. The end salary might be similar, but with no taxes and no living expenses...they aren't as bad off as you might expect. How many people here tip their housekeeper at a motel the same amount that they tip their room steward?

I paid my gratuities happily, and included extra for a lot of them. They did a wonderful job and made the trip extra special.....but I don't believe they are as bad off as some believe.

 

[MrsPete]

Interesting that you'd bring this up! I was wondering the same thing. My husband and I were joking about working on a cruise ship after we retire -- maybe six months on and six months off wouldn't be a bad deal!

The $45,000 figure looks like it could be realistic. BUT one other big thing has been overlooked: they get room and board for free, plus they have little opportunity for shopping and little space for them to keep "stuff." Therefore, they potentially could bank the great majority of their earnings. Remember the tax thing too -- that makes a huge difference.

Remember that this is largely unskilled labor. It doesn't take a college degree to wait tables -- yes, it takes hard work and the right personality, but it isn't rocket science.

Let's compare this salary:

I live in North Carolina, and I heard on the radio last week that the average NC family has about $35,000 coming in per year. Notice I said FAMILY, not worker. Remember, these people are paying taxes, rent, and food. That doesn't make the cruise service industry pay look too bad!

As a teacher with 13 years experience, I earn about $38,000.

Do I think they work hard? Yes.
Do I think they deserve more pay? No. It sounds like it's well above average for the service industry.

 

[aprilgail2]

Originally posted by MrsPete

Let's compare this salary:

I live in North Carolina, and I heard on the radio last week that the average NC family has about $35,000 coming in per year. Notice I said FAMILY, not worker. Remember, these people are paying taxes, rent, and food. That doesn't make the cruise service industry pay look too bad!

As a teacher with 13 years experience, I earn about $38,000.

Wow, 38,000....I would say that is underpaid...my brother is a teacher here and makes about 70,000! Though I am sure it is cheaper to live in NC than it is to live in NY....I can't wait to retire and move down south...the 7800 a year property taxes here are a killer!

 

[Mjasp]

Originally posted by aprilgail2
Wow, 38,000....I would say that is underpaid...my brother is a teacher here and makes about 70,000! Though I am sure it is cheaper to live in NC than it is to live in NY....I can't wait to retire and move down south...the 7800 a year property taxes here are a killer!

I was just going to say the same thing, come to LI and you will make at least $75,000, but that is the reason why our taxes are that high also.

Joanna

 

[mark & sandra]

Although this has gotten a little off course, I guess it's just a matter of perspective. In order to net about 50,000 a year you'd have to earn in the mid 60s, and if you have that much left after food and rent, you'd probably be earning in the mid 80s. My upcoming 7 day cruise, cat #6, cost me 3575.00. Using the numbers I'm getting from this thread, my stateroom host/hostess could pay for it with 3 weeks "net" pay. I guess it just a matter of perspective.

 

[abitjaded]

On soap box:

If the cruise is not full, just imagine. Our cruise was very empty. Our servers only had about a 2/3 full first seating and NONE in the second seating. The station was lousy and people moved out in droves. These servers still had to do all meals and the extra duties required, so essentially they worked minimum wage for about 84 hours in one week. And remember this means lots of the cabin folks were not getting full tips either. Trade?? Not me. One of our servers had not seen his children in 4 months, and you could tell it hurt. And some of the servers are from European countries that have a more expensive cost of living than the U.S. Do not assume they all come from some poverty stricken area. A decent wage yes, but take a look at the average age, especially of the restaurant servers. They are young, few want to spend their lives working at this gruelling pace when they are 50. They all push for the "excellent ratings" because they get TIME OFF for them not more money. Those who do do it until they are old are usually the ones from the more poverty stricken areas of the world, especially notable on other lines. They keep on because they have to. The rest burn-out.

Off soap box.

Carla

 

[jrabbit]

MrsPete - since you are a US citizen, you would still be required to pay US taxes, even though the the ship is registered in the Bahamas. DCL would withhold US taxes from your pay (the $50/month) and they would be required to report your estimated tips (the $45,000). It still sounds better than your pay as a teacher in NC.

That is why there are so few US citizens working in the cruise industry - low wages still have to pay Uncle Sam. On our last cruise there were only 12 cm's from the US (out of about 970)

 

[rae519]

It's all in one's perspective, of course.

To work as hard as they do for the long, irregular hours and to maintain a pleasant attitude regardless of to whom they are speaking or serving - I think that they deserve every tip they get -regardless.

My Aunt who taught for 30 years always told me - teachers get paid for one years work but have holidays, weekends and summer off. They can have second jobs and most do. This is HER opinion, not mine.

All labor can be stressful with long hours, but not all employees must be as cheerful and helpful as DCL CM's.

Just my two cents...

Rae

 

[Scott5150]

I recall reading that a typical CM gets a base salary of $1000 per month, and DCL charges them $1000 for room and board. It is probably an accounting issue, but that is the way it is done. Remember, they have virtually NO expenses while on board. There is even a shop where they can buy the things that they need at regular prices.

There is no shortage of workers willing to fill the jobs, the challenge is getting the best workers for your company. A lot of people work at WDW for small ammounts of money, but they get really good perks. Living in a free market like we do, if the good people can get better compensation and perks elsewhere, they will leave these jobs behind.

This reminds me of the "Do I really need to tip the suggested ammount for an infant" discussion. When you see how hard the crew works for you, only a super cheapskate would not tip. I, however, am only a regular cheapskate, so the only way I would not tip would be for EXTREMELY poor service.

All that being said, I have found the service level on the Magic excellent for all 3 of my cruises.

Scott

 

[alexandrew]

Having grown up on LI, and still having family there, here are some all too true facts about the Isle of Long....

1. 75k on LI, is like 35k in NC...heres why...
2. If you can get away with $7500 in property taxes on LI, you are way ahead of the game....most nice areas of Nassau and Suffolk you pay 10k+ in property taxes annually
3. you cant buy a tool shed in a nice area with "A" rated schools in Nassau or Suffolk for under 400k...and then you'll get a house thats 50+ years old, requiring expensive maintenance...
4. High heating oil or natural gas prices, coupled with some of the highest electric bills in U.S.
5. Lets not forget NY state tax taken from each paycheck....also, if you work in NYC, and live on LI, you pay city tax as well...
6. Higher car insurance, and more wear and tear on car due to the potholes and salt used on icy roads...

As you can see, this is a subject I'm passionate about....My family thinks LI is Nirvana, while I think otherwise....

 

[Horace Horsecollar]

Originally posted by MrsPete
BUT one other big thing has been overlooked: they get room and board for free, plus they have little opportunity for shopping and little space for them to keep "stuff." Therefore, they potentially could bank the great majority of their earnings. Remember the tax thing too -- that makes a huge difference.

I really doubt that there are many tipped crew members who "bank the great majority of their earnings." I think the vast majority of the service staff members make the sacrifice of working many thousands of miles away from their loved ones in order to support their spouses, children, parents, grandparents, or siblings. They're using their earnings to pay for a roof over their loved ones' heads, shoes on their feet, and food in their stomachs.

I can't imagine what it would be like if I had to share a small room at my place of employment with three on my co-workers, while my real home, my wife and my children are on the other side of the globe.

There may be some tipped crew members who are in a poistion to bank money so that they can get a higher education or start a business, but I think they're the exception.

Regarding "the tax thing," I don't think any of us really know how the crew member's income at sea is taxed. "jrabbit" wrote that a US citizen would have to pay US taxes. If that's true, who's to say that a Bulgarian would not pay Bulgarian income taxes or a Costa Rican would not pay Costa Rican income taxes?