Couple Arrested for Refusing to Pay Tip

[N.Bailey]

As well as the tip outs server's make each night, is also based on sales. Doesn't matter if you made zero tip, on a check of a $100. You still need to tip your bussers, bar (and in some cases) host staff. On that $100 bill, that you leave nothing on, your server has to *at least* tip about 3%, out.

This is one of the reasons many might have noticed "automatic gratuity" went up from 15%, to 18%.



All credit card tips, are automatically claimed. That's it. Point, blank, period. If anyone is concerned your servers are tax evaders, then leave them their tip, on a credit card.

It's up to the server to claim any cash tips. Are there servers that don't claim it. I'm sure there are. There are also eBay sellers, not claiming money - child care providers, not claiming it - your buddy who works on your car - not claiming it. This isn't a server issue - this is a human nature issue, and honesty issue. Why it's thought to be only servers who may not claim it all, is beyond me.

It's not up to the general public to 'supplement' a paycheck? That's rich.

I never worked anywhere that reported credit card tips as tips received. It's always been based on % of sales (8%). I honestly cannot even wrap my head around a way a restaurant could keep track of this (unless every tip is on file). There would be no way for the management staff to separate all that.

 

[N.Bailey]

But this is something you'd have to take up with your legislators, not during a meal you don't feel like tipping on, KWIM?

That being said - it's my understanding we in the United States, have some of the best servers, world wide - partly due to the fact they *do* have to bust their behinds to get a tip.

Just like people complain that they feel automatic gratuity makes their servers, less than attentive, don't you feel the same would happen if tipping was gone, altogether?

Oh - and servers *do* get fired. And plenty of times, it's an irate, over bearing customer who demands such, and it's done on-the-spot.

I'd suggest if you work in such a restaurant that you seek new employment ASAP. I have NEVER in my life witnessed anyone being fired because of the way irrational guests have treated them. As a matter of fact, in 12 years, I probably only came across 2 people that I'd call irrational.

And for the record, I made upward to $200 a day in tips when I waited tables (not the diner I started in, but the restaurant I worked in for 10 years).

I tried my best to make every guest feel as if their needs were important to me. I knew their paycheck wasn't handed to them anymore than mine was handed to me. So, those people leaving you a tip, they actually had to work for their $$$$ too and I didn't expect them to simply hand it over to me for doing nothing.

 

[N.Bailey]

You're right. If a server isn't up to par, you should steal from them!!!!

Steal? This is NEVER going to hold up in a court of law. NEVER! It's not theft and your attitude of entitlement really bewilders me.

 

[N.Bailey]

Obviously not a "bright" business owner or should I say, delegator (his bartender who called Police) what fools! I know I would NEVER patronize the place. CRAZY way to DRUM up business.........
As far as the TIP goes, it is usually STATED on the menu and posted when they automatically add it to groups of a certain size. So, in fairness, they did NOT pay the full bill.
Meanwhile, judge will likely throw it out, another waste of court time.....I think business should be ashamed!!

If they put on the menu that after you're done eating, they're going to take you out back and shoot you, do you think that would be legal?

Just because they put it on the menu, doesn't make it legal.

 

[disneyfav4ever]

Steal? This is NEVER going to hold up in a court of law. NEVER! It's not theft and your attitude of entitlement really bewilders me.

I'm pretty sure she was being sarcastic when she said that.

 

[Took]

But this is something you'd have to take up with your legislators, not during a meal you don't feel like tipping on, KWIM?

That being said - it's my understanding we in the United States, have some of the best servers, world wide - partly due to the fact they *do* have to bust their behinds to get a tip.

Just like people complain that they feel automatic gratuity makes their servers, less than attentive, don't you feel the same would happen if tipping was gone, altogether?

Oh - and servers *do* get fired. And plenty of times, it's an irate, over bearing customer who demands such, and it's done on-the-spot.

I don't know about the word "best." I just came back from Europe where I had some excellent wait staff and they were essentially not earning tips. But that's beside the point.
I didn't mean to imply that those who stiff waiters out of "protest" are correct. Yes, we do need to take up the issue with our representatives, and I was just indicating that I wish we would do so.

took

 

[N.Bailey]

I'm pretty sure she was being sarcastic when she said that.

I didn't pick up on the sarcasm, but do apologize if I misinterpreted what was intended.

 

[LuvCuteBoys]

Putting words in your mouth?? Huh? I had to do extra copying and pasting, and bolding - to keep the statement you brought from another poster, into what I quoted from you. And then, I answered him - you - whoever. It was your post.

Overreacting? Really? I'm not the one getting upset for being quoted.

You laughed at me and wondered why I thought servers were an underground group of non-tax-payers. And you didn't answer me. That's why I repeated the question; because I didn't know the answer. Still don't.

It's not up to the general public to 'supplement' a paycheck? That's rich.

So you're agreeing with me? Or not? I can't tell. Either way, it's not my responsibility. It's my choice to leave a gift if I wish to. It's certainly not my obligation.

Steal? This is NEVER going to hold up in a court of law. NEVER! It's not theft and your attitude of entitlement really bewilders me.

I'm pretty sure she was being sarcastic when she said that.

No, I'm pretty sure she was being serious.

 

[C.Ann]

you know this whole debate on to tip or not tip is rather STUPID -

this is simple the tip should be earned and not demanded otherwise it is NOT a tip!!!

i have been a waitress for quite some time when i was younger fyi...


this is the problem now a days everyone demands things like they are entitled to it somehow without earning a thing! ...

Amen!!

 

[CathrynRose]

I never worked anywhere that reported credit card tips as tips received. It's always been based on % of sales (8%). I honestly cannot even wrap my head around a way a restaurant could keep track of this (unless every tip is on file). There would be no way for the management staff to separate all that.

Where on earth did you work?? And when?? I'm 36 - and haven't served for over 10 years - and every place I worked, they most certainly could keep track of credit card tips. It's that little button on the credit card machine - reports.

I'd suggest if you work in such a restaurant that you seek new employment ASAP. I have NEVER in my life witnessed anyone being fired because of the way irrational guests have treated them. As a matter of fact, in 12 years, I probably only came across 2 people that I'd call irrational.
.

Good for you. I have.

And I no longer serve. I've stated that a few times.

I also stated good service = good tip.

Steal? This is NEVER going to hold up in a court of law. NEVER! It's not theft and your attitude of entitlement really bewilders me.

What are you talking about? Do you even know which post I was referring to? Did you see what was quoted?

Do me a favor? Find my 'sense of entitlement' post. I'm curious.

You laughed at me and wondered why I thought servers were an underground group of non-tax-payers. And you didn't answer me. That's why I repeated the question; because I didn't know the answer. Still don't.
.

Yes I did. More than once. In fact - it's in this post, as well.


This is getting ridiculous.

 

[LuvCuteBoys]

No, you didn't. One person commented on it but didn't know the answer either.

I'm glad you're having fun though.

 

[CathrynRose]

No, you didn't. One person commented on it but didn't know the answer either.

I'm glad you're having fun though.

Are you serious? What on earth are you talking about? Having fun with what?

I do know the answer, and gave it to you. Go ahead and search my posts, and you can find it again.

 

[CathrynRose]

Here you go: http://disboards.com/showpost.php?p=34403899&postcount=210

And if you think I'm 'laughing at you' when I copied your entire post - and even referred to the poster YOU QUOTED in my reply, then I don't even know what else to say to you.

 

[N.Bailey]

Where on earth did you work?? And when?? I'm 36 - and haven't served for over 10 years - and every place I worked, they most certainly could keep track of credit card tips. It's that little button on the credit card machine - reports.




Good for you. I have.

And I no longer serve. I've stated that a few times.

I also stated good service = good tip.



What are you talking about? Do you even know which post I was referring to? Did you see what was quoted?




Yes I did. More than once. In fact - it's in this post, as well.


This is getting ridiculous.

I worked in a restaurant where people did leave tips on credit cards. While the managers could see what was left as a tip, they couldn't differentiate what was left on credit and what was left on the table. You MUST report 8% of sales (in my store you'd get allocated if you didn't). That's what the IRS states. If they're automatically turning in your credit card tips for you, how would they determine what was cash tips? With many other servers to keep track of; not to mention every other employee, how is the management suppose to keep track of 20 to 30 servers cash tips and make sure they still report 8% of sales for cash tips and take it upon themselves to differentiate the credit card tip? I have never heard of ANYONE or any company automatically turning in credit card tips for you. You're expected in most places to turn tip reports in and you're suppose to turn those credit card tips in alongside your cash tips each week.

I am well versed that some restaurants (usually smaller places), turn in a % of sales each week divided by servers, or server hours worked to divvy the tips out amongst the waitstaff. These types of places don't require any sort of tip reports at all. Even in them, credit cards tips are treated the same, 8% is assumed tip even if a 50% is left.

I've had friends in the restaurant business in just about every chain imaginable. No one that I am aware of; and waitresses like to discuss tips with one another, so it's a topic that comes up a lot when you're all waiting tables, no company that I'm aware of ever automatically turned in the credit card tips for any server.

--------------------------

What was I talking about what I addressed your post about it being ok to steal from the waitstaff? I addressed that it is NOT stealing, period.

 

[CathrynRose]

I worked in a restaurant where people did leave tips on credit cards. While the managers could see what was left as a tip, they couldn't differentiate what was left on credit and what was left on the table. You MUST report 8% of sales (in my store you'd get allocated if you didn't). That's what the IRS states. If they're automatically turning in your credit card tips for you, how would they determine what was cash tips? With many other servers to keep track of; not to mention every other employee, how is the management suppose to keep track of 20 to 30 servers cash tips and make sure they still report 8% of sales for cash tips and take it upon themselves to differentiate the credit card tip? I have never heard of ANYONE or any company automatically turning in credit card tips for you. You're expected in most places to turn tip reports in and you're suppose to turn those credit card tips in alongside your cash tips each week.

I am well versed that some restaurants (usually smaller places), turn in a % of sales each week divided by servers, or server hours worked to divvy the tips out amongst the waitstaff. These types of places don't require any sort of tip reports at all. Even in them, credit cards tips are treated the same, 8% is assumed tip even if a 50% is left.

I've had friends in the restaurant business in just about every chain imaginable. No one that I am aware of; and waitresses like to discuss tips with one another, so it's a topic that comes up a lot when you're all waiting tables, no company that I'm aware of ever automatically turned in the credit card tips for any server.

--------------------------

What was I talking about what I addressed your post about it being ok to steal from the waitstaff? I addressed that it is NOT stealing, period.

That's *your* opinion, OP. (as far as stealing) IMO - going into a restaurant, full knowing that server is 'tipping out' her bussers, bar, etc - and choosing not to tip *even if the service is fantastic* but because they don't like to, and making that server pay out of their own pocket to do that tip out, is IMO, stealing.


Easiest way to verify the CC tip reporting? Call any chain restaurant. They all do it.

Why do you think I'm making it up??? Why would I? That is what we *all* had to do. And this was 10+ years ago.

 

[merryweather20]

Here you go: http://disboards.com/showpost.php?p=34403899&postcount=210

And if you think I'm 'laughing at you' when I copied your entire post - and even referred to the poster YOU QUOTED in my reply, then I don't even know what else to say to you.

No her question is that since it was required, the restaurants should have to record it in their gross revenue, just like regular food sales. Your regular tips don't hit the company's income statement and I suspect these 18% fees don't either.

Since the restaurant wants them to be guaranteed, they shouldn't be treated like tips. When they are paid out to you it would be treated like regular salary or commission. I don't think it would matter alot up here (to the waitresses bottom-line, not the restaurant), but I don't know about the states.

 

[LuvCuteBoys]

Ya know what? I'm not willing to risk getting banned from here, so I think I'm done.

But if anyone knows the answer to whether or not the tax burden for a forced gratuity should be the responsibility of the restaurant as part of their profit, feel free to send me a message because I'm really curious.

Because now I actually wonder if the tax part of this equation has something to do with why a gratuity cannot be required. If the "gratuity" is required, the restaurant should also be collecting tax on said gratuity (which hurts my head)... yes? So the $16 or whatever it was, should be even higher still because the $16 should be taxed...?

 

[merryweather20]

That's *your* opinion, OP. (as far as stealing) IMO - going into a restaurant, full knowing that server is 'tipping out' her bussers, bar, etc - and choosing not to tip *even if the service is fantastic* but because they don't like to, and making that server pay out of their own pocket to do that tip out, is IMO, stealing.


Easiest way to verify the CC tip reporting? Call any chain restaurant. They all do it.

Why do you think I'm making it up??? Why would I? That is what we *all* had to do. And this was 10+ years ago.

I don't think anybody is talking about fantastic service here. I think most people here agree the large table that stiffed you are jerks.

But happygirl posted that she'd pretty much spit in a waitress's face before she'd leave no tip. If someone gives me no service again, like the no-cuttlery waitress, I have no problem leaving them no tip. I would never spit in someone's face.

 

[happygirl]

Ya know what? I'm not willing to risk getting banned from here, so I think I'm done.

But if anyone knows the answer to whether or not the tax burden for a forced gratuity should be the responsibility of the restaurant as part of their profit, feel free to send me a message because I'm really curious.

Because now I actually wonder if the tax part of this equation has something to do with why a gratuity cannot be required. If the "gratuity" is required, the restaurant should also be collecting tax on said gratuity (which hurts my head)... yes? So the $16 or whatever it was, should be even higher still because the $16 should be taxed...?

I wouildn't think the resturant would claimed the tip since the server gets the money not the restaurant

 

[happygirl]

I don't think anybody is talking about fantastic service here. I think most people here agree the large table that stiffed you are jerks.

But happygirl posted that she'd pretty much spit in a waitress's face before she'd leave no tip. If someone gives me no service again, like the no-cuttlery waitress, I have no problem leaving them no tip. I would never spit in someone's face.

OMG that isn't even close to what I said.

This is what I said
I can't image stiffing a server they would have to spit on my face and call me every name in the book and then some, for me not to leave them something

Huge Difference