Could DW Parks be Expanded?

[Fantasia79]

Close the monorail? I don't see it.

 

[George4]

"The one about closure for capacity is not...so 1-2 parks close for a couple of hours in the middle of the day on 12/24-25,12/31, 7/4, and Memorial Day?

Is that an issue? You just don't go on those days... Everybody knows that... Or should have enough common sense to figure it out.
It's not worth 360 days of infrastructure to accommodate 5."

The problem with this thought, is that they aren't only closed on those days. I have been there when they close in early December, June and July (not July 4). It isn't just those few days any more. There are more and more of them every year.

 

[clsteve]

The concern is warranted. As this has been developing for a long time...
The last 5 quizzical years of the previous CEO and now a staggering 10 of his tanning booth replacement. "Les Moonves lite"

I'm worried...as if there was any doubt of that...lol

Do they pay attention? I'm sure There is some random desk...somewhere... Staffed by a 31 year old with 9 years experience at Disney with a $31,000 salary he's "real proud of" that tracks this... They love info...

But what deaf ears does it die with?
When the boss has a heated
Toilet of solid gold in his aspen ski lodge that he's only been to 3 times (hypothetically...)...where's the concern?

I think the current regime...for park fans...will be looked back upon as operating under a smoke screen. They really have made a fundamental shift in the park experience - especially Florida - but haven't been questioned NEARLY enough...
And the "screen" was all that property acquisition... The "great healer" with Pixar (as if that wasnt gonna happen)...and marvel...and Lucas...

It's given too much street cred...for the part that's on the street.

That Star Wars movie better not be crap

Those deaf ears are spot on

Just looking at it totally objectively:

There are only so many hours in a day and only so many ways you can slice and dice 'em. We, just aren't getting the hours we want. For an Exec Team and BoD of a company the size of Disney, the least number of hours go to those established businesses that are churning the amount of return they expect on their investment.

That's us, Domestic P&R.

The rest and largest portion of their time is spent on 2 things: Investment (new markets, acquisitions, new projects - like films, etc.) and fighting Fires.

For the small amount of time, in comparison to the other lines of business, they spend on all of Parks and Resorts, the majority of that time is going to be spent on Asia/China (investment) and fighting fires (Paris).

CapEx follows a pretty similar curve.

Throw in personality in the form of legacy - that curve gets more skewed. Nobody's going to remember this Team for their domestic P&R Legacy. Their P&R legacy and history will be written on the 2 major bets they've made: Paris bailout and Shanghai.

It goes a long way to understanding the reason behind the 5 year, slow roll, plans for domestic, and why everything from maintenance, mono's, price hikes, food quality, etc., is a constant discussion, here.

We aren't getting the hours........

 

[rteetz]

"The one about closure for capacity is not...so 1-2 parks close for a couple of hours in the middle of the day on 12/24-25,12/31, 7/4, and Memorial Day?

Is that an issue? You just don't go on those days... Everybody knows that... Or should have enough common sense to figure it out.
It's not worth 360 days of infrastructure to accommodate 5."

The problem with this thought, is that they aren't only closed on those days. I have been there when they close in early December, June and July (not July 4). It isn't just those few days any more. There are more and more of them every year.

I can see June and July but I've never seen a phased closure in early December. And also with a phased closure it's only certain people who can't enter. And they haven't done a full closure in years I think.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I can see June and July but I've never seen a phased closure in early December. And also with a phased closure it's only certain people who can't enter. And they haven't done a full closure in years I think.

I don't think there's been a closure in the summer in probably 20 years... Other than 7/4 and that doesn't happen often.

Almost all closures are on 12-24/25/31 and 1/1...

And as in this years case... Usually a 11 closure and a 1-2 reopen..

Because its so disgusting in there people run for the hills.

Why, oh why...anyone would do that by choice will never be justified...

Memory that will last a lifetime? Yeah..you won't forget that experience.

As you pointed out..it's now a tiered closure as well. They could make it a tiered opening from the start if they wanted...

Are they worried about alienating off-site and day visitors? Not one molecules's worth...

And why should they? Those people have already proven that they haven't spent enough...by not booking Wilderness lodge at $545 a night for the week...

At least until tha converts to DVC

 

[George4]

But see, that's the problem. It started as just Christmas Day. Now it is Christmas Eve and New Years Eve. In 2013 and 2014, I was there the first and second Saturday's in December and Magic Kingdom closed both times (once with a monorail closure as well - disaster). In summer of 2014 in late June on a Saturday (forget the exact date), park closed for a few hours in the afternoon. All of this should be considered a problem. If your park is turning away guests on any day, you are losing revenue. Even if it is just a few hundred people, those are people that are less likely to come back (many that I saw were fuming angry at not being let in). Multiply that times 5 days now per year. Add that up over the past two years (at least). What happens when 5 days becomes 6, becomes 7, becomes more. If they aren't planning for the future, planning for future expanded visitor bases, then they are simply going to lose more revenue. Add to that, all of the people that are tired of waiting in 60 minute lines for most rides (all summer plus holiday times) and there are more and more people swearing off returning to the parks. Disney is not being proactive about some of these problems, and that shows very poor "visioning" and planning for the future.

I love the place, been going there since around 1978, and there were no closures in the early 80's and 90's. It is a relatively new phenomenon in the history of the parks, and Disney is not working to prevent it form getting worse. Will I still go in the near future? Absolutely. But Disney has already lost four of my neighbors who swear they will never go back because of the lines and the waiting for absolutely everything. That doesn't count the ones that think it is too expensive for what they are getting. It is about creating a value for your customer. People are willing to spend their money if they feel it is a good value. More and more people do not consider a Disney vacation a good value. That is a shame.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Sorry, George...

Less than a 2% closure rate for the year...
And even "closure" is misleading as it usually last for only a few hours...is just not a big problem from an operational standpoint...

Honestly...do you know how much money they make on those days? Because while th lines are long/packed...there are so many more people in the Giftshops on a particular day that the loss of the gate is more Than compensated for...

And remember that "capacity" is relative... They can put 125,000 or more in there on Christmas...but in June they may set a Lower "limit"...
Would they consider closing magic kingdom to push people to EPCOT or animal kingdom?

You betcha...and who's to stop them? The complex is its own special jurisdiction and municipal agency...

Walt Disney world is the closest thing to the Vatican in the US - fact.

The point is...and we see this alot...is that mass crowds are not a huge concern for the management...we are along way off...

Until large portions of the calendar are maxed out...there will be no great attention paid to this...

If the place starts filling up in October, November, April, and may...
Then we got something.

 

[George4]

Sorry, George...

Less than a 2% closure rate for the year...
And even "closure" is misleading as it usually last for only a few hours...is just not a big problem from an operational standpoint...

On this we agree. For now, it isn't a major problem, although I would argue that it is an issue. But 10-15 years ago, it was 0%. At what point does it become too high? Is it 3%, 4%, 10%? My only point is that they need to start planning for it now, before it gets too much - however "too much" is determined.