Continuing fallout from FP+ cost overruns

[NavyDad]

Thanks! Massive cost overruns with the MyMagic+ program in Florida, plus ominous budgeting issues looming for Shanghai’s woefully behind construction schedule, all sent Burbank bean counters diving under their desks in horror last fall. The result is that nearly every major addition for theme parks in North America is now shelved.... 1. We heard this rumor a couple of months ago, about additions in North America being shelved. 2. ...but not because of ominous budgeting issues looming in Shanghai. The very same Shanghai that JUST got a 800 million dollar investment from Disney and private Chinese investors in order to increase the expansion of the build?? Walt Disney Co. and its Chinese partner will invest an additional $800 million in a Shanghai theme park currently under construction, the media giant's chief executive, Robert Iger, said on Monday. "We decided we would accelerate the expansion of the park while we're building it," Mr. Iger said. "It's a huge vote of confidence not just in the market, but in this project." Shanghai Shendi owns 57% of Shanghai Disney Resort and Disney owns 43%. The companies' investments are proportional to their ownership shares. The additional money will be spent on new attractions and entertainment, Mr. Iger said at the Millken Institute Global Conference here. He didn't offer specific details. http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304163604579530321203227840 If the bean counters were diving under their desks last fall, why give Shanghai tons of money now in order to create even more attractions?

Careful - common sense takedown of unsubstantiated rumors does not support the kind of narrative we are trying to push around here....

 

[MillauFr]

I don't take anything from Internet bloggers as gospel.

As with any news in general you have to question the source. Even some major news organizations have no clue sometimes... "Dewey beats Truman"

Some of the internet bloggers are very good and I trust most everything they say... Nate Silver was spot on in the last election and I trust what he says. On these boards I trust Tikiman's info on the Poly renovations as he has been proven right many times.

 

[surferdave]

Have you seen how much those IT people cost now days? If you want the best the price is steep. I'm sure Disney has trouble hiring the best and brightest software engineers. They are more likely to work for Google, Amazon, Facebook, etc. That Disney is having problems with a major IT project is not surprising. They are very difficult and prone to problems.

Yes, that's what many of us said when Disney announced that they were going to develop this first of it's kind wonder system, in light of past experience with their IT products.

 

[NavyDad]

That obviously could be the case, but that doesn't seem likely to me. I am not a Star Wars fan, but it seems crystal clear that Star Wars has proven staying power and has a huge following. Avatar on the other hand has not proven anything yet, only had one of its movies released, and does not have the kind of following Star Wars does. There is no way Disney just figured that out.

I don't believe this is an either/or proposition. Creating an entirely new land with an independent entity who has creative control is a completely different type of project than re-theming areas of a park that has an established footprint where you own the movies and have complete control.

As has been stated before there has been zero indication that the Disney company in general and Disney Parks specifically are scaling back investment at all unless there is another down turn in the economy. They have done the complete opposite for the last 5 years.

This is basically a rumor put out to explain why previous rumors have not come to pass.....

 

[fairyprincess88]

James Cameron isn't just going to let the cut back anyway they want. He is like Rowling in the way that he is going to have it perfect. He is going to make sure they get it right down to the color of the leaf on a certain type of tree. So to believe that they just decided hey lets cut a ride is about as unbelievable as Star Wars land being announced next week. We just have to wait but until we have proof we only treat it as a rumor.

It's doubtful that Cameron has this level of control or even the level of control that Rowling has over at Universal. One of the reasons (besides not liking Disney's plans) that Rowling did not choose Disney was because they would not release full creative control to her. JKR commented herself that Universal was the only theme park company that granted her full creative control and decision making.

Disney is very much like Rowling in the regard that they always must have final word. I just can not see them giving Cameron any rights that would have him determining what they can and can not do or cut from their park.

 

[flicx]

I don't understand how it is so hard to believe. When you are over budget on another project 1 to 1.5 billion dollars and growing, something has got to give! Maybe it isn't true but I got to believe something is definitely going to get cut, if not many projects. After all that kind of money could come close to building another park!

 

[wendybeth75]

That obviously could be the case, but that doesn't seem likely to me.

I am not a Star Wars fan, but it seems crystal clear that Star Wars has proven staying power and has a huge following. Avatar on the other hand has not proven anything yet, only had one of its movies released, and does not have the kind of following Star Wars does. There is no way Disney just figured that out.

 

[mickeysgirl17]

Exactly.

I don't understand....with record attendance + higher prices (which, of course equals record profits,) are we assuming that now poor old Disney is broke? And now they must shutter the plans for future development in all parks?

Why has MyMagic+ cost so much?


I believe what I've heard is MyMagic+ was projected to cost <$1B and is now projected at $2B. Even $1B seems like a huge amount of money, so it's confusing to me where the money has gone.

I know where the money has gone. To a crappy new system called fp+ that will have to be modified at some point anyway because of kinks in the system as well as too many guests unhappy with it. In the long run, I don't see fp+ working, but in my opinion, legacy fp should of stayed and they should of used to money towards new attractions. While Disney is spending billions on fp+, Universal is building rides. If Disney has record attendance, its because people have to stay longer to do what they want. Standby lines are generally longer and headliners are getting harder to ride especially if you are in a tier park or if you don't rope drop.

 

[BeachClubBride]

Maybe they will ditch avatar land and build an area dedicated to cold weather animals...polar bears, penguins, reindeer....and some frozen rides?

 

[SuperRob]

In the long run, I don't see fp+ working, but in my opinion, legacy fp should of stayed and they should of used to money towards new attractions.

FastPass+ already is working. You may not LIKE it, but it is accomplishing what Disney wants it to, which is getting more guests through ride queues faster, and increasing spending per guest. It's not going anywhere, so you might as well figure out how to work with it.

 

[Jennasis]

Frankly Disney would be out of their mind stupid to not do something with Star Wars in the park in a BIG way with the movie slated for next December. Not saying they should have something built by then, but an announcement should be made either at this year's Destination D event or next summer's D23...IF they're smart.

And I'm talking WWOHP BIG. Not A ride. Not A dining experience. BIG BIG.

 

[jtowntoflorida]

Frankly Disney would be out of their mind stupid to not do something with Star Wars in the park in a BIG way with the movie slated for next December. Not saying they should have something built by then, but an announcement should be made either at this year's Destination D event or next summer's D23...IF they're smart.

And I'm talking WWOHP BIG. Not A ride. Not A dining experience. BIG BIG.

Absolutely. They should figure out how to build something fast in Orlando for once (maybe engage some of Universal's engineering/construction firms ) and have a full land opening to coincide with the movie's release. I think the movie release date is December 18, 2015. If they opened Star Wars Land at the same time, the entire Star Wars geekdom would probably plan visits to their mecca in Orlando.

It will never happen, but it's always nice to dream.

 

[RalphinSC]

It's doubtful that Cameron has this level of control or even the level of control that Rowling has over at Universal. One of the reasons (besides not liking Disney's plans) that Rowling did not choose Disney was because they would not release full creative control to her. JKR commented herself that Universal was the only theme park company that granted her full creative control and decision making.

Disney is very much like Rowling in the regard that they always must have final word. I just can not see them giving Cameron any rights that would have him determining what they can and can not do or cut from their park.

You might have to consider that perhaps Disney learned from their mistake with WWOHP and have given Cameron much more creative control than they have over past collaborations.

And whether he has a ton of control over it or not, I do think he'd at least be knowledgable enough on the project to correctly answer the question he was posed just a few days ago where he indicated that two rides were still on the drawing board.

I'd trust the word of a principal contributor to the project over whoever is ghostwriting for poor Al Lutz right now.

 

[OnSpaceshipEarth]

Oh no! I hope this isn't true!

I have been totally psyched about AK becoming a night-time park!

 

[ConnieB]

Who's surprised? Anyone? Anyone?

Not surprised, but happy to hear that they're not going to go crazy over Avatarland. Of course if money is an issue and there are no plans for expansions it also likely means no chance of Star Wars Land in the works to go with the new movies coming out. I had been reading rumors (or maybe just wishful thinking) that Lights Motorcars might go away to make room for Star Wars land. Now THAT I could get excited about!

 

[TLSnell1981]

Have you seen how much those IT people cost now days? If you want the best the price is steep. I'm sure Disney has trouble hiring the best and brightest software engineers. They are more likely to work for Google, Amazon, Facebook, etc. That Disney is having problems with a major IT project is not surprising. They are very difficult and prone to problems.

So uh..why do if halfway?

FastPass+ already is working. You may not LIKE it, but it is accomplishing what Disney wants it to, which is getting more guests through ride queues faster, and increasing spending per guest. It's not going anywhere, so you might as well figure out how to work with it.

They have NOT achieved this from me. MM, FP+, MDE..oh and DAS have me leaving the park and shopping in the malls. It isn't reliable and a pain in the behind.

 

[Mad Hattered]

This is the same Avatarland that Disney announced in 2011, right?

 

[lugnut33]

OK, this just out from Disney runs counter to what was posted by Al Lutz:

Disney has today revealed concept art for the new night show heading to Disney's Animal Kingdom.

According to Disney, “Rivers of Light” promises to be an innovative show unlike anything ever seen in Disney Parks, combining live music, floating lanterns, water screens and swirling animal imagery. The show will magically come to life on the broad, natural stage of the Discovery River, between Discovery Island and Expedition Everest, delighting our guests and truly capping off a full day of adventures at Disney’s Animal Kingdom.

Let's refresh our memories about what the blog said:

Avatarland for Disney’s Animal Kingdom, it appears, has now been scaled back to one flying simulator ride, a handful of shops, and a restaurant.

I'm not afraid to say it looks like he was wrong.

 

[OtherScott]

OK, this just out from Disney runs counter to what was posted by Al Lutz:

Let's refresh our memories about what the blog said:

I'm not afraid to say it looks like he was wrong.

Thanks for the update.

 

[damo]

OK, this just out from Disney runs counter to what was posted by Al Lutz:



Let's refresh our memories about what the blog said:



I'm not afraid to say it looks like he was wrong.

Does the new night show have anything to do with Avatarland?