Change in plans...

[TECHJPM]

We just ended up cancelling our stay at FW, and now we are going to stay off grounds for those 3 days before we check in to OKW. We just realized that we were paying @$400 for a site for 3 days. The prices are too high, and the economy isn't getting better. Has anyone else changed their plans because of the economy?

 

[akemper98]

We're going because of the economy 10 nights value season AAA discount partial hook-up ~$385.00. If I cook 3/4 of the time in my site, I don't see how I can beet that any where. Unless gas shoots up to $4 again.

 

[BigDaddyRog]

$400 for 3 nights???? Is that in the cabins? That sounds WAAAY off!

 

[beagles7278]

We are suppose to be there for 12 nights starting March 6th, but will likely be cancelling and camping closer to home in the summer. Our premium site was averaging around $117/nights, so the $400 doesn't sound way off.

 

[mh1973]

We are staying 10 nights in May in a preferred site and it is a little of $900. I can't believe I am paying that much to camp!

 

[Shan-man]

No, no... you are paying that much to camp at Fort Wilderness! To pay that much for a level pad, water spigot, sewer hole and an outlet would, admittedly, be insane. But you're going to Walt Disney World, staying in perhaps the most entertaining resort there*, taking all the comforts of home with you (even pets, for many of us), and doing it for less than $100 per day! What a bargain!!!




------------
*I've never heard of anybody going to the other resorts and not going to the Parks... have you?

 

[Stitch76]

I gotta agree with Shan-Man on this, your not just paying for a campsite, your paying for the Disney experience. To me having the Disney magic right outside my door from the second my kids wake up, to the second they go to sleep at night is worth a little more $$$.
There's no way we would ever stay off site. Our family has agreed to make Disney a (once every 2-3 years) trip, and save our money by skimping on the other vacations in between those years. It's Disney people, this is not the time for saving $$$, this is the time to splurge a little, be a kid again, and not worry about things like money for a few days.

 

[BradyBz12]

To pay that much for a level pad, water spigot, sewer hole and an outlet would, admittedly, be insane. But you're going to Walt Disney World, staying in perhaps the most entertaining resort there*, taking all the comforts of home with you (even pets, for many of us), and doing it for less than $100 per day! What a bargain!!!

 

[AuburnJen92]

Has anyone else changed their plans because of the economy?

Absolutely. I am not of the majority in the thread here and respectfully disagree with previous posters. I have watched Disney up the prices of the pads (which have had little improvement) and such over the years and feel the current levels of pricing are too extreme. Hence, we have cut WAY back because of the economy and for the mere fact that only a few of the campsites will be full hookups and most will be at the premium and preferred levels.

Since I live so close to Disney, some on the boards feel that I am one of the spoiled crowd that always whines about things, but when you see over the years what you used to get for a Disney dollar and what you get now, it is very disheartening. I have been going to FW since I was a child in the 70's with my grandparents, back when the bakery cart would come around to each campsite and when the train whistle would be the best sound a child could hear in the morning getting out of the camper. I know it can never go back to that, but $100 a night to camp is too much.

 

[auntie]

While I agree FW is a "magical" camping resort...campsite rates at well over $100.00 is an awful lot to pay for camping. It kind of makes you think that Disney is looking for the dollars from those folks with expensive coaches, as it does seem they are pricing a good portion of the camping community out with rates like that. I don't think it's an accident either.

 

[TheFlame]

Magical or not, we just canceled a 15 night stay that would have started this past Saturday. The beginning of the stay would have been $64 a night but for the other 10 days it would have been around $95 a night for a full hook-up. We decided that we were not going to pay it since they would not give us the AP discount and even with the discount, it is too much to pay for a campsite ANYWHERE! Don't get me wrong, we love FW and WDW, but since our last trip was just this past Thanksgiving, we feel that we would have been fools to take this trip and pay that price for a campsite when the future is so uncertain. May doesn't look good either at $80 or so a night for a full. MB here we come!

I am very glad we didn't go BTW, my mom had unexpected surgery yesterday and I would have been so upset if I wasn't here for her!

 

[DaddyDon]

Absolutely. I am not of the majority in the thread here and respectfully disagree with previous posters. I have watched Disney up the prices of the pads (which have had little improvement) and such over the years and feel the current levels of pricing are too extreme. Hence, we have cut WAY back because of the economy and for the mere fact that only a few of the campsites will be full hookups and most will be at the premium and preferred levels.

Since I live so close to Disney, some on the boards feel that I am one of the spoiled crowd that always whines about things, but when you see over the years what you used to get for a Disney dollar and what you get now, it is very disheartening. I have been going to FW since I was a child in the 70's with my grandparents, back when the bakery cart would come around to each campsite and when the train whistle would be the best sound a child could hear in the morning getting out of the camper. I know it can never go back to that, but $100 a night to camp is too much.

And people laughed at me when i complained when disney went to there pre holiday scale and i was not happy....
No the prices are getting out of hand.It may be disney...but 100.00 a nite

 

[Sinclare]

I have to agree that the prices are getting extreme for camping, even with some of the upgrades they are doing. However, it does have some off sets which keeps me coming back regardless. I'm going in June for 17 nights in a partial. With AAA discount for 4 adults and 3 children (well actually 2 of those children are Diseny Adults so that's an extra $30 a night tacked on which is extreme in my view), I'm paying 1003.24 for those 17 nights. That figures up to about $60 a night (at least I hope they already added in the extra adult fee). Now we tent camp so that's 7 people out of a possible 10 for $60 a night at Disney which isn't bad.

The real problem is that, the smaller the group the less of a value it gets to be. If it was just me and my son, then it would actually be more cost effective to fly down and stay in a value.

Still, I don't think I could consider anywhere else even a fraction of a vacation value that the Fort is. I would die of boredom at a regular campground anywhere else after being spoiled at FW. Even figuring in PAP's (which I stretch out and only buy every 3rd year), the PAP's average out to about $18 per day. So for camping, it runs ~$100 a day with tickets for me and him for a WDW vacation. Plus food and souvenirs of course.

I don't count my parents, sister, niece, and nephew in the equation because they just come along for the ride although I do usually buy their tickets as well. I would be there regardless so I just count the two of us for estimating cost of vacation.

I've considered things like renting/buying a ski/fishing boat and doing weekends at a local lake/camp ground but it's not actually any cheaper when you figure everything in and not as much to do in the long run. Even going someplace like the Smoky Mountains and camping for that length of time doesn't average out that much cheaper. A good camp site there in the summer will be at least $40-50 a night or over twice that for a decent motel; add in the fact that all there is to really do is shop, visit over priced arcades/racing carts, DollyWood (a few decent rides which get boring after a couple days), or hiking (which I love but even it gets old) and you end up spending just as much, if not more money.

Really the only price point justification I've been able to come up with is the gas cost to drive round trip to Orlando and even that's off set by the fact that when you get there, you park your car/truck and don't spend a dime on gas for the next two weeks.

So for now, I can't justify going anywhere else for the money I spend. If I'm going to take a vacation at all (and not just stay at home) then it might as well be to the Happiest Place On Earth

 

[auntie]

Absolutely. I am not of the majority in the thread here and respectfully disagree with previous posters. I have watched Disney up the prices of the pads (which have had little improvement) and such over the years and feel the current levels of pricing are too extreme. Hence, we have cut WAY back because of the economy and for the mere fact that only a few of the campsites will be full hookups and most will be at the premium and preferred levels.

Since I live so close to Disney, some on the boards feel that I am one of the spoiled crowd that always whines about things, but when you see over the years what you used to get for a Disney dollar and what you get now, it is very disheartening. I have been going to FW since I was a child in the 70's with my grandparents, back when the bakery cart would come around to each campsite and when the train whistle would be the best sound a child could hear in the morning getting out of the camper. I know it can never go back to that, but $100 a night to camp is too much.

I would think that during these tough economic times Disney would be counting on its Florida residents, or those in fairly close proximity to visit. Offering discounts of some sort. It annoys me that many of the discounts available to the resorts (even value) don't apply to the campground. At one time I could understand that, given the rates for a site were pretty reasonable already...considering the bang for your buck with FW and Disney. However, I can see where campers are re-evaluating their situations now, and weighing their options more carefully. Most who visit FW are towing a significant distance. While the price of gas is low now, (it's been creeping it's way back up here in NY) if it gets anything near what it was last summer, the "regular Joe" is gonna cancel that trip. It was one thing to suck it up and pay for the gas when you're getting a good rate on a campsite. You could figure in that you wouldn't have to eat ALL your meals out..that sort of thing. If that perfect storm of higher gas prices returns, and sites of $100+, I think FW may be a bit emptier than it has in the past. While I do know it's been the only resort continuously making money since 9-11, there are now the new components of higher gas prices and expenseive site fees which may have FW seeing a decline in business for the first time in a long time.

Even for the resorts and cabins this 7 days for the price of 4 "deal"..they have going now...I'm not sure what kind of a bargain that really is. You're paying full rack rate for the first 4 nights..and park passes are expensive for the first 4 days..then it's only $5.00 a day to extend your pass anyway. (wow you saved a $15.00 bucks..well that will pay for.....NOTHING in Disney ) I've found better bargains on rooms with a pin code or AP rate. Even public codes and Disney Visa codes. I've been lucky enough to never have paid full rack rate for a room. Been a shareholder since WAY back, when they actually offered great shareholder discounts of 40%...yep...40%! Those days are long gone.. It's crazy.
WHY do I keep going back...
While we are planning a Florida trip in May....it won't be to Disney. Between the rooms and passes..it's just not affodable. I guess we'll wait and see what they offer for the rest of the year, because I'd love to go back, but can't justify the expense right now.

 

[BibbidyBobbidyBoo]

The real problem is that, the smaller the group the less of a value it gets to be. If it was just me and my son, then it would actually be more cost effective to fly down and stay in a value.

I definitely agree with this. The only reason it's cheaper for us is because we're a family of 5 and at this point we'd have to pay more to stay at a more expensive resort or two rooms (or family suite) at a value.

I thought I remembered it being quite a bit cheaper years ago when we "considered" staying at FW in our trailer. But even with the price increases it's still cheaper for us only because we're a family of 5. If we were a family of 4- it might be cheaper or the same cost at a resort!

Also I think they are already noticing a decline in those staying at FW. I only say this because in the past we had a hard time even finding an opening for varying dates when i looked into staying there years ago- and everyone saying it's so booked you have to book WAY ahead to get a space- and that certainly seemed the case. But now... we had no problems recently booking space for during CHRISTMAS in 2009 and then short notice booking the week at FW for May 09. We booked that only a few months ahead of the date- that was unheard of a couple of years ago... that would have been booked solid back then. I was already preparing myself to find no availabilities and was quite surprised we had no problem booking for those dates with such short notice. So I think they are already realizing a difference atleast in how far ahead FW is booked solid.

But anyway- for us we're comparing resort cost (for us family of 5) vs FW and ofcourse FW wins (not just the cost but driving instead of flying, not having to eat all our meals at Disney restaurants, etc.) We weren't comparing other campsites to FW. KWIM?

(ps. our booking for premium campsites 12/20-12/26 2009 were $114 per night. We cancelled that when we changed to May 23-30th, 2009 and those are $93 per night. Our family of 5 cannot stay in a resort for near that amount)

 

[Shan-man]

I just wanted to say that even for two people, Fort Wilderness makes decent sense. If I decided to drive our van (20mpg) and stay in the All Stars for 10 nights, the cost for gas, room, and tax is nearly $1100 (during our favorite time of year, early December). To drive our gas-hog of a motorhome (7mpg) and spend 10 nights in a Premium site is about $1200. Knock it down to a Preferred site, and the two are dead even.

Frankly, if you gave me the room free I'd have a hard time getting excited about staying at the AS, much less if it cost within a $100 of a Fort stay! Move up to CBR and you are talking $500 cheaper to stay at FW... and I'd be none too excited about CBR, either! Sure, I guess I'd like to stay at AK in a concierge room once, so I could do the Sunrise Safari ($700/nt), and a couple nights in the Poly might be cool if it had a MK view ($500/nt), or maybe a weekend at the Yacht Club ($400/nt) so I could enjoy that pool, but really, there is almost no where I'd rather stay than the Fort, even in my jalopy of a camper... and I wouldn't care to stay at those other resorts very long. I could spend a month or three at the Fort! And I could do it with my pups, which means a happy wife!

Just my 2¢

 

[AuburnJen92]

I would think that during these tough economic times Disney would be counting on its Florida residents, or those in fairly close proximity to visit. Offering discounts of some sort. It annoys me that many of the discounts available to the resorts (even value) don't apply to the campground. At one time I could understand that, given the rates for a site were pretty reasonable already...considering the bang for your buck with FW and Disney. However, I can see where campers are re-evaluating their situations now, and weighing their options more carefully. Most who visit FW are towing a significant distance. While the price of gas is low now, (it's been creeping it's way back up here in NY) if it gets anything near what it was last summer, the "regular Joe" is gonna cancel that trip. It was one thing to suck it up and pay for the gas when you're getting a good rate on a campsite. You could figure in that you wouldn't have to eat ALL your meals out..that sort of thing. If that perfect storm of higher gas prices returns, and sites of $100+, I think FW may be a bit emptier than it has in the past. While I do know it's been the only resort continuously making money since 9-11, there are now the new components of higher gas prices and expenseive site fees which may have FW seeing a decline in business for the first time in a long time.

Back in 2001, when Disney was hurting, they relied, as they always have done in the past, on the FL residents to bail them out. For some reason this time around, they are still clinging to the hopes and dreams of the people who are "saving" up all year to go for the once in a year or lifetime trip so that they can rake in as much as they can. The problem is that the times are so bad that the saving is really that. People are saving because they HAVE to in order to prepare for the worst. Everyone I talk to down here in FL are having their jobs threatened. I called a couple of days ago to try to apply a discount to our ressie in June/July and was flat told by the CM that because it is 15 nights (I made it a year ago) that there are no discounts that are applicable to it. I asked why and she said that stays over 14 days cannot receive discounts. So, I knocked a day off, still nothing. If they don't do something to their tiered system of charging out the woohoo, I will cut way back on that reservation, way back.

For those of you who think Disney is justified in charging this, I will disagree with you until my last breath. FW one of the first places on property that paid for itself and has been a profit maker for them since day one. They have done little to improve it over the years, yet, during the past decade, have increased the prices more than 2 fold. Auntie is right, gas is creeping back up, despite crude oil being in the $30 a barrel range. Why? because the oil companies are shutting down refineries due to the law of supply and demand and sometimes greed. Yes, FW is a wonderful place to be and I love going there, however, I don't bring a herd of people with me and even though 114 miles is not a lot to travel one way, it is a chunk to pay $100 a night when I also have to go to the grocery store, the gas station and pay the diesel bill and everything else associated with camping. Yes, I CHOSE to live this lifestyle and go camping in my RV, pay the payments and insurance and such. I did not choose this lifestyle to pay Disney more money than it costs to rent a value resort hotel (and they clean up after you) to rent a campsite.

I understand that many of you don't get down here often and that some of us poo pooing the magic for you is unsettling, but you really need to know the subtle things that go on, or else you just accept it and go on without any background or knowledge. Disney would be happy if you did that. I chose to inform people so that maybe, like the boat situation with the WL last year, something will ultimately be done about it for the greater good of the people who visit FW.

 

[Shan-man]

I have no interest in arguing this unto anybody's last breath, but I do want to counter at least one statement:

I did not choose this lifestyle to pay Disney more money than it costs to rent a value resort hotel (and they clean up after you) to rent a campsite.

I ran the numbers in a previous post, and I cannot stay at a the cheapest Disney resort for less than the cost of a Preferred site. Not without some kinda discount anyhow. And they give those discounts because their occupancy is dangerously close to not covering their operating expenses. When the Fort's occupancy is so low that they don't cover expenses you'll see discount codes for the Fort too.

I have not been a lifelong Fort'er, so I can't really speak to the incessant rise in campsite prices, but I have been going to the World for an awful long time and though I find the prices of todays park passes a bit painful, I don't look back at my $18 ticket stubs and sneer. Trying to judge where we are by comparing to what once was is a recipe for dissatisfaction. If I judged Epcot that way I would rather they cut their price by $60 and bring back Horizons and World of Motion! Take me back to the '80s, Baby! I think it is more useful to listen to newbies to the Fort (like the Podcast team) rave about what a great value it is.

Just my 2¢, I'll shut up now.

 

[auntie]

Hey .. you KNOW we don't like optimists here...have you been partying with rock stars?... ..or is it a little too much Kungaloosh lately?...
Must be the whole "santa" thing you have goin' on!

Just kidding..we love ya to death!

 

[Shan-man]

Yeah, I know I run the risk of being alienated by being optimistic! But hey, at least I'm not skinny! We really hate skinny people around here! LOL I do think the old saying that "familiarity breeds contempt" tends to be true... not that it has to be true, but left unchecked it will be true. I think the way to check it is to remind yourself of the unchanging things that first attracted you, and embrace the new things that appeal to you, and rest you can either try to change or learn to deal with. To complain against the thngs you cannot change and to make them the focus of your attention can only leave you jaded. That goes for any object of your affections. I sure don't want anybody around here to be jaded against the Fort... even the skinny folks!