Can anyone tell me about flying with a child in lap

[leshunlenese]

I would hope that you also ask to be re-seated if the person next to you is using a laptop, dvd player or something similar.

I would imagine that it's just as likely, if not more so, to become airborne during turbulence.

will be seating with family

 

[bumbershoot]

It's really not that big of a deal flying with a lap baby.

I don't find it dangerous at all. ...why would the airlines allow this for children under two if it was "so irresponsible"?

OP, you'll be fine so don't worry.

If you even read my post on the first page, you would see that not every child is "not that big a deal" to have as a lap baby. It really messed with the start (and anticipation of the end, and once we got home) of our vacation, because I was so exhausted. And you never know what sort of flight you're going to have, and what mood your kidlet will be in, until it's waaaaaaay too late.

It's dangerous because of *turbulence*, as I said in my reply, which was intended to help the OP understand what she might be in for [because I personally wish I could have known *ahead of time* what I was going to be dealing with]. There have been flights with sudden, severe turbulence that have sent people towards the ceiling, if they aren't buckled in. A lap baby shouldn't be buckled in (I've seen FAs tell people to get their kids out from their seatbelt), so they could much more easily go flying in such turbulence.

The FAA hasn't made it a requirement because of statistics. YES, statistically we're safer in the air than in a car. Remember though, statistics like that mean nothing if you are the one in the severe turbulence. Statistics don't extrapolate to one personal experience. But it's also because of money, because they would lose travelers if the travelers had to pay for seats for babies.

 

[jsilvers]

I don't find it dangerous at all. It's an airplane. If it's going down you all are going down no matter if you're in a seat or not.

Not remotely true. Many aircraft accidents are survivable - if one is properly secured. An example is United 232, which crashed in Sioux City in 1989; even though the aircraft flipped over and broke up, most of those aboard survived, but one of the lap infants did not.

"Not all the love in the world could hold a child under those conditions. It's like playing Russian roulette to put them on a lap." -- http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/06/09/earlyshow/contributors/susankoeppen/main6564141.shtml

 

[goofy4tink]

Wow! this is not a debate we all have opinons. Thank you and thank u for everyone who actually read my first post about tips or suggestions with flying with a lap child. if there is no way u will ride a plane with a lap baby then why r yall on here..when i said its not an option or for discussion thats what i meant. i have read threads about lap babies and they all end up as a debate and i was trying to avoid that. i honestly believe its safer to be in my lap on a plane than in a car in a car seat but that does not mean im going to suggest to others that they shouldnt take a child in a car. We all have our opinons and what works for others does not for another.I Think it is very rude for others to say i dont care about my child because i will fly him in my lap i was on bed rest for 5 months for this one so dont even dare to say that. if anyone wants to gadly make another seat on the plane or pay for cancelltation on one reservation and pay for another seat please be my guest!

No debate here. You need to understand that it isn't about plane crashes here. It is about sudden, unexpected turbulance. There is no way you are going to be able to hold onto a baby if that plane drops 1500'. No, it doesn't happen often, but if it did happen, and it was your baby bouncing off the overhead, perhaps you would feel differently.

then dont put out there that i should buy a seat. it made it seem as if i should buy a seat for my child or not fly at all. dont say "dont fly at all" if money is a concern and i wouldnt have bought it up.if u are not here to answer my question then leave. my child is number one no matter what anyone thinks.

Ah...nobody has to 'leave' just because they have a differing opinion here. If someone doesn't like what is being posted, they have the option of not opening the thread and posting to it. It will surely die and drop out of sight.

It's really not that big of a deal flying with a lap baby. I have three children and have done it several times with all of them at various times.

Yes you have to keep them busy, yes it's tiring for you. I found my little ones often fell asleep with a bottle on my lap.

I don't find it dangerous at all. It's an airplane. If it's going down you all are going down no matter if you're in a seat or not. Just my two cents and I'm sure I'll get flamed for that, but the way I look at it, why would the airlines allow this for children under two if it was "so irresponsible"?

OP, you'll be fine so don't worry.

Here's the issue, in a nutshell. I'm sure there are very responsible parents out there, flying with lap babies. BUT...I have been seated in front of lap babies in the past and it wasn't a particularly pleasant experience for me. Mom allowed that baby, close to the age of not being a lap baby based on size and behaviours, to continually kick my seat. Then, when junior pulled himself up, on the seat back and started poking at me, his mom says...'Look, he's trying to make new friends!!!' Ah no...he's just really annoying!
I've been seated in front of kids that are being held on laps when they have a meltdown...stretching those little bodies out, legs straight, screaming in distress....not fun to be in front of.

Again, I am fully aware that not all parents allow this with their lap babies. But it happens more often than not. I have seen very nicely behaved babies, sleeping away in their parents' laps.
I'm just more concerned with a sudden issue and the ability to hold onto that child.


It is fine to offer differing opinions here as long as it is done politely. We can agree to disagree. I, for one, would like to see the airlines stop the practice of allowing lap babies. But, that's just my opinion. No one needs to agree with that.

 

[ccgirl]

Not remotely true. Many aircraft accidents are survivable - if one is properly secured. An example is United 232, which crashed in Sioux City in 1989; even though the aircraft flipped over and broke up, most of those aboard survived, but one of the lap infants did not.

"Not all the love in the world could hold a child under those conditions. It's like playing Russian roulette to put them on a lap." -- http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/06/09/earlyshow/contributors/susankoeppen/main6564141.shtml

While I agree with the premise here; in the issue of fairness I would like to point out that 99 others died along with the lap baby.

 

[uva185]

While I agree with the premise here; in the issue of fairness I would like to point out that 99 others died along with the lap baby.

In crashes like that where you sit on the plane can play a major factor. Some areas of the plane experience greater g-force when it flips, turns, etc and some just die based on where the plane breaks apart. Its worth nothing the Mother of the lap baby survived.

"More than 100 people died -- including a 22-month-old lap baby. His mom, who was belted in, survived." Source

You could certainly make the argument based on the Mother's survival that had the baby been belted into an adjacent seat he would have survived that particular crash.

I'm not a parent, but it surprises me to see the protective things a Mother will do for her child and at the same time refuse to pay extra for their own seat on a plane. It comes across as hypocritical and cheap.

 

[Disneyadore]

Just asking,not commenting but don't the American airlines use the "child belts"?

When the passengers have to fasten there belt every lap child get a special belt that is adjusted to the original belt the parents uses.
The FC adjust them every time when needed.

 

[BellePrincessBelle]

Just asking,not commenting but don't the American airlines use the "child belts"?

When the passengers have to fasten there belt every lap child get a special belt that is adjusted to the original belt the parents uses.
The FC adjust them every time when needed.

No, they do not. I am with the others of no lap child EVER.

 

[Disneyadore]

No, they do not. I am with the others of no lap child EVER.

Very strange but maybe they are only used by European air lines.
Can you imagen having an almost two year old child sitting on your lap for more than ten hours?
That must be hell for the parents,the child and the people surrounding them.

 

[uva185]

Just asking,not commenting but don't the American airlines use the "child belts"?

I've never seen "child belts" used or distributed on any flight I've taken (Neither International or Domestic carriers).

The closest thing I saw by searching "child belts" was this: http://www.kidsflysafe.com/

 

[Alexander]

Both of my kids flew as lap babies and on much longer flights than 1 hour. You need to do what you feel you need to do. As soon as I saw this thread, I knew it was going to turn into "You're a bad mom for not buying a seat." To each is own, but as I said, both of my kids flew as lap babies and I have no problem with others doing the same. You are more likely to have your baby harmed or killed by driving from Atlanta to Orlando WITH him in a car seat. Enjoy your flight and your trip, you'll be just fine.

 

[Disneyadore]

I've never seen "child belts" used or distributed on any flight I've taken (Neither International or Domestic carriers).

The closest thing I saw by searching "child belts" was this: http://www.kidsflysafe.com/

Next time I will take a better look when the crew buckles up the children.
The one I saw were specific from the air line ,they were marked with there brand name.
Its quite a hassle to install them. First mom has to wiggle and let the CM fasten the belt on her left hip,than the child has to "slip "into the belt and clicked to moms belt on the right.
The CM always do this themselves. ( for safety I suppose)

 

[ccgirl]

In crashes like that where you sit on the plane can play a major factor. Some areas of the plane experience greater g-force when it flips, turns, etc and some just die based on where the plane breaks apart. Its worth nothing the Mother of the lap baby survived.

"More than 100 people died -- including a 22-month-old lap baby. His mom, who was belted in, survived." Source

You could certainly make the argument based on the Mother's survival that had the baby been belted into an adjacent seat he would have survived that particular crash.

I'm not a parent, but it surprises me to see the protective things a Mother will do for her child and at the same time refuse to pay extra for their own seat on a plane. It comes across as hypocritical and cheap.

Yes, I did read the story. It made no mention if the people on either side of the mom also survived. So, it is quite possible that if the infant had been restrained they still could have possibly perished. I'm not taking either side here. I just wanted to state that the story didn't say exactly where all individuals were sitting or their ages/sizes. Just didn't want to make any assumptions here. We don't know what would have happened had the baby been buckled.

OP - please enjoy your trip!

 

[Phlip]

OP-you asked for tips/suggestions about flying with a lap child? My tip and suggestion is not to do it. I've done it, and never ever again! That was with a very well behaved baby, my DD. As prior posters said, it is not easy to fly with the best of children under the best circumstances and absolutely no fun at all with a difficult child under difficult circumstances! In my opinion, if you would like to enjoy your vacation and child, find a way to purchase a seat. With my DS, if we couldn't buy a seat, we didn't go. It was just not worth it. One thing that may work for you would be a sling or bjorn front baby carrier. I could never use them with my kids, but a lot of folks do. Make sure you bring plenty of snacks, bottles, binkies, etc. My DS had terrible ear pain on landing, DD still does.
Good Luck!

 

[My 2 princesses]

Just asking,not commenting but don't the American airlines use the "child belts"?

When the passengers have to fasten there belt every lap child get a special belt that is adjusted to the original belt the parents uses.
The FC adjust them every time when needed.

I have not seen this on any of the flights either in America or in Canada. I have used this on Emirates and Gulf Air, so it's not just a European thing as these airlines hubs are in the middle east. Strangely Gulf Air was in partnership with Air Canad and AC did not give out these belts but Gulf Air did.

 

[uva185]

Yes, I did read the story. It made no mention if the people on either side of the mom also survived. So, it is quite possible that if the infant had been restrained they still could have possibly perished. I'm not taking either side here. I just wanted to state that the story didn't say exactly where all individuals were sitting or their ages/sizes. Just didn't want to make any assumptions here. We don't know what would have happened had the baby been buckled.

OP - please enjoy your trip!

Well here are the facts straight from the NTSB report.

According to the NTSB report (Section 1.15.2) the 4 mothers of the lap babies were in seats 11F, 12B, 14J, and 22E. The seating configuration for this plane was AB-CDEFG-HJ.

According to the Seat Injury Map:
-The person adjacent to 11F suffered minor injuries.
-The person adjacent to 12B suffered no injuries.
-The person adjacent to 14J suffered minor injuries.
-The person to the right of 22E suffered minor injuries, the person to the left of 22E was killed due to smoke inhalation.

NTSB Report - 1.15.2 Infants
There were four in-lap occupants onboard flight 232. Three of
them were under 24 months, and one was 26 months old.
During preparations for the emergency landing, the parents were instructed to place
their "infants" on the floor and to hold them there when the parent assumed
the protective brace position. The four in-lap occupants were held on the
floor by adults who occupied seats 11F, 12B, 14J and 22E.

The woman in 14J stated that her son "flew up in the air" upon
impact but that she was able to grab him and hold onto him. Details of what
happened to the 26-month-old child at 12B during the impact sequence are not
known, but he sustained minor injuries. The mother of the 11-month-old girl
at 11F said that she had problems placing and keeping her daughter on the
floor because she was screaming and trying to stand up. The mother of the
23-month-old at 22E was worried about her son's position. She kept asking
the flight attendants for more specific instructions about the brace position
and her "special situation with a child on the floor." The mothers of the
infants in seats 11F and 22E were unable to hold onto their infants and were
unable to find them after the airplane impacted the ground. The infant
originally located at 11F was rescued from the fuselage by a passenger who
heard her cries and reentered the fuselage. The infant held on the floor in
front of seat 22E died of asphyxia secondary to smoke inhalation. The Safety
Board addressed the infant restraint issue in Safety Recommendations
A-90-78 and A-90-79 issued May 30, 1990..

Also worth noting "a 32-month-old boy seated in 17G was given pillows to tighten his seat belt. He remained restrained during the impact sequence and was not injured."

 

[Disneyadore]

I have not seen this on any of the flights either in America or in Canada. I have used this on Emirates and Gulf Air, so it's not just a European thing as these airlines hubs are in the middle east. Strangely Gulf Air was in partnership with Air Canad and AC did not give out these belts but Gulf Air did.

I knew I had to make a picture last time we flew.
Next year I will be prepared with my Sony camera .

 

[ccgirl]

Well here are the facts straight from the NTSB report.

According to the NTSB report (Section 1.15.2) the 4 mothers of the lap babies were in seats 11F, 12B, 14J, and 22E. The seating configuration for this plane was AB-CDEFG-HJ.

According to the Seat Injury Map:
-The person adjacent to 11F suffered minor injuries.
-The person adjacent to 12B suffered no injuries.
-The person adjacent to 14J suffered minor injuries.
-The person to the right of 22E suffered minor injuries, the person to the left of 22E was killed due to smoke inhalation.




Also worth noting "a 32-month-old boy seated in 17G was given pillows to tighten his seat belt. He remained restrained during the impact sequence and was not injured."

Thanks for the thorough investigation and for posting the injuries. I see the person next to the mom also died. Such a tragic situation for everyone.

OP- another thing to be aware of is that it is difficult to put the tray table down with the infant on your lap. I wasn't aware of that when I flew. I would call your airline to see if the Baby Bjorn is allowed. There seems to be conflicting reports of that. My son slept great in it and didn't bobble at all during the flight.

Good luck with your decision.

 

[jodifla]

Well here are the facts straight from the NTSB report.

According to the NTSB report (Section 1.15.2) the 4 mothers of the lap babies were in seats 11F, 12B, 14J, and 22E. The seating configuration for this plane was AB-CDEFG-HJ.

According to the Seat Injury Map:
-The person adjacent to 11F suffered minor injuries.
-The person adjacent to 12B suffered no injuries.
-The person adjacent to 14J suffered minor injuries.
-The person to the right of 22E suffered minor injuries, the person to the left of 22E was killed due to smoke inhalation.



Also worth noting "a 32-month-old boy seated in 17G was given pillows to tighten his seat belt. He remained restrained during the impact sequence and was not injured."

So, the infant died not due to trauma, but to smoke inhalation?

 

[tjmw2727]

Thanks for the thorough investigation and for posting the injuries. I see the person next to the mom also died. Such a tragic situation for everyone.

OP- another thing to be aware of is that it is difficult to put the tray table down with the infant on your lap. I wasn't aware of that when I flew. I would call your airline to see if the Baby Bjorn is allowed. There seems to be conflicting reports of that. My son slept great in it and didn't bobble at all during the flight.

Good luck with your decision.

FAA regulations prohibit the use of any device that is not approved for airline use. This includes front carriers, belly belts and other devices. Unless the carrier/device has a label indicating it is "approved for use on aircraft" then it its prohibited.

As mentioned upthread, using these or belting the child in your seatbelt will result in your baby acting as your airbag in the event of turbulance or worse.

Just check any airlines website to confirm this - here is the section from American Airlines:

FAA Non-Approved Infant Seat or Child Restraint Devices;
The following may not be used when an infant seat or child restraint device is required:

Any device without an approval label
Booster seats with no approval label or shoulder harness
Vest and/or harness-type devices except Aviation Child Safety Devices (ACSD) bearing FAA aircraft approval labels
Belt extensions that attach to the parent or the parent's restraint
Any device that positions a child on the lap or chest of an adult