Camera for college photography classes?

[LisaR]

I would love some help with this since I know nothing about cameras. My DD is really into photography. She uses a cheap Kodak digital camera and manages to get awesome pictures. She has been told by quite a few people that she has a natural eye for this. I have tried to find a photography class for her for years without any luck.

She is dual enrolled at the community college and they offer two options. One class is a photography class for non-majors. It requires a DSLR. Her friend took it this past semester and hated it. While they did take pictures, much of the class was actually spent writing papers about cameras and photography. DD does not want to take that class now.

We talked to an adviser today and they said she could take the classes that are designed for a photography certificate in addition to going for her AA. These classes sound much more promising. From the colleges website, the descriptions only say they need a digital camera. Nothing more specific. A DSLR is not required according to the adviser. There is only one class that has a specific requirement:
35 mm fully adjustable camera with manual capabilities. Aren't these the older cameras - somewhat outdated? Does this sound like something one would start out using? These aren't digital, are they? She would only need it for the one class but would still need a digital for the other classes.

The classes are Photography 1 (this is the one that requires the 35mm), Photojournalism, Photography w/ digital camera, Portraiture, Portfolio Development, Digital Imaging, and Advanced Digital Photography.

Any help, suggestions or opinions on the classes or a camera would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

 

[ukcatfan]

Check out the used stuff at KEH.com and at B&H and Adorama. If you go with any of the main brands (except Olympus since they changed mounts), you can get a film camera that uses some of the same lenses as the digital DSLRs. If she is really serious, then a DSLR is the way to go. Since it is my brand of choice, I suggest looking at the Pentax K-x DSLR. Then add a used film body and a used 50mm and she is set for the class and for growth. One of the nice things about Pentax is that all of their old lenses work on the new DSLRs. The K-x is a really great camera for the price. It is hard to beat in the bang for the buck. The lens that comes with the K-x would not work on the film since it is a designed for digital lens, so that is why I suggest a 50mm to go with the film body. Then after the class is over, she still has a nice 50mm to use with the DSLR.

 

[disneyboy2003]

If your daughter is really into photography, then getting a dSLR camera is the way to go. Honestly, any of the entry-level dSLR cameras will work for your daughter's upcoming photography classes, so it doesn't matter whether you buy a Canon, Nikon, Sony, Pentax, Olympus, etc.

Those college photography classes sound very academic. If that's not your daughter's style of learning photography, then see if there's an adult education night class (usually offered by local community colleges) on photography. Or see if your local camera store offers an Intro to Digital Photography class. These would be more hands-on, "go out and take lots of pictures" type classes.

Or, if your daughter is pretty self-motivated, there are plenty of great books on photography at your local bookstore and local library. There are literally *dozens* of different Intro to Digital Photography books at your local bookstore, so have her check them out.

Also, since your daughter's in school, take advantage of student pricing for whatever photography software she'll need, like Photoshop, Lightroom vs Aperture vs Bibble, etc.

Hope that helps!


Yay! My 500th post!

 

[photo_chick]

The class she needs a film camera for probably teaches darkroom techniques. (my photo I class was all about black and white printing in the darkroom, as well as how to make an exposure. I gained a good 85% of the technical knowledge I have in that class.) Many photo programs still start with the traditional film, even though they teach digital as well. The skills you learn in the darkroom and with film will translate to digital.

Check for used gear. Or see if the school has a camera she can check out... they often do. And if she's planning to keep at this get the same mount for your film camera as whatever she wants to get for a DSLR... for example I shot with a 35mm Canon Rebel so I got a Canon DSLR. I can share my film lenses with my DSLR that way. Nikon and Pentax also kept the same mount that they were using in their 35mm cameras when DSLR's came out.

Edited to add.... I'm slow... I just realized some of what I said was already said.

And fair warning... many a darkroom junkie has come out of photo 1. You may find yourself with a closet holding an enlarger and develping trays and a sink full of reels if she really gets into it.

 

[AlbertZeroK]

A Canon AE1 is a very popular manual 35mm camera. I'd get one of these with a 50mm lens. Shouldn't cost you much used.

Personally, I shoot canon and would recommend a Canon T1i. 50D or 7D if you can afford it. I'd also look at possibly the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 because it's about $300 and can do macro photography and is great for low light shooting. Or even the Sigma 50mm f/1.4 for $500.

 

[LisaR]

Thanks everyone! Unfortunately, I only understood about half of what you said.

Let me recap what I think you guys are saying. DSLR is the way to go. I can buy that in X brand and I can buy a 35mm body and lens in that same brand and everything will be interchangeable. The 35mm is a film camera, correct?

Since the first class requires the 35mm, I can buy that and add the same brand DSLR 16 weeks later when she takes the next class, right?

By the way, the college doesn't rent/loan cameras. I already checked.

Why wouldn't a DSLR be mandatory in any of these classes but they make it mandatory for the "photography for non-majors" class? That seems strange if the DSLR is the camera of choose.

A lot of you mention buying the 35mm used. Where should I look for a used one? I am very leery about buying used since I don't know a thing about cameras. I don't think I would be comfortable buying off Craigslist. We only have one camera shop. I didn't ask if they sell any used items.

Thanks!

 

[AlbertZeroK]

You can buy used from:

keh.com
adorama.com
bhphotovideo.com

all three are VERY well thought of in the industry for used. Also, check with a local camera shop. One thing to remember, when buying a 35mm film camera and a manual focus lens, the lens may work on the Digital SLR, but it will still be manual focus, not really what you want these days. However, most consumer grade Digital SLR cameras come with an auto focus lens anyways.

 

[photo_chick]

A Canon AE1 is a very popular manual 35mm camera. I'd get one of these with a 50mm lens. Shouldn't cost you much used.

Personally, I shoot canon and would recommend a Canon T1i. 50D or 7D if you can afford it. I'd also look at possibly the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 because it's about $300 and can do macro photography and is great for low light shooting. Or even the Sigma 50mm f/1.4 for $500.

Here's where I'd skip the AE-1. You will spend less money on a used Rebel or Elan, which will more than do the job, and then you can share lenses with a Canon DSLR. The AE-1 is an FD mount and while they are awesome cameras, you can't use the lenses on an EOS camera.

Let me recap what I think you guys are saying. DSLR is the way to go. I can buy that in X brand and I can buy a 35mm body and lens in that same brand and everything will be interchangeable. The 35mm is a film camera, correct?

35mm is a film camera. No, everything is not interchangeable. You have to make sure the lens mounts match. Canon and Nikon both changed their mounts in the early 80's. Pentax has been the same for much longer.

With Canon you want an EOS camera. A Rebel or an Elan... that's if she wants to get a Canon DSLR. I'm not sure on Nikon which ones to point you to, maybe a Nikon user will speak up. Nikon some limitations with lens functionality on it's entry level DSLR's. (not Nikon bashing, just pointing that out) With Pentax you're wide open on what to get since their mount has been the same for so long and they make an adapter for the old mount.

Do not buy a flash or speedlight for the 35mm camera. You should not use the same one on a DSLR... there are voltage issues. She won't need one anyway, as photo 1 classes are all about available light.

Now that I've totally lost you..... To me, the easiest way may be for her to choose a DSLR she'd want to get down the road. Then find a 35mm camera that matches since it is a lot easier to go out and try out DSLR's in the store.

Why wouldn't a DSLR be mandatory in any of these classes but they make it mandatory for the "photography for non-majors" class? That seems strange if the DSLR is the camera of choose.

Because they are teaching the craft of photography... and that starts old school, with black and white film in a darkroom. Believe me, the work with film and in the darkroom will really help her understanding of the photographic process. And a digital camera isn't that different from a 35mm camera... the exposure is made the same way, it's just a different recording medium. The non-major classes most likely don't get very technical and probably focus more on basic usage and composition fundamentals... which are also usually covered in photo 1, it's just photo 1 for majors usually covers a whole lot more.

If she really gets into it, depending on how far the program goes, she may end up processing color film later and using medium and large format film cameras. That's when things get really fun.

 

[polkadotminnie]

A lot of you mention buying the 35mm used. Where should I look for a used one? I am very leery about buying used since I don't know a thing about cameras. I don't think I would be comfortable buying off Craigslist. We only have one camera shop. I didn't ask if they sell any used items.

Thanks!

I have bought 2 used cameras from B and H Photo online and have been extremely pleased with them.

 

[seashoreCM]

1. To learn photographic composition, any camera in the world, even a disposable film camera, will do. But I would recommend at least a run of the mill digital with the ubiquitous f/2.8 lens and 3x zoom. And of course the digital with its LCD viefinder lets you see (and critique) what you got very quickly.

2. To learn principles of light and the technical parts of photography, you should have a camera with manual adjustments, even though it may have automatic mode as well. The manual adjustments must include shutter speeds, f/stops, and ISO.

3. To learn darkroom techniques, you would need a film camera and also some black and white film. (Color developing can come later.)

Now the trick is to get one camera that fulfills #1 and #2. Many folks will go straight for a DSLR because they think they will continue to take advantage of its flexibility, and also the DSLR is almost mandatory to get lenses for low light photography.

In terms of optics, including ISO, film cameras and digital cameras work the same way.

Digital camera hints: http://www.cockam.com/digicam.htm