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PhotoPass photographers are Disney Cast Members.

ALL Disney Cast Members, at all Disney theme parks, are required to oblige any Guest who asks them to take a pic with the Guests camera.

Ergo, it's part of the photographers' job description to take pics of the Guest with the Guest's camera.

If you don't personally think it's right for Disney to require its "highly-trained" photographic professionals to take pics with the Guests' cameras, you are free to not ask.

And since I personally think it's fine, and it doesn't violate any Disney policies, I will not criticize anyone for doing so.

That's all I have to say about that.
 
I also think you are in the wrong. Their job is to make money selling pictures, not to do it for free. Also, I dated a photopass photographer, lets just say that they really have perfected that fake smile when guests ask to have their picture taken with a different camera.

I thought their job was to follow whatever policy their employer has in place?
 
Personally, I really don't care if they like it or not. That's irrelevant. I put on a big smile and was cheerful back in the days I bagged groceries for a living. Do you think I wanted to take groceries out to a customer's car in the pouring rain, especially when I knew I wasn't going to get a tip before I even put a can into a bag? But it didn't matter, because it was the job I was being paid to do. Nobody hires someone and then says, "These will be your duties ... unless you'd rather not." Disney is paying people to do a job. Either you like it (and I'm sure there are PhotoPass photographers who do like their jobs), or you don't like it but you suck it up and do the job anyway, or you find a different job.

Whether a cast member likes or doesn't like doing their job, my asking them to do it doesn't make me in the wrong.


ITA!:)

TC:cool1:
 
I bet if you got up in the ranks at Disney, they probably have done some marketing study on this very topic. They research everything to death there. So, if they have not proclaimed that the photographers are not allowed to use your camera, then they are alright with it and it does not matter an ounce what the actual photographer thinks. I guarantee that having designated photographers increases the productivity of the other employees not being asked to take shots as much anymore.

You will not find the photographers at character meals willing to use your camera b/c they have been told by their employer that it is not allowed. They will not even leave the shots with you for a few minutes to look over and decide like they used to do. They now hover over you until you decide.
 

They make money taking pictures. I've never had a photographer at the parks try to sell me a picture.

SSB

and by taking pictures that they (disney) cannot sell, it takes money away from the company. If they take 2 pictures for you, then thats two pictures they could have taken on their camera with someone else who might have possibly bought them.
 
i'd say at least 80% of people at disney have a camera.......and most P&S can take a decent shot out of the box.......so if its as simple as "hey take my picture and save me money" then why wouldn't everyone do that? Why even have photopass? A D70 on auto mode is practically a fancy point and shoot anyway right? If they were encouraged to take guests photos for free with the guests camera, nobody would use photopass.
 
and by taking pictures that they (disney) cannot sell, it takes money away from the company. If they take 2 pictures for you, then thats two pictures they could have taken on their camera with someone else who might have possibly bought them.
First, Disney allows it. They make the rules. They obviously have decided it makes good sense for them to do this. They cannot encourage or even allow cast members to do this and then blame them for doing it. And it doesn't take money away from the company -- it just keeps them from making as much as they theoretically might have made. You may think that's splitting hairs, but there's a difference between taking a loss and making slightly less profit.
MonoManBlue said:
i'd say at least 80% of people at disney have a camera
Based on what?
MonoManBlue said:
so if its as simple as "hey take my picture and save me money" then why wouldn't everyone do that? Why even have photopass? A D70 on auto mode is practically a fancy point and shoot anyway right? If they were encouraged to take guests photos for free with the guests camera, nobody would use photopass.
You do realize you're actually making my point for me, right? this hypothetical would be a good counter-argument, except for the fact that for for whatever reason, Disney has continued (even expanded, IIRC) the PhotoPass system. Now why would they do that if they're not making money from it?

Why indeed? Yet this doesn't happen. There are people who don't bother bringing their own cameras because they know Disney will do it. Maybe they like the special effects, or maybe they think they'll get better photos, or maybe they'd rather not carry a camera around the parks. All of those are reasons I could understand, even if I don't feel the same -- I'm sure there are other reasons.

As long as Disney allows it, I'll have PhotoPass photographers take a few shots with my camera. I could understand some concern if a guest tries to monopolize a PhotoPass photographer's time and tries to make him into a personal photographer, demanding hundreds of photos at a time. I'd daresay that wouldn't be fair to other guests (if other guests are waiting ... as they usually are), whether they're doing it with Disney's camera or the guest's.

But for the 8-10 photos I have them shoot for me on a typical three or four day trip, I don't feel bad at all. In addition to the convenience, I'm more comfortable having a cast member shoot my photos. I'm pretty confident a CM isn't going to run off with the camera -- with a random guest, I have no such guarantee. If the cast members don't like it, tough. If Disney decides that too many people are doing this and change the policy, I'll make other arrangements. It wouldn't kill me. If they decide they aren't making enough money and discontinue PhotoPass completely, then again, I'll make other arrangements. At that point, it will be Disney's fault for coming up with a system that ultimately didn't work, not mine for using a system they designed. What's next -- shall we be urged not to ride PotC, because otherwise it will wear out faster? Disney doesn't charge me a fee directly to ride it, either. Don't forget that very few guests get in the gate without laying out a substantial amount of money first. Silly analogy? Not at all; the rides are a much bigger draw in general, but the difference is one of degrees.

Again, I have spoken at length with PhotoPass photographers. I have no doubt some would rather not use my camera -- I have no doubt that some would rather not have to do anything, for that matter. But some were enthusiastic. Some have made unsolicited offers to use my camera; in other words, without my asking. As for the one you dated who purports to don a fake smile -- well, maybe she was a grump. Maybe she puts on a fake smile for everyone; or maybe she represents the typical PhotoPass cast member. I cannot say. I would love to think that the cast members I encounter like or even love their jobs, and I hope they do. I try to be respectful, polite and appreciative toward cast members, especially those who go above and beyond. They truly make the whole thing work. But when I go out to the parks, it isn't my job or my purpose to make the cast members feel good.

I can think of one reason why a PhotoPass photographer might prefer not use a guest's camera -- maybe they aren't comfortable handling a camera with which they're unfamiliar. That's understandable, but I imagine they'll get over that pretty quickly. I took a job as a delivery driver once, knowing I'd have to drive a truck with a manual transmission -- which I didn't know how to do. I took the job because I really needed a job. It took me a day or two to get comfortable driving the truck -- but I did it. I could have chosen not to do it. I could have quit at the first opportunity ... but that job was with a printing company, and I eventually used it as a springboard to better things I really wanted to do.

SSB
 
/
I buy the photo pass pics along with having them use my camera as well. Either shot, mine or theirs is free advertising when I show them off to friends and family. If they were losing money they would not allow/instruct their employees to do it. The higher ups at Disney are not idiots, they know what they're doing.
 
and by taking pictures that they (disney) cannot sell, it takes money away from the company. If they take 2 pictures for you, then thats two pictures they could have taken on their camera with someone else who might have possibly bought them.

I buy the photo pass pics along with having them use my camera as well. Either shot, mine or theirs is free advertising when I show them off to friends and family. If they were losing money they would not allow/instruct their employees to do it. The higher ups at Disney are not idiots, they know what they're doing.

MonoMan, I think you might be over estimating how important Photopass income is to Disney. Wenrob has it right. The decision makers know what they are doing. I would be willing to bet that they do not even worry about the whole thing even making money. It is a service no different than the rides or entertainment. Think of it this way. With the costs they have in the CD you buy, I doubt that they even make $50 per disk. Compare that to how much they bring in on gate fees, food, lodging, merchandise, etc. and the Photopass money is not even a blip on the radar. Using your logic, you should be just as upset with people that over utilize it and get 300+ shots. With that much labor cost into it, Disney likely ends up losing money on that person.
 
I also think you are in the wrong. Their job is to make money selling pictures, not to do it for free. Also, I dated a photopass photographer, lets just say that they really have perfected that fake smile when guests ask to have their picture taken with a different camera.

As compared to the CM's who serve hot dogs, clean bathrooms, or do a thousand other jobs at Disney whose smiles are more genuine? Or the millions of guests who all go back to their own jobs after their vacation is over and are also expected to do their job and be pleasent?

and by taking pictures that they (disney) cannot sell, it takes money away from the company. If they take 2 pictures for you, then thats two pictures they could have taken on their camera with someone else who might have possibly bought them.

Maybe Disney should ban all cameras in the parks and only allow photopass pictures to be taken- then they would sell way more pictures and make way more money. I mean really- why allow people to take their own pictures of their own family members in front of trademarked disney icons like the castle? This is a service offered by Disney and every camera-phone in the park is bleeding off potential Disney revenue. The bag search is already in place so it would not cost Disney anything to implement this policy immediately. :rolleyes1

Or maybe Disney is doing something right already. I skimmed this article and could not find anything on the Photopass program cutting into their $1.28 billion profit last quarter. In fact is said "Parks and resorts revenues grew 5 percent to $3.04 billion, despite the weak U.S. economy..." Maybe they are on to something by being more concerned their guests come away with a pleasent park experience than having complete focus on squeezing the last dime out of every soul who finds their way thru the turnstile.
 
I bought the CDs my last trip. $150 for about 400 photos. Of course, I could have 3000 for all they care. So:

That averages out to 38 cents per photo. A mere 38 cents for a photographer to take a minute or two to get the shot (Plus time/materials).

So, either
A) It a great service Disney provides with little or no intent to make profit; or more likely,
B) The bean counters know what they're doing, and the net profit for the whole Photopass service (printed or digital) is significant, and people using their own cameras does not play a major factor.

Personally, given the cost of their prints, and the extreme ease of dumping digitals to CDs, I'd say the whole service is a Cash Cow for Disney. People using their own cameras doesn't become an issue until the Cow croaks.
 
Bottom line is - all this talk of..........
whether they like taking pics with our cameras or not,
whether they are really professional photographers or not.
whether they wear fake smiles or not,
whether they get paid to take or sell photos
whether we think its right or not,

Its all irrelevent I'm afraid. If its in their contract that they should oblige a Disney guest when asked to take a photo using the guests own camera then thats where the matter starts and ends.
We can discuss this until we are MonoManBlue in the face (see what I did there :goodvibes ) and it still wont change a thing. It's their job, they have to do it. Same as me - I dont like my job but I have to do it or get a new job. End of story.
 
I don't know if everyone read all the posts on the other thread, but I'll state one of my points here...

What was it like before there was a Photopass Photographer?

People were still taking pictures in those same spots and MANY times a CM who happened to be walking by would offer to take or would be asked to take a picture for that family with that families camera.

So, someone in the Disney front office says "HEY! Why don't we ALSO hire more CM's, give them a camera and offer to sell pictures to not only those same people, but maybe other peoople who never thought of having their picture taken in that spot or they forgot their camera or for what ever reason. I'm mean, our employee's are ALREADY taking pictures for people, why don't we get in on this and MAKE SOME MONEY!!! We'll still take pictures for people with their camera's if that is what the guest chooses, but we'll also take pictures with OUR camera, give them a little card, then let them go online and maybe they'll buy a few. I'll be there are even people who would spend over $100 for their own CD of images. We'll offer that too. What a great way to make bring another revenue stream into the Disney Corp."

Before there was photopass, how many of you had a CM take a picture for you. Maybe not a lot, but there were more than a few people who had that experience with a CM. Before Photopass how many of you bought CD's with images on them? Um, yep,,,, zilch, zip, zero.

So now, Disney is making more money, the state of Florida is happy because Disney had to hire more people to take these pictures (taxes), guests are happy (well except those who think the photopass photographers are getting a raw deal.... :confused3 ) and they come back and spend more money. To quote a beer commercial.... "BRILLIANT!!"
 
When I've already been paid $7000 up-front to shoot a wedding, do you think I mind it when the bride's grandmother asks me if I can use her camera to take a picture of her and her husband at their table during the reception meal? I take her camera and say "smile". The referrals I get from that wedding alone will pay my mortgage. It's not worth losing those referrals over a single 4x6 snapshot.

While WDW does sell food, t-shirts, antenna toppers, and photo prints, none of those things are what draws millions of people through the Disney gates each year. What Disney sells first and foremost is a magical experience. A magical experience is what ensures that those guests, and their wallets, return to WDW. Happy guests also provide positive word-of-mouth advertising when sharing their vacation photos with their family, friends, and co-workers. Disney execs know that positive word-of-mouth advertising is priceless, valued at far more than a mere PhotoPass print. So, it's very myopic to think that WDW loses money when a PhotoPass photographer uses a guest's own camera. What would definitely cut into Disney's revenue is if a disgruntled guest, upon returning from the WDW vacation that he saved up for years to take, were to tell all of his friends, family, and co-workers all about his negative experience with a CM who refused to use his camera to capture the cherished moment of his little girl's first trip to Cinderella's castle, forcing him to pay $$$ for a mediocre 5x7 print. That kind of short-sighted thinking would cost WDW tens of thousands of dollars in future revenue in exchange for a few bucks today.

Besides, even if a fraction of one percent of all Disney guests buy PhotoPass prints (which they do), Disney is still making a profit on this service. If you want your photo to have the official Disney borders or special effects in the image, and you want the print delivered in a little paper Disney folder, you have to go through Disney for the prints. The PhotoPass website encourages you to upload your own pictures to apply the special Disney borders and effects, and order the prints through Disney (at marked up prices). So, it doesn't matter whether the PhotoPass photographer uses Disney's camera or your own, because when it comes to PhotoPass, Disney isn't selling you picture-taking services; they're selling you photo prints.
 
I would be willing to bet that 90% of them do not ever even aspire to be professional. I also believe that they are paid dirt and receive nothing but completely basic training, so no intelligent aspiring professional would take the job anyway.
Most likely so. I wouldn't be surprised, on the other hand, to learn that having the job might kick-start an interest in photography for some of them. Might be a positive (in a personal sense) in that respect.

SSB
 
Besides, even if a fraction of one percent of all Disney guests buy PhotoPass prints (which they do), Disney is still making a profit on this service. If you want your photo to have the official Disney borders or special effects in the image, and you want the print delivered in a little paper Disney folder, you have to go through Disney for the prints. The PhotoPass website encourages you to upload your own pictures to apply the special Disney borders and effects, and order the prints through Disney (at marked up prices). So, it doesn't matter whether the PhotoPass photographer uses Disney's camera or your own, because when it comes to PhotoPass, Disney isn't selling you picture-taking services; they're selling you photo prints.

Small point, but if you order the CD you get all of those photos with the borders/etc with a photo release to print them wherever you want. Of course, they still got you with the $125($100) and for any prints/albums/etc they sell you online, but....

Or you could be like me and do a photopass share with a group of people and end up having the CD cost you only $10 and contain over a thousand photographs.
 
I love the way Disney.. who knows what is going on, chooses to handle this program.

They are doing a great job!

I pay them $4000 for my vacation!

They make it magical!
 
let me clear some things up
lol and i may post this in that other thread too


I am a photopass photographer for the professional family portraits at the resorts. however i started at Disney's Hollywood Studios over a year ago there.
Photopass photographers are paid by the hour. not commission. so we don't care if we take one with your camera. in fact i ALWAYS OFFER IT. if i see a family tryin to get a photo of teh GUITAR at AEROSMITH, they are often WAYYYYYY TOO CLSOE to the guitar to get a proper photo. so i walk all the way up there... ask them if i can take it for them... i then ask them to move liek 20 steps foward, and i take their photo. i take it at a more professional level that i would take a photopass photo with my D70 Nikon.

HOWEVER i also ask if they have a photopass. if they do i take it with my camera and i tell them that i can simply add it to their photopass free of charge (some guests don't understand the photopass concept still). if they don't have it then i hand them a card and i say "take this is free, its complimentary for your entire disney vacation. anytiem you see a photographer hand us this card and your personal camera and we will take both for you, including at character locations. then when you are finished you can buy our photos with borders and autographs on them, or jsut simply go online at home and share them to your freinds and family for free by sending them an email link to all your photos" and if i have time i will also explain to them " you can also upload your OWN PERSONAL PHOTOS to the photopass site for free and share them that way as well as purchase any customizable items"

seriously....Disney knows what they are doing. we make so much money off those CDs (and they are still a good price if you get 100+ photos and considering you get the copywrite handed over to you.)

by us taking your photo with our camera is NOT losing business. we are a SERVICE.. a FREE SERVICE. whether we take a photo with our camera or your camera is up to us.... GENERALLY our photos from our NIKONs come out better than a point and shoot camera a guest may have... PLUS our photos have copywritten borders and character autographs - but guests dont have that ability to get those. Also we tend to get more creative with guests and with characters we tend to get the adorable candid hugs and kisses that parents don't get.... When we do - THATS how we make our money...

So don't feel bad... NO ITS NOT DEGRADING... whoever said that needs to realize that WE ARE A SERVICE...and PLEASE ASK US TO TAKE YOUR PHOTO.. but please use our service b/c our photos can come out amazing and you may miss out on a great product that captures a memory that you may never catch on your camera.... but you are NEVER obligated to buy it. that is your choice.


DID THAT HELP?????
 
DID THAT HELP?????
I don't know -- the guy in that other thread didn't seem to be one who'd let facts or logic get in the way of his opinion. I would think that it would settle the issue pretty well if he were willing to listen to reason.

Everything you said lines up with what other PhotoPass (is it "PhotoPass" or "Photopass"?) photographers have told me. So, score one for consistency!

Has being a Photopass photographer had any effect on your personal interest in photography, for good or ill?

SSB
 

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