Cafeteria Catholics?

[JunieJay]

We had a nice conversation about this once long ago on the DIS, that has long since been poofed, wondering if we can revive it now.

Who belongs to the cafeteria brand of Catholicism?

I do, for sure. It annoys my Grandmother to no end, but there you have it. I absolutely love some things about the Catholic Church and get great comfort from those things. Like I wish I could take the bits of the church that I like - the social justice work, the Jesuits, and Mary (oh how I love Mary!), and dump all the anti-woman, homophobic teachings. If I could do this I'd be much happier with it all. I'd probably send my kids to Catholic schools if it weren't for the part I don't like, which to me seem to have intensified since I was in Catholic schools. I don't remember much discussion about gays or women in the church when I was a kid in the 60s and 70s...I do remember Catholics being on the right side in the Civil Rights movement. I grew up with a lifetime commitment against racism, thanks to the nuns. One of the things I so loved about being a Catholic and what I took away from it as an adult is the tolerance for all people, regardless of race or creed. Nowdays I seem to hear more exclusionary tactics being used by Catholics and quite frankly I don't like it.

Even still, at my core I'm a Catholic. I know that annoys the devout. But, for me, the faith is there. I consider faith to be the core of the religion, and the rest are opinions of other thinking individuals, and I can assume those opinions, or not. And, besides, I am Catholic, it's part of how I grew up, part of who I am. I figure there isn't an institution or organization that I belong to with which I am in 100% agreement 100% of the time. Yet, I still belong to these institutions. Why should I have to give up being Catholic just because I don't agree with 100% of its teachings? There are many who feel I should just go ahead and become a Protestant since I am only willing to take some of Catholicsm and discard the rest. But my feeling is because in any church there would be things for me to disagree with, and some kind of built-in power structure that I very probably would disagree with. So why trade one imperfect institution for another?

Anyone else? I remember there being quite a few of us diehard Cafeteria Catholics....sometimes with one foot in and one foot out, but still hanging in at our core. Would love to hear your thoughts on the subject.......

 

[Fitswimmer]

I used to be a Cafeteria Catholic, but the more I read and prayed about it I realized that it was all about ME. I didn't want to accept certain teachings, I didn't want to believe this or that. I went to a spirituality convocation and the speaker was this wonderful Southern Bishop. The line that really got me was: "Guess what?? It's NOT ABOUT YOU! It's about GOD". I was putting myself in God's shoes and making decisions as if I was in charge.
I've read the VII documents and many of the Papal writings. When I read Pope John Paul II's Theology of the Body, the teachings about sex make a lot more sense. I also read Cardinal Bernardin's book about Consistent Ethic of Life, and I now understand how abortion, euthanasia and the death penalty fit together in one picture. As far as the homosexuality issue, I'm still working on it. All I know is that the Church does not hate homosexuals, in fact, the first AID's hospices in NYC were set up by the Archdiocese. When nobody else would care for those early victims in the 80's, the Church was there. Anyone who says that they are Catholic and they hate homosexuals are cut from the same cloth as that nutball group that protests at soldier's funerals. They call themselves Baptists, but no self respecting Baptist I've ever heard of acts that way.

 

[Crankyshank]

I'm a lapsed agnostic Catholic with Pantheistic leanings
I consider myself a Catholic by heritage and not necessarily by practice. I went to Catholic school all the way straight through college (except one year at UMASS). I'm going to a Dominican college now (which my MIL thought was Dominican like the country and not like the friars )

I go to Mass on occasion (when my priest needs a lector mostly). I am fascinated by the history of the Church. I am comforted by the ritual of the mass, and making candle offerings, but I lost my faith years ago during the beginnings of the Church scandal and because of the fact the Church has really lost touch with its members. I get more and more angry with Church leaders who turned a blind eye to the abuse and yet try to incorporate more tactics the more evangelical fundamentalist protestant sects use in hopes of enticing more people to the Church.

I love Mary and still enjoy reading my book about the lives of the saints. Maybe because I came from a less than devout family, except for my very religious Meme, but I honestly don't understand the need to 100% subscribe to the politics of the Church in order to be considered a "real Catholic". I find that more "Born Again Catholics" seem to spout that better Catholic than you attitude than those who were raised Catholic. I wonder if that's because BAC's tend to come from more evangelical backgrounds and cradle Catholics consider it more of a heritage. Either way it bothers me and the more and more I encounter that attitude, the more I question where I fit in spiritually.

 

[RickinNYC]

Yup, it's not about you, NOR is it about the church. It's about God. I have since chosen the idealogy that I don't need a huge building run by a repressed group of men to tell my what my relationship with God should or should not be. It's taken a long time for me to come to the understanding but now, I'm extremely happy and don't live my life with guilt or fear of damnation.

And yes, the church does condemn homosexuals.

 

[golfgal]

I guess I would say that my experience growing up Catholic was different from yours in respect to the "homophobic" teachings of the church. The Catholic Church does not condemn the homosexual, it does not approve of the homosexual act and to me that is a HUGE difference. Personally, I agree with that that teaching. I do not have issues with people being gay, I do not agree with Gay sex, however. I am certainly not going to tell anyone how to live their life, I am not going to protest any anti-gay anything, I have friends that are gay I just don't talk about their sex life, nor to I talk about the sex life of our straight friends either.

As far as being a Cafeteria Catholic, about the only issue I have with the church is the stance on birth control. I do feel that is a very outdated belief and that yes, 2000 years ago, I can see the need to go forth and populate the world but we have done that, time to move on to something else.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

I grew up Catholic, my brother went into the seminary and then quit and never went back to church again. I won't say what he said but it wasn't pretty.

I attempted to return to the Catholic faith awhile back. I now sit on the fence watching...

 

[Crankyshank]

Oh I should mention that my priest is gay. It's not something that's known (although the man loves showtunes and Disney and uses accessories to snazz up the boring black- how could he not be ) because obviously that would just be not well accepted by the diocese or the parishoners but there's definitely no anti homosexuality preaching in my Church during the Mass. There are groups of parishoners that are organized and meet in the Church that are anti-gay marriage just like there are pro-life groups.

 

[diznygirl]

Fitswimmer - you have a good grasp of the concept. I've long believed that it's any church's job to teach certain things and expect the highest possible out of it's "students." It's our job to learn and try to be the best we can. I try to be more Christ-like, which is always a struggle. This is all balanced by the knowledge that the higher-ups in the church, although very close to God and inspired by the Holy Spirit, are human after all and can make mistakes, just like the rest of us.

Nobody has all the answers. Religion is about learning and aspiring to be closer to God, but knowing that we will never be as perfect. (Although some believe they ARE perfect already!!) LOL!

 

[sugarpie]

Where do I join this Cafeteria Catholic church?

I was raised Catholic & so was my husband. We both went to Catholic schools. But even when I was young I knew I didn't agree with a large percentage of the Catholic teachings. Religion should be about trying to be a good person, not condemning others.

I, too, find a lot of comfort from many things about the Catholic religion. I never feel more peaceful than when I'm coming out of Mass. But I don't feel welcome in a Catholic church anymore. I had my first daughter on purpose (GASP!) before we were married. And we weren't married in a Catholic church (double GASP!). My children haven't been baptised in the Catholic church (to Hell I go).

I just try to be kind to others. That's my religion.

 

[JunieJay]

Oh I should mention that my priest is gay. It's not something that's known (although the man loves showtunes and Disney and uses accessories to snazz up the boring black- how could he not be ) because obviously that would just be not well accepted by the diocese or the parishoners but there's definitely no anti homosexuality preaching in my Church during the Mass. There are groups of parishoners that are organized and meet in the Church that are anti-gay marriage just like there are pro-life groups.

Wow that is fascinating that your priest is somewhat openly gay, even though its not something that is openly discussed.

I wonder if the homophobic preaching is something that is done in other parts of the country. They never do it in my parish either, nor do I hear much from the pro life crowd. Perhaps its done in the more conservative parts of the country? I hear about it a lot on the DIS, but never have really experienced it firsthand.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

I think we should start "The American Catholic Church"...and I am not kidding.

 

[SandraVB79]

I think you can call most Belgian catholics cafeteria catholics. We're catholic, we believe what we want to believe, and there are many things we just don't care for (like most of what the pope says about relationships and sex).

 

[JunieJay]

I think we should start "The American Catholic Church"...and I am not kidding.

I've already joined.

 

[diznygirl]

I, too, find a lot of comfort from many things about the Catholic religion. I never feel more peaceful than when I'm coming out of Mass. But I don't feel welcome in a Catholic church anymore. I had my first daughter on purpose (GASP!) before we were married. And we weren't married in a Catholic church (double GASP!). My children haven't been baptised in the Catholic church (to Hell I go).

I just try to be kind to others. That's my religion.

Think of the church like your parents: they want you to grow up, get a good job, find someone nice, settle down and start a family, right? They want "what's best for you." Thanks Mom! But I will decide for myself. So, Free Will kicks in and you find someone nice and have a baby, but no marriage. BUT YOUR PARENTS STILL LOVE YOU! (well, most of them will, anyway!) And God will still love you, even if you didn't do A B and C. And they still want to see you once in awhile and see pics of the baby.

That's the way I look at it anyway.

 

[JunieJay]

Think of the church like your parents: they want you to grow up, get a good job, find someone nice, settle down and start a family, right? They want "what's best for you." Thanks Mom! But I will decide for myself. So, Free Will kicks in and you find someone nice and have a baby, but no marriage. BUT YOUR PARENTS STILL LOVE YOU! (well, most of them will, anyway!) And God will still love you, even if you didn't do A B and C. And they still want to see you once in awhile and see pics of the baby.

That's the way I look at it anyway.

I like that way of looking at it.

 

[golfgal]

I think you can call most Belgian catholics cafeteria catholics. We're catholic, we believe what we want to believe, and there are many things we just don't care for (like most of what the pope says about relationships and sex).

I can tell you that the Belgians that immigrated to Minnesota sure don't hold the same thinking!!! Very conservative Catholics, like Pre-Vatican II Catholics.

 

[golfgal]

I think you can call most Belgian catholics cafeteria catholics. We're catholic, we believe what we want to believe, and there are many things we just don't care for (like most of what the pope says about relationships and sex).

Totally but do you know what Rolle Bolle is???

 

[jennobrn01]

I used to be a Cafeteria Catholic, but the more I read and prayed about it I realized that it was all about ME. I didn't want to accept certain teachings, I didn't want to believe this or that. I went to a spirituality convocation and the speaker was this wonderful Southern Bishop. The line that really got me was: "Guess what?? It's NOT ABOUT YOU! It's about GOD". I was putting myself in God's shoes and making decisions as if I was in charge.

This totally blessed me! Thanks for sharing.

 

[LisaNJ25]

Think of the church like your parents: they want you to grow up, get a good job, find someone nice, settle down and start a family, right? They want "what's best for you." Thanks Mom! But I will decide for myself. So, Free Will kicks in and you find someone nice and have a baby, but no marriage. BUT YOUR PARENTS STILL LOVE YOU! (well, most of them will, anyway!) And God will still love you, even if you didn't do A B and C. And they still want to see you once in awhile and see pics of the baby.

That's the way I look at it anyway.

and dont forgot the weekly envelopes with money.... you dont want to annoy the parents.

 

[SandraVB79]

I can tell you that the Belgians that immigrated to Minnesota sure don't hold the same thinking!!! Very conservative Catholics, like Pre-Vatican II Catholics.

Maybe they couldn't handle the liberal thoughts in Belgium, and emigrated because of that?

Rolle Bolle, sure it's written that way?
I know what "rollebollen" means