Best hybrid DSLR for disney?

[Raenstoirm]

I am looking to buy a hybrid DSLR in the next few weeks. I need something relatively small (hence why I am not interested in a full scale DSLR) but quality. I have gone to the store to play with them, but you cant really see what you are buying very well. My only real requirement is that is uses SD cards. I suspect most if not all do at this point, but my macbook only reads SD cards. And I would prefer a smallish flash and good durability as I plan on wearing this thing around my neck all week without any padding or case.

And on a secondary issue. What are your favorite lenses? This is our first (and maybe only) Christmas visit and I want a lot of pics, but I also dont want to have to carry a lot of different lenses around.

 

[Gianna'sPapa]

I haven't heard the term "hybrid" DSLR. What are you looking at, a mirrorless camera with interchangeable lenses, superzoom? If you could provide the manufacturer and models you are referring to, maybe someone could jump in here and help.

 

[zackiedawg]

I'm going to guess you are referring to the mirrorless interchangeable lens cameras as well, since that is a big, growing segment right now, and you do mention lenses specifically. The range of mirrorless cameras is so diverse right now, that it's really hard to compare them to eachother - they go from tiny 1/2.3" sensor cameras (Pentax Q) to semi-small 1" sensors (Nikon 1) to established micro 4:3 sensors (Olympus & Panasonic) a bit smaller than DSLR ones, to full APS-C sensors right from DSLRs (Sony NEX, Samsung). They range from bodies just like compact cameras, but with interchangeable lenses, to slim bodies with few controls or touch screens and no viewfinders, to more enthusiast-level bodies with more controls on thinner bodies, to mini-DSLR type designs that are large and chunky and full of controls. They're all smaller than most DSLRs, but some of them can get pretty close. And even some of those with smaller bodies still start to get bigger as the lenses get added to the mix - so depending on which lenses you put on them, they can range from pocketable, to superzoom compact sized, to near-DSLR sized. In all cases, they should be lighter than a DSLR - and even with larger lenses, a mirrorless camera with bigger lens will still be much smaller in volume, bulk, and weight than a typical entry-level DSLR.

Ergonomics vary greatly, so you should handle them all and see if any in particular feel good, right-sized, and controls intuitive or comfortable. Base which sensor system you get on what types of shooting are important to you - lots of zoom, high ISO, action, etc.

I personally chose the NEX system from Sony, based on my own personal needs - I wanted a second body to ride alongside my DSLR and occasionally go in its stead. I wanted something that could be immensely compact when needed, but still fully DSLR capable in low light, so the APS-C sensor was very desirable. I don't mind if it's not pocketable, as long as it's light and non-bulky around my neck. And I wanted good versatility with adapters and manual lenses. It may or may not be the perfect system for someone else - it's not necessarily 'better' or 'worse' than other mirrorless systems, but like them all, has its advantages and disadvantages - and I weighed them all to pick the system that best matched my own needs.

Once you start to widdle down the choices, feel free to ask for some guidance towards the system that might be best for your needs.

 

[boBQuincy]

Again assuming you are thinking of mirroless interchangeable lens cameras: most of them come with a kit lens that is equivalent to about 28-80 in 35mm terms. This is a good walkaround lens for most people.

My choice among these cameras requires a real viewfinder and the clunky add-on viewfinders do not count. This pretty much limits the field to Panasonic G3, Sony NEX-7, and Nikon V1. Panasonic's GH2 is expensive and soon to be replaced.

If you are ok with using the LCD screen then the choices are much more open.

 

[Raenstoirm]

I thought "hybrid" was the going term but i guess not on here. I am talking about the 4/3rds systems. My current forerunner is the Panasonic Lumix DMC-GF series. But the reviews all talk about poor night shots, so I am hesitant.

I personally chose the NEX system from Sony, based on my own personal needs -

My concern with sony is the proprietary lenses. Have you found that they are good quality? I dont want to blow a grand on a camera and then find out their lenses are subpar and get tied to that specific brand.

Do they take SD or are still using the sony sticks? (I havent really looked into sony since my point and shoot from the early 2000's and it used those stupid sticks)

 

[zackiedawg]

Sony dumped the word 'proprietary' long ago...all their cameras use standard SD cards as well as Sony cards (for those who still have some or want to buy one). Lens-wise, ALL cameras technically are 'proprietary' since each has their own mount - can't use a Canon on a Nikon, or a Nikon on a Pentax, etc. So in that sense, the Sony NEX isn't any different than any other mount - it's a new mount like the Panasonic/Olympus M4:3 mount, Nikon 1 mount, Pentax Q mount, and Samsung NX mount. Remember, these mirrorless cameras all take a brand new mount, different even from their larger DSLR cousins...however they all can adapt to using the larger mount lenses via adapters.

Sony's NEX line currently has 7 lenses designed for its mount - less than Panasonic & Olympus' M4:3 mount, more than Nikon's 1 or Pentax's Q mount. None have close to the typical DSLR companies' mounts (Pentax, Sony, Nikon, and Canon's DSLR mounts all number in the hundreds of lenses)...but the lenses are light and well designed to function with these mirrorless cameras, quietly and with good optical quality.

Via adapters, you can fit over 10,000 lenses on the NEX and M4:3 cameras, as long as you don't mind manually focusing - it's one of the neat side perks to these cameras: they have almost no registration gap between sensor and lens...so to adapt to any other lens mount ever made, all they need is a metal spacer to place the lens the appropriate distance from the sensor (since all DSLR and rangefinder mounts sit much farther back from the sensor). These adapter rings cost around $25-40, and allow a huge range of old and used lenses to work beautifully on these cameras.

The proper terms for these cameras is usually either 'compact system cameras (CSC)', or 'Mirrorless Interchangeable Lens cameras (MIL)'. Micro 4:3 is named for its sensor, developed by Olympus - it's larger than a P&S camera sensor, but smaller than a DSLR sensor. The difference between 4/3 and 'micro 4:3' is that 4/3 sensors were developed for their mirrored DSLRs, while M4:3 was developed without the mirror and therefore much smaller registration gap. Because Sony and Samsung use a regular APS-C sized sensor (same as DSLRs), they can't be called 4/3 systems. That's why either MIL or CSC usually acts as a coverall for these types of cameras. With Nikon's new smaller sensor 1 system, and Pentax's tiny P&S sensor Q system, these cameras are vastly different from eachother - 'mirrorless' at least covers them all!

I have had excellent experience with the NEX system, mainly as the Sony 14MP and the newer 16MP sensor are some of the best APS-C sensors ever developed. The 16MP sensor in the NEX5N is the same as that in the Sony A580, Nikon D5100, Nikon D7000, and Pentax K5. So low light performance is spectacular with the NEX, and combined with multistacking ISO abilities, can shoot handheld at ISO25800 and still yield printable results straight from JPG. I shoot a lot of low light, so the NEX stood out as a best choice for my needs. I keep a gallery of shots with the NEX3 here, if you want to take a look or get an idea - there are high ISO shots to 6400 in the gallery:
http://www.pbase.com/zackiedawg/sony_nex3

That's the older 14MP sensor too - the newer 16MP sensor is even better. Most of those shots were with the standard 18-55mm kit lens, which I've found to be of very good quality with excellent sharpness and color. The M4:3 cameras I think should be perfectly competitive and are fine choices - with a slightly larger lens selection available, and a sensor that in good light can match most DSLRs, and only falls down in low light/high ISO situations. Even there, it would take extreme high ISO shooting to really see any issues - at ISO1600 the M4:3 cameras should be perfectly usable and deliver nice results.

 

[Raenstoirm]

zackiedawg you are awesome and just the type of person I was looking to find. I have tons of point and shoots and an old SLR (still uses FILM ) I have never taken a class so my word choice is nowhere near the correct terminology, so forgive me on that.
Sony seems to have the best low light reviews, but it seems the Olympus Pens have the fastest auto focus. So you think the Nex 5N would be a good choice? Does it have a manual focus setting? As I said my terminology is, well non-existant, but one thing I like about the old SLR is the ability to turn the lens and "choose" my focus point. Is there something like that? I read on a few other cameras that you can tap the screen to pick the focus point. I would love to be able to use those old lenses on a digital camera but they are just so darn heavy to lug around the parks all day.

Maybe I have to go back to Best buy and play some more (I prefer Best buy to the camera stores since mine has a lot of high end SLR stuff and they dont hover over you like they do in the speciality camera stores)

 

[zackiedawg]

zackiedawg you are awesome and just the type of person I was looking to find. I have tons of point and shoots and an old SLR (still uses FILM )

Thanks - and no problem. I actually have several film cameras still around the house - including my Pentax ME-Super and Canon EOS-IX that I still used into the 21st century, and Konica and Chinon SLRs that I bought as packages with lenses so I could use the lenses on my NEX. I've had digital cameras from Sony, Minolta, Pentax, and Canon too - so I've gone all over the map!

Sony seems to have the best low light reviews, but it seems the Olympus Pens have the fastest auto focus.

That's about right - but remember too, those are straight tests - the Oly isn't THAT much faster than the NEX in normal use for most folks, and the NEX isn't THAT much better in low light in normal use for most folks. It's generally those more rare shooters who really need to push the limit, either in action focus speed or extreme low light handheld.

So you think the Nex 5N would be a good choice? Does it have a manual focus setting?

Indeed - most of these cameras, including the NEX5N, have manual focus ability. They are switchable between auto or manual focus, can work with all manual focus lenses, or can even use a hybrid mode (Sony calls theirs DMF, or Direct Manual Focus), whereby you can autofocus a scene, then grab the focus ring and fine-tune the focus manually before shooting.

The NEX-5N certainly looks like one of the nicer ones out there, with a ton of features, a nice tilting LCD, touch screen, high ISO ability, an optional electronic viewfinder option you could get in the future if you decide you want one, and the very cool multistacking ISO, HDR, and sweep panorama modes which work very effectively. Just make sure you like the way it feels in your hands. Don't worry too much about any of the controls with the NEX or Micro 4:3 cameras - they may not seem well laid out, or lacking too many buttons, but all of these are highly customizable, allowing you to assign all your most-used controls to the buttons of your choice.

As I said my terminology is, well non-existant, but one thing I like about the old SLR is the ability to turn the lens and "choose" my focus point.

While most folks stick with autufocus on digital cameras, you actually might occasionally enjoy playing with manual focus or even a manual lens or two - because the manual lenses on these cameras really delivers that feel of a classic SLR - there's something enjoyable about a nicely damped manual focus lens.

I read on a few other cameras that you can tap the screen to pick the focus point.

As far as I know - most of the Micro 4:3 cameras with touch screen can do this, and the NEX-5N can do this. There is a slight difference in how they function - the micro 4:3 cameras can allow you to touch to both focus and fire the shot, while the NEX-5N allows you to pick the focus, but you still press the shutter button to shoot. Either way, it's a neat feature.

I would love to be able to use those old lenses on a digital camera but they are just so darn heavy to lug around the parks all day.

They're definitely heavier than the native lenses, but depending on the lens, some can be pretty nifty. The short primes, like 50mm F1.7s and 35 & 40mms with an adapter can actually be as small as the kit lens, and not much heavier, plus just deliver a satisfying experience turning an aperture ring and focus ring to shoot 'old school' style. Still, though I have over a dozen manual lenses for my NEX, I still do the bulk of the shooting with the 18-55mm kit lens just autofocusing, as it's just the most convenient.

Maybe I have to go back to Best buy and play some more (I prefer Best buy to the camera stores since mine has a lot of high end SLR stuff and they dont hover over you like they do in the speciality camera stores)

That's a very good idea. You may find you really like the style, the grip, the feel, or some key feature of one particular model over another, and you really aren't going to make a bad decision no matter which you go with. Try to tune out any reps that do try to talk you up, as they may be biased towards a particular model and might sway you away from your instinctual choice.

 

[jakoky]

This has me excited, reading about the sony nex N5...i have one on order right now...my dad is in the process of selling his nikon d300 (wanting to upgrade to the d7000) and while helping him, i ran into the sony...(he is selling his camera and one of his lens for 700, but it is just too big for me ..and sadly, he said i could have it for 200)....from everything i have read, i have only 1 worry/question...my daughter plays a lot of soccer, is this camera not good with action. I have read conflicting things...Right now, i have a panasonic FZ 40 and my most recent before that i was a sony H50)...I love the fact about the large sensor size and the low light ability...can anyone tell me about action shots..thanks so much

 

[boBQuincy]

I played around with a Panasonic GF3, Olympus E-PL3, and Sony NEX-5n for about a half hour today at Best Buy. Based on handling the GF3 was my top choice but all of them felt good and seemed like they would not take long to get used to. The Sony has the best sensor but their lenses are big. Panasonic's new X 14-42 makes the combo about the same size as a medium P&S, sort of pocketable.

 

[zackiedawg]

Jakoky, TThese types of cameras aren't generally designed as sports or action cameras, but that's compared to DSLRs which have a faster focus system for these types of shots. However, it doesn't mean they'll be BAD for this type of shooting - in fact, they'll generally be better than any P&S camera, and in decent light the focus systems are fast enough that you'd be hard pressed to even notice the difference from a DSLR. If trying to continuously focus track a moving subject, that's the only time you'll really notice that mirrorless cameras can't keep up with DSLRs. But taking a single shot of a person running or a pet jumping in the yard, etc - no problem. And the NEX-5N has one nice feature that helps it shoot fast-shutter action shots - electronic first-curtain shutter, which eliminates any lag at all from the time you press the shutter. So I expect you'll do fine as long as you're not trying to shoot Sports Illustrated sequences of professional football players at 1000mm in a night game!

 

[jakoky]

zackiedawg...thanks so much, you answered my question completely. I just wanted to make sure i could get at least a little better pics of soccer than i do out of my advanced point and shoot (and i can say i have gotten some great shots with it)...i assume the nex will be a little better in this area and maybe even a little faster...i am very excited, looks like i have 2 weeks to wait though ...happy shooting