Based on another thread: what do you think of group projects?

My husband has been doing group projects through his job for at least 10 years. He doesn't complain really. Just a fact of life for him.

Anyway, in college they were a mixed bag for me. Doing my undergrad, they were the bane of my existence! You could never find a good time outside of class to work with the people, plus since I was an older student and commuted, it was always a huge hassle. I was always among those doing the bulk of the work, which I didn't mind THAT so much because I'm a bit of a control freak when it comes to projects.

In grad school, my groups were great. I never had a bad group in grad school.

One question I have for people whose kids are doing them in school, have your kids ever actually had to meet outside of school? Because that's not the way it's generally done here. Any group project done in school is done in the classroom and is strictly overseen by the teacher. I've never seen kids punished with a bad grade because of any other student not pulling their weight.

My DD's group projects are almost *always* done completely outside the classroom (and it has been that way since grade school). With fellow students who can't be bothered...
to show up when the kids all agree to
to do their fair share of the work
who can't seem to contact anyone else on their own and who wait for someone else to initiate EVERYTHING and who ask a fellow student how (In the most elementary terms) they are supposed to do their assignment.
The last one, it was more of the same. People couldn't be bothered to get together, so they ended up e-mailing DD their contributions (sentences that described specific aspects of a certain book which some of them apparently never bothered to read so they just copied stuff out of SparkNotes) and she then got to spell-check and edit their sentences and she got to cut out and SHE then got to put everything on a poster (for them of course) and then they complained that it wasn't as fancy as *they* wanted it and why didn't DD contact them?
Well, gee golly whiz, Einstein, YOU DIDN'T DO ANY REAL WORK and she texted you and Facebook messaged you and if it weren't for DD, there wouldn't have been *anything* to hand in.

So yes, I hate group projects with a passion.

agnes!
 
Hate them!!

DS13 just had a partner project and the kid he was partnered with went on a cruise. DS had to do everything. I'm not sure if they gave the other kid a grade, knowing the teacher he gave the other kid the same grade as DS.

ETA: so far the group projects are done in school
 
I hate group projects for kids, at any level when they are to be done in any way, shape or form outside of school. To me it's not fair to have kids depend on their parents and OTHER children's parents to get them together to work on it for a grade. Many times materials costing money is involved.

If you are going to give group projects, fine, let them be all in-school where the materials are provided and each student's participation is monitored.

That's how I feel about it!:goodvibes
 
I never understood the reasoning behind group anything. Group study sessions were always ridiculously lame because some people actually do want to study and not have a party. The work projects were always annoying because people are not all strong students or workers. The trouble with them is unless a leader with some leverage is provided the slackers will have no accountability and will always take advantage and pull everyone else down. How does that help anything? Peer pressure and modeling only work on personalities that WANT to fit in and conform but they are zero benefit to the high performers anyway. IMO,by late adolescence the kids who want to fit in have already stopped being slackers.
 

My son loves them because he's a sociable creature and can get other kids to do all the work that's hard for him because of his LD. He will organize and socialize and cheer-lead, and he'll buy snacks... and somehow someone else will end of doing all the writing and drawing!

I'm suspicious of all this, because it seems to me that all group projects are teaching him is how to manipulate people into doing his work for him. Part of why I pulled him out of school in Kindergarten is because he'd convinced the little girls in his class to do all his written work for him - all he did was sign his name!

My daughter hates them, especially in math, because she always gets stuck with the most competitive boys in the class, and they're jerks. She very quickly got tired of being told to just shut up and let the guys do the work. They wouldn't listen to her, even when she tried to point out a mistake in their work. So she started doing all the math work on her own - under her OWN name - and submitting it separately from theirs. The teacher didn't say anything, and this year she beat out all the boys in a math competition!

But... I think groups (outside of math) can actually be good for her. She's not a very social person, and the ONLY reason I've ever seen her go over to a friend's house, or have a friend over here, is because they're working on a school project. If not for that, she'd probably never see anyone outside of school hours.

And for all I know, the only reason she put the effort into math is because the boys in her group ticked her off. Normally she's pretty lazy about schoolwork.

So... I'm torn on the issue of group work. I can see both good and bad sides to them.
 
My son loves them because he's a sociable creature and can get other kids to do all the work that's hard for him because of his LD. He will organize and socialize and cheer-lead, and he'll buy snacks... and somehow someone else will end of doing all the writing and drawing!

I'm suspicious of all this, because it seems to me that all group projects are teaching him is how to manipulate people into doing his work for him. Part of why I pulled him out of school in Kindergarten is because he'd convinced the little girls in his class to do all his written work for him - all he did was sign his name!

My daughter hates them, especially in math, because she always gets stuck with the most competitive boys in the class, and they're jerks. She very quickly got tired of being told to just shut up and let the guys do the work. They wouldn't listen to her, even when she tried to point out a mistake in their work. So she started doing all the math work on her own - under her OWN name - and submitting it separately from theirs. The teacher didn't say anything, and this year she beat out all the boys in a math competition!

But... I think groups (outside of math) can actually be good for her. She's not a very social person, and the ONLY reason I've ever seen her go over to a friend's house, or have a friend over here, is because they're working on a school project. If not for that, she'd probably never see anyone outside of school hours.

And for all I know, the only reason she put the effort into math is because the boys in her group ticked her off. Normally she's pretty lazy about schoolwork.

So... I'm torn on the issue of group work. I can see both good and bad sides to them.

Maybe you can look at the positive side for you son. He is learning to delegate and will make a great boss someday!!


I don't like group projects either. My issue is having to give up control over some thing I am getting graded on.

Dd doesn't mind them but prefers when the teacher makes the groups. Otherwise she gets stuck with the kid no one else wants in their group because she feels sorry for him. Problem is he does none of the work. (he doesn't even cheer lead or bring the snacks! :laughing:) He just sits there and watches everyone else do the work. She has learned to take charge though and be the group or pair leader, so I guess that is her positive from it.
 
So many people say they understand their importance but I have to admit, I don't. I have never had a job where I have had to truly work with a group and neither has DH. We have both had projects where someone needs to do step 1 before the next person can do step 2. We have also done brainstorming sessions with a group. When we have worked in a true group setting, everyone seems to have their actual task spelled out for them. I am not saying there aren't any jobs that require group projects to be done the way a school "prepares" you for them, but I think they are few and far between.

Look at it this way, how many posts do you see on The Dis from adults complaining about group projects at work?

In my line of work, everything is group work. (I'm a software engineer) Someone works the back end, business logic, someone creates frameworks to build stuff on, there is a tester, and a person who designs and/or develops the user interface. Then there is the project manager who decides what parts of each project gets done when. There is a big push in my field to build things in a manner that NO ONE is waiting on someone to finish before they can start their part of the project. Are there still dependencies? Yes, but not as many as you would think. So yes, working in a group is a big part of some people's jobs.

What about drywallers? If the group isn't working as a team how would they ever get the giant pieces of drywall on the ceiling? Or chef's in a nice restaurant? Obviously your entire meal is not made by one person. One person makes sauces, one person makes the side dishes and another cooks the entree. It's a team effort that comes together on a plate.

Beside that, group projects help a person to see what roles they naturally fill. Are you a leader? Do you prefer to remain behind the scenes? Or are you *that* guy that convinces everyone else to do the work and then takes the credit? Yes, even in real life that happens all the time. And the people who did the work and didn't get the credit need to learn to deal with that in a professional manner. (Granted, little kids probably don't need to deal with that so early on.) But if one of your co-workers isn't pulling their load, you probably need to know how to handle it... and in different environments. In one work situation it might be perfectly acceptable to call the slacker out to his/her boss, in another, it might be a better idea to keep your mouth shut so you don't end up being accused of not being a team player. I've been in both situations, and it's not a fun lesson to learn on the job.
 
In my line of work, everything is group work. (I'm a software engineer) Someone works the back end, business logic, someone creates frameworks to build stuff on, there is a tester, and a person who designs and/or develops the user interface. Then there is the project manager who decides what parts of each project gets done when. There is a big push in my field to build things in a manner that NO ONE is waiting on someone to finish before they can start their part of the project. Are there still dependencies? Yes, but not as many as you would think. So yes, working in a group is a big part of some people's jobs.

What about drywallers? If the group isn't working as a team how would they ever get the giant pieces of drywall on the ceiling? Or chef's in a nice restaurant? Obviously your entire meal is not made by one person. One person makes sauces, one person makes the side dishes and another cooks the entree. It's a team effort that comes together on a plate.

Beside that, group projects help a person to see what roles they naturally fill. Are you a leader? Do you prefer to remain behind the scenes? Or are you *that* guy that convinces everyone else to do the work and then takes the credit? Yes, even in real life that happens all the time. And the people who did the work and didn't get the credit need to learn to deal with that in a professional manner. (Granted, little kids probably don't need to deal with that so early on.) But if one of your co-workers isn't pulling their load, you probably need to know how to handle it... and in different environments. In one work situation it might be perfectly acceptable to call the slacker out to his/her boss, in another, it might be a better idea to keep your mouth shut so you don't end up being accused of not being a team player. I've been in both situations, and it's not a fun lesson to learn on the job.


I never said there weren't jobs that require group work but I stand by the fact that MOST do not require you to work the way a school does in a group project.

In school, kids are generally required to do all the leg work to get the group off the ground. They determine when they will meet, what project they will work on, and who will do what on the project. It is up to them to follow up and make sure everyone is on track. In school group projects, if a kid doesn't show up, oh well. If a kid only does half of his task, too bad. 99% of the time, nothing is done to the slackers. As a matter of fact, the slacker is generally rewarded with the same grade as the rest of the group.

In the work place, if you act like some of the kids do in school, you would be fired. You are hired to do a specific job. You don't sit around and decide what you will do. If you are a sous chef, you don't get to come into work and announce that you plan on being the pastry chef that day. If you do drywall, you don't get to tackle trim because you are bored.

Unlike school, where most groups meet after hours, there is almost always a boss on duty that supervises in the workplace. When one drywaller is not helping, they fire him right there on the spot. If the meal at the nice restaurant isn't being made in the correct amount of time, people lose their job. Nobody loses their job in a school group project.

My DH is a project manager for 250 people. He got the job based on his qualifications. The group didn't raise their hands and nominate him as the person in charge. His job, among other things, is to make sure the group is functioning as a whole. He needs to make sure they stay on task. If they aren't, he has steps he takes to get them back on track or else they are fired. Little 10 year old Johnny that was put in charge of the school group project doesn't have those skills yet. When he tells people to focus, they tend to laugh at him.

The workplace group is night and day compared to the school group and the school group project is teaching very little real skills to survive in the workplace.
 
I just finished my Masters in Education. We had many group projects, I hated them all. Teachers are the worst students. Every project there ended up being 1 or 2 that did all the work picking up the slack for the rest.
In one class we were asked to write a personal page talking about our experience with the project including who did what and what we thought about it. It was nice to be able to tell the professor, hey I did xxx and so-so did nothing.
 
My opinions on group work REALLY depend on who's in the class/what the assignment is. I've had some really really great group projects in high school/college that I still look back on and remember how good they were (generally these were when we could pick our own groups, or when the assignments were fun), but I've also had ones that were absolutely miserable. Like in my high school business class we had a project where we had to come up with answers to a bunch of questions as a group and then the teacher would ask each group member in private the questions, and whoever's individual grade on those answers was the lowest would determine the grade for the entire group (so that we would work together). And OF COURSE, I was stuck with people who couldn't care less about their grades or the project (it was the end of senior year), so that wasn't fun. At all.
 


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