BART Cop Arrested for Murder

[MarkBarbieri]

Gee, a little extreme maybe?? All I'm saying is this has been VERY one sided reporting, and just like with all the protests, everyone on the DIS is making their minds up after hearing only ONE side of the story.

I don't believe that this officer is some cold hearted killer who deserves all the condemnation or death threats he has received.

No, that's not all you were saying. If your only complaint was with the press coverage or the threats to the officer, I would not have been appalled by your comments.

What you really did say was:

"Good riddance, I say."

and

"...at least he got rid of one more thug who did nothing good in his life and made the Bay Area a more dangerous place."

That sure makes it sound like you think that the killing of the victim was a good thing. Associating that kind of thinking with the Taliban or Saddam Hussein doesn't sound that far out of line. Can you name any civilized country where it is considered OK for a police officer to execute someone at their own discretion when that person is not even engaging in a significant crime? Of course not. We wouldn't call a place like that civilized.

I can understand the desire to defend the officer, but your complete contempt for the life of the victim is reprehensible. No one should be killed like that.

 

[Heidict]

Yes, I know that this thread is ancient, but I'm bumping it because the case is going to jury today.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/07/02/subway.shooting/index.html?hpt=T2

 

[cm8]

Yes, I know that this thread is ancient, but I'm bumping it because the case is going to jury today.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/07/02/subway.shooting/index.html?hpt=T2

Thanks for the bump and the link...........

 

[Cat0727]

Officer was convicted of involuntary manslaughter. what a joke.

http://www.aolnews.com/nation/artic...er-verdict-in-killing-of-oscar-grant/19547810

 

[Geoff_M]

Officer was convicted of involuntary manslaughter. what a joke.

Perhaps not in the eyes of the street mobs out to get themselves some new bling, but if you go back to page 4 and read what I posted right after this broke, you'll see that what the jury did was actually follow the laws as written. The DA swung for the fence in the effort to make the "street" happy, but came up predictably short. In order to get a murder conviction, the DA would have had to convince the jury that the officer decided to intentionally blow away the poor guy, with malice, in full view of fellow officers, lots of other people, and with cell phone video cameras rolling with little provocation from the victim. The situation called for a Taser, which is what the officer said he thought he pulled. It's been documented that in other cases guns have been mistaken for Tasers. The officer's actions were criminally reckless, and I think that the charge and jury's verdict are perfectly justifiable. The dude's going to jail, as he should.

And for those that think that it's ridiculous to think that someone would ever mistake a Taser for a handgun in the heat of the moment, consider these:

 

[Heidict]

Officer was convicted of involuntary manslaughter. what a joke.

http://www.aolnews.com/nation/artic...er-verdict-in-killing-of-oscar-grant/19547810

Why is that a joke?

Personally, I think involuntary manslaughter was the correct decision in this case. He did not intend to kill this person, he thought he was grabbing his taser. It was a horrible, tragic accident.

I think it is absolutely pathetic that people are rioting and busting up stores because they didn't get the verdict that THEY wanted. These people have no knowledge of the legal system and I guess we can thank the attorneys that they picked some jurors with brains. The evidence did not support a murder conviction.

Why do I have a feeling that there would have been rioting and things being stolen from busted up shops regardless of the verdict?

 

[NewDCLGuy]

deleted

 

[diznygirl]

Perhaps not in the eyes of the street mobs out to get themselves some new bling, but if you go back to page 4 and read what I posted right after this broke, you'll see that what the jury did was actually follow the laws as written. The DA swung for the fence in the effort to make the "street" happy, but came up predictably short. In order to get a murder conviction, the DA would have had to convince the jury that the officer decided to intentionally blow away the poor guy, with malice, in full view of fellow officers, lots of other people, and with cell phone video cameras rolling with little provocation from the victim. The situation called for a Taser, which is what the officer said he thought he pulled. It's been documented that in other cases guns have been mistaken for Tasers. The officer's actions were criminally reckless, and I think that the charge and jury's verdict are perfectly justifiable. The dude's going to jail, as he should.

And for those that think that it's ridiculous to think that someone would ever mistake a Taser for a handgun in the heat of the moment, consider these:

Whose bright idea was it to make taser look like a gun?

 

[BlueIrish]

Why is that a joke?

Personally, I think involuntary manslaughter was the correct decision in this case. He did not intend to kill this person, he thought he was grabbing his taser. It was a horrible, tragic accident.

I think it is absolutely pathetic that people are rioting and busting up stores because they didn't get the verdict that THEY wanted. These people have no knowledge of the legal system and I guess we can thank the attorneys that they picked some jurors with brains. The evidence did not support a murder conviction.

Why do I have a feeling that there would have been rioting and things being stolen from busted up shops regardless of the verdict?

agreed.

Sadly this is the best outcome for this case. Terrible situation all around. Grant was no angel, he should not have been resisting arrest. But the officer should not have used deadly force in this situation.

And the people that rioted, yeah way to go.

 

[NewDCLGuy]

Whose bright idea was it to make taser look like a gun?

While there are some similarities in 2D pictures, in the real world they are pretty much inmistakable. The officer's gun weighs about 4 times what the taser does, has a different feel in the hand, has the safetly in a completely different location, and has firing sequence that is totally different from a taser.

 

[OceanAnnie]

agreed.

Sadly this is the best outcome for this case. Terrible situation all around. Grant was no angel, he should not have been resisting arrest. But the officer should not have used deadly force in this situation.

And the people that rioted, yeah way to go.

I don't get it. What does looting and rioting have to do with disagreeing with the sentence? Grab whatever you want because _____ ? Makes no sense.

I don't think Holder should get involved. The jury made a decision. It should end with that.

 

[Acklander]

I don't get it. What does looting and rioting have to do with disagreeing with the sentence? Grab whatever you want because _____ ? Makes no sense.

I don't think Holder should get involved. The jury made a decision. It should end with that.

I understand it, I may not agree with it, but I understand it.

While it's easy to say - the jury made a decision, it should end with that. But that's not always right. Look at many of the cases in Mississippi during the civil rights movement. Sometimes you have to stand up and say "This is wrong" Sometimes you have to get angry. Look at our history here in America which started with the Boston Tea Party. This is how change comes about.

 

[disneyjunkie]

I understand it, I may not agree with it, but I understand it.

While it's easy to say - the jury made a decision, it should end with that. But that's not always right. Look at many of the cases in Mississippi during the civil rights movement. Sometimes you have to stand up and say "This is wrong" Sometimes you have to get angry. Look at our history here in America which started with the Boston Tea Party. This is how change comes about.

I don't agree with their actions, but I do understand the anger.

 

[minniecarousel]

The looters were not as interested in the Meserle verdict as they were just riotering to riot. Most were not even from Oakland. If Meserle had been found guilty of murder, there would have still been huge crowds on the street, celebrating. The anarchists would have been out there creating havoc too.

Having grown up in Oakland, it's sad to see the city go through this. And because of budget cuts, 80 Oakland police officers will be laid off on Monday.

Our next hurdle will be sentencing on August 6. Downtown will again close up for the day and hope for the best. (Think of the $$$ lost by all the businesses that told their employees to stay home on Friday, along with letting them all out early on Thursday.)

 

[Heidict]

While there are some similarities in 2D pictures, in the real world they are pretty much inmistakable. The officer's gun weighs about 4 times what the taser does, has a different feel in the hand, has the safetly in a completely different location, and has firing sequence that is totally different from a taser.

You posted almost the same thing last night and then deleted it. Why post it again this morning?

Oh well, if you decide to delete this one also, at least we got it quoted.

Now, in regards to what you are saying, the weight of the gun being different and the firing sequence being different, do you know if this info brought up in the trial?

Is it possible, that in the heat of the moment he didn't realize the difference in weight? Seems like a small thing to notice when you have your adrenaline pumping and you are concentrating on a person that you think is going for a weapon.

I just have a hard time believing that a police officer or security officer (which was he?), would knowingly shot an unarmed suspect in the back as he was laying on the floor. Especially in the presence of tons of witnesses, other cops and a few videos being made. The level of stupidity that would take is mind blowing.

I understand it, I may not agree with it, but I understand it.

While it's easy to say - the jury made a decision, it should end with that. But that's not always right. Look at many of the cases in Mississippi during the civil rights movement. Sometimes you have to stand up and say "This is wrong" Sometimes you have to get angry. Look at our history here in America which started with the Boston Tea Party. This is how change comes about.

Absolutely, wrongs have to be brought to light the in order to be exposed and fixed. But I can't compare this verdict to something as serious as civil rights or the Boston tea party.

If this man had been found not guilty on all counts and allowed to walk out of that court room and back to his life then I would say that you have a case. However, he was found guilty of the charge that honestly made the most sense in this situation.

The crowd is just yelling for blood. They want murder all the way or they are going to throw a fit if they don't get it. So, they destroy their own neighborhoods and community and harm each other. Yeah, that makes sense.

This is not a effort to educate or fix a wronged system this is a bunch of worthless punks taking advantage of an opportunity to get some free stuff and have some fun.

 

[BlueIrish]

Those people that are destroying and stealing do not care about civil justice and they don't care about this case. They are just destroying their neighborhood.

One man is dead and anothers life is ruined. This is a bad situation all around. This was the best outcome though for the case.

 

[Geoff_M]

While there are some similarities in 2D pictures, in the real world they are pretty much inmistakable. The officer's gun weighs about 4 times what the taser does, has a different feel in the hand, has the safetly in a completely different location, and has firing sequence that is totally different from a taser.

Yes, there certainly are recognizable differences... but there are enough similarities that they can be, and have been confused by other law enforcement officers in the past*. As for the safety issue, many police officers carry their sidearms with the safety in the off position. The officer should have taken the time to realize that he'd drawn the wrong weapon, which is why his actions were criminally negligent... but not murder.

* Here and here

 

[OceanAnnie]

Geoff_M, I meant to thank you earlier for the pictures of the gun and taser you posted. They have amazing similarities, of which I did not know. Thank you.