Ball caps & cell phones

[badblackpug]

I guess - I've never heard of a significant other of a deaf person who doesn't sign (when the deaf person does, which given the sig, again, I'm presuming), unless the person went deaf very late in life after the start of the relationship? Still would seem weird to me I guess, though to each his or her own, I wasn't criticizing, just trying to figure it out.

The only immediate family members I've known or heard of who didn't sign when there was a deaf person in the same house who did as their native/primary language were in cases of parents wanting a strict oral education and the deaf children ending up going to manual when they could, type of thing.

It would be weird to me, but I have had deaf patients who come in with family members who can't sign, even parents in some instances. I don't know why this is, I have never asked, and it is not the norm, but I have seen it happen.

I was just throwing out a theory.

 

[cornflake]

It would be weird to me, but I have had deaf patients who come in with family members who can't sign, even parents in some instances. I don't know why this is, I have never asked, and it is not the norm, but I have seen it happen.

I was just throwing out a theory.

No, I know, I was just trying to figure it out too, wasn't intending to shoot anything down like I know the ans. I got nuttin. Parents is the one I'm familiar with, aside from that, unless there's a big age gap or someone became deaf as an adult, I've never really heard of immediate family not signing. Guess it's more common than I've run into.

 

[sam_gordon]

You can tell yourself that it is outdated, that it doesn't matter at certain establishments, but the social norm is still that hats aren't worn indoors (again, exclusive of religious observance or uniform)

But doesn't this thread, and all the examples of people seeing others wear hats indoors, show it's not a 'social norm'?

FWIW, most of the time I do take my hat off indoors or at the table. I just don't understand the comments that it's "rude" not to.

As far as phones, I don't care what someone at another table does. If I'm with someone who puts their phone on the table, I'm thinking "it's probably more comfortable there than in the pocket" or "they'll be able to tell if someone's calling". I'm not concerned about someone thinking I'm not the most important person to them, because (unless it's DW or my kids), I'm not.

 

[Snowflakey]

So who determines whether something is "rude" or not? Is it society? If so, this thread is a prime example that declaring hats indoors "rude" is not a unanimous decision.

If it's just one or two people deciding what's rude, then I say claiming what "everyone knows" is rude.

Exactly!!!

Hats do not bother me one bit (and no one in my family wear them) I remember being out for dinner several years ago with my family and my parents. My mother mentioned someone wearing a ball cap and saying it was rude.

My daughter questioned that in the car on the way home saying "why did grandmother say that was rude" and I explained and she replied "old people must have made that rule because it is not rude"

 

[kaytieeldr]

That interactionnse is hilarious, Snowflakey. It not only ignores manners, being polite, making others comfortable, that none of us exists in the world alone, and that there's no need for a hat indoors; it also indicates a lack of awareness that nobody was born old, that for a great deal of her life old[er than she] people will be the ones making the rules, and that she someday will be "old".

 

[Ceila]

I think it's unreasonable for you to talk down to me simply because you can't avoid making a mess at the table with an elastic cuff on your wrist

Kaytieeldr, you are certainly entitled to your opinion. If you want to dangle your cell phone from your wrist, go ahead. If you prefer leaving your phone in your purse, go ahead. But when you accuse me of lack of planning simply because my outfits don't all have pockets, and when you accuse me of being discourteous to my friends by completely disregarding my statements that they not only don't mind phones on the table but they do the same in order to ensure their children can reach them, well, you crossed a line. Frankly, what I posted showed great restraint on my part in light of your condescending and rude post. I will not respond to any further posts by you on this thread.

 

[ols386]

I believe that what once may have been considered "rude" in years past, may not necessarily be considered rude today.

Socially acceptable behavior changes over time.

There are many things now days that are generally acceptable, that were not acceptabe back when I was a child.

If someone chooses to be offended by someone who walks into Applebee's wearing a hat, you do indeed choose to feel that way.

If I see someone in Applebee's (or a similar place) with a hat on, it doesn't offend me in the least, because I choose not to be offended.

 

[mjkacmom]

So you'll be teaching all the manners in your home even if they are outdated? Did you see my list? Do the females in your family wear long white gloves when they arrive at dinner? Do the men dress in jackets every day unless they are in the country? Of course not! You are picking and choosing the "manners" that you think are still relevant. In your opinion, you feel it is important to take off hats indoors. That is certainly fine to teach your children if that is what you believe, but just remember that there are plenty of other outdated manners that you are ignoring.

Finding someone rude and disrespectful because they wore a hat at a place like Outback is as silly as finding them rude and disrespectful because they didn't wear their long gloves or jacket.

Just a heads up - gloves haven't been worn in decades, but the hat rule still exists. Let me guess - you butter your whole roll at once in nice restaurants... Seriously, I'm so grateful my parents raised me with manners, that come naturally, making me less likely to offend others. I'm sorry your parents didn't do the same.

 

[smitch425]

Just a heads up - gloves haven't been worn in decades, but the hat rule still exists. Let me guess - you butter your whole roll at once in nice restaurants... Seriously, I'm so grateful my parents raised me with manners, that come naturally, making me less likely to offend others. I'm sorry your parents didn't do the same.

Was that really necessary?

It's one thing to have opinions, but some of the comments in this thread are crossing some serious lines. I find it ironic that the people saying hats indoors are "rude" and are a sign of having "bad manners" seem to have no trouble bashing the parents and family members of the people they are arguing with. Um yeah...because THAT'S not rude at all. Seriously... this is nuts.

 

[gwynne]

I believe that what once may have been considered "rude" in years past, may not necessarily be considered rude today.

Socially acceptable behavior changes over time.

There are many things now days that are generally acceptable, that were not acceptable back when I was a child.

If someone chooses to be offended by someone who walks into Applebee's wearing a hat, you do indeed choose to feel that way.

If I see someone in Applebee's (or a similar place) with at hat on, it doesn't offend me in the least, because I choose not to be offended.

Very true. And in explaining the hat thing to a child, maybe the best way to do it (and not endorse ageism) would be to just say:

I think wearing a hat is fine. Your grandma may not, that's her opinion. Lots of folks have differing opinions on etiquette.
End of story.

 

[sam_gordon]

That interactionnse is hilarious, Snowflakey. It not only ignores manners, being polite, making others comfortable, that none of us exists in the world alone, and that there's no need for a hat indoors; it also indicates a lack of awareness that nobody was born old, that for a great deal of her life old[er than she] people will be the ones making the rules, and that she someday will be "old".

How exactly did Snowlakey's DD ignore manners? I think she did that and WAS polite by waiting until they were heading home before questioning. Also, who was made uncomfortable? Does it make you uncomfortable to see someone wearing a hat indoors? Why?

Also, your definition of "need" is different from others. I think most guys today don't wear a hat because they NEED to, but more as a fashion accessory... showing their support for a team, company, whatever.

 

[brerrabbit]

In a word it all boils down to respect. Respecting others as you would wish to be respected. If you are eating out with others then put the phone away. It shows that you respect those you are with enough to engage in conversation with them. We are raising a generation of people who are socially inept. Case in point DW and I go to a fast food place to eat. You order your food, then they call your name and go pick it up. There are booths and tables and after we get our drinks we are sitting waiting for our food and notice a family or four sitting near us. Dad is looking at his phone, Mom is looking at her phone, two kids 7 to 10 years old are playing ninetento hand held games. Their food is on the table, they are shoving bits in their mouths every once in a while and having 0 conversation. WTH? Kids don't use their phones to call each other these days, they text, and have running conversations in a language that I don't understand.

Socially kids are not developing. They cannot have a lucid conversation with adults or each other because they do it so infrequintly they have no practice at it. When not buried in their phone away from home they dive into their computers at home and look at facebook.

The best commercial on TV is the girl worried about her parents because she read "part" of an article on the internet that says older people are becoming socially isolated and got them a facebook account and how sad it is they only have 19 friends while she has 687. In the meantime her parents are out off road biking. While others see the humor in this, I see a sad social commentary.

Maybe it's because I lived a lot of my life before the internet, home computers, and cell phones but quite frankly don't see why you have to have it in your hand 24/7. I have one, I am on call for work, but nights and weekends I check it every couple of hours and that's good enough. People say I have kids, I have to know right away if there are issue. We guess what generations of children were raised and did just fine without their parents having cell phones to know what was happening every minute of every day with the kids.

Respect, I don't want to have my conversation in a resturant in front of others and don't want to have to listen to yours. I don't want to hear your ringtone while I am eating. Yeah, yeah, every ring I have ever heard be it in a resturant, in church, at the movies, in the bathroom, or anywhere else the person always says, "I always put it on silent".

Finally I was rasied that you take your hat off indoors. Period end of sentence. No exceptions, no one offs, just no hats. Bum Phillips ex head coach of the Houston Oilers was asked one time why he never wore his trademark cowboy hat when coaching home games. Home games were played at that time inside the Astrodome. He said "because my Momma always taught me to take my hat off indoors" We live in a world where everyone is taught to challenge everything and as a result we have thrown many social norms out the window. Some of those norms are simply respectful. Taking you hat off lets me see you and know who you are. If you don't want to take it off maybe it's because you want to hide something, and that is merely a lack of respect.

 

[Janepod]

In a word it all boils down to resprect. Respecting others as you would wish to be respected. If you are eating out with others then put the phone away. It shows that you respect those you are with enough to engage in conversation with them. We are raising a generation of people who are socially inept. Case in point DW and I go to a fast food place to eat. You order your food, then they call your name and go pick it up. There are booths and tables and after we get our drinks we are sitting waiting for our food and notice a family or four sitting near us. Dad is looking at his phone, Mom is looking at her phone, two kids 7 to 10 years old are playing ninetento hand held games. Their food is on the table, they are shoving bits in their mouths every once in a while and having 0 conversation. WTH? Kids don't use their phones to call each other these days, they text, and have running conversations in a language that I don't understand.

Socially kids are not developing. They cannot have a lucid conversation with adults or each other because they do it so infrequintly they have no practice at it. When not buried in their phone away from home they dive into their computers at home and look at facebook.

The best commercial on TV is the girl worried about her parents because she read "part" of an article on the internet that says older people are becoming socially isolated and got them a facebook account and how sad it is they only have 19 friends while she has 687. In the meantime her parents are out off road biking. While others see the humor in this, I see a sad social commentary.

Maybe it's because I lived a lot of my life before the internet, home computers, and cell phones but quite frankly don't see why you have to have it in your hand 24/7. I have one, I am on call for work, but nights and weekends I check it every couple of hours and that's good enough. People say I have kids, I have to know right away if there are issue. We guess what generations of children were raised and did just fine without their parents having cell phones to know what was happening every minute of every day with the kids.

Respect, I don't want to have my conversation in a resturant in front of others and don't want to have to listen to yours. I don't want to hear your ringtone while I am eating. Yeah, yeah, every ring I have ever heard be it in a resturant, in church, at the movies, in the bathroom, or anywhere else the person always says, "I always put it on silent".

Finally I was rasied that you take your hat off indoors. Period end of sentence. No exceptions, no one offs, just no hats. Bum Phillips ex head coach of the Houston Oilers was asked one time why he never wore his trademark cowboy hat when coaching home games. Home games were played at that time inside the Astrodome. He said "because my Momma always taught me to take my hat off indoors" We live in a world where everyone is taught to challenge everything and as a result we have thrown many social norms out the window. Some of those norms are simply respectful. Taking you hat off lets me see you and know who you are. If you don't want to take it off maybe it's because you want to hide something, and that is merely a lack of respect.

Excellent post. We would love to have dinner with you any time.

 

[Ceila]

In a word it all boils down to respect. Respecting others as you would wish to be respected. If you are eating out with others then put the phone away. It shows that you respect those you are with enough to engage in conversation with them. I agree that taking "just for fun calls" while eating out is rude. But, believe it or not, most people are very capable of leaving a phone on the table in case a child is calling and still engaging in conversation with their tablemates. As I said earlier, leaving my phone in my purse may result in a missed call, since I do leave the ringer off. When my son is camping with the Boy Scouts, for example, the leaders depend on being able to reach parents if needed. It would be rude to them to not take their call. I'm sure you and others may disagree with me, but I'm quite comfortable with that. We are raising a generation of people who are socially inept. Case in point DW and I go to a fast food place to eat. You order your food, then they call your name and go pick it up. There are booths and tables and after we get our drinks we are sitting waiting for our food and notice a family or four sitting near us. Dad is looking at his phone, Mom is looking at her phone, two kids 7 to 10 years old are playing ninetento hand held games. Their food is on the table, they are shoving bits in their mouths every once in a while and having 0 conversation. WTH? Well, that is something we almost never do, but it could have been us once. However, after a long day of traveling in the car to Florida, and having lots of conversation along the way, we did let the kids plug in while DH checked his e-mail for work and I checking on my personal e-mails. One snapshot does not an entire story make. Kids don't use their phones to call each other these days, they text, and have running conversations in a language that I don't understand. Just because you personally don't understand it make it less worthy?

Socially kids are not developing. They cannot have a lucid conversation with adults or each other because they do it so infrequintly they have no practice at it. When not buried in their phone away from home they dive into their computers at home and look at facebook. Again, not true. I am a parent of, a scout leader to, and teach kids who are 9-13 years old, and the majority of them do very well. The kids I know are into scouting, sports, dance, drama, playing outside (yes, really!), other activities, and computers/games. I get so tired of the "kids these days are terrible" comments. Kids today are nice, giving, caring, and responsible, but so many people only see the few but negatives and project it on the majority. That's terribly sad.

The best commercial on TV is the girl worried about her parents because she read "part" of an article on the internet that says older people are becoming socially isolated and got them a facebook account and how sad it is they only have 19 friends while she has 687. In the meantime her parents are out off road biking. While others see the humor in this, I see a sad social commentary. Agreed, but adults have done this for years, too, but in print on from watching something on TV. Really nothing new here.

Maybe it's because I lived a lot of my life before the internet, home computers, and cell phones but quite frankly don't see why you have to have it in your hand 24/7. I have one, I am on call for work, but nights and weekends I check it every couple of hours and that's good enough. People say I have kids, I have to know right away if there are issue. We guess what generations of children were raised and did just fine without their parents having cell phones to know what was happening every minute of every day with the kids. Yes, and they lived without computers to get on the internet and post on the Dis, too, but I don't see people complaining about that.

Respect, I don't want to have my conversation in a resturant in front of others and don't want to have to listen to yours. I don't want to hear your ringtone while I am eating. Yeah, yeah, every ring I have ever heard be it in a resturant, in church, at the movies, in the bathroom, or anywhere else the person always says, "I always put it on silent".

Personally, I won't apologize for making sure my kids or a sitter can reach me at a moment's notice. Sure, our parents did without, but they also did without computers and many other devices that make life easier. And just because some people don't bother to turn their ringer off or decide to hold a loud phone conversation in a restaurant does not mean that those who remember to silence their ringers and take the call outside should be penalized. Do you believe in holding everyone accountable for the actions of a few? I, for one, do not.

Finally I was rasied that you take your hat off indoors. Period end of sentence. No exceptions, no one offs, just no hats. Bum Phillips ex head coach of the Houston Oilers was asked one time why he never wore his trademark cowboy hat when coaching home games. Home games were played at that time inside the Astrodome. He said "because my Momma always taught me to take my hat off indoors" We live in a world where everyone is taught to challenge everything and as a result we have thrown many social norms out the window. Some of those norms are simply respectful. Taking you hat off lets me see you and know who you are. If you don't want to take it off maybe it's because you want to hide something, and that is merely a lack of respect. You are attributing motives to others where you don't have a right to do so. Leaving a hat on now means that someone has something to hide? No, it really doesn't. My husband takes his hat off indoors, and we teach our son that as well. However, I refuse to attribute nefarious intentions to those who do not.

Bear Bryant, legendary Alabama football coach, usually wore a houndstooth hat. Once, Alabama played a football game in the Superdome, and Bryant arrived, sans hat. He was asked why he didn't have his hat on, and his reply was, " My momma told me that a gentleman never wears a hat indoors."

Hmm, so which one was it?

My comments are in red, above.

 

[sam_gordon]

In a word it all boils down to respect. Respecting others as you would wish to be respected. If you are eating out with others then put the phone away. It shows that you respect those you are with enough to engage in conversation with them.

So you can't engage in conversation if your phone is on the table? I understand your point. I just disagree with it.

We are raising a generation of people who are socially inept. Case in point DW and I go to a fast food place to eat. You order your food, then they call your name and go pick it up. There are booths and tables and after we get our drinks we are sitting waiting for our food and notice a family or four sitting near us. Dad is looking at his phone, Mom is looking at her phone, two kids 7 to 10 years old are playing ninetento hand held games. Their food is on the table, they are shoving bits in their mouths every once in a while and having 0 conversation. WTH? Kids don't use their phones to call each other these days, they text, and have running conversations in a language that I don't understand.

As mentioned, you don't know anything about this family. They may have talked themselves out already.

The best commercial on TV is the girl worried about her parents because she read "part" of an article on the internet that says older people are becoming socially isolated and got them a facebook account and how sad it is they only have 19 friends while she has 687. In the meantime her parents are out off road biking. While others see the humor in this, I see a sad social commentary.

I just wonder what the ad is for.

Maybe it's because I lived a lot of my life before the internet, home computers, and cell phones but quite frankly don't see why you have to have it in your hand 24/7. I have one, I am on call for work, but nights and weekends I check it every couple of hours and that's good enough.

That works for YOUR situation, not everybody's. When I'm on call, the issues could be anything from "my computer won't turn on" to something costing the company THOUSANDS of dollars. I don't think my boss would agree that *I* could simply check every couple of hours.

People say I have kids, I have to know right away if there are issue. We guess what generations of children were raised and did just fine without their parents having cell phones to know what was happening every minute of every day with the kids.

I'm guessing there were also parents who were out when their kids had accidents and they found out hours later. Those hours could have made a difference. Is that an extreme example? Sure. I'm a parent with a cell phone. I don't want to know what's happening "every minute of every day", but I'll want to know if my kids are stranded somewhere.

Respect, I don't want to have my conversation in a resturant in front of others and don't want to have to listen to yours. I don't want to hear your ringtone while I am eating. Yeah, yeah, every ring I have ever heard be it in a resturant, in church, at the movies, in the bathroom, or anywhere else the person always says, "I always put it on silent".

I'll agree I don't want/need to hear someone's conversation, but I couldn't care less if I hear their ringtone. Really? THAT bothers you?

Finally I was rasied that you take your hat off indoors. Period end of sentence. No exceptions, no one offs, just no hats. Bum Phillips ex head coach of the Houston Oilers was asked one time why he never wore his trademark cowboy hat when coaching home games. Home games were played at that time inside the Astrodome. He said "because my Momma always taught me to take my hat off indoors" We live in a world where everyone is taught to challenge everything and as a result we have thrown many social norms out the window. Some of those norms are simply respectful. Taking you hat off lets me see you and know who you are. If you don't want to take it off maybe it's because you want to hide something, and that is merely a lack of respect.

So you're doing the "right" thing because it's the way you were taught, but other people doing what THEY were taught are doing the "wrong" thing?

 

[jrmasm]

Just a heads up - gloves haven't been worn in decades, but the hat rule still exists. Let me guess - you butter your whole roll at once in nice restaurants... Seriously, I'm so grateful my parents raised me with manners, that come naturally, making me less likely to offend others. I'm sorry your parents didn't do the same.

Mine taught me that speaking to and treating others kindly are the best manners.

 

[crashbb]

Was that really necessary?

It's one thing to have opinions, but some of the comments in this thread are crossing some serious lines. I find it ironic that the people saying hats indoors are "rude" and are a sign of having "bad manners" seem to have no trouble bashing the parents and family members of the people they are arguing with. Um yeah...because THAT'S not rude at all. Seriously... this is nuts.

It was weird. In one sentence she states that she is "less likely to offend others" and in the next makes a comment that is designed to purposefully to offend others. Doesn't make much sense.

I don't wear a hat indoors and would prefer if people (at my table) didn't have their phones out, but I don't really care (or notice) if people at other tables are doing either thing.

 

[wvjules]

[I It won't be me. I really assume that any woman who's husband has a hat on when he's eating with her doesn't have the respect of her husband so I would just avoid those people. [/I]

Wow, really?????

I can't believe that no one else picked up on that?

 

[smitch425]

Wow, really?????

I can't believe that no one else picked up on that?

I'm sure people noticed, but it was such a ridiculous and judgemental statement that noone bothered to acknowledge it with a response.

 

[Ceila]

I'm sure people noticed, but it was such a ridiculous and judgemental statement that noone bothered to acknowledge it with a response.

And when you know the style of the person who posted it, well...